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K28
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Joined: 29 Nov 2012
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 Posted: Fri Dec 19, 2014 3:20 pm Post subject: |
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| kikanga wrote: | | ringfinger wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | venturalakersfan wrote: | | Maybe Kobe doesn't have the pull that many of us thought |
He's saved TWC/Lakers from an even more precipitous drop, business wise. |
How is that possible when we are down 28% in a season with Kobe vs the same time last year without him?
We should be up YoY if that were the case.
I think the problem is that the Kobe people want to see, isn't the Kobe you're seeing on the court anymore. |
Blaming Kobe for our low ratings is like blaming the kitchen crew for the titanic sinking. Maybe the food could've been better, but that's not why people are drowning.
The ratings are lower this year because this is our second season in a row below .500. Not the first.
FWIW, championship ball leads to consistently great TV ratings. Not the other way around. There are few things less important in the long run then TV ratings in a down year. The laker fanbase has always been full of bandwagonners.
Improve the quality of players on the court and the rest will follow. |
Expect nothing less from ringfinger. The 28% drop would have been much larger if not for Kobe. |
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venturalakersfan
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| Posted: Fri Dec 19, 2014 3:21 pm Post subject: |
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| Don Draper wrote: | | Another thing is that MDA's offense was at least exciting. Byron Ball is like a mixture of MB's sets and something a coma patient would come up with. |
Good point.
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kikanga
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| Posted: Fri Dec 19, 2014 3:29 pm Post subject: |
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I don't believe Kobe's presence is contributing to the downward trend in TV ratings.
But if I did believe that. I would hold FO members of the Lakers organization accountable for not reigning-in their best asset. It's Kobe's job to play as hard and as smart as he can. It's the job of the FO to make sure Kobe's play benefits the organization in the short and long term.
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ringfinger
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| Posted: Fri Dec 19, 2014 3:38 pm Post subject: |
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| yinoma2001 wrote: | | ringfinger wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | venturalakersfan wrote: | | Maybe Kobe doesn't have the pull that many of us thought |
He's saved TWC/Lakers from an even more precipitous drop, business wise. |
How is that possible when we are down 28% in a season with Kobe vs the same time last year without him?
We should be up YoY if that were the case.
I think the problem is that the Kobe people want to see, isn't the Kobe you're seeing on the court anymore. |
So you're saying viewership would be up without Kobe this year? That's a stretch. I think it would have been worse without Kobe. |
What you're saying sounds logical, but it's not what the data says.
How can viewership be worse without Kobe, when viewership wasn't, in fact, worse without Kobe? It was better.
We can only assume that Kobe, at best, has negligible impact on viewership at this point and that the drop in ratings (relative to the period without Kobe) is almost entirely due to having an even poorer performing team. |
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venturalakersfan
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| Posted: Fri Dec 19, 2014 3:43 pm Post subject: |
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To yinona's point, you are comparing two different beasts (2013-14 Lakers and 2014-15 Lakers). This team started much worse than that team did, the Lakers bought some time by starting out beating the Rockets and Clippers and were about .500 at this point. So yinona could be right, the Lakers might be down 38% without Kobe. Of course we will never know unless we lose Kobe again. And to add in Don's point, the MDA team losing by scoring 105+ was more entertaining than this team losing in the 90's. I was wrong in thinking that having Kobe would at least keep the status quo.
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ringfinger
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| Posted: Fri Dec 19, 2014 3:47 pm Post subject: |
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| kray28_ wrote: | | kikanga wrote: | | ringfinger wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | venturalakersfan wrote: | | Maybe Kobe doesn't have the pull that many of us thought |
He's saved TWC/Lakers from an even more precipitous drop, business wise. |
How is that possible when we are down 28% in a season with Kobe vs the same time last year without him?
We should be up YoY if that were the case.
I think the problem is that the Kobe people want to see, isn't the Kobe you're seeing on the court anymore. |
Blaming Kobe for our low ratings is like blaming the kitchen crew for the titanic sinking. Maybe the food could've been better, but that's not why people are drowning.
The ratings are lower this year because this is our second season in a row below .500. Not the first.
FWIW, championship ball leads to consistently great TV ratings. Not the other way around. There are few things less important in the long run then TV ratings in a down year. The laker fanbase has always been full of bandwagonners.
Improve the quality of players on the court and the rest will follow. |
Expect nothing less from ringfinger. The 28% drop would have been much larger if not for Kobe. |
What you're saying makes no sense.
The 28% drop is the decline from a period already WITHOUT Kobe. |
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ringfinger
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| Posted: Fri Dec 19, 2014 3:53 pm Post subject: |
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| venturalakersfan wrote: | | To yinona's point, you are comparing two different beasts (2013-14 Lakers and 2014-15 Lakers). This team started much worse than that team did, the Lakers bought some time by starting out beating the Rockets and Clippers and were about .500 at this point. So yinona could be right, the Lakers might be down 38% without Kobe. Of course we will never know unless we lose Kobe again. And to add in Don's point, the MDA team losing by scoring 105+ was more entertaining than this team losing in the 90's. I was wrong in thinking that having Kobe would at least keep the status quo. |
Right. But I'm not saying Kobe caused the decline. I'm saying we can't say (with absolute certainty) that without Kobe the decline WOULD be worse.
The only way you can point the finger solely at Kobe is if all things were equal. But they are not. New coach, new roster, poorer record, other factors.
The point is that retaining Kobe was supposed to keep the boat afloat so to speak in what was projected to be a down season anyway. I think we all thought he would be able to do that. He's not. I'm just postulating as to why. And I think it's because if you didn't know who Kobe was, didn't know the history as we all do, he's not really a reason to turn on the TV anymore. The 50pt outbursts, the scoring streaks, the ability to single-handedly carry an entire team on his back from end-to-end, the ability to outscore the opponent by yourself, all of those magical things are gone. If you didn't know anything about basketball and watched a Lakers game 10 years ago, you couldn't help but be mesmerized by what Kobe did on the court. Now, much of that magic is gone, and so he is unable to be that draw to the casual fan that he once was. |
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Drifts
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| Posted: Fri Dec 19, 2014 4:03 pm Post subject: |
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it's hard to watch crappy offense... I mean, the most lethal scorer in the history of the NBA is putting up a stinking 38% FG shooting in this offensive system. it's offensive.
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kikanga
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| Posted: Fri Dec 19, 2014 4:08 pm Post subject: |
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| ringfinger wrote: | | kray28_ wrote: | | kikanga wrote: | | ringfinger wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | venturalakersfan wrote: | | Maybe Kobe doesn't have the pull that many of us thought |
He's saved TWC/Lakers from an even more precipitous drop, business wise. |
How is that possible when we are down 28% in a season with Kobe vs the same time last year without him?
We should be up YoY if that were the case.
I think the problem is that the Kobe people want to see, isn't the Kobe you're seeing on the court anymore. |
Blaming Kobe for our low ratings is like blaming the kitchen crew for the titanic sinking. Maybe the food could've been better, but that's not why people are drowning.
The ratings are lower this year because this is our second season in a row below .500. Not the first.
FWIW, championship ball leads to consistently great TV ratings. Not the other way around. There are few things less important in the long run then TV ratings in a down year. The laker fanbase has always been full of bandwagonners.
Improve the quality of players on the court and the rest will follow. |
Expect nothing less from ringfinger. The 28% drop would have been much larger if not for Kobe. |
What you're saying makes no sense.
The 28% drop is the decline from a period already WITHOUT Kobe. |
I'm strongly resisting the urge to go in circles with you over this point. Like you said, not all factors are equal.
But nothing is hurting our ratings worse then consistent, prolonged below .500 basketball. If Kobe shoots 1% from the field but we're over .500 basketball right now. This thread wouldn't exist. And your dislike toward Kobe would make more sense.
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eureca
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Joined: 18 Jan 2004
Posts: 15830
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| Posted: Fri Dec 19, 2014 4:20 pm Post subject: |
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| ringfinger wrote: | | kray28_ wrote: | | kikanga wrote: | | ringfinger wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | venturalakersfan wrote: | | Maybe Kobe doesn't have the pull that many of us thought |
He's saved TWC/Lakers from an even more precipitous drop, business wise. |
How is that possible when we are down 28% in a season with Kobe vs the same time last year without him?
We should be up YoY if that were the case.
I think the problem is that the Kobe people want to see, isn't the Kobe you're seeing on the court anymore. |
Blaming Kobe for our low ratings is like blaming the kitchen crew for the titanic sinking. Maybe the food could've been better, but that's not why people are drowning.
The ratings are lower this year because this is our second season in a row below .500. Not the first.
FWIW, championship ball leads to consistently great TV ratings. Not the other way around. There are few things less important in the long run then TV ratings in a down year. The laker fanbase has always been full of bandwagonners.
Improve the quality of players on the court and the rest will follow. |
Expect nothing less from ringfinger. The 28% drop would have been much larger if not for Kobe. |
What you're saying makes no sense.
The 28% drop is the decline from a period already WITHOUT Kobe. |
The 28% drop is from the time last season where the Lakers started well and Kobe was playing 6 games. They took the ratings from around the time Kobe played his last game last season on December 17th and compared it to the ratings start this season. The overall ratings for the entire season last year is lower than the ratings start this season with Kobe.
That is not to say the ratings won't continue to decline like it did last season we will see. |
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PICKnPOP
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Joined: 14 Jul 2014
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| Posted: Fri Dec 19, 2014 4:51 pm Post subject: |
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When the lakers are losing, the NBA is losing. This 28 % decline is only the beginning because not all fans are as dedicated as the ones on these types of forums. Most laker fans are fair weather fans who are not interested in watching the team lose. Honestly, I'm not even really paying attention to games as much the last two seasons and I've been a diehard fan for over 25 years.
the only way to reverse this trend is to trade for a nam that these casual fans will recognize. Since rondo is gone deron Williams is just as good. They will associate his name with the deron Williams they remember from Utah and start watching games again.
Personally, I think NJ would have to send us a future draft pick just for us to take him off thier hands. It's something to consider. |
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P.K.
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Joined: 10 Jul 2003
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| Posted: Fri Dec 19, 2014 5:25 pm Post subject: |
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| PICKnPOP wrote: | When the lakers are losing, the NBA is losing. This 28 % decline is only the beginning because not all fans are as dedicated as the ones on these types of forums. Most laker fans are fair weather fans who are not interested in watching the team lose. Honestly, I'm not even really paying attention to games as much the last two seasons and I've been a diehard fan for over 25 years.
the only way to reverse this trend is to trade for a nam that these casual fans will recognize. Since rondo is gone deron Williams is just as good. They will associate his name with the deron Williams they remember from Utah and start watching games again.
Personally, I think NJ would have to send us a future draft pick just for us to take him off thier hands. It's something to consider. |
That's a totally outdated concept - that for the NBA to be successful they need the big market teams
The league just signed a HUGE new TV contract even though the Lakers haven't been particularly relevant for about 4 years or so now.
A recent report says that the most marketable player in the league isn't Kobe, isn't Lebron, isn't Melo...it's freaking Durant who plays in tiny market freaking OKC. So much for needing major TV markets for endorsements.
the availability of broadband and cable/sat TV means that the dominance of the big markets is pretty much a mirage now. Yes, it helps no doubt to have LA be big - but it's no where near as important as it was even 10 years ago.
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The Shadow King
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| Posted: Fri Dec 19, 2014 6:10 pm Post subject: |
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I haven't watched on a consistent basis over the past two seasons. I refuse to waste my time with this garbage product that the Buss family is giving us.
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salami
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| Posted: Fri Dec 19, 2014 6:24 pm Post subject: |
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The stats show a direct correlation between not bringing back Andy Adler and the drop in the ratings. Numbers dont lie
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LakerLand247
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| Posted: Fri Dec 19, 2014 6:36 pm Post subject: |
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| I wish it was the NBA that was down in total TV viewership by 28%. eff you Stern! |
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ringfinger
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| Posted: Fri Dec 19, 2014 6:55 pm Post subject: |
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| kikanga wrote: | | ringfinger wrote: | | kray28_ wrote: | | kikanga wrote: | | ringfinger wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | venturalakersfan wrote: | | Maybe Kobe doesn't have the pull that many of us thought |
He's saved TWC/Lakers from an even more precipitous drop, business wise. |
How is that possible when we are down 28% in a season with Kobe vs the same time last year without him?
We should be up YoY if that were the case.
I think the problem is that the Kobe people want to see, isn't the Kobe you're seeing on the court anymore. |
Blaming Kobe for our low ratings is like blaming the kitchen crew for the titanic sinking. Maybe the food could've been better, but that's not why people are drowning.
The ratings are lower this year because this is our second season in a row below .500. Not the first.
FWIW, championship ball leads to consistently great TV ratings. Not the other way around. There are few things less important in the long run then TV ratings in a down year. The laker fanbase has always been full of bandwagonners.
Improve the quality of players on the court and the rest will follow. |
Expect nothing less from ringfinger. The 28% drop would have been much larger if not for Kobe. |
What you're saying makes no sense.
The 28% drop is the decline from a period already WITHOUT Kobe. |
I'm strongly resisting the urge to go in circles with you over this point. Like you said, not all factors are equal.
But nothing is hurting our ratings worse then consistent, prolonged below .500 basketball. If Kobe shoots 1% from the field but we're over .500 basketball right now. This thread wouldn't exist. And your dislike toward Kobe would make more sense. |
There is no need to go in circles since there is only one direction that makes sense.
Kobe doesn't cause the decline. He just isn't able to to make up for it by his lonesome. |
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K28
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| Posted: Fri Dec 19, 2014 6:59 pm Post subject: |
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| LakerLand247 wrote: | | I wish it was the NBA that was down in total TV viewership by 28%. eff you Stern! |
Stern doesn't care anymore....he's having a margarita on a beach somewhere. |
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K28
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| Posted: Fri Dec 19, 2014 7:05 pm Post subject: |
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| ringfinger wrote: |
Kobe doesn't cause the decline. He just isn't able to to make up for it by his lonesome. |
Last year, the team played even for the first month...and Kobe coming back was supposed to tip the scales in favor of a playoff push.
It didn't work out....but expectation of Kobe coming back was of great interest.
This team started out of the gates on a huge losing streak....so it's not surprising that ratings would decline. Literally the only reason to watch is to see what Kobe scores. Lin was a curiosity too...but Byron nipped that in the bud by benching him. |
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Oliver Reed
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| Posted: Fri Dec 19, 2014 7:21 pm Post subject: |
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| Kobe shooting 38% is not good tv. Even if he is scoring 25 points a game. Everyone on the team is a bench player. Swag is the perfect 6th man. Everyone else would be better off playing off the bench. It's 1 true starter and 4 bench players starting. Cant win like that. |
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K28
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Posts: 10038
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| Posted: Fri Dec 19, 2014 7:29 pm Post subject: |
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| Oliver Reed wrote: | | Kobe shooting 38% is not good tv. Even if he is scoring 25 points a game. Everyone on the team is a bench player. Swag is the perfect 6th man. Everyone else would be better off playing off the bench. It's 1 true starter and 4 bench players starting. Cant win like that. |
What's the bigger contributor to the decline though? Kobe or the fact that the rest of the team are a bunch of scrubs? |
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Oliver Reed
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| Posted: Fri Dec 19, 2014 7:43 pm Post subject: |
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| kray28_ wrote: | | Oliver Reed wrote: | | Kobe shooting 38% is not good tv. Even if he is scoring 25 points a game. Everyone on the team is a bench player. Swag is the perfect 6th man. Everyone else would be better off playing off the bench. It's 1 true starter and 4 bench players starting. Cant win like that. |
What's the bigger contributor to the decline though? Kobe or the fact that the rest of the team are a bunch of scrubs? |
Kobe's decision making contributes to low efficiency scoring. If his assists were lower then I would say, yah, these jackholes arent making their shots when he distributes, but he is averaging exactly the same stats as he has his entire career. |
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ringfinger
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| Posted: Fri Dec 19, 2014 10:24 pm Post subject: |
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| kray28_ wrote: | | Oliver Reed wrote: | | Kobe shooting 38% is not good tv. Even if he is scoring 25 points a game. Everyone on the team is a bench player. Swag is the perfect 6th man. Everyone else would be better off playing off the bench. It's 1 true starter and 4 bench players starting. Cant win like that. |
What's the bigger contributor to the decline though? Kobe or the fact that the rest of the team are a bunch of scrubs? |
Does it matter? The point is that the logic behind the extension was that it was supposed to keep proverbial butts in seats. That clearly isn't happening.
He doesn't do anything worth tuning in for (for casual fans) anymore. IMO, that decline is the disappearance of the casual fan who might have tuned in a decade ago to watch a 50 pt outburst on a losing team. |
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Tagurt
Starting Rotation
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Posts: 739
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| Posted: Fri Dec 19, 2014 10:46 pm Post subject: |
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Kobe fans are hilarious. Didn't you guys claim that Kobe is going to justify his huge extension by drawing in viewers? If you come in saying that the sharp decline from viewership is largely because of the team sucking then you are admitting that giving large money to Kobe over getting more help is a terrible idea. The viewership would decline even further without Kobe? We are comparing last year's team that has Gasol and a bunch of scrubs and this year's team that has Kobe and better scrubs, and the former has MUCH better rating than the latter. I guess the Lakers should have given Gasol a large deal instead.  |
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lakersken80
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Posts: 38791
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| Posted: Fri Dec 19, 2014 10:47 pm Post subject: |
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| Ratings need to tank like this team needs to tank so things can get done....until then, their stuck in purgatory. |
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GSDunk
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Posts: 1875
Location: Santa Monica
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| Posted: Fri Dec 19, 2014 10:52 pm Post subject: |
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That Warrior/OKC game the other night was a game that I actually looked forward to watching. The Laker/OKC game?? I had no clue they were even on until I was flipping through the channels.
It really sucks to admit, but this Laker team gives me zero viewing pleasure whatsoever. |
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