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Kobe did it better for longer than any player in the history of the NBA
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jodeke
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Posted: Sat Dec 20, 2014 12:10 pm Post subject:

Tagurt wrote:

jodeke wrote:

I don't think where you grow up makes you articulate, that's something you have to make yourself. You can grow up a millionair in Beverly Hills and still say duh and ax.

So if you know someone from Arcadia who acts sophisticated and a guy from Compton who acts like a thug, you are going to praise the guy from Arcadia and blame the guy from Compton for not applying himself? Where you are raised and how you are raised have A LOT to do with how you will act when you become an adult. I guess we will just have to agree to disagree.

jodeke wrote:

I rearead my post many times and can't find where I intimated "where did the idea that college makes you a well mannered person come from?" If I implied that please point it out to me.

You just said this three hours ago:

Quote:

He didn't go to college but purports himself as one who did. When he's not potty mouthing his conveyance is smartly articulate.

You are implying that not going to college is supposed to make it much more difficult for a person to act well educated. My argument is that it's not difficult as long as you were raised in a stable neighborhood. In Kobe's case he happened to live in a good place in Italy followed by one of the richest place in the states.

There are 17 years of your life before you hit college. That 17 years defines what you are much more than the 4 years that follow.

jodeke wrote:

I marvaled what Kobe has done on his own, you want to give it validation by where he was raised, OK, if you want to so be it. I'll still marvel because of what he's done not where he's from.

You can marvel at what he has done, but you can also take into account that he was a lot more fortunate than his contemporaries. For example KG and AI grew up in a poor neighborhood with single parents while T-Mac was born in a place with a median household income of $33,000 with nearly 10% of the population below poverty line. They also didn't have a pro basketball player as a father who also had connections to let them play against amateur pros in Europe. Kobe had it easy compared to those guys.

Quote:

No need to respond. I've looked over your past posts. I LINK

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Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.

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jodeke
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Posted: Sat Dec 20, 2014 12:31 pm Post subject:

Saka wrote:

nevitt_smrek wrote:

lakersken80 wrote:

Kobe grew up in Italy....its not a surprise he is pretty worldly when it comes to his thinking. He was only in Philly for high school probably not long enough to fully assimilate the local culture.

Which is what makes it so surprising to hear the level of vulgarities that comes out of his mouth. I would have assumed his growing up overseas and getting exposure to culture(s) that he'd be a different person. It's always F this, F that.

Yeah, have you ever been to Italy? I'm pretty sure being exposed to their culture made him even more vulgar.

Forgidaboutit Vito Corleone
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Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.

America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves.

ppineda
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Posted: Sat Dec 20, 2014 12:44 pm Post subject:

PhoenixForce wrote:

Dreamshake wrote:

saacman5033 wrote:

Dreamshake wrote:

Shaq has 19 seasons. He was clearly dominant for his first 14 seasons (92/93 - 05/06). He was also dominant in 08/09. That would be 15.

Normally like your takes and have no problem with much of this one, but the bolded is laughable.

That season Shaq played 75 games and avg 18/8/1 on 61%. He had a PER of 22 and made an All-NBA team. That's just as dominant as Kobe's 3rd season (98/99), which I counted.

stop it. Shaq was not dominant in 2008-09. The only players that can say they've had similar or better longevity as Kobe are Kareem and Malone.

Duncan is still going strong at 38. How can you not list him?

lakersken80
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Posted: Sat Dec 20, 2014 12:49 pm Post subject:

ppineda wrote:

PhoenixForce wrote:

Dreamshake wrote:

saacman5033 wrote:

Dreamshake wrote:

Shaq has 19 seasons. He was clearly dominant for his first 14 seasons (92/93 - 05/06). He was also dominant in 08/09. That would be 15.

Normally like your takes and have no problem with much of this one, but the bolded is laughable.

That season Shaq played 75 games and avg 18/8/1 on 61%. He had a PER of 22 and made an All-NBA team. That's just as dominant as Kobe's 3rd season (98/99), which I counted.

stop it. Shaq was not dominant in 2008-09. The only players that can say they've had similar or better longevity as Kobe are Kareem and Malone.

Duncan is still going strong at 38. How can you not list him?

Duncan isn't a day to day player anymore and his minutes are cut drastically.

ppineda
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Posts: 701

Posted: Sat Dec 20, 2014 12:53 pm Post subject:

lakersken80 wrote:

ppineda wrote:

PhoenixForce wrote:

Dreamshake wrote:

saacman5033 wrote:

Dreamshake wrote:

Shaq has 19 seasons. He was clearly dominant for his first 14 seasons (92/93 - 05/06). He was also dominant in 08/09. That would be 15.

Normally like your takes and have no problem with much of this one, but the bolded is laughable.

That season Shaq played 75 games and avg 18/8/1 on 61%. He had a PER of 22 and made an All-NBA team. That's just as dominant as Kobe's 3rd season (98/99), which I counted.

stop it. Shaq was not dominant in 2008-09. The only players that can say they've had similar or better longevity as Kobe are Kareem and Malone.

Duncan is still going strong at 38. How can you not list him?

Duncan isn't a day to day player anymore and his minutes are cut drastically.

Yes, until the playoffs - then his minutes go up as needed. Duncan was dominating, and even had 30pt games in the 2013 playoffs (the one they lost). And did very well in his last title run. He still is dominant and who the Spurs go to or through in crunch time. And he's still relevant, he could add another title this season. He definitely is in the Kobe, Kareem, Malone group as great performing old guys lol

jodeke
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Posted: Sat Dec 20, 2014 1:06 pm Post subject:

lakersken80 wrote:

ppineda wrote:

PhoenixForce wrote:

Dreamshake wrote:

saacman5033 wrote:

Dreamshake wrote:

Shaq has 19 seasons. He was clearly dominant for his first 14 seasons (92/93 - 05/06). He was also dominant in 08/09. That would be 15.

Normally like your takes and have no problem with much of this one, but the bolded is laughable.

That season Shaq played 75 games and avg 18/8/1 on 61%. He had a PER of 22 and made an All-NBA team. That's just as dominant as Kobe's 3rd season (98/99), which I counted.

stop it. Shaq was not dominant in 2008-09. The only players that can say they've had similar or better longevity as Kobe are Kareem and Malone.

Duncan is still going strong at 38. How can you not list him?

Duncan isn't a day to day player anymore and his minutes are cut drastically.

That's what you call coaching. Pop is the best in the league at getting his prime players to the playoffs rested. He got fined for sending Duncan, Parker and Ginobili home on Southwest Airlines during a road trip. Scott should take a page out of Pops playbook.
_________________
Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.

America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves.

lakersken80
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Joined: 12 Aug 2009
Posts: 38789

Posted: Sat Dec 20, 2014 1:08 pm Post subject:

jodeke wrote:

lakersken80 wrote:

ppineda wrote:

PhoenixForce wrote:

Dreamshake wrote:

saacman5033 wrote:

Dreamshake wrote:

Shaq has 19 seasons. He was clearly dominant for his first 14 seasons (92/93 - 05/06). He was also dominant in 08/09. That would be 15.

Normally like your takes and have no problem with much of this one, but the bolded is laughable.

That season Shaq played 75 games and avg 18/8/1 on 61%. He had a PER of 22 and made an All-NBA team. That's just as dominant as Kobe's 3rd season (98/99), which I counted.

stop it. Shaq was not dominant in 2008-09. The only players that can say they've had similar or better longevity as Kobe are Kareem and Malone.

Duncan is still going strong at 38. How can you not list him?

Duncan isn't a day to day player anymore and his minutes are cut drastically.

No doubt. I know why Duncan doesn't get as much minutes as he used to. Pop knows how to use the weapons he has at his disposal.

lakersken80
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Joined: 12 Aug 2009
Posts: 38789

Posted: Sat Dec 20, 2014 1:09 pm Post subject:

ppineda wrote:

lakersken80 wrote:

ppineda wrote:

PhoenixForce wrote:

Dreamshake wrote:

saacman5033 wrote:

Dreamshake wrote:

Shaq has 19 seasons. He was clearly dominant for his first 14 seasons (92/93 - 05/06). He was also dominant in 08/09. That would be 15.

Normally like your takes and have no problem with much of this one, but the bolded is laughable.

That season Shaq played 75 games and avg 18/8/1 on 61%. He had a PER of 22 and made an All-NBA team. That's just as dominant as Kobe's 3rd season (98/99), which I counted.

stop it. Shaq was not dominant in 2008-09. The only players that can say they've had similar or better longevity as Kobe are Kareem and Malone.

Duncan is still going strong at 38. How can you not list him?

Duncan isn't a day to day player anymore and his minutes are cut drastically.

But thats the reason why....
He isn't being used much in the regular season. He isn't a day to day player. Pop saves him for the playoffs.
In comparison, Kobe has an extra year in the NBA and he's still playing high 30+ minutes every game, even 40+ sometimes, in irrelevant games at times.

ribeye
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Joined: 10 Nov 2001
Posts: 12632

Posted: Sat Dec 20, 2014 1:21 pm Post subject:

lakersken80 wrote:

Duncan isn't a day to day player anymore and his minutes are cut drastically.

Nope, but name another player besides Kareem Abdul Jabbar who played as well (both have PER's of 22.7) at 38.
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jodeke
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Posted: Sat Dec 20, 2014 1:51 pm Post subject:

ribeye wrote:

lakersken80 wrote:

Duncan isn't a day to day player anymore and his minutes are cut drastically.

Nope, but name another player besides Kareem Abdul Jabbar who played as well (both have PER's of 22.7) at 38.

Wilton Norman Chamberlain 37
_________________
Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.

America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves.

ribeye
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Joined: 10 Nov 2001
Posts: 12632

Posted: Sat Dec 20, 2014 2:46 pm Post subject:

jodeke wrote:

ribeye wrote:

lakersken80 wrote:

Duncan isn't a day to day player anymore and his minutes are cut drastically.

Nope, but name another player besides Kareem Abdul Jabbar who played as well (both have PER's of 22.7) at 38.

Wilton Norman Chamberlain 37

Well besides the minor technicality that 37 ≠ 38, Wilt's last game was at 36 and 262 days.
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"A metronome keeps time by using a Ringo"

jodeke
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Posted: Sat Dec 20, 2014 2:53 pm Post subject:

ribeye wrote:

jodeke wrote:

ribeye wrote:

lakersken80 wrote:

Duncan isn't a day to day player anymore and his minutes are cut drastically.

Nope, but name another player besides Kareem Abdul Jabbar who played as well (both have PER's of 22.7) at 38.

Wilton Norman Chamberlain 37

Well besides the minor technicality that 37 ≠ 38, Wilt's last game was at 36 and 262 days.

Oooooootay....

PhoenixForce
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Joined: 07 Oct 2014
Posts: 1780

Posted: Sat Dec 20, 2014 3:01 pm Post subject:

ribeye wrote:

lakersken80 wrote:

Duncan isn't a day to day player anymore and his minutes are cut drastically.

Nope, but name another player besides Kareem Abdul Jabbar who played as well (both have PER's of 22.7) at 38.

Karl Malone was pretty damn good at 38-39 years old.

Aeneas Hunter
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Posted: Sat Dec 20, 2014 3:02 pm Post subject:

jodeke wrote:

He didn't go to college but purports himself as one who did. When he's not potty mouthing his conveyance is smartly articulate.

I don't know about that. Whenever I've heard Kobe talk about anything other than basketball or himself, he didn't exactly sound like a college educated guy. I don't mean that he sounds stupid. He sounds like . . . a jock. The example that jumps to mind is the "I'd rather play on Pluto" interview back in the summer of 2007. At least he didn't say that he'd rather take his talents to Pluto.

In recent years, he has developed a smooth delivery for interviews, but he never really says anything. It always sounds like an elevated version of the clichés in Bull Durham. When things get off script, he flounders or switches to a disarming laugh.

I don't mean to be hard on Kobe. Offhand, I can't think of many jocks who ever had much of anything to say when they got out of their comfort zone. I don't hold any of these guys to a very high standard. I just ask that they put up a front that makes them seem at least tolerably decent human beings, even though I expect that most of them are spoiled, self-absorbed pricks.

Tagurt
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Posted: Sat Dec 20, 2014 3:14 pm Post subject:

lakersken80 wrote:

Duncan isn't a day to day player anymore and his minutes are cut drastically.

He has missed only four games and is averaging 32 minutes a night. That's pretty much regular starter minutes. That's hardly a day to day player.

jodeke
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Posted: Sat Dec 20, 2014 5:58 pm Post subject:

Aeneas Hunter wrote:

jodeke wrote:

He didn't go to college but purports himself as one who did. When he's not potty mouthing his conveyance is smartly articulate.

Opinions and preceptions are of ones choosing.

I'm not elevating or judging Kobe by any level of education. I marvel at what he's done to educate himself.

How many "jocks" speak multiple languages? Kobe is fluent in Italian, learning Serbian and French. That's impressive to me.

You say how you see him when the subject is about sports and he seems like a jock. Have you ever heard or read an conversations not on camera, about other subjects? Do you know how he handles them?

AH, you've read my posts, you know I'm not a Kobe jocker. I'm impressed by what he's done to educate himself without going to college, that's all. Am I allowed?

You know Vidal Sassoon didn't graduate high school, impressive.
_________________
Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.

America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves.

Aeneas Hunter
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Posted: Sat Dec 20, 2014 6:31 pm Post subject:

jodeke wrote:

You're allowed to think whatever you want. Bookmark this post. You officially have my permission.

I'm giving you my own impression. He doesn't strike me as any better educated than the typical jock, including the ones who went to college for a year or two (which speaks volumes about "student-athletes," but that is a different subject). Of course, there are guys like Battier who seem to be cut from a different cloth than the typical jock, but that would be an unfair standard for Kobe.

As for being fluent in Italian, come on. He lived in Italy for seven years as a child.

Obviously, I am not privy to the man's private conversations. Come on, man. Do you think I'm a stalker or something? Anyway, I've heard any number of interviews and the like when he was caught candid or taken off script.

jodeke
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Posted: Sat Dec 20, 2014 7:14 pm Post subject:

Aeneas Hunter wrote:

jodeke wrote:

Done, bookmarked

I prfeface my post with "Opinions and preceptions are of ones choosing." You're approaching from one angle, I another. I understand and respect your opinion and impression. I'm not viewing from the same prespective therefore a different allowance.

I'm not comparing him to other "jocks." I'm saying I'm impressed by his self education.

Why didn't you complete the thought"learning Serbian and French?" Completed sights more the gist.

I know, or, I don't believe, you're a stalker, only making a point. You don't know his positions not printed or vidoed.

Candid, off script. Mit Romney ring a bell?
_________________
Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.

America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves.

KobeBryantCliffordBrown
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Posts: 6429

Posted: Sat Dec 20, 2014 9:54 pm Post subject:

[quote="Aeneas Hunter"]

jodeke wrote:

Aeneas Hunter
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Posted: Sat Dec 20, 2014 10:33 pm Post subject:

KobeBryantCliffordBrown wrote:

I think of him as being more intelligent that educated. Maybe a 130 IQ.

A 130 IQ? That's not likely. We do know that he made a 1080 on the SAT back when 1600 was the max and 400 was the min. That's an above average score. SAT scores are different from IQ, of course, but I'd expect someone with a 130 IQ to do considerably better on the SAT. Just for grins, I pulled up an estimator that tries to convert SAT scores from those days to an IQ score. 1080 on the SAT from that era converts to an IQ of about 114. I wouldn't give an estimator a lot of weight, but if you told me that Kobe has an IQ of 114, I would find that believable.

Tagurt
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Posted: Sun Dec 21, 2014 3:48 pm Post subject:

Aeneas Hunter wrote:

KobeBryantCliffordBrown wrote:

I think of him as being more intelligent that educated. Maybe a 130 IQ.

I could actually believe that. I was rated at 134 IQ and I scored 1100 on the SAT(I am six years younger than Kobe) without studying much. If Kobe didn't take much time on studying then I would believe him if he said he had above average IQ.

jodeke
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Posted: Sun Dec 21, 2014 4:52 pm Post subject:

Query: How many 38 year old players are triple teamed? It happens to Kobe game in game out. _________________ Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind. America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves.

Magic2Kobe
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Posted: Sun Dec 21, 2014 5:07 pm Post subject:

This season shouldn't be celebrated as "evidence" of Kobe's longevity. It's an abomination. I know his diehard, unobjective fans just look at PPG and nothing else, but when you dig beyond (outdated) per game stats, Kobe has been downright terrible. He's 426th in defensive RAPM. He's even a net negative offensively. He's shooting 1-26 in the last minute of games. He's turnover prone. The offensive stagnates when he's on the floor. I could on and on. To compare him with other such longevity standard bearers as Kareem, Karl Malone (a choker, yes, but he stayed dominant in the regular season at least), and even Tim Duncan, who is leading the league in pretty much any defensive metric you can think of, is insulting. I apologize if this sounds like "hate," but it's mighty frustrating, as a fan of the LAKERS, to watch. He got his passing Jordan thing. So for the love of God and good basketball, just put him on the injured list.

activeverb
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Posted: Sun Dec 21, 2014 5:25 pm Post subject:

[quote="jodeke] Why didn't you complete the thought"learning Serbian and French?" Completed sights more the gist. [/quote] I'm not sure if this is accurate. There were news reports back in 2008 that he was learning a little Serbian and French because Turif spoke French and Vladimir Radmanovic spoke Serbian. I'm not sure he cares anymore about Serian and French now that those two are long gone, and I'm not sure he ever learned anything but a few Serbian swear words.

jodeke
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Posted: Sun Dec 21, 2014 5:43 pm Post subject:

activeverb wrote:

[quote="jodeke]

Why didn't you complete the thought"learning Serbian and French?" Completed sights more the gist.

Quote:

I'm not sure if this is accurate. There were news reports back in 2008 that he was learning a little Serbian and French because Turif spoke French and Vladimir Radmanovic spoke Serbian.

I'm not sure he cares anymore about Serian and French now that those two are long gone, and I'm not sure he ever learned anything but a few Serbian swear
words.

Could be. Still doesn't alter my admiration for him self educating himself. I don't place him with scholars, I'm only saying I admire his self elevation educationally.

Hey, if any don't share my admiration, so be it, won't change my shelf of respect for him educating himself.
_________________
Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.

America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves.

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