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catman2u
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 22, 2014 3:45 pm    Post subject: Re: Frustrating to no end.

nshid wrote:
catman2u wrote:
In any situation I try to be humble enough to realize I could be wrong. However on many occasions I listen to the feed from the other team and they say almost the exact same things most of us on the forum have been saying. I think it was the game before the announcers were specifically saying that BS has a choice to make, whether to leave the hot 2nd unit it or bring in the failed 1st unit. Of course we know what BS does on the way to losing the game.


But isn't it more important for this team to find their starting lineup for the year and possibly next year?

Granted they would win more games if BS went with the hot hand that night, but wouldn't developing your best starting five be the best move going forward?


The coach doesn't necessarily know the best starting 5 and 2nd 5 unless he tries different combinations. Its what Popovich does.
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Reflexx
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 22, 2014 4:24 pm    Post subject: Re: Frustrating to no end.

catman2u wrote:
nshid wrote:
catman2u wrote:
In any situation I try to be humble enough to realize I could be wrong. However on many occasions I listen to the feed from the other team and they say almost the exact same things most of us on the forum have been saying. I think it was the game before the announcers were specifically saying that BS has a choice to make, whether to leave the hot 2nd unit it or bring in the failed 1st unit. Of course we know what BS does on the way to losing the game.


But isn't it more important for this team to find their starting lineup for the year and possibly next year?

Granted they would win more games if BS went with the hot hand that night, but wouldn't developing your best starting five be the best move going forward?


The coach doesn't necessarily know the best starting 5 and 2nd 5 unless he tries different combinations. Its what Popovich does.


Well, we do know one combination that Scott does NOT like.
Lin/Davis
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Phillycheese
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 22, 2014 6:46 pm    Post subject:

Then he should try Kobe/Davis pnr which was working too. But it's like the pnr is a d'antoni play so Scott feels he cannot depend on it. I'm beginning to think Scott carries too much baggage to be a truly effective coach.
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catman2u
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 22, 2014 7:54 pm    Post subject: Re: Frustrating to no end.

Reflexx wrote:
catman2u wrote:
nshid wrote:
catman2u wrote:
In any situation I try to be humble enough to realize I could be wrong. However on many occasions I listen to the feed from the other team and they say almost the exact same things most of us on the forum have been saying. I think it was the game before the announcers were specifically saying that BS has a choice to make, whether to leave the hot 2nd unit it or bring in the failed 1st unit. Of course we know what BS does on the way to losing the game.


But isn't it more important for this team to find their starting lineup for the year and possibly next year?

Granted they would win more games if BS went with the hot hand that night, but wouldn't developing your best starting five be the best move going forward?


The coach doesn't necessarily know the best starting 5 and 2nd 5 unless he tries different combinations. Its what Popovich does.


Well, we do know one combination that Scott does NOT like.
Lin/Davis


I just saw the most out of touch BS quote. Something like "not going to sacrifice Kobe's well being for wins". IS HE KIDDING? "Sacrificing Kobe's well being is waht is costing the lakers wins. Sheesh.
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A Mad Chinaman
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 23, 2014 7:53 am    Post subject: Re: Frustrating to no end.

catman2u wrote:
Reflexx wrote:
catman2u wrote:
nshid wrote:
catman2u wrote:
In any situation I try to be humble enough to realize I could be wrong. However on many occasions I listen to the feed from the other team and they say almost the exact same things most of us on the forum have been saying. I think it was the game before the announcers were specifically saying that BS has a choice to make, whether to leave the hot 2nd unit it or bring in the failed 1st unit. Of course we know what BS does on the way to losing the game.
But isn't it more important for this team to find their starting lineup for the year and possibly next year?

Granted they would win more games if BS went with the hot hand that night, but wouldn't developing your best starting five be the best move going forward?
The coach doesn't necessarily know the best starting 5 and 2nd 5 unless he tries different combinations. Its what Popovich does.
Well, we do know one combination that Scott does NOT like.
Lin/Davis
I just saw the most out of touch BS quote. Something like "not going to sacrifice Kobe's well being for wins". IS HE KIDDING? "Sacrificing Kobe's well being is waht is costing the lakers wins. Sheesh.
BScott has a dilemma:
Boozer and JLin were not producing as starters against their opposing numbers while they need Swaggy coming off the bench
Facing the issue of whom to give the first chance, he decided that Price would have the first chance since he is a veteran over Clarkson
How many games does he give every different option a chance. Seemingly around 20 games is the appropriate amount of time to give a realistic chance to see if any lineup can work
How does he manage Kobe's PT. He can go the Pop Route by having him have an occasional CDDNP or play around 28-30 minutes. Could that mean the following:
5 minutes at the end of games
9 minutes at the start of the game
5 minutes at the end of the 2nd quarter
9 minutes at the start of the 3rd quarter
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catman2u
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 23, 2014 8:09 am    Post subject: Re: Frustrating to no end.

A Mad Chinaman wrote:
catman2u wrote:
Reflexx wrote:
catman2u wrote:
nshid wrote:
catman2u wrote:
In any situation I try to be humble enough to realize I could be wrong. However on many occasions I listen to the feed from the other team and they say almost the exact same things most of us on the forum have been saying. I think it was the game before the announcers were specifically saying that BS has a choice to make, whether to leave the hot 2nd unit it or bring in the failed 1st unit. Of course we know what BS does on the way to losing the game.
But isn't it more important for this team to find their starting lineup for the year and possibly next year?

Granted they would win more games if BS went with the hot hand that night, but wouldn't developing your best starting five be the best move going forward?
The coach doesn't necessarily know the best starting 5 and 2nd 5 unless he tries different combinations. Its what Popovich does.
Well, we do know one combination that Scott does NOT like.
Lin/Davis
I just saw the most out of touch BS quote. Something like "not going to sacrifice Kobe's well being for wins". IS HE KIDDING? "Sacrificing Kobe's well being is waht is costing the lakers wins. Sheesh.
BScott has a dilemma:
Boozer and JLin were not producing as starters against their opposing numbers while they need Swaggy coming off the bench
Facing the issue of whom to give the first chance, he decided that Price would have the first chance since he is a veteran over Clarkson
How many games does he give every different option a chance. Seemingly around 20 games is the appropriate amount of time to give a realistic chance to see if any lineup can work
How does he manage Kobe's PT. He can go the Pop Route by having him have an occasional CDDNP or play around 28-30 minutes. Could that mean the following:
5 minutes at the end of games
9 minutes at the start of the game
5 minutes at the end of the 2nd quarter
9 minutes at the start of the 3rd quarter


I have an idea. How about BS manage each game. Make adjustments so his 5 on the floor are best against the 5 from the other team. ANYONE can see that Boozer and Lin will never work because Boozer is both a total defensive liability and he sits a mile from the basket ready to take a long 2. Some games he has a hot hand and it works but again, as an offensive strategy it cannot succeed.
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nshid
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 23, 2014 9:29 am    Post subject: Re: Frustrating to no end.

catman2u wrote:
A Mad Chinaman wrote:
catman2u wrote:
Reflexx wrote:
catman2u wrote:
nshid wrote:
catman2u wrote:
In any situation I try to be humble enough to realize I could be wrong. However on many occasions I listen to the feed from the other team and they say almost the exact same things most of us on the forum have been saying. I think it was the game before the announcers were specifically saying that BS has a choice to make, whether to leave the hot 2nd unit it or bring in the failed 1st unit. Of course we know what BS does on the way to losing the game.
But isn't it more important for this team to find their starting lineup for the year and possibly next year?

Granted they would win more games if BS went with the hot hand that night, but wouldn't developing your best starting five be the best move going forward?
The coach doesn't necessarily know the best starting 5 and 2nd 5 unless he tries different combinations. Its what Popovich does.
Well, we do know one combination that Scott does NOT like.
Lin/Davis
I just saw the most out of touch BS quote. Something like "not going to sacrifice Kobe's well being for wins". IS HE KIDDING? "Sacrificing Kobe's well being is waht is costing the lakers wins. Sheesh.
BScott has a dilemma:
Boozer and JLin were not producing as starters against their opposing numbers while they need Swaggy coming off the bench
Facing the issue of whom to give the first chance, he decided that Price would have the first chance since he is a veteran over Clarkson
How many games does he give every different option a chance. Seemingly around 20 games is the appropriate amount of time to give a realistic chance to see if any lineup can work
How does he manage Kobe's PT. He can go the Pop Route by having him have an occasional CDDNP or play around 28-30 minutes. Could that mean the following:
5 minutes at the end of games
9 minutes at the start of the game
5 minutes at the end of the 2nd quarter
9 minutes at the start of the 3rd quarter


I have an idea. How about BS manage each game. Make adjustments so his 5 on the floor are best against the 5 from the other team. ANYONE can see that Boozer and Lin will never work because Boozer is both a total defensive liability and he sits a mile from the basket ready to take a long 2. Some games he has a hot hand and it works but again, as an offensive strategy it cannot succeed.


This is not feasible long term...D'Antoni did this and it was a nightmare.
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LIN17
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 23, 2014 10:00 am    Post subject:

catman2u wrote:
fiendishoc wrote:
A Mad Chinaman wrote:
Richmond wrote:
mhan00 wrote:
Huh, just realized that Kobe had more shots than the rest of the starters combined. That can't be a recipe for success. How often has that happened? I'm sure it does with notorious shot jackers like Iverson and Harden and Westbrook existing, but it can't be too common, can it?

Edit - might be more common than I thought. Westbrook had 27 shots compared to 27 shots by the rest of the starters combined tonight too. Volume shooters are volume shooters I guess.
The difference is that Westbrook is shooting 46% for the year, Kobe is shooting 37%. The 9 turnovers for a shooting guard is pretty obscene also.
the major difference is that Kobe has no other viable scorers outside of Swaggy

JLin is not a confident shooter
Hill is inconsistent
Davis is a reluctant shooter
Johnson is not dependable
Ellington is not playing enough
Sacre is ugh
Boozer is acceptable
Clarkson has not played
Price is awful


It's a no brainer to fix. Play Kobe 30-32 minutes. Start Lin and play him 35 minutes alongside Davis so they can work their 2 man game. Play Swaggy around 37 minutes. Give Ellington and/or Clarkson some PG minutes next to Kobe to further limit Price's playing time. Stop running so many isos, and run more motion and pick and roll. Get the big men involved in more screens and force them to actually roll to the basket. You know.. do some actual coaching.


Lin did the 2 man game so well with Tyson Chandler. I'm sure he could get it going with Ed Davis if EVER given the chance by BS. Once that gets going it opens up the floor for more.



But that would be the D'Antoni system. Do you know how stupid BS would look implementing a system the previous coach just got fired for? Oh wait....nvm
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Reflexx
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 23, 2014 11:19 am    Post subject:

LIN17 wrote:
catman2u wrote:
fiendishoc wrote:
A Mad Chinaman wrote:
Richmond wrote:
mhan00 wrote:
Huh, just realized that Kobe had more shots than the rest of the starters combined. That can't be a recipe for success. How often has that happened? I'm sure it does with notorious shot jackers like Iverson and Harden and Westbrook existing, but it can't be too common, can it?

Edit - might be more common than I thought. Westbrook had 27 shots compared to 27 shots by the rest of the starters combined tonight too. Volume shooters are volume shooters I guess.
The difference is that Westbrook is shooting 46% for the year, Kobe is shooting 37%. The 9 turnovers for a shooting guard is pretty obscene also.
the major difference is that Kobe has no other viable scorers outside of Swaggy

JLin is not a confident shooter
Hill is inconsistent
Davis is a reluctant shooter
Johnson is not dependable
Ellington is not playing enough
Sacre is ugh
Boozer is acceptable
Clarkson has not played
Price is awful


It's a no brainer to fix. Play Kobe 30-32 minutes. Start Lin and play him 35 minutes alongside Davis so they can work their 2 man game. Play Swaggy around 37 minutes. Give Ellington and/or Clarkson some PG minutes next to Kobe to further limit Price's playing time. Stop running so many isos, and run more motion and pick and roll. Get the big men involved in more screens and force them to actually roll to the basket. You know.. do some actual coaching.


Lin did the 2 man game so well with Tyson Chandler. I'm sure he could get it going with Ed Davis if EVER given the chance by BS. Once that gets going it opens up the floor for more.



But that would be the D'Antoni system. Do you know how stupid BS would look implementing a system the previous coach just got fired for? Oh wait....nvm


Previous coach didn't get fired. He resigned. And that was mainly due to Kobe not wanting to play for him and the Lakers not giving him an extension. So with only 1 yr on his contract, butting heads with Kobe would have been a nightmare not dealing with all season.
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trunkz08
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 23, 2014 11:37 am    Post subject:

D'Antoni's system is predicated on ball movement and spacing...noticed how he got fired in NY and LA where Kobe and Melo play...hmmm...
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catman2u
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 23, 2014 7:13 pm    Post subject:

trunkz08 wrote:
D'Antoni's system is predicated on ball movement and spacing...noticed how he got fired in NY and LA where Kobe and Melo play...hmmm...


Sadly when it was Lin with Tyson Chandler and Amare Stoudemire (who was used to p&r with Nash) the Knicks had Linsanity. As soon as selfish Carmelo came back he brought the team down and Woodsen helped let D'Antoni twist in the wind. The next year EVERY player on the Knicks had career years and they did well enough with a 1st round exit though. After that Woodsen showed what a mediocre coach he really is.
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bws94
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 24, 2014 12:33 pm    Post subject:

catman2u wrote:
trunkz08 wrote:
D'Antoni's system is predicated on ball movement and spacing...noticed how he got fired in NY and LA where Kobe and Melo play...hmmm...


Sadly when it was Lin with Tyson Chandler and Amare Stoudemire (who was used to p&r with Nash) the Knicks had Linsanity. As soon as selfish Carmelo came back he brought the team down and Woodsen helped let D'Antoni twist in the wind. The next year EVERY player on the Knicks had career years and they did well enough with a 1st round exit though. After that Woodsen showed what a mediocre coach he really is.


Melo and Lin had some really good games together. Melo didn't feel comfortable in D'Antoni's system and the team started losing. When Melo sort of shut down for D'Antoni, he resigned, Woodson took over, and they played more through Melo on the post. Woodsen started to win at first, but Tyson didn't like him the last season he played for him and sort of quit on him.

Lin is great with some big men, Asik was good but had bad hands, at times he was good with Howard, great with Chandler, potential to be great with Ed Davis, just OK with Boozer and Hill. He's great with 3 point shooters, Novak played his best with Lin and he's great with high flyers, if Wes could do a Landry Fields, Lin and him would be great together. He's not as great with ball-dominant, high-scoring, create-their-own-shots, sometimes facilitate guys like Harden, Kobe, Nick Young, Melo, but those guys are out there and Lin has to learn how to impose his game and will on guys like that, even when they are superstars.
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