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A Mad Chinaman
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Joined: 07 Apr 2005
Posts: 6121

PostPosted: Thu Jan 01, 2015 3:55 pm    Post subject:

bws94 wrote:
A Mad Chinaman wrote:
bws94 wrote:
A Mad Chinaman wrote:
bws94 wrote:
A Mad Chinaman wrote:
bws94 wrote:
Great to have you back DB.

Awesome game. Lakers built a big cushion so Denver's 2nd half bench run didn't get them over the hump. Kobe, even with the TOs, played very well. Price seems to have improved his scoring, he's had a few games now of upper teens scoring. Can't depend on that but it helps, especially if Lin has an off game. Young and Lin didn't do much scoring, for some reason the defense keyed in on Lin in the first half. But Young and Lin will be needed in games to come, so they need to snap back, and they will. Davis will be masked, that's ok. Price looked like he may have hurt something late in the game, but walked it off and it looks like he's ok.
BScott has demonstrated that he will have the players that have been the most effective play in the final moments of the game. There are no guaranteed PT and production is awarded.

JLin shared that it is hard to come off the bench, the flip side is that one has the chance to see how the game is flowing and know what to bring with great energy (translation: make an impact on the game/make things happen). With Boozer and Swaggy being among the most productive players, look forward to when JLin will make similar impact when he is in the game. He certainly has a golden opportunity

Look forward to having Black push JHill to be more effective and to limit his 18 feet BRICKS and get boards - since he is not a rim protector or dunker - consistently

When will Johnson be depended on being able to guard the opposing best player on the opposing team without double teams and set his feet on his shots

Sacre will hopefully still improve his game where he will make more of an effective impact - yes?
Hill seems to be in a shooting slump, maybe he benefitted by Lin finding him, but still, he's missing shots he made earlier this season. Hill needs to do 2 things, find his shot and rebound. He shouldn't be holding the ball high at the top of the key which happens some games. Tonight's game had fine ball movement, well most of the game it did which was refreshing to see.

I've already posted about Lin not being a great option off of the bench but people are convinced he's a bench player. I think he's a developing starter, just needs a coach that will commit to that and maybe he'll find him and maybe not. Even it he comes off the bench, Lin is best with 26-32 minutes and he sometimes takes his good sweet time to make an impact and get into a rhythm. He didn't find one tonight, he didn't have it. Other games will be different, and he'll get them hopefully.
Nobody is given to be a starter or starter minutes - one has to earn it (if he wants to keep it). As Coach Dave has shared many times, it is easy to be a starter, much harder to stay a starter

As a JLin fan, I was hoping that he would do well, especially since he started as a starter (with Nash out) and Kobe taking a personal interest in his growth as a player. Price is now just outplaying him. Maybe he needs to be on a team located in a much smaller market where the expectations are low that will allow him a great deal more PT that will allow him to find his game.

Since he can't close like Parker, Nash, Westbrook, Lillard, Curry, Irving, Walker and DRose - he needs to find a way to make an impact like players such as Rondo and Conley who have inconsistent outside shots but still impact the game
I don't know why you are talking about Lin so much in this thread as it is a thread on the whole team but Price hasn't outplayed Lin overall as a starter. Price had terrible games, good games as did Lin.

I think he is best as a starter and it takes awhile if you play like Lin to adjust to Kobe. That's my opinion. In pre-season Steve Nash said he had potential but needs minutes. Lin is not a finished product at all, he is sloppy. But his upside is higher than Price, he's 6 years younger, and I think he should be playing the minutes however uneven his production is most of the time. You never know when Lin may start playing well as has been shown in a few games this season.

Why is this important? Because Lin is a part of the Lakers that can help the team win. And that's the point of these DB analysis, to try to see how players can be best used to get the best out of the team. Lin is a guy that could use more allotted minutes, around 20 is not enough. This game no, but last game he did with good results although he didn't look that great until the 4th quarter. Young also had a tough game after a good game. Sometimes that happens.
Thank you for identifying why I am focused on him, in addition to being a fan of his

As Boozer and Swaggy has seen, BScott will allow players that are producing PT at the end of game, or not Does he have the higher ceiling, like Wes Johnson, he does. However, the NBA is filled with players that have not fulfilled their greatest potential. Has JLin earn to play 20mpg consistently, nope. Has he shown the potential to be a starter, a few times.

Since JLin or Price have not forced teams to double team them because of their inability to be viable legitimate offensive threats consistently, Kobe is playing PG. if Price is producing on offense, he is getting the most PT

Since this is a PG driven league, the focus is on this position. A good PG will make everybody else better on offense, cause even Sacre can miss a dunk and we will limit JHill from shooting 18' shots while getting clean looks for Ellington/Swaggy/Johnson. Is JLin good enough (now) to be a ball dominant PG right now (over Kobe) and deserve to start over Price - no. If not, Lakers will be looking an elite PG
I don't agree with any of that. Lin played better with higher minutes, was more productive. I think Byron just wanted to play Price because of personal preferences in his style of playing PG. Lin does make others better and especially big men especially Davis but also Boozer, Hill and sometimes Sacre when he gets it going. He's had some of the best feeds to Wes too before he was taken off of the first unit. Kobe is not a point guard, he had 9 turnovers yesterday and makes a ton of them when he plays as a point guard. He's a wonderful facilitating shooting guard, but Kobe is a shooting guard.
JLin played better with more MPG, but he has to earn them. Understand that you feel he is playing better than Price (he has more talent, size and length), but the team was always starting very slow. He has shown flashes during the game that he has skills, he has not been able to close at the end of games resulting in BScott replacing him with Price.

Kobe is facilitating the ball because he is the ONLY player that demands a double team. At the end of games, neither Price or JLin have cause the opposing teams much concern

Price is shooting better because he is now aggressively and with confidence shooting the ball. At the end of games or the last minutes that he is on the floor, JLin is not closing at the hoop or dependable shooting outside shots - hence no double teams.

Understand you want Kobe and BScott to always have him on the court with starter minutes, whether or not he is producing. Maybe learning from Boozer and Swaggy on how to come off the bench might help. Maybe one could think that having Boozer and Swaggy (with no Kobe) would give him the space and freedom to do what you feel he should do - dominate the ball.

The team has been playing better with this rotation. It is acknowledge that this does not change your desire to have JLin starting and playing at the end of games - all the time

It has been fun going back and forth. Now it is time to see if Black will start taking minutes away from either and/or both JHill and Sacre
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nshid
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Joined: 16 Dec 2014
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 02, 2015 7:35 am    Post subject:

Lorenzomax wrote:
Price is averaging 7.8 and 3.6 on 42 FG% when he is the starter. He is just outplaying himself who came off the bench.

Despite NOT playing with E.D. that much, AND playing with Boozer SO much, Lin still ranked #1 at Defensive-RPM among all active Lakers.

2-man line-up MinPlayed
Davis,Ed - Randle,Julius 13
Davis,Ed - Kelly,Ryan 19
Davis,Ed - Henry,Xavier 65
Davis,Ed - Clarkson,Jordan 115
Davis,Ed - Boozer,Carlos 126
Davis,Ed - Sacre,Robert 176
Davis,Ed - Young,Nick 210
Davis,Ed - Lin,Jeremy 213
Davis,Ed - Ellington,Wayne 249
Davis,Ed - Hill,Jordan 387
Davis,Ed - Johnson,Wesley 446
Davis,Ed - Bryant,Kobe 460
Davis,Ed - Price,Ronnie 556

2-man line-up MinPlayed
Boozer,Carlos - Kelly,Ryan 1
Boozer,Carlos - Henry,Xavier 12
Boozer,Carlos - Clarkson,Jordan 68
Boozer,Carlos - Davis,Ed 126
Boozer,Carlos - Price,Ronnie 147
Boozer,Carlos - Ellington,Wayne 176
Boozer,Carlos - Sacre,Robert 222
Boozer,Carlos - Young,Nick 302
Boozer,Carlos - Hill,Jordan 446
Boozer,Carlos - Johnson,Wesley 484
Boozer,Carlos - Bryant,Kobe 568
Boozer,Carlos - Lin,Jeremy 645


DRPM
Last Updated: December 30, 2014 5:00:02 PM PST
http://espn.go.com/nba/statistics/rpm/_/sort/DRPM/position/1

Jeremy Lin -0.15
Nick Young -0.29
Ronnie Price -0.61
Ed Davis -0.73
Carlos Boozer -1.30
Wes Johnson -1.43
Jordan Hill -1.60
Kobe Bryant -3.66



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A Mad Chinaman
Star Player
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Joined: 07 Apr 2005
Posts: 6121

PostPosted: Fri Jan 02, 2015 9:21 am    Post subject:

nshid wrote:
Lorenzomax wrote:
Price is averaging 7.8 and 3.6 on 42 FG% when he is the starter. He is just outplaying himself who came off the bench.

Despite NOT playing with E.D. that much, AND playing with Boozer SO much, Lin still ranked #1 at Defensive-RPM among all active Lakers.

2-man line-up MinPlayed
Davis,Ed - Randle,Julius 13
Davis,Ed - Kelly,Ryan 19
Davis,Ed - Henry,Xavier 65
Davis,Ed - Clarkson,Jordan 115
Davis,Ed - Boozer,Carlos 126
Davis,Ed - Sacre,Robert 176
Davis,Ed - Young,Nick 210
Davis,Ed - Lin,Jeremy 213
Davis,Ed - Ellington,Wayne 249
Davis,Ed - Hill,Jordan 387
Davis,Ed - Johnson,Wesley 446
Davis,Ed - Bryant,Kobe 460
Davis,Ed - Price,Ronnie 556

2-man line-up MinPlayed
Boozer,Carlos - Kelly,Ryan 1
Boozer,Carlos - Henry,Xavier 12
Boozer,Carlos - Clarkson,Jordan 68
Boozer,Carlos - Davis,Ed 126
Boozer,Carlos - Price,Ronnie 147
Boozer,Carlos - Ellington,Wayne 176
Boozer,Carlos - Sacre,Robert 222
Boozer,Carlos - Young,Nick 302
Boozer,Carlos - Hill,Jordan 446
Boozer,Carlos - Johnson,Wesley 484
Boozer,Carlos - Bryant,Kobe 568
Boozer,Carlos - Lin,Jeremy 645


DRPM
Last Updated: December 30, 2014 5:00:02 PM PST
http://espn.go.com/nba/statistics/rpm/_/sort/DRPM/position/1

Jeremy Lin -0.15
Nick Young -0.29
Ronnie Price -0.61
Ed Davis -0.73
Carlos Boozer -1.30
Wes Johnson -1.43
Jordan Hill -1.60
Kobe Bryant -3.66


Early season stats are interesting

Other facts listed at the link
JLin and Price are better than Conley
JLin is playing more than Price
Would you rather have JLin/Price over Conley?
Just wondering
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