I think they will go hard after Aldridge. He will be their main target.
C-Aldridge
Pf-Randle
Sf-Kobe
sg-Russel
Pg-Rondo
Is this very unrealistic ? That team if healthy is a top 4 team in the west. Of course we would need a solid bench. But guys like Brown Black Johnson and of course Clarkson are a good bench core. Plus we would get some other FAs
Aldridge doesn't like to play C and Rondo wouldn't be a good fit with Clarkson.
Joined: 19 Jul 2005 Posts: 14660 Location: unfortunately not Los Angeles anymore
Posted: Sat Apr 25, 2015 8:08 pm Post subject:
Dave20 wrote:
KobeDunk wrote:
I think they will go hard after Aldridge. He will be their main target.
C-Aldridge
Pf-Randle
Sf-Kobe
sg-Russel
Pg-Rondo
Is this very unrealistic ? That team if healthy is a top 4 team in the west. Of course we would need a solid bench. But guys like Brown Black Johnson and of course Clarkson are a good bench core. Plus we would get some other FAs
Aldridge doesn't like to play C and Rondo wouldn't be a good fit with Clarkson.
I think they will go hard after Aldridge. He will be their main target.
C-Aldridge
Pf-Randle
Sf-Kobe
sg-Russel
Pg-Rondo
Is this very unrealistic ? That team if healthy is a top 4 team in the west. Of course we would need a solid bench. But guys like Brown Black Johnson and of course Clarkson are a good bench core. Plus we would get some other FAs
Aldridge doesn't like to play C and Rondo wouldn't be a good fit with Clarkson.
I think they will go hard after Aldridge. He will be their main target.
C-Aldridge
Pf-Randle
Sf-Kobe
sg-Russel
Pg-Rondo
Is this very unrealistic ? That team if healthy is a top 4 team in the west. Of course we would need a solid bench. But guys like Brown Black Johnson and of course Clarkson are a good bench core. Plus we would get some other FAs
Aldridge doesn't like to play C and Rondo wouldn't be a good fit with Clarkson.
clarkson off the bench?
That team, whether healthy or not, would be nowhere near a top 4 team in the west. And I love LMA and would love to get him.
But that's a defensively awful team starting two rookies.
Joined: 30 Nov 2006 Posts: 33474 Location: Long Beach, California
Posted: Sat Apr 25, 2015 8:58 pm Post subject:
We're building for the future. What's the point of Rondo for 1 year? If you're not part of our future, from here on out, you either better be already on the roster or at the end of our bench. The trend of one year rentals should end with last year. _________________ LakersGround's Terms of Service
We're building for the future. What's the point of Rondo for 1 year? If you're not part of our future, from here on out, you either better be already on the roster or at the end of our bench. The trend of one year rentals should end with last year.
it'll stil preserve cap space for 2016. A one year signing or two with a team option after the 1st would make a lot of sense. With J-Lin & Ronnie Price out..that leaves you with Jordan Clarkson..would you rather take Rondo at a low risk, or pay big $$$ for the likes of a Brandon Knight, or Reggie Jackson?
Joined: 30 Nov 2006 Posts: 33474 Location: Long Beach, California
Posted: Sat Apr 25, 2015 9:11 pm Post subject:
usc/lakers wrote:
LakerSanity wrote:
We're building for the future. What's the point of Rondo for 1 year? If you're not part of our future, from here on out, you either better be already on the roster or at the end of our bench. The trend of one year rentals should end with last year.
it'll stil preserve cap space for 2016. A one year signing or two with a team option after the 1st would make a lot of sense. With J-Lin & Ronnie Price out..that leaves you with Jordan Clarkson..would you rather take Rondo at a low risk, or pay big $$$ for the likes of a Brandon Knight, or Reggie Jackson?
First, if you just want to punt cap space, use it on a young player like an Ed Davis type... someone who still could be part of the future, and wouldn't come at the risk of ruining team chemistry or imparting some bad habits on our young guys.
Second, the cap is going to blow up in 2016, so there really is no preserving cap space... especially when you consider how much more cap space we will have with Kobe off the books. We will have more than enough cap space in 2016 whether we use it this year or not. In fact, we should use it on a long term player this year no matter what because what we pay this year will be below market value next year. We need to take advantage of that while we can by getting players on longer deals. Otherwise, we are really wasting our cap space this year.
Third, you don't have to pay for Knight or Jackson either. You can use that money on a zillion other players like Aldridge, Jordan, Lopez, Hibbert, Dragic, Danny Green, Draymond Green, etc.. In other words, use it on players who we want for more than 1 year. The options you present aren't the only ones. Plus, it is conceivable that we may draft another PG, which would make Rondo unnecessary in that circumstance as well.
Fourth, it makes no sense to sign a guy like Rondo for 1 year from a team building stand point... he'll only come for 1 year because he has no other options, which, knowing him, means he will sulk the entire year feeling unappreciated and be a distraction. A guy like Rondo wants respect as a given, he doesn't want to earn it. He also doesn't fit our team because we need shooters, which he isn't.
We're building for the future. What's the point of Rondo for 1 year? If you're not part of our future, from here on out, you either better be already on the roster or at the end of our bench. The trend of one year rentals should end with last year.
it'll stil preserve cap space for 2016. A one year signing or two with a team option after the 1st would make a lot of sense. With J-Lin & Ronnie Price out..that leaves you with Jordan Clarkson..would you rather take Rondo at a low risk, or pay big $$$ for the likes of a Brandon Knight, or Reggie Jackson?
First, if you just want to punt cap space, use it on a young player like an Ed Davis type... someone who still could be part of the future, and wouldn't come at the risk of ruining team chemistry or imparting some bad habits on our young guys.
Second, the cap is going to blow up in 2016, so there really is no preserving cap space... especially when you consider how much more cap space we will have with Kobe off the books. We will have more than enough cap space in 2016 whether we use it this year or not. In fact, we should use it on a long term player this year no matter what because what we pay this year will be below market value next year. We need to take advantage of that while we can by getting players on longer deals. Otherwise, we are really wasting our cap space this year.
Third, you don't have to pay for Knight or Jackson either. You can use that money on a zillion other players like Aldridge, Jordan, Lopez, Hibbert, Dragic, Danny Green, Draymond Green, etc.. In other words, use it on players who we want for more than 1 year. The options you present aren't the only ones. Plus, it is conceivable that we may draft another PG, which would make Rondo unnecessary in that circumstance as well.
Fourth, it makes no sense to sign a guy like Rondo for 1 year from a team building stand point... he'll only come for 1 year because he has no other options, which, knowing him, means he will sulk the entire year feeling unappreciated and be a distraction. A guy like Rondo wants respect as a given, he doesn't want to earn it. He also doesn't fit our team because we need shooters, which he isn't.
Signing Rondo would be a really stupid decision from every angle.
touche not at all for Rondo coming to the Lakers. Just afraid Kobe might get his way as usual. The players you mentioned would be awesome in purple & gold. Really don't need a big signing, just pieces for the future. The one year rentals: Wes Johnson, Boozer, and Lin are definitely no more. Players who had no business being Lakers in the first place made me sick! We'll see what trump card Jimmy boy & Mitch have up their sleeve...
We're building for the future. What's the point of Rondo for 1 year? If you're not part of our future, from here on out, you either better be already on the roster or at the end of our bench. The trend of one year rentals should end with last year.
it'll stil preserve cap space for 2016. A one year signing or two with a team option after the 1st would make a lot of sense. With J-Lin & Ronnie Price out..that leaves you with Jordan Clarkson..would you rather take Rondo at a low risk, or pay big $$$ for the likes of a Brandon Knight, or Reggie Jackson?
Neither. I think a lot of us are warming up to the idea of going with two-three value signings. The Danny Green/Demarre Caroll/Kosta Koufus group. And resigning Davis/Lin would also be an option in this plan, though I'm personally not sold on the latter. I would put this at Plan D, with Plan A being Aldridge or Gasol, Plan B being a pure rim protector like Jordan or Chandler, and Plan C being Dragic. Rondo isn't even Plan Z in my book, unless he comes at $5-7M, and even then it wouldn't be an automatic "DO IT, MITCH!" He's that bad right now, unfortunately, both as a player and a fit on this specific roster...
Joined: 25 Apr 2015 Posts: 31919 Location: Anaheim, CA
Posted: Sun Apr 26, 2015 1:00 am Post subject:
I don't want Rondo on this team for even a minimum contract. Jeremy Lin is better than him, right now. For those that want him, I have to wonder if you actually watch the games? I don't say this to be condescending. I honestly wonder if people have seen him play lately. He always relied on his athleticism with the Celtics and that at least helped him to be a good player, even though he was a poor shooter. But the NBA game has changed since the Celtics' Rondo teams were championship contenders. Perimeter players need to be able to shoot now. Now take into account that since his torn ACL, Rondo has simply lost that plus athleticism that he needed to be good; he can't get by his defender with a quick first step and he can't defend his man effectively anymore. Now take into account that he has MASSIVE BAGGAGE, which is well-documented. Now take into account that he would take minutes away from Clarkson or, well, any other PG we could get. He's just not good anymore. He's a name, and nothing more. He doesn't help in the short-term and he sure as hell doesn't help in the long-term.
Please, please, PLEASE stay away from Rajon Rondo. His presence on this team makes no sense and he would be a net negative even on a minimum contract. If we sign him for big money we will be wasting the cap space we have and, thus, losing out on picking up a legitimate asset. I honestly believe that giving Rondo big money, even for just one year, would be a big blow to this franchise.
Joined: 29 Aug 2004 Posts: 11197 Location: The Other Perspective
Posted: Sun Apr 26, 2015 4:54 am Post subject:
ChickenStu wrote:
I don't want Rondo on this team for even a minimum contract. Jeremy Lin is better than him, right now. For those that want him, I have to wonder if you actually watch the games? I don't say this to be condescending. I honestly wonder if people have seen him play lately. He always relied on his athleticism with the Celtics and that at least helped him to be a good player, even though he was a poor shooter. But the NBA game has changed since the Celtics' Rondo teams were championship contenders. Perimeter players need to be able to shoot now. Now take into account that since his torn ACL, Rondo has simply lost that plus athleticism that he needed to be good; he can't get by his defender with a quick first step and he can't defend his man effectively anymore. Now take into account that he has MASSIVE BAGGAGE, which is well-documented. Now take into account that he would take minutes away from Clarkson or, well, any other PG we could get. He's just not good anymore. He's a name, and nothing more. He doesn't help in the short-term and he sure as hell doesn't help in the long-term.
Please, please, PLEASE stay away from Rajon Rondo. His presence on this team makes no sense and he would be a net negative even on a minimum contract. If we sign him for big money we will be wasting the cap space we have and, thus, losing out on picking up a legitimate asset. I honestly believe that giving Rondo big money, even for just one year, would be a big blow to this franchise.
Well said on all counts. _________________ "Chick lived and breathed Lakers basketball…but he was also fair and objective and called every game the way it was played."
-from Chick: His Unpublished Memoirs and the Memories of Those Who Knew Him
I don't want Rondo on this team for even a minimum contract. Jeremy Lin is better than him, right now. For those that want him, I have to wonder if you actually watch the games? I don't say this to be condescending. I honestly wonder if people have seen him play lately. He always relied on his athleticism with the Celtics and that at least helped him to be a good player, even though he was a poor shooter. But the NBA game has changed since the Celtics' Rondo teams were championship contenders. Perimeter players need to be able to shoot now. Now take into account that since his torn ACL, Rondo has simply lost that plus athleticism that he needed to be good; he can't get by his defender with a quick first step and he can't defend his man effectively anymore. Now take into account that he has MASSIVE BAGGAGE, which is well-documented. Now take into account that he would take minutes away from Clarkson or, well, any other PG we could get. He's just not good anymore. He's a name, and nothing more. He doesn't help in the short-term and he sure as hell doesn't help in the long-term.
Please, please, PLEASE stay away from Rajon Rondo. His presence on this team makes no sense and he would be a net negative even on a minimum contract. If we sign him for big money we will be wasting the cap space we have and, thus, losing out on picking up a legitimate asset. I honestly believe that giving Rondo big money, even for just one year, would be a big blow to this franchise.
Well said on all counts.
Exactly!!!! _________________ Lakers need to build a freaking team !
Joined: 29 Aug 2004 Posts: 11197 Location: The Other Perspective
Posted: Sun Apr 26, 2015 8:24 am Post subject:
Unreliable outside shot, can't defend, but nice passing/court vision. Is Rondo even an upgrade over Kendall Marshall these days? _________________ "Chick lived and breathed Lakers basketball…but he was also fair and objective and called every game the way it was played."
-from Chick: His Unpublished Memoirs and the Memories of Those Who Knew Him
So there's seriously a debate about Rondo? Jeez, hasn't he made it clear that he doesn't have it anymore and that he's more trouble than he's worth? Hey, maybe we should trade for Deron Williams too.
I don't think the Lakers view the future as 5 years from now. They're going to be heavily invested in the next 2 years as well. Sure that doesn't mean they'll trade Randle for a veteran NBA player, but it also means they'll be looking to sign players who are like Rondo - 8-10 year players, who will likely decline once Randle/2015 pick peak in 3-4 years. The whole point is that there's an ultimatum here, Mitch and Jim are on their way out if they don't deliver a WC powerhouse in 2 years.
Personally I totally understand the argument against certain players who'll be declining in 3 years (or possibly before) just when we anticipate something stellar from Randle and this year's draft pick. But, realistically the Lakers can't justify to their ticket holders and even within the Buss clan, possibly being in the lottery another few years.
I understand that Rondo is not the player he once was but I can't stand this Bob Ryen-esque, Overreaction Tuesday assertions.
Straight up saying that you wouldn't take Rondo even if he came for free, or paid the Lakers?
That Jeremy Lin is "way better" than him?
Hopefully other FOs feel the same way most of you do so his value keeps tanking and the Lakers can get him at a bargain.
I think if Rondo could be had for $5-$8 million it would be a steal, and totally worth the risk.
He was averaging 8 PTS, 11 AST, 8 REBs on a mediocre Celtics team before getting traded to the Mavs. Near triple-double averages.
The jumpshooting is potentially fixable. The player he is most compared to (J. Kidd) evolved into a great 3 point shooter over time.
Perhaps Kobe and Nash could help Rondo with his jumpshot, much in the same way Kobe helped Ariza, that made him into the 3-point sniper that was so crucial to the 09 chip run.
We're talking about a guy who is still only 29 and showed that he is capable of doing this:
Lin is making 8 M a year (Well at least against the cap) so lets assume that's what Rondo would cost (although the anticipation is a team that gets Rondo pays him more than 8 M a year).
Anyway, the first problem in this Lin < Rondo argument - Lin wasn't even a good investment. The main attribute to the Lin trade was the draft pick. I didn't think Lin was going to be anything but a short term guy and a backup on a good team.
You don't want to continue overpaying PG's who can't lead you to the playoffs do you? I do agree that an engaged Rondo (post ACL and all) is better than Lin. However, it still wouldn't justify adding Rondo to a roster for that much money.
My main point is - even if Rondo > Lin, it still doesn't mean it's a good signing. I totally get the concern in signing someone like Rondo.
Joined: 14 Apr 2001 Posts: 144468 Location: The Gold Coast
Posted: Sun Apr 26, 2015 10:29 am Post subject:
usc/lakers wrote:
LakerSanity wrote:
We're building for the future. What's the point of Rondo for 1 year? If you're not part of our future, from here on out, you either better be already on the roster or at the end of our bench. The trend of one year rentals should end with last year.
it'll stil preserve cap space for 2016. A one year signing or two with a team option after the 1st would make a lot of sense. With J-Lin & Ronnie Price out..that leaves you with Jordan Clarkson..would you rather take Rondo at a low risk, or pay big $$$ for the likes of a Brandon Knight, or Reggie Jackson?
Luckily there are more options than that. Better options. _________________ RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023.
Joined: 14 Apr 2001 Posts: 144468 Location: The Gold Coast
Posted: Sun Apr 26, 2015 10:32 am Post subject:
wolfpaclaker wrote:
I don't think the Lakers view the future as 5 years from now. They're going to be heavily invested in the next 2 years as well. Sure that doesn't mean they'll trade Randle for a veteran NBA player, but it also means they'll be looking to sign players who are like Rondo - 8-10 year players, who will likely decline once Randle/2015 pick peak in 3-4 years. The whole point is that there's an ultimatum here, Mitch and Jim are on their way out if they don't deliver a WC powerhouse in 2 years.
Personally I totally understand the argument against certain players who'll be declining in 3 years (or possibly before) just when we anticipate something stellar from Randle and this year's draft pick. But, realistically the Lakers can't justify to their ticket holders and even within the Buss clan, possibly being in the lottery another few years.
Rondo started declining last season. There are better options for similar money to get some wins now. _________________ RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023.
I think they will go hard after Aldridge. He will be their main target.
C-Aldridge
Pf-Randle
Sf-Kobe
sg-Russel
Pg-Rondo
Is this very unrealistic ? That team if healthy is a top 4 team in the west. Of course we would need a solid bench. But guys like Brown Black Johnson and of course Clarkson are a good bench core. Plus we would get some other FAs
Aldridge doesn't like to play C and Rondo wouldn't be a good fit with Clarkson.
People keep ignoring this fact.
If we get Towns/Okafor to play center then maybe he'd be slightly interested. I don't think he'll be running to L.A. to play aside Robert Sacre.
Even in this dream scenario that we get Towns/Okafor and then sign Aldridge, the gap in age between our young guys and Aldridge would be too great. Shaq was just entering his prime when we drafted Kobe. They had time to grow together. If we get Aldridge at 30 we have a very small window.
Doesn't make a lot of sense. San Antonio makes the most sense for him. I just don't see him being a good fit in the Lakers' long term plans.
Joined: 25 Apr 2015 Posts: 31919 Location: Anaheim, CA
Posted: Sun Apr 26, 2015 10:39 am Post subject:
Batguano wrote:
Yeah, I don't know...
I understand that Rondo is not the player he once was but I can't stand this Bob Ryen-esque, Overreaction Tuesday assertions.
Straight up saying that you wouldn't take Rondo even if he came for free, or paid the Lakers?
That Jeremy Lin is "way better" than him?
Hopefully other FOs feel the same way most of you do so his value keeps tanking and the Lakers can get him at a bargain.
I think if Rondo could be had for $5-$8 million it would be a steal, and totally worth the risk.
He was averaging 8 PTS, 11 AST, 8 REBs on a mediocre Celtics team before getting traded to the Mavs. Near triple-double averages.
The jumpshooting is potentially fixable. The player he is most compared to (J. Kidd) evolved into a great 3 point shooter over time.
Perhaps Kobe and Nash could help Rondo with his jumpshot, much in the same way Kobe helped Ariza, that made him into the 3-point sniper that was so crucial to the 09 chip run.
We're talking about a guy who is still only 29 and showed that he is capable of doing this:
Yes, right now, Jeremy Lin is a better basketball player than Rajon Rondo. And, yes, I don't want him even for a minimum deal. I was not being dramatic. I simply don't want him on this team for the reasons I mentioned. Just on the baggage alone he would be a net negative for this squad. I realize that we have to sign some veterans in the next 2 years to mix with the young guys we're going to have. But the vet signings MUST be solid signings. Between Rondo's level of play falling off a cliff and the baggage, we can't risk using valuable cap space on him. And even though I'm steadfast in my belief that we shouldn't even sign him for cheap, we all know that, realistically, he's going to cost some money. WE NEED TO STAY AWAY HERE!
Joined: 25 Apr 2015 Posts: 31919 Location: Anaheim, CA
Posted: Sun Apr 26, 2015 10:50 am Post subject:
wolfpaclaker wrote:
Quote:
That Jeremy Lin is "way better" than him?
Lin is making 8 M a year (Well at least against the cap) so lets assume that's what Rondo would cost (although the anticipation is a team that gets Rondo pays him more than 8 M a year).
Anyway, the first problem in this Lin < Rondo argument - Lin wasn't even a good investment. The main attribute to the Lin trade was the draft pick. I didn't think Lin was going to be anything but a short term guy and a backup on a good team.
You don't want to continue overpaying PG's who can't lead you to the playoffs do you? I do agree that an engaged Rondo (post ACL and all) is better than Lin. However, it still wouldn't justify adding Rondo to a roster for that much money.
My main point is - even if Rondo > Lin, it still doesn't mean it's a good signing. I totally get the concern in signing someone like Rondo.
I was saying that just to illustrate how far Rondo has fallen. I don't think Lin is great, although he would make a fine backup PG if the money were reasonable. This season Rondo's PER was 13.5, with a .037 Win Shares Per 48 minutes played and a 0.8 VORP. Lin had a 15.6 PER with .068 WS/48 Mins and a 0.6 VORP.
Rondo is essentially an even-worse version of Patrick Beverley at this point. Neither guy can shoot but Beverley still plays elite D, something Rondo doesn't do anymore. (And by the way, Beverley has much better numbers in terms of WS/48 and VORP than Rondo does, though PER doesn't like him as much.)
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not at all for Rondo coming to the Lakers. Just afraid Kobe might get his way as usual. The players you mentioned would be awesome in purple & gold. Really don't need a big signing, just pieces for the future. The one year rentals: Wes Johnson, Boozer, and Lin are definitely no more. Players who had no business being Lakers in the first place made me sick! We'll see what trump card Jimmy boy & Mitch have up their sleeve...
