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Dennis_D
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 Posted: Thu Apr 02, 2015 7:24 am Post subject: "Boston’s front office has run circles around the Lakers..." |
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At times, I wonder if sports writers read their own articles. Zach Lowe has an article up on Grantland that is comically self-contradictory.
| Zach Lowe wrote: | | It says everything about the difficulty of rebuilding that Boston has absolutely nailed Phase 1 and yet has no clear path to 50 wins. |
If they don't have a clear path to 50 wins, I'd say that haven't absolutely nailed Phase 1 of the rebuild.
Zach, tell us more about how they "absolutely nailed Phase I".
| Zach Lowe wrote: | | [T]hey have no stars and no clear path to getting one outside a major break in free agency or the trade market. The Celtics have made the leap to mediocrity so fast that they may have no easy way out. They’re still not good, but they’re not bad enough to get an early first-round pick — to get a clear shot at a star, in other words. Even if they lose this season’s slap fight for the final Eastern Conference playoff spot, they will likely pick in the late lottery — a range that looks like their draft ceiling for the next few seasons. |
That sounds like a total failure to me - that the Celtics are in the worst position an NBA team can find itself.
I would define "absolutely nailed Phase I" of a rebuild as acquiring three potential stars. If Clarkson, Randle and the Lakers 2015 top 5 pick all look like potential stars, then I would say the Lakers absolutely nailed Phase I of their rebuild.
| Zach Lowe wrote: | | The Celtics have as many as six extra first-round picks coming and oodles of cap space, they’ve drafted solid players across the first round, and they just acquired a dynamic young point guard — Isaiah Thomas — on the cheap. |
Kudos to the C's for acquiring all those first-round picks. But have "they’ve drafted solid players across the first round"? Let's look at their recent first-round draft history:
2010 - #19 Avery Bradley
Bradley is the C's current starting SG. He's undersized and contributes little besides scoring. Zach Lowe describes him as "a ravenous defender with legit 3-point range, but he shoots too many long 2s early in the shot clock and needs a dynamic off-the-dribble guy to create shots for him".
2011 - #27 JaJuan Johnson (after draft day trade)
Played 36 games in the NBA
2012 - #21 Jared Sullinger
2012 - #22 Fab Melo
Zach Lowe describes Sullinger as "chronically out of shape and hasn’t cracked 30 percent from deep." Melo played 6 games in the NBA
2013 - #13 Kelly Olynyk (after draft day trade)
Zach Lowe describes Olynyk as "a shooting big man who struggles on defense and doesn’t shoot all that well yet".
2014 - #6 Marcus Smart
2014 - #17 James Young
Smart just suffered through a brutal March - 8.5 ppg on 32.9% shooting, 4.5 rpg, 2.5 apg, 1.4 TO, 1.8 Stl, 0.4 bpg in in 30.0 mpg. Zach Lowe writes "Smart is going to be an assassin on defense, but he has looked uncomfortable running the pick-and-roll; he doesn’t drive much, and Boston usually has at least one other ball handler on the floor to ease his workload". James Young has yoyoed constantly between the C's and the D-League and has played only 308 minutes.
I don't find the Celtics drafting record inspiring. Having all those draft picks isn't going to help them if they keep drafting more Sullingers and Melos.
Is Isaiah Thomas "on the cheap"? He has a 4 year, $27M contract. That's not even cheap for a starter and he's a back up. If he becomes a starter (not unlikely), then picking Smart over Payton, Randle and a certain Laker drafted in the second round looks even worse.
Strikes me that the whole premise of the article is based on a superficial assessment of the Celtics - they're competing for a playoff spot early for a rebuild and they have a ton of future draft picks. They must be doing a great job!
Making predictions is hard, particularly about the future, but I'm happier with a foundation of Clarkson, Randle, Black and hopefully a top 5 draft pick over what the Celtics have.
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oldschool32
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| Posted: Thu Apr 02, 2015 7:27 am Post subject: |
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Boston has drafted a bunch of role players. They will be stuck in mediocrity for a long time, under that path.
Ainge is the same screw up as before KG and Allen. Those guys fell into his lap, and saved his career. Other than that, a big fat zero. I'm really hoping they make the playoffs so they can get destroyed in the 1st round, and miss out on the lotto. Although, do they have someone else's lotto pick this year?
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pmacla
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| Posted: Thu Apr 02, 2015 7:29 am Post subject: |
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Lowe grew up a Ball Boy for the Celtics and writes for Celtic Fan Boy Simmons site, he will always up play anything Celtics do and take shots at Lakers whenever he can, he will always deny this but proof is in the writing.
There are quite a few former Celtic writers and lifelong Celtic fans that are prominent NBA writers and thus that is why you feel there is bias, I cant think of one NBA national writer who could be charachterized a Laker homer |
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yinoma2001
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| Posted: Thu Apr 02, 2015 7:29 am Post subject: |
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I'd rather be in Philly's shoes than Boston's. However, this summer for the Lakers will be a very important one.
1. whether we get a top 5 pick, and if so, whether we nail it;
2. whether Randle can resume his career and dominate like we would like him to;
3. what free agents will come to the Lakers in 2015;
4. what Kobe and the team will do about him after this season.
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oldschool32
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| Posted: Thu Apr 02, 2015 7:41 am Post subject: |
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If Clarkson can continue to play well, and Randle pans out to be the double double machine most thought he can be the Lakers will be on the fast track to getting back to contending. Add in a top 5 pick if we are lucky, and we will be well ahead of Boston in a rebuild race. We haven't even began to add in any free agents yet. Clarkson looking like a starter, has really been a steal. It's almost like having two lotto picks from last year. He can really help shorten the rebuild time.
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yinoma2001
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| Posted: Thu Apr 02, 2015 7:52 am Post subject: |
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| pmacla wrote: | Lowe grew up a Ball Boy for the Celtics and writes for Celtic Fan Boy Simmons site, he will always up play anything Celtics do and take shots at Lakers whenever he can, he will always deny this but proof is in the writing.
There are quite a few former Celtic writers and lifelong Celtic fans that are prominent NBA writers and thus that is why you feel there is bias, I cant think of one NBA national writer who could be charachterized a Laker homer |
regardless he's easily my favorite NBA writer.
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yinoma2001
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| Posted: Thu Apr 02, 2015 7:53 am Post subject: |
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| oldschool32 wrote: | | If Clarkson can continue to play well, and Randle pans out to be the double double machine most thought he can be the Lakers will be on the fast track to getting back to contending. Add in a top 5 pick if we are lucky, and we will be well ahead of Boston in a rebuild race. We haven't even began to add in any free agents yet. Clarkson looking like a starter, has really been a steal. It's almost like having two lotto picks from last year. He can really help shorten the rebuild time. |
The advantage we will have is that Boston will likely have to trade for its big stars, while we can trade AND lure them here via free agency.
If we can come out of this summer with say Towns, Randle, Clarkson we are well on that way.
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ocho
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| Posted: Thu Apr 02, 2015 7:58 am Post subject: |
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| Boston has done a nice job of liquidating their assets for maximum value. Got picks for old players and even their coach. Of course, with picks it's what you do with them. |
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Reflexx
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| Posted: Thu Apr 02, 2015 8:04 am Post subject: |
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They started before the Lakers and really don't look like they're much further ahead, if they're even ahead at all.
I wouldn't be surprised if we were better than them by next season. |
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yinoma2001
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| Posted: Thu Apr 02, 2015 8:04 am Post subject: |
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| Reflexx wrote: | They started before the Lakers and really don't look like they're much further ahead, if they're even ahead at all.
I wouldn't be surprised if we were better than them by next season. |
The one thing that they do have on the Lakers is better coaching IMO. I'll take Stevens over Scott all day. At least there's a system he's implemented for 2 years now. Scott? Probably gone by 2016 and we start all over.
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Anthony Peeler
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| Posted: Thu Apr 02, 2015 8:07 am Post subject: |
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| yinoma2001 wrote: | I'd rather be in Philly's shoes than Boston's. However, this summer for the Lakers will be a very important one.
1. whether we get a top 5 pick, and if so, whether we nail it;
2. whether Randle can resume his career and dominate like we would like him to;
3. what free agents will come to the Lakers in 2015;
4. what Kobe and the team will do about him after this season. |
Exactly. A strong "Phase I" isn't just getting 3 potential stars, it's also getting rid of flotsam and jetsam like Nick Young, and unfortunately, Kobe. It's also about accumulating picks for the long-term, as Hinkie is doing right now.
The worst part about Randle getting injured was that we couldn't evaluate whether he's a fake star like Antoine Walker or Al Jefferson or a true star. A true star becomes apparent even in his rookie year.
Most championship teams usually have one, if not two, superstars -- Magic, Kareem, and Worthy's Lakers; Bird, McHale, and Parish's Celtics; Jordan, Pippen, and Rodman's Bulls; Olajuwon's Rockets; Duncan's Spurs; Shaq and Kobe's Lakers; Dirk's Mavericks; Wade and Shaq's Heat; Lebron, Wade, and Bosh's Heat. These are not just stars but Top 50 All-time NBA Superstars. Only the Pistons in mid-2000s were the exception to this rule.
A bad scenario is if we become just good enough to make the WCF but not good enough to win the championship, like the Malone/Stockton Jazz or the Ewing Knicks or Kemp/Payton Sonics. |
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Chronicle
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| Posted: Thu Apr 02, 2015 8:36 am Post subject: |
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Great post, as always 
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panamaniac
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| Posted: Thu Apr 02, 2015 8:44 am Post subject: |
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| Unless Robert Parrish becomes the GM of the Pelicans and giftwraps them Anthony Davis, I don't see the Celtics as real players for a while. |
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Megaton
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| Posted: Thu Apr 02, 2015 9:00 am Post subject: |
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Here's the thing: Celtics did a great job collecting picks/assets. The problem is, they drafted a bunch of role players (Avery Bradley, Jared Sullinger, Marcus Smart).
Despite the dumb, brainless moves this FO have made (or lack of moves as well) in the last couple of years, SOMEHOW, the Lakers would be in an amazing position in the future if we keep the top 5 pick. And why? Because they found a diamond in the rough in the 2nd round and got a stud with a 7 pick last year.
Just because the Celtics are literally one game away from being in the playoffs this year doesn't mean they are in a better position. It just means they will be stuck in mediocrity for years to come unless they pull a KG/Ray Allen, and making the 8th seed in the East is like winning the special Olympics at this current joke of an Eastern Conference.
It just means they will get knocked out of the playoffs in 4/5 games of the playoffs and then only have a 17th pick or so to show for it. It could still be good of course but not at the level you want it to be long term. And with the way the Celtics have been drafting, I don't like their chances.
As far as I'm concerned, despite all the screw ups, it's the other way around. The Lakers, if they keep the top 5 pick, will have run circles over the Celtics. Not the other way around. Clarkson, Randle, and the top 5 pick is better than anything the Celtics have right now. |
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22
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| Posted: Thu Apr 02, 2015 9:15 am Post subject: |
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Agreed with the OP and many others.
I remember there was a thread here not too long ago complaining how far the Celtics are ahead of us in the re-build. I said it then too. We are far ahead of them.
Clutchson & Randle are better than any young prospect the C's have. If we keep our top 5 pick then we'll have another one better than anything they got. All of their picks don't have a ton of value because they aren't really high. Sure it gives them more flexibility, but as of yet they don't have much to show for it.
The only area in which they are ahead is coaching. B Scott may be a terrible coach in totality, but he does do a good job in building culture/character. When Kobe retires we'll get a coach who is also good at modern X's & O's too |
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Chronicle
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| Posted: Thu Apr 02, 2015 9:16 am Post subject: |
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Is this the nickname? 
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JoJo Dancer
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| Posted: Thu Apr 02, 2015 9:28 am Post subject: |
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| ocho wrote: | | Boston has done a nice job of liquidating their assets for maximum value. Got picks for old players and even their coach. Of course, with picks it's what you do with them. |
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22
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| Posted: Thu Apr 02, 2015 9:40 am Post subject: |
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| Chronicle wrote: |
Is this the nickname? |
That's the one I'm going with Chron man!
Ever since that game winning tip-in in SPL it's been evident this kid has the clutch gene. When we played Philly I knew we were going to win if Philly let Clutchson get the ball. I saw the fire in his eyes 
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32
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| Posted: Thu Apr 02, 2015 9:46 am Post subject: |
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Grantland + Lowe = Laker haters.
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10scott10
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| Posted: Thu Apr 02, 2015 9:47 am Post subject: |
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| The key difference was that they we're willing to trade away players who are important to their team's history, while we tried to take care of ours. |
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tony smith
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| Posted: Thu Apr 02, 2015 9:49 am Post subject: |
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| 10scott10 wrote: | | The key difference was that they we're willing to trade away players who are important to their team's history, while we tried to take care of ours. |
Yup. And if we lose our pick this year... there will be no denying that Boston's FO is indeed running circles around us. |
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Laker's Fan
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| Posted: Thu Apr 02, 2015 9:51 am Post subject: |
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Yes, Ainge has put Boston in a good position to "potentially" come up big. But he did so by backing the truck up over a group of players who had earned the right to remain Celtics. He found a mark in Brooklyn and got an unbelievable deal so at least he can point to being "blown away". But any respectable veteran will have noticed that you cannot earn tenure with that franchise.
The Lakers on the other hand have a different code. Dr. Buss set up the Laker culture to always let a champion defend their title (looking at you M Cuban) and to honor those who bring you success even if there are other cutthroat options that seem "better". Some of that is honor, some is thinking long term where you can point to that philosophy in recruiting future players. You might make the case it's not a feature that will move the needle in free agency, but we'll see.
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22
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| Posted: Thu Apr 02, 2015 9:54 am Post subject: |
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| tony smith wrote: | | 10scott10 wrote: | | The key difference was that they we're willing to trade away players who are important to their team's history, while we tried to take care of ours. |
Yup. And if we lose our pick this year... there will be no denying that Boston's FO is indeed running circles around us. |
would you trade our roster, cap situation, and FO for theirs? I sure as heck wouldn't. We are ahead of them in every area except HC IMO |
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Chronicle
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| Posted: Thu Apr 02, 2015 9:57 am Post subject: |
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| 22 wrote: | | tony smith wrote: | | 10scott10 wrote: | | The key difference was that they we're willing to trade away players who are important to their team's history, while we tried to take care of ours. |
Yup. And if we lose our pick this year... there will be no denying that Boston's FO is indeed running circles around us. |
would you trade our roster, cap situation, and FO for theirs? I sure as heck wouldn't. We are ahead of them in every area except HC IMO |
Yup
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yinoma2001
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| Posted: Thu Apr 02, 2015 9:58 am Post subject: |
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| 22 wrote: | | tony smith wrote: | | 10scott10 wrote: | | The key difference was that they we're willing to trade away players who are important to their team's history, while we tried to take care of ours. |
Yup. And if we lose our pick this year... there will be no denying that Boston's FO is indeed running circles around us. |
would you trade our roster, cap situation, and FO for theirs? I sure as heck wouldn't. We are ahead of them in every area except HC IMO |
Well, the Lakers always enjoyed the advantage of...LA.
Assuming we get their assets/roster/coach and get to run it all in LA...?
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