Why is Mudiay so high on mock draft boards?
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 03, 2015 4:27 pm    Post subject: Why is Mudiay so high on mock draft boards?

Why is Mudiay so high on mock draft boards? Clarkson is extremely solid and if were not going to draft a big then why not look for a 2 guard such as Russel or Winslow "take your pick". Is Mudiay really that good of a player to potentially stop all the momentum that we have going on with Clarkson? Thanks in advance
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 03, 2015 4:38 pm    Post subject:

because he is a 19 year old athletic pg? I really can't tell you. I am not high o him, his shot and FT% scare me to death.
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 03, 2015 4:38 pm    Post subject:

Because his name sort of rhymes with "Ali Bomaye?"
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 03, 2015 4:39 pm    Post subject:

Because outside of shooting, he's got some amazing tools. If he had a shot like Russell there would be no question who the better pick was
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 03, 2015 4:43 pm    Post subject:

Because he looked better in HS than China.
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 03, 2015 4:49 pm    Post subject:

Been going to bat for this dude, so there's no reason to stop now.

IMO, he looks special. He's a legit 6'5" 200 lb'er at age 18, so he could easily be 6'6" 210. But even if he doesn't grow another inch, he's a big, TRUE PG.

The most special thing about him to me is his "feel for the game". Already has shown an uncanny passing ability, ability to get to the paint at will & finish in traffic, and rebounding skills. Reminds me of a D-Wade with true PG skills.

He's an unpolished product, though, and he played overseas. So he doesn't have as much exposure. And he also has some holes in his game to work on, like his FT%, his shot, and being consistent with his decision-making. But if he can round off his edges, I really think the sky's the limit. I think he has much more offensive game than John Wall or Russell Westbrook at the same age, but he's bigger & stronger than both, but perhaps a tad bit less freak athlete. But he's as good or better a passer than either, in terms of his creativity and instincts.

Others on here hate him for some reason. And it's no knock against any other prospect. But I see his potential upside, and it is as high as it gets, IMO.

If you're curious about him, take a look at the McDonalds 2014 game, where IMO, along with Okafor, and to a lesser extent, Towns & Russell, he stood out amongst all of the draft hopefuls. He's legit.
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 03, 2015 5:06 pm    Post subject:

1. The comparisons against Wall and Russell don't compute athletically. They showed in HS, but not in China. Don't care how many games. He should be out speeding everyone. He isn't.

2. He has elite size at PG. So does DeAngelo Russell. One can argue, Dunn is up there too. They all have 6'3"+ height and 6'8"+ wingspans.

3. Dunn, Mudiay, and Russell are all shifty, so it depends on what you want. If you want quickness/speed, it's Dunn of the three. If you want the strongest with body control, it's Mudiay. If you want flat out PG IQ, it's Russell.

4. Passing. Dunn has the 50% assist rate. Yes, it comes with 4 turnovers, but he's not exactly loaded with teammates from Kentucky. Mudiay had a target or two in China. Russell is by himself. All of them are near 2:1 A/TO ratios. Russell is the guy who shows the best ability to pass. Dunn is flat out playmaking. Mudiay is just making the simple plays.

5. Age. Honestly, don't even care if Dunn is a junior. Those are polished skills in terms of PnR play, playmaking, pull up on the mid-range, and ball anticipation. Mudiay can get to that point. Russell is flat out elite with passing in halfcourt and transition situations. It's the ability to finish and athleticism that are question marks; of course this has me leaning to Dunn still.

6. Who has more feel for the game than Russell? He's making the tough plays. Dunn has the 50% assist rate. There are quantifiable statistics and things seen on the floor that show feel. How does Mudiay have more?

7. Honestly, not knocking the guy. This is a different draft class; Top heavy, talented through 13 picks, and dies out by the end of the 1st round. In any other draft, Mudiay is easily 1 or 2, but when Towns, Russell, and Okafor have proven more against competition with more effort, it's Mudiay that slips.
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 03, 2015 5:09 pm    Post subject:

Mudiay is the Exum of this draft. People sometimes get crazy and overhype players overseas, or players we have hardly seen.

Let the mock draft sites overhype him. All that means is that if we get a 4th pick, it will increase the chances of landing a true star guard Russell instead of that bust.
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 03, 2015 5:10 pm    Post subject:

How is this laker related? We're getting rondo. We're not drafting a younger version of him.
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 03, 2015 5:10 pm    Post subject:

Megaton wrote:
Mudiay is the Exum of this draft. People sometimes get crazy and overhype players overseas, or players we have hardly seen.

Let the mock draft sites overhype him. All that means is that if we get a 4th pick, it will increase the chances of landing a true star guard Russell instead of that bust.


I think Mudiay is better than that. He repeatedly attacks the rim. Exum was more opportunistic.

I also don't think Mudiay is a bust. He's still a jumpshot and some discipline away from being a 6'5" Jrue Holiday.

That's legit.
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 03, 2015 5:13 pm    Post subject:

Mike@LG wrote:
Megaton wrote:
Mudiay is the Exum of this draft. People sometimes get crazy and overhype players overseas, or players we have hardly seen.

Let the mock draft sites overhype him. All that means is that if we get a 4th pick, it will increase the chances of landing a true star guard Russell instead of that bust.


I think Mudiay is better than that. He repeatedly attacks the rim. Exum was more opportunistic.

I also don't think Mudiay is a bust. He's still a jumpshot and some discipline away from being a 6'5" Jrue Holiday.

That's legit.


He won't be. Again I'm not falling for the same crap many people did with Exum.

Besides, Lakers already have their PG. Having another PG in the backcourt that can't shoot makes no sense. Russell at least has star potential and already a very good shooter. He would complement much better with Clarkson than Mudiay ever will.
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 03, 2015 5:22 pm    Post subject:

Megaton wrote:
Mike@LG wrote:
Megaton wrote:
Mudiay is the Exum of this draft. People sometimes get crazy and overhype players overseas, or players we have hardly seen.

Let the mock draft sites overhype him. All that means is that if we get a 4th pick, it will increase the chances of landing a true star guard Russell instead of that bust.


I think Mudiay is better than that. He repeatedly attacks the rim. Exum was more opportunistic.

I also don't think Mudiay is a bust. He's still a jumpshot and some discipline away from being a 6'5" Jrue Holiday.

That's legit.


He won't be. Again I'm not falling for the same crap many people did with Exum.

Besides, Lakers already have their PG. Having another PG in the backcourt that can't shoot makes no sense. Russell at least has star potential and already a very good shooter. He would complement much better with Clarkson than Mudiay ever will.


For every Exum, there's a Giannis Antetokounmpo.

No one wants to miss that.
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 03, 2015 5:26 pm    Post subject:

Mike@LG wrote:
Megaton wrote:
Mike@LG wrote:
Megaton wrote:
Mudiay is the Exum of this draft. People sometimes get crazy and overhype players overseas, or players we have hardly seen.

Let the mock draft sites overhype him. All that means is that if we get a 4th pick, it will increase the chances of landing a true star guard Russell instead of that bust.


I think Mudiay is better than that. He repeatedly attacks the rim. Exum was more opportunistic.

I also don't think Mudiay is a bust. He's still a jumpshot and some discipline away from being a 6'5" Jrue Holiday.

That's legit.


He won't be. Again I'm not falling for the same crap many people did with Exum.

Besides, Lakers already have their PG. Having another PG in the backcourt that can't shoot makes no sense. Russell at least has star potential and already a very good shooter. He would complement much better with Clarkson than Mudiay ever will.


For every Exum, there's a Giannis Antetokounmpo.

No one wants to miss that.


Miss what exactly? Greek Freak is not exactly a star or have that kind of potential either. He's solid no doubt but not a "can't miss" player.
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 03, 2015 5:29 pm    Post subject:

Megaton wrote:
Mike@LG wrote:
Megaton wrote:
Mike@LG wrote:
Megaton wrote:
Mudiay is the Exum of this draft. People sometimes get crazy and overhype players overseas, or players we have hardly seen.

Let the mock draft sites overhype him. All that means is that if we get a 4th pick, it will increase the chances of landing a true star guard Russell instead of that bust.


I think Mudiay is better than that. He repeatedly attacks the rim. Exum was more opportunistic.

I also don't think Mudiay is a bust. He's still a jumpshot and some discipline away from being a 6'5" Jrue Holiday.

That's legit.


He won't be. Again I'm not falling for the same crap many people did with Exum.

Besides, Lakers already have their PG. Having another PG in the backcourt that can't shoot makes no sense. Russell at least has star potential and already a very good shooter. He would complement much better with Clarkson than Mudiay ever will.


For every Exum, there's a Giannis Antetokounmpo.

No one wants to miss that.


Miss what exactly? Greek Freak is not exactly a star or have that kind of potential either. He's solid no doubt but not a "can't miss" player.


I disagree. 7'6" arms, center's hands, and can go end-to-end. He may not scream franchise player, but you can bet the Lakers can teach him to defend PF and SF, while get better touch from the perimeter.

The Lakers would kill for that kind of versatility at PF or SF. A Randle/Antetokoumpo front court would be great for transition and D.
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 03, 2015 5:31 pm    Post subject:

Mike@LG wrote:
Megaton wrote:
Mike@LG wrote:
Megaton wrote:
Mike@LG wrote:
Megaton wrote:
Mudiay is the Exum of this draft. People sometimes get crazy and overhype players overseas, or players we have hardly seen.

Let the mock draft sites overhype him. All that means is that if we get a 4th pick, it will increase the chances of landing a true star guard Russell instead of that bust.


I think Mudiay is better than that. He repeatedly attacks the rim. Exum was more opportunistic.

I also don't think Mudiay is a bust. He's still a jumpshot and some discipline away from being a 6'5" Jrue Holiday.

That's legit.


He won't be. Again I'm not falling for the same crap many people did with Exum.

Besides, Lakers already have their PG. Having another PG in the backcourt that can't shoot makes no sense. Russell at least has star potential and already a very good shooter. He would complement much better with Clarkson than Mudiay ever will.


For every Exum, there's a Giannis Antetokounmpo.

No one wants to miss that.


Miss what exactly? Greek Freak is not exactly a star or have that kind of potential either. He's solid no doubt but not a "can't miss" player.


I disagree. 7'6" arms, center's hands, and can go end-to-end. He may not scream franchise player, but you can bet the Lakers can teach him to defend PF and SF, while get better touch from the perimeter.

The Lakers would kill for that kind of versatility at PF or SF. A Randle/Antetokoumpo front court would be great for transition and D.


We can just draft Winslow? He will likely end up being the better player anyway if we draft four.
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 03, 2015 5:33 pm    Post subject:

Megaton wrote:
Mike@LG wrote:
Megaton wrote:
Mike@LG wrote:
Megaton wrote:
Mudiay is the Exum of this draft. People sometimes get crazy and overhype players overseas, or players we have hardly seen.

Let the mock draft sites overhype him. All that means is that if we get a 4th pick, it will increase the chances of landing a true star guard Russell instead of that bust.


I think Mudiay is better than that. He repeatedly attacks the rim. Exum was more opportunistic.

I also don't think Mudiay is a bust. He's still a jumpshot and some discipline away from being a 6'5" Jrue Holiday.

That's legit.


He won't be. Again I'm not falling for the same crap many people did with Exum.

Besides, Lakers already have their PG. Having another PG in the backcourt that can't shoot makes no sense. Russell at least has star potential and already a very good shooter. He would complement much better with Clarkson than Mudiay ever will.


For every Exum, there's a Giannis Antetokounmpo.

No one wants to miss that.


Miss what exactly? Greek Freak is not exactly a star or have that kind of potential either. He's solid no doubt but not a "can't miss" player.


As Mike said, he's far from Exum. It's a lazy and short sighted comparison on your part for very obvious reasons.
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 03, 2015 5:35 pm    Post subject:

Megaton wrote:
Mike@LG wrote:
Megaton wrote:
Mike@LG wrote:
Megaton wrote:
Mike@LG wrote:
Megaton wrote:
Mudiay is the Exum of this draft. People sometimes get crazy and overhype players overseas, or players we have hardly seen.

Let the mock draft sites overhype him. All that means is that if we get a 4th pick, it will increase the chances of landing a true star guard Russell instead of that bust.


I think Mudiay is better than that. He repeatedly attacks the rim. Exum was more opportunistic.

I also don't think Mudiay is a bust. He's still a jumpshot and some discipline away from being a 6'5" Jrue Holiday.

That's legit.


He won't be. Again I'm not falling for the same crap many people did with Exum.

Besides, Lakers already have their PG. Having another PG in the backcourt that can't shoot makes no sense. Russell at least has star potential and already a very good shooter. He would complement much better with Clarkson than Mudiay ever will.


For every Exum, there's a Giannis Antetokounmpo.

No one wants to miss that.


Miss what exactly? Greek Freak is not exactly a star or have that kind of potential either. He's solid no doubt but not a "can't miss" player.


I disagree. 7'6" arms, center's hands, and can go end-to-end. He may not scream franchise player, but you can bet the Lakers can teach him to defend PF and SF, while get better touch from the perimeter.

The Lakers would kill for that kind of versatility at PF or SF. A Randle/Antetokoumpo front court would be great for transition and D.


We can just draft Winslow? He will likely end up being the better player anyway if we draft four.


Because he's not a franchise player.
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 03, 2015 5:36 pm    Post subject:

Megaton:

Don't fault Mudiay for Exum getting overhyped. They're apples & oranges. And by the way, again, the book isn't closed on Exum. He's what? 20 years old?!?!?!? WAAAY to early to call him a bust. He was always going to be a project.

Exum is a tall skinny ball-handling guard who, at his full potential, could be a Shawn Livingston type. He can be good in the pick & roll, and shows some nice shooting ability for his age & transition ability. But he's never going to be a guy who makes his living in the paint, or absorbing contact. He also doesn't have a lot of creativity near the basket. He's just not a scorer, plain & simple. And if he does become a scorer, it'll be because he became a drastically better shooter.

Mudiay, on the other hand, is more of a traditional "American" style PG. He loves to get into the lane & either make the pass or score. He's also shown some nice ability to initiate or take contact & go for the And-1's. He's just WAY more physical than Exum ever will be.

I don't consider any of these guys busts. It's way too early to write off any of these kids. Contrary to popular belief on this board, I actually think Mudiay will be a star. But regardless, just keep an open mind, man.
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 03, 2015 5:36 pm    Post subject:

Mike@LG wrote:
Megaton wrote:
Mike@LG wrote:
Megaton wrote:
Mike@LG wrote:
Megaton wrote:
Mike@LG wrote:
Megaton wrote:
Mudiay is the Exum of this draft. People sometimes get crazy and overhype players overseas, or players we have hardly seen.

Let the mock draft sites overhype him. All that means is that if we get a 4th pick, it will increase the chances of landing a true star guard Russell instead of that bust.


I think Mudiay is better than that. He repeatedly attacks the rim. Exum was more opportunistic.

I also don't think Mudiay is a bust. He's still a jumpshot and some discipline away from being a 6'5" Jrue Holiday.

That's legit.


He won't be. Again I'm not falling for the same crap many people did with Exum.

Besides, Lakers already have their PG. Having another PG in the backcourt that can't shoot makes no sense. Russell at least has star potential and already a very good shooter. He would complement much better with Clarkson than Mudiay ever will.


For every Exum, there's a Giannis Antetokounmpo.

No one wants to miss that.


Miss what exactly? Greek Freak is not exactly a star or have that kind of potential either. He's solid no doubt but not a "can't miss" player.


I disagree. 7'6" arms, center's hands, and can go end-to-end. He may not scream franchise player, but you can bet the Lakers can teach him to defend PF and SF, while get better touch from the perimeter.

The Lakers would kill for that kind of versatility at PF or SF. A Randle/Antetokoumpo front court would be great for transition and D.


We can just draft Winslow? He will likely end up being the better player anyway if we draft four.


Because he's not a franchise player.


No but he has all star written all over him, which is more than I can say for Greek Freak.

And certainly much more than Mudiay.
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 03, 2015 5:38 pm    Post subject:

Quote:

No but he has all star written all over him, which is more than I can say for Greek Freak.

And certainly much more than Mudiay.


I disagree.

Winslow is everything you want in a role player/wing, not as a playmaker.

You don't think Greek Freak would give Winslow fits on both ends of the floor?
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 03, 2015 5:41 pm    Post subject:

Mike@LG wrote:
Quote:

No but he has all star written all over him, which is more than I can say for Greek Freak.

And certainly much more than Mudiay.


I disagree.

Winslow is everything you want in a role player/wing, not as a playmaker.

You don't think Greek Freak would give Winslow fits on both ends of the floor?


Nope. I completely disagree.

Winslow is strong, has motor, can do pretty much everything well on offense besides ball handling, which can easily be fixed. You're thinking of Stanley Johnson, not Winslow.

Greak Freak doesn't matter to me. He's not on the Lakers, he's not a free agent nor will he be for a very long time, and Bucks aren't going to trade him. So whether he would give fits to Winlsow in his rookie year is not a concern.
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 03, 2015 5:46 pm    Post subject:

Megaton wrote:
Mike@LG wrote:
Quote:

No but he has all star written all over him, which is more than I can say for Greek Freak.

And certainly much more than Mudiay.


I disagree.

Winslow is everything you want in a role player/wing, not as a playmaker.

You don't think Greek Freak would give Winslow fits on both ends of the floor?


Nope. I completely disagree.

Winslow is strong, has motor, can do pretty much everything well on offense besides ball handling, which can easily be fixed. You're thinking of Stanley Johnson, not Winslow.

Greak Freak doesn't matter to me. He's not on the Lakers, he's not a free agent nor will he be for a very long time, and Bucks aren't going to trade him. So whether he would give fits to Winlsow in his rookie year is not a concern.


Winslow can't create his own shot unless it's transition.

Ball handling isn't easily fixed. At least he has the Euro step, far more advanced than Johnson.

That's a 3rd option on offense.
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 03, 2015 5:49 pm    Post subject:

Mike@LG wrote:
Megaton wrote:
Mike@LG wrote:
Quote:

No but he has all star written all over him, which is more than I can say for Greek Freak.

And certainly much more than Mudiay.


I disagree.

Winslow is everything you want in a role player/wing, not as a playmaker.

You don't think Greek Freak would give Winslow fits on both ends of the floor?


Nope. I completely disagree.

Winslow is strong, has motor, can do pretty much everything well on offense besides ball handling, which can easily be fixed. You're thinking of Stanley Johnson, not Winslow.

Greak Freak doesn't matter to me. He's not on the Lakers, he's not a free agent nor will he be for a very long time, and Bucks aren't going to trade him. So whether he would give fits to Winlsow in his rookie year is not a concern.


Winslow can't create his own shot unless it's transition.

Ball handling isn't easily fixed. At least he has the Euro step, far more advanced than Johnson.

That's a 3rd option on offense.


Can't create his own shot? I've seen the exact opposite in March Madness thus far. Hell, Winslow has been the main reason for Duke winning games right now. Every time the game gets close, they give the ball to Winslow and suddenly the game is out of reach.

Considering we have Clarkson and Randle as a part of the future core, 3rd option ain't so bad. That'so a pretty damn good 3rd option that would be 2nd option on most teams when it is all said and done.
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 03, 2015 5:55 pm    Post subject:

Megaton wrote:
Mike@LG wrote:
Megaton wrote:
Mike@LG wrote:
Quote:

No but he has all star written all over him, which is more than I can say for Greek Freak.

And certainly much more than Mudiay.


I disagree.

Winslow is everything you want in a role player/wing, not as a playmaker.

You don't think Greek Freak would give Winslow fits on both ends of the floor?


Nope. I completely disagree.

Winslow is strong, has motor, can do pretty much everything well on offense besides ball handling, which can easily be fixed. You're thinking of Stanley Johnson, not Winslow.

Greak Freak doesn't matter to me. He's not on the Lakers, he's not a free agent nor will he be for a very long time, and Bucks aren't going to trade him. So whether he would give fits to Winlsow in his rookie year is not a concern.


Winslow can't create his own shot unless it's transition.

Ball handling isn't easily fixed. At least he has the Euro step, far more advanced than Johnson.

That's a 3rd option on offense.


Can't create his own shot? I've seen the exact opposite in March Madness thus far. Hell, Winslow has been the main reason for Duke winning games right now. Every time the game gets close, they give the ball to Winslow and suddenly the game is out of reach.

Considering we have Clarkson and Randle as a part of the future core, 3rd option ain't so bad. That'so a pretty damn good 3rd option that would be 2nd option on most teams when it is all said and done.


I watch Duke religiously and have watched Winslow closely this year because he started the season looking like Duke's best player, then had some struggles as he worked his way back from an injury, and is now firing on all cylinders again.

At his best, he is an athletic wrecking ball going from end to end with pace and power. His shot is very inconsistent but he can knock it down if he catches and shoots on balance and in rhythm. On defense, he can reasonably defend 2-4 because of his size, strength, and quickness.

If he can develop a consistent jumper (probable, he has no serious mechanical flaws that aren't correctable) and improves his ballhandling, Winslow can be comparable to a left handed Andre Iguodala. So I'd say his ceiling is a 1 or 2 time all star if on the right team, but will be a role player on a championship team. So as Mike says, not a franchise guy, but a very very good role player.
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iceberg01
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 03, 2015 6:19 pm    Post subject:

Mike@LG wrote:
1. The comparisons against Wall and Russell don't compute athletically. They showed in HS, but not in China. Don't care how many games. He should be out speeding everyone. He isn't.

2. He has elite size at PG. So does DeAngelo Russell. One can argue, Dunn is up there too. They all have 6'3"+ height and 6'8"+ wingspans.

3. Dunn, Mudiay, and Russell are all shifty, so it depends on what you want. If you want quickness/speed, it's Dunn of the three. If you want the strongest with body control, it's Mudiay. If you want flat out PG IQ, it's Russell.

4. Passing. Dunn has the 50% assist rate. Yes, it comes with 4 turnovers, but he's not exactly loaded with teammates from Kentucky. Mudiay had a target or two in China. Russell is by himself. All of them are near 2:1 A/TO ratios. Russell is the guy who shows the best ability to pass. Dunn is flat out playmaking. Mudiay is just making the simple plays.

5. Age. Honestly, don't even care if Dunn is a junior. Those are polished skills in terms of PnR play, playmaking, pull up on the mid-range, and ball anticipation. Mudiay can get to that point. Russell is flat out elite with passing in halfcourt and transition situations. It's the ability to finish and athleticism that are question marks; of course this has me leaning to Dunn still.

6. Who has more feel for the game than Russell? He's making the tough plays. Dunn has the 50% assist rate. There are quantifiable statistics and things seen on the floor that show feel. How does Mudiay have more?

7. Honestly, not knocking the guy. This is a different draft class; Top heavy, talented through 13 picks, and dies out by the end of the 1st round. In any other draft, Mudiay is easily 1 or 2, but when Towns, Russell, and Okafor have proven more against competition with more effort, it's Mudiay that slips.


#3 on your list is the heart of our difference in preference. I like Russell a lot too. I really do. I just feel that a physical leader at a given position is a huge advantage. And that's the biggest difference between Mudiay & Russell. Russell's slight and will probably always be. So, IMO, he has to become a shooter, which is fine.

But on the other hand, guys with the physical advantage at ANY given position can attack EVERY team where it hurts: in the lane, where they can get to the line or get bigs in trouble. Mudiay, IMO, fits into that latter category: from day one, no one, even Westbrook, Wall, or any of the bigger PG's, will be able to keep him out of the lane. And shame on a little PG in his way. HUGE advantage. Even if Eric Bledsoe, with his current skill set (& I think Mudiay is a better true PG than Bledsoe is), would be an absolute BEAST at 6'5" 200+
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