A Suddenly Somewhat Promising Future.
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 13, 2015 1:13 pm    Post subject: A Suddenly Somewhat Promising Future.

Everyone seems to think the future of the Lakers is so bleak and dark, but really that couldn't be further from the truth.

That's not to say I see us being a championship team in two years because as much of an optimist as I am I wouldn't anticipate the return to glory being that quickly.

Keeping the pick is huge. That goes without saying. You're talking about being up to conceivably have three young players to build around. Basically three lottery picks. Yes we know Clarkson was a second rounder, but he sure as hell hasn't played like one. He should finish at least top 3 in the voting for rookie of the year or there should be an investigation.

I'm not trying to anoint the kid because he is just a rookie after all, but being a Lakers fan as long as I have as a lot of you have when was the last time we had a young, electric, athletic player at the point guard position like Clarkson? It has been quite some time. Of course there are things he needs to work on.

Stu highlighted last night sometimes he dribbles too high in the midst of traffic and that can lead to turnovers. His defense is subpar at best, but so is Andrew Wiggins who was seen as somebody who is gonna be a lockdown defender because of his premier athletic ability and defensive instincts. Point being most expect him to improve so there's no reason Clarkson can't improve as well on the defensive end.

Now Julius Randle. Suffered a freak, terrible injury on opening night. All signs however point to him coming back at 100 percent. I'm no doctor, but it didn't look nearly as bad as Paul George's injury in July and he's already back and playing at a high level. Yes I realize Randle has yet to even really play in the NBA. All we've basically seen is him in the pre-season and Summer League and now awhole lot can be put into that. However the skill set is evident. Julius isn't the tallest guy, but he is supremely skilled for a big man. The ability to post, ball handling skills, combined with his physicality and his athleticism and ability to beat his man off the dribble is something very rare. Much like Clarkson he needs to improve defensively and finishing with his right hand because in the NBA teams will force him away from his strong end. He seems to be as dedicated and detrimened as any young player coming into this league. You see his interviews and he always talks about his love for the game of basketball, wanting to get back, getting better and better and I have no doubt he will.

Now to the pick. The Lakers deserve to be critiqued for not providing better protection to the pick however think back to the trade did anyone actually think we'd be where we're? In regards to being in the draft lottery twice in a row. Nobody anticipated Nash's career ending in the manner in which it did or Kobe suffering an assortment of season ending injuries that have severely hampered him. Again doesn't excuse not protecting the pick better, but you can see why they were so confident they weren't gonna lose that pick. Still and all we have over an 80 percent chance of keeping it and if we do it gives us three building blocks. That's not a bleak future. That's a potentially bright and very bright future.
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 13, 2015 1:19 pm    Post subject:

Completely agree with the OP. I see a bright future. Especially if we keep the top 5 pick
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 13, 2015 1:33 pm    Post subject:

Let's save this post until 5/19/15.
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 13, 2015 1:36 pm    Post subject:

yinoma2001 wrote:
Let's save this post until 5/19/15.


Why?

Even if we don't keep the pick that would be a blow, but we'd still have Clarkson and Randle.

That's not a bad start to a rebuild.

You still have Kobe coming off the books next season and plenty of cap room along with two young players with a lot of potential to attract a free agent or two.
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 13, 2015 1:40 pm    Post subject:

I agree that we have a bright future. We could be really good as soon as next season, with the right moves and if a little luck comes our way. We need to surround Randle and Clarkson with a defensive center and some defensive wing player that are good three point shooters. Such players should be available in the draft, free agency and maybe trade. My blue print is currently as follows:

Draft
#4 Cauley Stein - defensive center
#28 Anderson- 3 and D wing
#34 Luwalu- 3 and D wing

Free Agency
Danny Green- proven 3 and D wing who was a starter on a championship team
I would give him 4years/48million

Tyson Chandler - proven defensive center who was also a starter on a championship team
I would give him 3years/what ever money we have left

JJ Barea- solid back up PG who was a key member of a championship team
I would give him the 2.8 million room exception

PF-Randle 18ppg, 9rpg, 3.5apg
SF-Green 12ppg, 1.5spg, 42% threes
C-Chandler 8ppg, 8rpg, 1bpg in 24mpg
PG-Clarkson 16ppg, 5rpg, 6apg
SG-Bryant 18ppg in 28mpg
SG/SF - Young 13ppg in 28mpg
C-Cauley Stein 7ppg, 6rpg, 2bpg in 24mpg
PG-Barea 4ppg, 3apg, 38% threes
PF-Kelly/Black
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 13, 2015 1:44 pm    Post subject:

Or worst case scenario: Clarkson's play is inflated by lack of star players around him, he falls, Randle comes back but is an under-achiever and doesn't really fit anywhere, possibly injury prone and also we lose our pick. That would be pretty crappy.
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 13, 2015 1:47 pm    Post subject:

everything comes down to the lottery and how we do. if we win the lottery - or even get a top 2 pick - this would be huge for our franchise in terms of a quick rebuild turnaround.

guys...keep in mind we're in a unique position of basically plugging in two lottery picks next season as julius randle didn't play this year. i'm starting to think we lucked out in the last draft with him. look at the three selections after the consensus top 3 (before randle got picked): aaron gordon (didn't get a lot of minutes this year...definetly a solid player...but the type of player with a game and body that has limited ceiling), dante exum (had worse season out of these three...has potential but right now is passive and needs development), and marcus smart (good defense and hungry....but undersized and is a chucker...not sure he will surpass or even meet the hype on nba level). would pick randle over these three all day (maybe exum might be tough to pass on if he were to improve over the next couple years).

randle was considered a top 2 or 3 pick early on at one point during last year's college season. i feel all the reasons for his stock drop last year aren't really related to his actual game (injury history, etc).

if we get a top 2 pick next month:

jordan clarkson + julius randle + okafor or towns = amazing young core heading forward for the lakers franchise. that's a sick frontcourt. we have kobe for his final season...keep jabari brown and tarik black while filling out our bench and getting rid of all the other scrubs from this year.

this scenario would be huge and attractive for our free agency next year and moving forward. although durant is likely going to his home town wizards, you don't think he would consider l.a. and a team like this to lead?

towns vs okafor: i honestly feel towns defense n type of game would probably complement randle better (better team defense, pick n roll defense, shot blocking, better defensive instincts than okafor overall)....but its really really tough to pass on okafor's skill and power and impact on offense.....he's a beast on the block...i'm sure with the right development and schooling he can be an adequate defender in the nba. (hopefully he's not the next coming of sacramento kings-version boogie couisins - big numbers, no impact).
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 13, 2015 1:51 pm    Post subject:

The truth is we have the possibility of looking promising....Clarkson can be a rotation player with the hope of being better than that...Randle I think will be a great player but the truth is we don't know yet.. If we're smart and get the right player in the draft i.e Russell, Winslow, WCS we're off to a good start.

As for the FA's we don't know...If the FO gives a max to Rondo then you'll know right away the future is not bright...If we're patient and possibly end up with Westbrook in a couple of years among others then yes the future is promising.
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 13, 2015 1:52 pm    Post subject:

Saka wrote:
Or worst case scenario: Clarkson's play is inflated by lack of star players around him, he falls, Randle comes back but is an under-achiever and doesn't really fit anywhere, possibly injury prone and also we lose our pick. That would be pretty crappy.


Clarkson's stats aren't inflated.

Inflated is when you take a lot of shots to get a lot of points on a garbage team.

That's not what's occured here.

This is a kid who's been efficient offensively. Hasn't taken many bad shots. All within the flow of the offense. Been aggressive. Created open shots off penetration. His three point shot has gotten better as the season has gone on. I don't see any of those things dissipating with better players. If anything it should and will make him even more efficient and harder to stop.
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 13, 2015 1:54 pm    Post subject:

Saka wrote:
Or worst case scenario: Clarkson's play is inflated by lack of star players around him


This is precisely why I expect the Lakers to go after a PG no matter what even the D-Leaguers like Brown and Buyks have looked solid playing for a team that has no star power .... it kinda reminds me off how the Sixers have so many unknowns having a career year.... there is no doubt that Clarkson will have a back-seat once the roster is more complete... any one can look good playing for this team it's a free for all system... I don't trust Clarkson yet and it's the right to have that notion feeling.
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 13, 2015 1:57 pm    Post subject:

If Lakers can have a little luck and get the first pick, the last two years of disastrous monstrosity would not have been in vain. They would build their future front court with Okafor and Randle and then it would mean a huge opportunity to get a prized free agent this year and then Durant in 2016.
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 13, 2015 2:03 pm    Post subject:

Lakers2015 wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
Let's save this post until 5/19/15.


Why?

Even if we don't keep the pick that would be a blow, but we'd still have Clarkson and Randle.

That's not a bad start to a rebuild.

You still have Kobe coming off the books next season and plenty of cap room along with two young players with a lot of potential to attract a free agent or two.


If we lose this pick, GT and Yinoma are gonna go on a rampage. I get scared thinking about it.
Clarkson has exceeded all our expectations coming into this season. He was a great draft pick. But that's just step 1 to the rebuild.
Randle hasn't played enough for us to know what value he brings to our rebuilding efforts.
The salary cap will go up for everybody in the league 2016. So alot of teams will have cap room and competition will be stiffer than usual for prize FAs.
I'm not trying to sound pessimistic, but Jim and Mitch have a tough road ahead.
Getting a top 5 draft pick and a NBA-starter caliber FA (or two) this offseason would go a long way.
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 13, 2015 2:05 pm    Post subject:

No one's even mentioned Black. The kid is a tough sob - he's the type of role player you need to compete for a title.
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 13, 2015 2:08 pm    Post subject: Re: A Suddenly Somewhat Promising Future.

Lakers2015 wrote:
Everyone seems to think the future of the Lakers is so bleak and dark, but really that couldn't be further from the truth.

That's not to say I see us being a championship team in two years because as much of an optimist as I am I wouldn't anticipate the return to glory being that quickly.

Keeping the pick is huge. That goes without saying. You're talking about being up to conceivably have three young players to build around. Basically three lottery picks. Yes we know Clarkson was a second rounder, but he sure as hell hasn't played like one. He should finish at least top 3 in the voting for rookie of the year or there should be an investigation.

I'm not trying to anoint the kid because he is just a rookie after all, but being a Lakers fan as long as I have as a lot of you have when was the last time we had a young, electric, athletic player at the point guard position like Clarkson? It has been quite some time. Of course there are things he needs to work on.

Stu highlighted last night sometimes he dribbles too high in the midst of traffic and that can lead to turnovers. His defense is subpar at best, but so is Andrew Wiggins who was seen as somebody who is gonna be a lockdown defender because of his premier athletic ability and defensive instincts. Point being most expect him to improve so there's no reason Clarkson can't improve as well on the defensive end.

Now Julius Randle. Suffered a freak, terrible injury on opening night. All signs however point to him coming back at 100 percent. I'm no doctor, but it didn't look nearly as bad as Paul George's injury in July and he's already back and playing at a high level. Yes I realize Randle has yet to even really play in the NBA. All we've basically seen is him in the pre-season and Summer League and now awhole lot can be put into that. However the skill set is evident. Julius isn't the tallest guy, but he is supremely skilled for a big man. The ability to post, ball handling skills, combined with his physicality and his athleticism and ability to beat his man off the dribble is something very rare. Much like Clarkson he needs to improve defensively and finishing with his right hand because in the NBA teams will force him away from his strong end. He seems to be as dedicated and detrimened as any young player coming into this league. You see his interviews and he always talks about his love for the game of basketball, wanting to get back, getting better and better and I have no doubt he will.

Now to the pick. The Lakers deserve to be critiqued for not providing better protection to the pick however think back to the trade did anyone actually think we'd be where we're? In regards to being in the draft lottery twice in a row. Nobody anticipated Nash's career ending in the manner in which it did or Kobe suffering an assortment of season ending injuries that have severely hampered him. Again doesn't excuse not protecting the pick better, but you can see why they were so confident they weren't gonna lose that pick. Still and all we have over an 80 percent chance of keeping it and if we do it gives us three building blocks. That's not a bleak future. That's a potentially bright and very bright future.


Here's a video of how good Wiggin's defense could be in a couple of years

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kJnarXYrFSs]

We don't know what we have in Randle and I won't even consider the pick ours until its announced.

Clarkson has been a nice surprise and I hope he continues to improve his game.

I have big doubts about our FO in FA especially their penchant to lock up players where we have to give away assets to get them out of here.
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 13, 2015 2:16 pm    Post subject:

Yes they are, this coming from obviously a fan of Clarkson who has his image as his avatar. I'll try to be objective, he does have promise to be a solid NBA player, but on a bad team any rookie given the green light (which BS totally gave him) can put up mad stats. When you have absolute carte blanche in a dismal season its easy to get caught up with the good but not the bad. He's had the ball in his hand to dictate the flow as he wanted. He's taken the entire shot clock down multiple times and throw up bad shots. Everyone is giving him the rookie break now because well he is one, only time will tell in his Soph year and so forth. When losing really counts and bad play, i have a feeling fans won't be so forgiving. I've seen enough rookies look promising to fall off fast in all sports.

Quote:


Clarkson's stats aren't inflated.

Inflated is when you take a lot of shots to get a lot of points on a garbage team.

That's not what's occured here.

This is a kid who's been efficient offensively. Hasn't taken many bad shots. All within the flow of the offense. Been aggressive. Created open shots off penetration. His three point shot has gotten better as the season has gone on. I don't see any of those things dissipating with better players. If anything it should and will make him even more efficient and harder to stop.
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 13, 2015 2:19 pm    Post subject:

HAKMamba24 wrote:
Yes they are, this coming from obviously a fan of Clarkson who has his image as his avatar. I'll try to be objective, he does have promise to be a solid NBA player, but on a bad team any rookie given the green light (which BS totally gave him) can put up mad stats. When you have absolute carte blanche in a dismal season its easy to get caught up with the good but not the bad. He's had the ball in his hand to dictate the flow as he wanted. He's taken the entire shot clock down multiple times and throw up bad shots. Everyone is giving him the rookie break now because well he is one, only time will tell in his Soph year and so forth. When losing really counts and bad play, i have a feeling fans won't be so forgiving. I've seen enough rookies look promising to fall off fast in all sports.

Quote:




Clarkson's stats aren't inflated.

Inflated is when you take a lot of shots to get a lot of points on a garbage team.

That's not what's occured here.

This is a kid who's been efficient offensively. Hasn't taken many bad shots. All within the flow of the offense. Been aggressive. Created open shots off penetration. His three point shot has gotten better as the season has gone on. I don't see any of those things dissipating with better players. If anything it should and will make him even more efficient and harder to stop.

That is false
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 13, 2015 2:23 pm    Post subject:

If we lose the pick it would be a major fail. I don't care what anyway tries to say otherwise. It would be a fail of epic proportions. lol
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 13, 2015 2:29 pm    Post subject:

This I can agree on, Lakers didn't obviously try to tank hard enough and chose to mix in player development, if this bites the Lakers in the behind it will have repercussions for years to come. I could care less what any player was putting up stat wise or moral victories late in the year. Thanks for nothing scrubs.



Troublesome626 wrote:
If we lose the pick it would be a major fail. I don't care what anyway tries to say otherwise. It would be a fail of epic proportions. lol
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 13, 2015 2:33 pm    Post subject:

overall...in general....i wouldn't underrate or dismiss clarkson's game and development. he's balled it up against some of the best point guards (video game dame lillard...cp3...etc). cp3 recently even commented on him after the second back to back clippers game saying the kid can really play and has a bright future.

he's definitely still learning....he's still a rook and he has ways to go. he needs to establish his defensive game and identity, but he also has a great mid range game and great feel and instincts for the game. the whole "padding your stats on a (bleep) team" argument is legit....but that doesn't necessarily work against clarkson's game and development. sure a buycks can put up numbers on a (bleep) team....but can he hold his own and ball up against the best of the best like clarkson has shown in his first year?

ultimately, does this mean clarkson is the future point guard for the lakers? depends. the draft and management's competence are big factors. personally...i think it would be HORRIBLE and misguided if the lakers signed rondo to the max this summer. i would bank on the draft and continue developing clarkson....wait it out....rondo aint putting us over the top to win a ring plus more free agency options will present themselves next year and the year after.

my top 4 picks (assuming we land somewhere in the top 4):

1. okafor
2. karl anthony towns
3. d'angello russell (if we pick him....hoping he becomes a james harden-type and can play the 2 alongside clarkson once kobe retires)
4. justise winslow (future do-it-all 3 for the lakers leading the core with clarkson and randle)
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 13, 2015 2:48 pm    Post subject:

yinoma2001 wrote:
Let's save this post until 5/19/15.


came in to make the same exact same post
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 13, 2015 2:53 pm    Post subject:

I agree, the bleak and dark was last season and this season, not the future.
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 13, 2015 2:59 pm    Post subject: Re: A Suddenly Somewhat Promising Future.

Lakers2015 wrote:
Everyone seems to think the future of the Lakers is so bleak and dark, but really that couldn't be further from the truth.

That's not to say I see us being a championship team in two years because as much of an optimist as I am I wouldn't anticipate the return to glory being that quickly.

Keeping the pick is huge. That goes without saying. You're talking about being up to conceivably have three young players to build around. Basically three lottery picks. Yes we know Clarkson was a second rounder, but he sure as hell hasn't played like one. He should finish at least top 3 in the voting for rookie of the year or there should be an investigation.

I'm not trying to anoint the kid because he is just a rookie after all, but being a Lakers fan as long as I have as a lot of you have when was the last time we had a young, electric, athletic player at the point guard position like Clarkson? It has been quite some time. Of course there are things he needs to work on.

Stu highlighted last night sometimes he dribbles too high in the midst of traffic and that can lead to turnovers. His defense is subpar at best, but so is Andrew Wiggins who was seen as somebody who is gonna be a lockdown defender because of his premier athletic ability and defensive instincts. Point being most expect him to improve so there's no reason Clarkson can't improve as well on the defensive end.

Now Julius Randle. Suffered a freak, terrible injury on opening night. All signs however point to him coming back at 100 percent. I'm no doctor, but it didn't look nearly as bad as Paul George's injury in July and he's already back and playing at a high level. Yes I realize Randle has yet to even really play in the NBA. All we've basically seen is him in the pre-season and Summer League and now awhole lot can be put into that. However the skill set is evident. Julius isn't the tallest guy, but he is supremely skilled for a big man. The ability to post, ball handling skills, combined with his physicality and his athleticism and ability to beat his man off the dribble is something very rare. Much like Clarkson he needs to improve defensively and finishing with his right hand because in the NBA teams will force him away from his strong end. He seems to be as dedicated and detrimened as any young player coming into this league. You see his interviews and he always talks about his love for the game of basketball, wanting to get back, getting better and better and I have no doubt he will.

Now to the pick. The Lakers deserve to be critiqued for not providing better protection to the pick however think back to the trade did anyone actually think we'd be where we're? In regards to being in the draft lottery twice in a row. Nobody anticipated Nash's career ending in the manner in which it did or Kobe suffering an assortment of season ending injuries that have severely hampered him. Again doesn't excuse not protecting the pick better, but you can see why they were so confident they weren't gonna lose that pick. Still and all we have over an 80 percent chance of keeping it and if we do it gives us three building blocks. That's not a bleak future. That's a potentially bright and very bright future.


In comparison, PHI has

A better playing rookie than JC in Noel.
A better return-from-injury rookie than Randle in Embbid.
A likely higher pick this year.
More cap.
And our pick next year (even if we kept it this year)

Do you think PHI has a promising future?

I think it's quite obvious that our future looks bleak for now. We ONLY have a possibility to be promising and that's it.
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 13, 2015 3:04 pm    Post subject: Re: A Suddenly Somewhat Promising Future.

mbright wrote:
Lakers2015 wrote:
Everyone seems to think the future of the Lakers is so bleak and dark, but really that couldn't be further from the truth.

That's not to say I see us being a championship team in two years because as much of an optimist as I am I wouldn't anticipate the return to glory being that quickly.

Keeping the pick is huge. That goes without saying. You're talking about being up to conceivably have three young players to build around. Basically three lottery picks. Yes we know Clarkson was a second rounder, but he sure as hell hasn't played like one. He should finish at least top 3 in the voting for rookie of the year or there should be an investigation.

I'm not trying to anoint the kid because he is just a rookie after all, but being a Lakers fan as long as I have as a lot of you have when was the last time we had a young, electric, athletic player at the point guard position like Clarkson? It has been quite some time. Of course there are things he needs to work on.

Stu highlighted last night sometimes he dribbles too high in the midst of traffic and that can lead to turnovers. His defense is subpar at best, but so is Andrew Wiggins who was seen as somebody who is gonna be a lockdown defender because of his premier athletic ability and defensive instincts. Point being most expect him to improve so there's no reason Clarkson can't improve as well on the defensive end.

Now Julius Randle. Suffered a freak, terrible injury on opening night. All signs however point to him coming back at 100 percent. I'm no doctor, but it didn't look nearly as bad as Paul George's injury in July and he's already back and playing at a high level. Yes I realize Randle has yet to even really play in the NBA. All we've basically seen is him in the pre-season and Summer League and now awhole lot can be put into that. However the skill set is evident. Julius isn't the tallest guy, but he is supremely skilled for a big man. The ability to post, ball handling skills, combined with his physicality and his athleticism and ability to beat his man off the dribble is something very rare. Much like Clarkson he needs to improve defensively and finishing with his right hand because in the NBA teams will force him away from his strong end. He seems to be as dedicated and detrimened as any young player coming into this league. You see his interviews and he always talks about his love for the game of basketball, wanting to get back, getting better and better and I have no doubt he will.

Now to the pick. The Lakers deserve to be critiqued for not providing better protection to the pick however think back to the trade did anyone actually think we'd be where we're? In regards to being in the draft lottery twice in a row. Nobody anticipated Nash's career ending in the manner in which it did or Kobe suffering an assortment of season ending injuries that have severely hampered him. Again doesn't excuse not protecting the pick better, but you can see why they were so confident they weren't gonna lose that pick. Still and all we have over an 80 percent chance of keeping it and if we do it gives us three building blocks. That's not a bleak future. That's a potentially bright and very bright future.


In comparison, PHI has

A better playing rookie than JC in Noel.
A better return-from-injury rookie than Randle in Embbid.
A likely higher pick this year.
More cap.
And our pick next year (even if we kept it this year)

Do you think PHI has a promising future?

I think it's quite obvious that our future looks bleak for now. We ONLY have a possibility to be promising and that's it.


Not that I'm enamored with Philly's situation, but why can't both teams have a bright future? Is it mutually exclusive?
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venturalakersfan
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 13, 2015 3:06 pm    Post subject:

Jim99187 wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
Let's save this post until 5/19/15.


came in to make the same exact same post


It doesn't matter, things will still be on the upswing.
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ADKLaketrout
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 13, 2015 3:10 pm    Post subject:

Purp 32 wrote:
No one's even mentioned Black. The kid is a tough sob - he's the type of role player you need to compete for a title.


Yes, a poor mans Oakley.
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