-- The 2015 NBA Playoffs Game Thread -- (Matchups Set, Page 1)
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jonnybravo
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 18, 2015 1:17 pm    Post subject:

doughboy90650 wrote:
jonnybravo wrote:
doughboy90650 wrote:
GoldenThroat wrote:
Dreamshake wrote:
BennyLava wrote:
Just one ESPN hack could mention the quality of the eastern conference. Does lebron do all that in the western conference?


The "conference quality" argument doesn't have much merit for most IMO. Never heard it in the 80s (for the West). Don't recall hearing it in other sports either.


In the 80's you had Stockton/Malone, Olajuwon/Sampson, Drexler/Porter, English/Lever, Aguirre/Blackmon, etc. out West.

The best players on the teams that the Cavs just beat are Avery Bradley, Jimmy Butler, & Al Horford. Jesus (bleep) Christ.


I know you remember how bad the Pacific Division was every year. I mean just putrid. Lakers had at least 15 wins before the season started with the awful Clippers, garbage Kings and halfway decent Warriors. They got better towards the end of the decade. If it weren't for the Blazers and Suns, they'd probably finish undefeated in the division. Hell, they were a guaranteed 12-0 just in the state. Blazers were decent but 42-40 records won't cut it. They won the division by like 20 games every year. Can't forget about Seattle and their back to back to back 30 win seasons. Just horrible.


I remember clearly and not sure how that's remotely a consideration when playoff seeding is a conference based and not division based. Who gives a (bleep) how bad the division was. Taht doesn't change a single thing GT siad.

Some of you guys try way, WAY too hard with the "I'm so un-biased" schtick it's lame.


Just being real. Division was brutal. Division winner got a top two seed. Not hard winning that train wreck. Not to mention that good ol' first round bye in the early 80s. Cake walks to the finals. Don't mind it. Just telling it how it is. I'll try to be ore biased next time.


You've completely missed his point entirely in your zeal. Yes the division sucked. That's completely irrelevant as other than Division winners, seeding is based on the rest of the conference. Regardless, I'm not sure why you felt the need to bring that up when the point GT is making is that there were historic combinations of players that existed in the West in that period. The East for the last 15 years? Um, yeah other than the pre-fabbed Lebron teams and Boston...who again? Obviously the West during the 80s was worse than the East but those two points aren't mutually exclusive unless...
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 18, 2015 1:35 pm    Post subject:

jonnybravo wrote:
doughboy90650 wrote:
jonnybravo wrote:
doughboy90650 wrote:
GoldenThroat wrote:
Dreamshake wrote:
BennyLava wrote:
Just one ESPN hack could mention the quality of the eastern conference. Does lebron do all that in the western conference?


The "conference quality" argument doesn't have much merit for most IMO. Never heard it in the 80s (for the West). Don't recall hearing it in other sports either.


In the 80's you had Stockton/Malone, Olajuwon/Sampson, Drexler/Porter, English/Lever, Aguirre/Blackmon, etc. out West.

The best players on the teams that the Cavs just beat are Avery Bradley, Jimmy Butler, & Al Horford.


I know you remember how bad the Pacific Division was every year. I mean just putrid. Lakers had at least 15 wins before the season started with the awful Clippers, garbage Kings and halfway decent Warriors. They got better towards the end of the decade. If it weren't for the Blazers and Suns, they'd probably finish undefeated in the division. Hell, they were a guaranteed 12-0 just in the state. Blazers were decent but 42-40 records won't cut it. They won the division by like 20 games every year. Can't forget about Seattle and their back to back to back 30 win seasons. Just horrible.


I remember clearly and not sure how that's remotely a consideration when playoff seeding is a conference based and not division based. Who gives a (bleep) how bad the division was. Taht doesn't change a single thing GT siad.

Some of you guys try way, WAY too hard with the "I'm so un-biased" schtick it's lame.


Just being real. Division was brutal. Division winner got a top two seed. Not hard winning that train wreck. Not to mention that good ol' first round bye in the early 80s. Cake walks to the finals. Don't mind it. Just telling it how it is. I'll try to be ore biased next time.


You've completely missed his point entirely in your zeal. Yes the division sucked. That's completely irrelevant as other than Division winners, seeding is based on the rest of the conference. Regardless, I'm not sure why you felt the need to bring that up when the point GT is making is that there were historic combinations of players that existed in the West in that period. The East for the last 15 years? Um, yeah other than the pre-fabbed Lebron teams and Boston...who again? Obviously the West during the 80s was worse than the East but those two points aren't mutually exclusive unless...


LOL and it's the same dudes in every thread haha
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 18, 2015 1:57 pm    Post subject:

yinoma2001 wrote:
Lebron apparently left Miami, in part, b/c of the stifling gaze of Riley and his insistence on sublimating his game for the betterment of the team.

On the Cavs, he gets to, once again, do whatever the hell he wants. Play GM, Coach, player, whatever.



Because he believes in his own hype. It's all about himself. He doesn't care about who is not fitting with him ( see Kevin Love).

The irony is that the fact that he is good at passing the ball ( but only if he can get an assist, not with the goal to make the whole team play better) make people think he is a team player when he is completely the opposite.
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 18, 2015 2:14 pm    Post subject:

ChefLinda wrote:
http://espn.go.com/blog/marc-stein/post/_/id/3896/lebrons-handling-of-blatt-unbecoming

Quote:
And we likewise saw LeBron emasculate Blatt in ways that are simply unbecoming of a player of James' legend-in-the-making stature.

I saw it from close range in my role as sideline reporter through the Finals for ESPN Radio. LeBron essentially calling timeouts and making substitutions. LeBron openly barking at Blatt after decisions he didn't like. LeBron huddling frequently with Lue and so often looking at anyone other than Blatt.

There was LeBron, in one instance I witnessed from right behind the bench, shaking his head vociferously in protest after one play Blatt drew up in the third quarter of Game 5, amounting to the loudest nonverbal scolding you could imagine.

Which forced Blatt, in front of his whole team, to wipe the board clean and draw up something else.



Ive never liked Lebron. I recognize he is the best player, has been for some time. Right when I think hes coming around to becoming a like able player, he does or says something that puts me off.
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 18, 2015 2:22 pm    Post subject:

Laker_Town wrote:
ChefLinda wrote:
http://espn.go.com/blog/marc-stein/post/_/id/3896/lebrons-handling-of-blatt-unbecoming

Quote:
And we likewise saw LeBron emasculate Blatt in ways that are simply unbecoming of a player of James' legend-in-the-making stature.

I saw it from close range in my role as sideline reporter through the Finals for ESPN Radio. LeBron essentially calling timeouts and making substitutions. LeBron openly barking at Blatt after decisions he didn't like. LeBron huddling frequently with Lue and so often looking at anyone other than Blatt.

There was LeBron, in one instance I witnessed from right behind the bench, shaking his head vociferously in protest after one play Blatt drew up in the third quarter of Game 5, amounting to the loudest nonverbal scolding you could imagine.

Which forced Blatt, in front of his whole team, to wipe the board clean and draw up something else.



Ive never liked Lebron. I recognize he is the best player, has been for some time. Right when I think hes coming around to becoming a like able player, he does or says something that puts me off.


What's amazing is for his entire career Kobe was crucified for being ball dominant and uncoachable. This guy has taken those attributes and amplified it by 10 and the media narrative spins it as positives.. This is one of hte only articles taking him to task on it. I mean this brazen...
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 18, 2015 2:27 pm    Post subject:

jonnybravo wrote:
Laker_Town wrote:
ChefLinda wrote:
http://espn.go.com/blog/marc-stein/post/_/id/3896/lebrons-handling-of-blatt-unbecoming

Quote:
And we likewise saw LeBron emasculate Blatt in ways that are simply unbecoming of a player of James' legend-in-the-making stature.

I saw it from close range in my role as sideline reporter through the Finals for ESPN Radio. LeBron essentially calling timeouts and making substitutions. LeBron openly barking at Blatt after decisions he didn't like. LeBron huddling frequently with Lue and so often looking at anyone other than Blatt.

There was LeBron, in one instance I witnessed from right behind the bench, shaking his head vociferously in protest after one play Blatt drew up in the third quarter of Game 5, amounting to the loudest nonverbal scolding you could imagine.

Which forced Blatt, in front of his whole team, to wipe the board clean and draw up something else.



Ive never liked Lebron. I recognize he is the best player, has been for some time. Right when I think hes coming around to becoming a like able player, he does or says something that puts me off.


What's amazing is for his entire career Kobe was crucified for being ball dominant and uncoachable. This guy has taken those attributes and amplified it by 10 and the media narrative spins it as positives.. This is one of hte only articles taking him to task on it. I mean this brazen...


If Kobe had the finals Lebron just did, he'd be getting destroyed in the media about how he didn't make his teammates better
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 18, 2015 3:53 pm    Post subject:

Luke wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
Lebron apparently left Miami, in part, b/c of the stifling gaze of Riley and his insistence on sublimating his game for the betterment of the team.

On the Cavs, he gets to, once again, do whatever the hell he wants. Play GM, Coach, player, whatever.



Because he believes in his own hype. It's all about himself. He doesn't care about who is not fitting with him ( see Kevin Love).

The irony is that the fact that he is good at passing the ball ( but only if he can get an assist, not with the goal to make the whole team play better) make people think he is a team player when he is completely the opposite.


Exactly, not sure why people have a hard time seeing right through this fraud of a King
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 18, 2015 5:50 pm    Post subject:

If true, it'll be hilarious because the biggest enemy of Lebron's success is himself. Looks like he's reverting back to the Lebron we remember during his first stint on the team.....
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 18, 2015 6:20 pm    Post subject:

22 wrote:
jonnybravo wrote:
The Grind wrote:
ChefLinda wrote:
http://espn.go.com/blog/marc-stein/post/_/id/3896/lebrons-handling-of-blatt-unbecoming

Quote:
And we likewise saw LeBron emasculate Blatt in ways that are simply unbecoming of a player of James' legend-in-the-making stature.

I saw it from close range in my role as sideline reporter through the Finals for ESPN Radio. LeBron essentially calling timeouts and making substitutions. LeBron openly barking at Blatt after decisions he didn't like. LeBron huddling frequently with Lue and so often looking at anyone other than Blatt.

There was LeBron, in one instance I witnessed from right behind the bench, shaking his head vociferously in protest after one play Blatt drew up in the third quarter of Game 5, amounting to the loudest nonverbal scolding you could imagine.

Which forced Blatt, in front of his whole team, to wipe the board clean and draw up something else.


LeBron the closet coach killer.


Mark Stein isn't long for this world.


RIP Marc Stein.

He could go the way of Simmons


If they fired everyone that ever wrote a piece like this, they wouldn't have any staff left. There have been tons of these pieces on LeBron over the years.
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jonnybravo
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 18, 2015 6:30 pm    Post subject:

Treble Clef wrote:
22 wrote:
jonnybravo wrote:
The Grind wrote:
ChefLinda wrote:
http://espn.go.com/blog/marc-stein/post/_/id/3896/lebrons-handling-of-blatt-unbecoming

Quote:
And we likewise saw LeBron emasculate Blatt in ways that are simply unbecoming of a player of James' legend-in-the-making stature.

I saw it from close range in my role as sideline reporter through the Finals for ESPN Radio. LeBron essentially calling timeouts and making substitutions. LeBron openly barking at Blatt after decisions he didn't like. LeBron huddling frequently with Lue and so often looking at anyone other than Blatt.

There was LeBron, in one instance I witnessed from right behind the bench, shaking his head vociferously in protest after one play Blatt drew up in the third quarter of Game 5, amounting to the loudest nonverbal scolding you could imagine.

Which forced Blatt, in front of his whole team, to wipe the board clean and draw up something else.


LeBron the closet coach killer.


Mark Stein isn't long for this world.


RIP Marc Stein.

He could go the way of Simmons


If they fired everyone that ever wrote a piece like this, they wouldn't have any staff left. There have been tons of these pieces on LeBron over the years.


Lol. Tons...
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 18, 2015 7:02 pm    Post subject:

jonnybravo wrote:
Treble Clef wrote:
22 wrote:
jonnybravo wrote:
The Grind wrote:
ChefLinda wrote:
http://espn.go.com/blog/marc-stein/post/_/id/3896/lebrons-handling-of-blatt-unbecoming

Quote:
And we likewise saw LeBron emasculate Blatt in ways that are simply unbecoming of a player of James' legend-in-the-making stature.

I saw it from close range in my role as sideline reporter through the Finals for ESPN Radio. LeBron essentially calling timeouts and making substitutions. LeBron openly barking at Blatt after decisions he didn't like. LeBron huddling frequently with Lue and so often looking at anyone other than Blatt.

There was LeBron, in one instance I witnessed from right behind the bench, shaking his head vociferously in protest after one play Blatt drew up in the third quarter of Game 5, amounting to the loudest nonverbal scolding you could imagine.

Which forced Blatt, in front of his whole team, to wipe the board clean and draw up something else.


LeBron the closet coach killer.


Mark Stein isn't long for this world.


RIP Marc Stein.

He could go the way of Simmons


If they fired everyone that ever wrote a piece like this, they wouldn't have any staff left. There have been tons of these pieces on LeBron over the years.


Lol. Tons...


They were pumping them out in large quantities in 2011
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 18, 2015 8:49 pm    Post subject:

"Dubs" are a fun, deserving champion. I think all fans wish that their teams played at their level. They are a quality measuring stick for the Lakers.

Iggy MVP? Not that he didn't do a good job, but that's simply a case of exceeding very low expectations. Don't think he did anything more special than what Prince or Big Ben did back in 2004, for instance. If the Cavs had a choice to remove one player from the Warriors, think they'd choose Iggy over Curry?
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 18, 2015 9:22 pm    Post subject:

ChefLinda wrote:
http://espn.go.com/blog/marc-stein/post/_/id/3896/lebrons-handling-of-blatt-unbecoming

Quote:
And we likewise saw LeBron emasculate Blatt in ways that are simply unbecoming of a player of James' legend-in-the-making stature.

I saw it from close range in my role as sideline reporter through the Finals for ESPN Radio. LeBron essentially calling timeouts and making substitutions. LeBron openly barking at Blatt after decisions he didn't like. LeBron huddling frequently with Lue and so often looking at anyone other than Blatt.

There was LeBron, in one instance I witnessed from right behind the bench, shaking his head vociferously in protest after one play Blatt drew up in the third quarter of Game 5, amounting to the loudest nonverbal scolding you could imagine.

Which forced Blatt, in front of his whole team, to wipe the board clean and draw up something else.


this supports what I was thinking all throughout the Finals... it was clear Lebron was ball-hogging it, calling plays for himself, passing only for assists, etc... took that superhero complex too much to his heart.

he didn't allow his teammates to succeed, didn't trust them to make plays, only trusted plays with him as the focal point. and it was evident it wore him down... the cavs would've done better if he allowed his team to gain confidence, to trust their instincts too.

I was wondering why Blatt was running too much Lebron-centric plays... at least it's now clear why, it was Lebron playing and coaching at the same time.
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 18, 2015 9:26 pm    Post subject:

moonriver24 wrote:
Drifts wrote:
City_Dawg wrote:
GoldenThroat wrote:
venturalakersfan wrote:
Klay Thompson disappeared in the Finals.


http://i65.photobucket.com/albums/h231/massinfusion/11203043_837052169744175_2479917528016763343_n_zpsmz10soez.jpg


(bleep), that's the best way to get through school. Klay knows what's up.


saying Klay contributed "nothing to the group project" is being shortsighted.
true, i think klay played well in 2nd or third game (both are losses) to give the team a chance to win. His efforts were forgotten because of the losses.

Overall, he is a C+ imo. Not that good but not that bad.


also, in the bigger picture... Klay did a lot in the regular season, also the playoffs, and as well as the Finals too... he had bad games in the Finals, with game 6 due to foul trouble and poor officiating. overall, he did a lot to the school project...
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 19, 2015 7:35 am    Post subject:

Drifts wrote:
ChefLinda wrote:
http://espn.go.com/blog/marc-stein/post/_/id/3896/lebrons-handling-of-blatt-unbecoming

Quote:
And we likewise saw LeBron emasculate Blatt in ways that are simply unbecoming of a player of James' legend-in-the-making stature.

I saw it from close range in my role as sideline reporter through the Finals for ESPN Radio. LeBron essentially calling timeouts and making substitutions. LeBron openly barking at Blatt after decisions he didn't like. LeBron huddling frequently with Lue and so often looking at anyone other than Blatt.

There was LeBron, in one instance I witnessed from right behind the bench, shaking his head vociferously in protest after one play Blatt drew up in the third quarter of Game 5, amounting to the loudest nonverbal scolding you could imagine.

Which forced Blatt, in front of his whole team, to wipe the board clean and draw up something else.


this supports what I was thinking all throughout the Finals... it was clear Lebron was ball-hogging it, calling plays for himself, passing only for assists, etc... took that superhero complex too much to his heart.

he didn't allow his teammates to succeed, didn't trust them to make plays, only trusted plays with him as the focal point. and it was evident it wore him down... the cavs would've done better if he allowed his team to gain confidence, to trust their instincts too.


I was wondering why Blatt was running too much Lebron-centric plays... at least it's now clear why, it was Lebron playing and coaching at the same time.


Don't forget his teammates clearing the lane for him to grab rebounds after every defensive possession. It's stat padding at its finest, and just terrible basketball.

You can't inspire confidence in teammates if you have the ball in your hands every possession. It makes them too reliant on you.

JR Smith was an a 18 ppg scorer and former sixth man of the year. He lit us up on a Denver team that was close to making the finals. I find it hard to believe they couldn't create plays for him. The same applies to Mozgov in the low post.

How do you drop 28/10 one game and then 0 the next? Part of it is Blatt's fault for benching him, but why does Lebron get a free pass too?
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 19, 2015 7:54 am    Post subject:

nevitt_smrek wrote:
"Dubs" are a fun, deserving champion. I think all fans wish that their teams played at their level. They are a quality measuring stick for the Lakers.

Iggy MVP? Not that he didn't do a good job, but that's simply a case of exceeding very low expectations. Don't think he did anything more special than what Prince or Big Ben did back in 2004, for instance. If the Cavs had a choice to remove one player from the Warriors, think they'd choose Iggy over Curry?


I think it is more of a function of his starts/increase in play coinciding with the series turning in the Warriors favor. Otherwise, I am not sure Iggy was more spectacular than, say, Draymond Green. If those two were a wash, the award should have went to Curry.
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 19, 2015 7:58 am    Post subject:

Drifts wrote:
ChefLinda wrote:
http://espn.go.com/blog/marc-stein/post/_/id/3896/lebrons-handling-of-blatt-unbecoming

Quote:
And we likewise saw LeBron emasculate Blatt in ways that are simply unbecoming of a player of James' legend-in-the-making stature.

I saw it from close range in my role as sideline reporter through the Finals for ESPN Radio. LeBron essentially calling timeouts and making substitutions. LeBron openly barking at Blatt after decisions he didn't like. LeBron huddling frequently with Lue and so often looking at anyone other than Blatt.

There was LeBron, in one instance I witnessed from right behind the bench, shaking his head vociferously in protest after one play Blatt drew up in the third quarter of Game 5, amounting to the loudest nonverbal scolding you could imagine.

Which forced Blatt, in front of his whole team, to wipe the board clean and draw up something else.


this supports what I was thinking all throughout the Finals... it was clear Lebron was ball-hogging it, calling plays for himself, passing only for assists, etc... took that superhero complex too much to his heart.

he didn't allow his teammates to succeed, didn't trust them to make plays, only trusted plays with him as the focal point. and it was evident it wore him down... the cavs would've done better if he allowed his team to gain confidence, to trust their instincts too.

I was wondering why Blatt was running too much Lebron-centric plays... at least it's now clear why, it was Lebron playing and coaching at the same time.

I concur.
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 19, 2015 8:07 am    Post subject:

This has been a story all season. I don't remember this being an issue under Brown or Spoelstra, but he was younger and perhaps they were more deferential. Frankly, the LeBron-Blatt drama has been rather pathetic. For all his talk of camaraderie, leadership, and unity, LBJ has a really curious way of displaying it. MJ, Magic, Kobe - a lot of that was behind-the-scenes. Some public comments, some outbursts - but on the court, I never saw a whole lot of it. But watching LBJ and Blatt...the tension leapt off the screen
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 19, 2015 8:15 am    Post subject:

It'll be interesting to see Lebron as he approaches his 30s.

He didn't need to refine the little skills that smaller players like Kobe/MJ did to succeed. You put those two in Lebron's body, maybe they succumb to overly utilizing physical attributes.

Put simply, Lebron is Tony Stark wearing the Iron Man suit.

Kobe/MJ were Tony Stark, and still beat the Iron Man suited version.
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 19, 2015 9:23 am    Post subject:

If I am Kevin Love, I am thinking long and hard about my options.

LeBron showing both his best and worst sides in these playoffs.
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 19, 2015 9:24 am    Post subject:

yinoma2001 wrote:
It'll be interesting to see Lebron as he approaches his 30s.

He didn't need to refine the little skills that smaller players like Kobe/MJ did to succeed. You put those two in Lebron's body, maybe they succumb to overly utilizing physical attributes.

Put simply, Lebron is Tony Stark wearing the Iron Man suit.

Kobe/MJ were Tony Stark, and still beat the Iron Man suited version.


Lebron is already 30 and going to be 31 this year??
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 19, 2015 9:37 am    Post subject:

Zhengi wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
It'll be interesting to see Lebron as he approaches his 30s.

He didn't need to refine the little skills that smaller players like Kobe/MJ did to succeed. You put those two in Lebron's body, maybe they succumb to overly utilizing physical attributes.

Put simply, Lebron is Tony Stark wearing the Iron Man suit.

Kobe/MJ were Tony Stark, and still beat the Iron Man suited version.


Lebron is already 30 and going to be 31 this year??


Yes, he is in/approaching the rest of his 30s.
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 19, 2015 11:06 am    Post subject:

NBA Finals postmortem by Draymond Green
http://cdn2.streamable.com/video/27effa2016ad11e5bdc3950552d45574.webm
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 19, 2015 12:37 pm    Post subject:

Zhengi wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
It'll be interesting to see Lebron as he approaches his 30s.

He didn't need to refine the little skills that smaller players like Kobe/MJ did to succeed. You put those two in Lebron's body, maybe they succumb to overly utilizing physical attributes.

Put simply, Lebron is Tony Stark wearing the Iron Man suit.

Kobe/MJ were Tony Stark, and still beat the Iron Man suited version.


Lebron is already 30 and going to be 31 this year??


Yes, it's going to be interesting to see if he can change/adapt his game when he loses his athletic prowess. You're right, EL Bj never really added a different arsenal to his gm. Sure he posts up, shots pull-up J's, but it's still awkward looking. And don't even get me started on his footwork. He's an all-time great, but I think his dependence on athletic ability and lack of polished fundamentals is going to hinder his longevity and possibly his legacy as well...
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yinoma2001
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 19, 2015 12:43 pm    Post subject:

jdm43390 wrote:
Zhengi wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
It'll be interesting to see Lebron as he approaches his 30s.

He didn't need to refine the little skills that smaller players like Kobe/MJ did to succeed. You put those two in Lebron's body, maybe they succumb to overly utilizing physical attributes.

Put simply, Lebron is Tony Stark wearing the Iron Man suit.

Kobe/MJ were Tony Stark, and still beat the Iron Man suited version.


Lebron is already 30 and going to be 31 this year??


Yes, it's going to be interesting to see if he can change/adapt his game when he loses his athletic prowess. You're right, EL Bj never really added a different arsenal to his gm. Sure he posts up, shots pull-up J's, but it's still awkward looking. And don't even get me started on his footwork. He's an all-time great, but I think his dependence on athletic ability and lack of polished fundamentals is going to hinder his longevity and possibly his legacy as well...


His post game is a result of his physicality/athleticism. I don't see any skillful moves in the post. It's sheer brutal muscle mass and strength. Again, put Kobe or Jordan in that Iron Man Suit, it's a wrap.
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