Andrew Bynum versus 2015 draft 7-Footers
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lakerfanaticPT
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PostPosted: Thu May 21, 2015 7:45 pm    Post subject:

Dave20 wrote:
lakerfanaticPT wrote:
Dave20 wrote:
Both are better prospects then Bynum. Bynum couldn't take bigs off the dribble or had the footwork of Okafor. He also couldn't shoot and play on the perimeter like Towns. He was just a back to the basket C. A good one, but he didn't have the potential of these two.


Come on Gave, Bynum developed a beautiful mid range stroke out to 18.
I truly believe some of the younger guys on here don't recall some of the things Bynum was doing to top notch defenders in the league as well as blocks/rebounds.

Very unfortunate the game against the Grizzles where Kobe fell into his knee. The beginning of the end for Bynum.
I remember how good Bynum was. He didn't have the quickness or face up game of Okafor and Towns. These two are franchise centers.


Bynum may not be as quick, but he demanded a constant double team or your defense was going to be eaten alive. He also was on his way to being a franchise center. I hope whichever center we take will be as good as Bynum pre-injuries.
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PostPosted: Thu May 21, 2015 7:47 pm    Post subject:

DaMuleRules wrote:
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Bynum is really being disrespected here. The kid was a beast and made tremendous strides from 2005-2008. He was the best all-round center in the league.

Two things happened...

1. He never recovered from when Kobe landed on his knee.
2. He didn't handle the fame like he should have.

He also hand a tendency to misjudge the type of shot he should take against lesser opponents.


But when he was healthy and focused... My goodness. He was almost too good to be true.

I've NEVER seen anyone dunk on Shaq from a post move. Bynum did that!


The couple of times that Bynum showed up Shaq were definitely fun for us Lakers fans at the time. But they were hardly career marking.

But I really don't think you want to bring up the "disrespect" word when it comes to Drew. Even most of his critics make note of the potential and acknowledge his few successes.

The problem is that Drew showed a great deal of disrespect from the beginning.

Starting with his approach to being an NBA player. He was always open about the fact that playing basketball was simply a job. That's a really cavalier attitude for someone in a position that many players would kill for.

The Lakers made him their star draftee and even got him a tutor of epic proportions - KAJ. And Drew's reaction and handling of that was - "Eh"

Another problem with AB was that for every dunking on Shaq moment, there's was a getting kicked out the game moment.

It's hard to take the idea that AB has been treated disrespectfully, because you have to demonstrate respect before you can earn it.


Please don't take this as me being dismissive, but the points you have brought up really don't matter if Bynum stays healthy. The fact of the matter is that Phil wanted Sean May at the time. The fans wanted Gerald Green. Jim wanted Bynum. I think it worked out great for the Lakers and the fans.

Had Bynum stayed healthy, I believe his mentality changes for the better. The injuries coupled with his immaturity were too much to overcome. Despite it all, I don't remember anyone here speaking this negatively about Socks. NOBODY!!!

Let's not be ungrateful now. He helped us win two titles. He served his purpose.


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Dave20
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PostPosted: Thu May 21, 2015 7:51 pm    Post subject:

If Bynum was a franchise center he would have carried us while Kobe and Pau struggled vs the Mavs. He was the 4th sometimes 5th best player on the championship teams. Kobe, Pau and Odom were more valuable. He was a very good center but not as great as you make him out to be.
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lakerfanaticPT
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PostPosted: Thu May 21, 2015 8:19 pm    Post subject:

Dave20 wrote:
If Bynum was a franchise center he would have carried us while Kobe and Pau struggled vs the Mavs. He was the 4th sometimes 5th best player on the championship teams. Kobe, Pau and Odom were more valuable. He was a very good center but not as great as you make him out to be.


With Kobe in the mix as well as Pau....Bynum was never going to be the man AT THAT TIME.

Again, if he stays healthy, he becomes our franchise center -- no doubt about it.
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PostPosted: Thu May 21, 2015 8:28 pm    Post subject:

KAJ did great things to help AB... I still remember that 40pt game he had vs Minny (I think?), he was just awesome and dominant in that game, it was a peak at how good Bynum was going to be... then he got injured. of course, we got Gasol after that, but we could only imagine how things could've been if Bynum didn't injure his knee...
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PostPosted: Thu May 21, 2015 8:56 pm    Post subject:

Bynum's best year was in 2011-2012 season....he could've been a lot better and who knows what his peak could've been if he wasn't injured back in 2007-2008. He was a huge part of the team when the Lakers were in 1st place when he went down. His mobility was never the same after his first injury, so its incredible that he was able to work himself back into all star numbers. Its a shame that he had a rather relaxed attitude towards playing basketball, I guess it was a coping mechanism as well since he was injured so often.
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focus
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PostPosted: Thu May 21, 2015 9:08 pm    Post subject:

Quote:
lakersken80 wrote:
Bynum's best year was in 2011-2012 season....he could've been a lot better and who knows what his peak could've been if he wasn't injured back in 2007-2008. He was a huge part of the team when the Lakers were in 1st place when he went down. His mobility was never the same after his first injury, so its incredible that he was able to work himself back into all star numbers. Its a shame that he had a rather relaxed attitude towards playing basketball, I guess it was a coping mechanism as well since he was injured so often.


A lot truth. That play against Philadelphia when he went in top of the key and finished long way above the rim with his other hand was his zenith of potential showing. Then he got that first injury. I recall thinking that play we got our next great amazing big. Explosion, edge, crazy length and touch. Kobe knew he lucked into something but not to be. If if if. We didn't even look like we needed Pau after that Philly dunk.

These guys though look way more polished at the same age. Who knows what their ultimate drive is


Last edited by focus on Fri May 22, 2015 10:52 am; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Thu May 21, 2015 9:08 pm    Post subject: Re: Andrew Bynum versus 2015 draft 7-Footers

Boldarblood wrote:
MrClutch44 wrote:
We're all excited about getting the #2 overall pick in 2015 - no doubt about it and hope it will change the fortune of the team....BUT honestly...are Towns or Okafor really franchise changing players?

I don't think any LGer would confuse either of these two with a David Robinson, Hakeem, Duncan, Ewing...or for that matter even Anthony Davis!

I know this might bea taboo comment here with some...but I think these two, especially Okafor, may be no better than Andrew Bynum - and Bynum was a #10 pick (2005)! To be fair to AB, he had a couple of great years when he was healthy and was motivated for a big contract, 18/11 in 2011, BUT even then he was not a player that changed the fortunes of a team alone. He was not a franchise center. And I don't think Towns or Okafor are either -- there is nothing in their game from college which suggests they will be either.

Thus...perhaps we should look a little deeper at our roster, as some here have suggested, and trade our #2 pick (sell high now!) and pick up high quality players who can complement the 2-3 max players we'll signing over the next couple of years. Because quite honestly, I don't think Towns or Okafor are the Lakers answer to a return to the banner days.





I think this article states it best for Okafor at least.

http://www.latimes.com/sports/lakers/la-sp-lakers-draft-pick-20150521-story.html

And this line in particular.

"Karl is way better than Bynum," Metuchen (N.J.) St. Joseph High Athletic Director Jerry Smith said in February. "I don't want to talk negative about [Bynum] but there's no comparison whatsoever. This kid works, this kid is really the total package. He's one in a million."


Of course this coach will say that. Bynum is out of the league. Towns is trying to secure the #1 spot.

Pre-injury Bynum was awesome. Check out this highlight reel, especially at the 1:18 mark

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PostPosted: Thu May 21, 2015 9:30 pm    Post subject:

Bynums footwork was really good

He was also so big (long), few could stop him without a double team

I wish we could have seen how good he could have been
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PostPosted: Thu May 21, 2015 10:17 pm    Post subject: Re: Andrew Bynum versus 2015 draft 7-Footers

composite wrote:
Boldarblood wrote:
MrClutch44 wrote:
We're all excited about getting the #2 overall pick in 2015 - no doubt about it and hope it will change the fortune of the team....BUT honestly...are Towns or Okafor really franchise changing players?

I don't think any LGer would confuse either of these two with a David Robinson, Hakeem, Duncan, Ewing...or for that matter even Anthony Davis!

I know this might bea taboo comment here with some...but I think these two, especially Okafor, may be no better than Andrew Bynum - and Bynum was a #10 pick (2005)! To be fair to AB, he had a couple of great years when he was healthy and was motivated for a big contract, 18/11 in 2011, BUT even then he was not a player that changed the fortunes of a team alone. He was not a franchise center. And I don't think Towns or Okafor are either -- there is nothing in their game from college which suggests they will be either.

Thus...perhaps we should look a little deeper at our roster, as some here have suggested, and trade our #2 pick (sell high now!) and pick up high quality players who can complement the 2-3 max players we'll signing over the next couple of years. Because quite honestly, I don't think Towns or Okafor are the Lakers answer to a return to the banner days.





I think this article states it best for Okafor at least.

http://www.latimes.com/sports/lakers/la-sp-lakers-draft-pick-20150521-story.html

And this line in particular.

"Karl is way better than Bynum," Metuchen (N.J.) St. Joseph High Athletic Director Jerry Smith said in February. "I don't want to talk negative about [Bynum] but there's no comparison whatsoever. This kid works, this kid is really the total package. He's one in a million."


Of course this coach will say that. Bynum is out of the league. Towns is trying to secure the #1 spot.

Pre-injury Bynum was awesome. Check out this highlight reel, especially at the 1:18 mark



It is not his coach. And unfair comparison, Bynum has had pro training. Give both of these two young guys some time with KAJ and let us see where we stand.
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PostPosted: Fri May 22, 2015 12:55 am    Post subject: Re: Andrew Bynum versus 2015 draft 7-Footers

Boldarblood wrote:
composite wrote:
Boldarblood wrote:
MrClutch44 wrote:
We're all excited about getting the #2 overall pick in 2015 - no doubt about it and hope it will change the fortune of the team....BUT honestly...are Towns or Okafor really franchise changing players?

I don't think any LGer would confuse either of these two with a David Robinson, Hakeem, Duncan, Ewing...or for that matter even Anthony Davis!

I know this might bea taboo comment here with some...but I think these two, especially Okafor, may be no better than Andrew Bynum - and Bynum was a #10 pick (2005)! To be fair to AB, he had a couple of great years when he was healthy and was motivated for a big contract, 18/11 in 2011, BUT even then he was not a player that changed the fortunes of a team alone. He was not a franchise center. And I don't think Towns or Okafor are either -- there is nothing in their game from college which suggests they will be either.

Thus...perhaps we should look a little deeper at our roster, as some here have suggested, and trade our #2 pick (sell high now!) and pick up high quality players who can complement the 2-3 max players we'll signing over the next couple of years. Because quite honestly, I don't think Towns or Okafor are the Lakers answer to a return to the banner days.





I think this article states it best for Okafor at least.

http://www.latimes.com/sports/lakers/la-sp-lakers-draft-pick-20150521-story.html

And this line in particular.

"Karl is way better than Bynum," Metuchen (N.J.) St. Joseph High Athletic Director Jerry Smith said in February. "I don't want to talk negative about [Bynum] but there's no comparison whatsoever. This kid works, this kid is really the total package. He's one in a million."


Of course this coach will say that. Bynum is out of the league. Towns is trying to secure the #1 spot.

Pre-injury Bynum was awesome. Check out this highlight reel, especially at the 1:18 mark



It is not his coach. And unfair comparison, Bynum has had pro training. Give both of these two young guys some time with KAJ and let us see where we stand.


Whatever. The guy is from the same HS that Bynum and Towns attended. He wants Towns to do as well as possible.

Just check out the highlight reels. It's not the footwork or pro game. It's the blocks, alley oops or dunks that pre-injury Bynum could do. He was just more "above the rim" than Towns or Okafor.
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PostPosted: Fri May 22, 2015 1:39 am    Post subject:

Bynum was a project player we picked up and had high hopes for him. Did he deliver? Well, we won 2 championships and lost another during his career here. How valuable? There is debate, when healthy, he performed pretty well in the regular seasons and in a few playoff matchups over the years. Due to his injury problems, especially come the playoffs he was essentially the backup center to Pau and Lamar Odom carried a lot of that weight. Its a shame with better health, we probably win another title with Drew.

My biggest complaint with him was his lack of rebounds and the hungry attitude to become an elite player. Like others have said, basketball was a job and I think he knew with his health problems even in high school, that his career was going to be shortened. Hence in the offseason, he wanted to do other things and live his life. As time went on, his attitude got worse and many Laker fans started to turn on him, and rightfully so.

I think with the rule changes requiring players to play a year of college ball, they are at 19 years old Towns and Okafor, a lot more polished than Drew was. They both will likely become key players in this league. Now whoever ends up in Minnesota, will that effect their attitude - probably like Kevin Love they will push to get out of there eventually.

Off the top of my head, I think Drew only had 500 or more rebounds in 2 seasons in his time in the NBA. My belief is that both players will exceed that by their 3rd seasons in the league, and will both stay out of the handicap parking spaces.

I actually think is going to be one of the strongest lottery classes in the last several years - the top six or seven players may all end up being very good players and be the next breed of all stars and Olympians in the coming years.
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PostPosted: Fri May 22, 2015 1:50 am    Post subject:

If want to compare Bynum and whoever, compare Bynum at the same age with them. Not peak Bynum against rookies.
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PostPosted: Fri May 22, 2015 2:48 am    Post subject:

It's really a tragedy what happened to Bynum. His injuries are directly related to his attitude. Had he not had knees of glass he probably would have become our franchise center. After he got traded and then couldn't stay on the court things spiraled.

I'd feel bad for him if it weren't for all the money he made in his tumultuous career. I won't, however, trash him.
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PostPosted: Fri May 22, 2015 4:01 am    Post subject:

This thread is silly. You could make the same argument that neither Towns or Okafor look like they'll be as talented as Kobe (who was a 13th pick!) so we might as well trade the pick.
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PostPosted: Fri May 22, 2015 4:05 am    Post subject:

RCS926 wrote:
Megaton wrote:
cKPayasoLoco wrote:
Megaton wrote:
Towns or Okafor>Bynum.

Bynum was a one time all star. Okafor or Towns have the potential to be multiple time all star superstars.

Bynum somehow has gotten REALLY overrated here for the past couple days. Seriously.

well see but bynum was on his way to multiple all star appearance i mean guy gabbed 30 reb over duncan posted playoff triple double he was special talent


Bynum was almost a non factor in the championship runs and he posted fridge all star at best numbers in the regular season on his best years.

He wasn't "special" by any means. He developed good post moves and a solid defender but other than that, nothing that indicates he was a hall of fame big or a star at all. He played well, not great.


Again, everything you're referring to with regards to Drew points to his post-injury days. The ceiling for pre-injury Drew was higher than any young big that's currently playing including Cousins and Davis.


Davis is probably where I would pump the breaks just a little bit. Davis could be one of the best bigs ever at the rate he's developing. I could have seen Drew being one of the best bigs in the league at the time, but I think Davis' ceiling is higher. Especially offensively.
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PostPosted: Fri May 22, 2015 5:11 am    Post subject:

lakerfanaticPT wrote:
RCS926 wrote:
dmills wrote:
I'm going to say this with all sincerity. If Andrew Bynum were able to stay healthy and remained on the trajectory that he was on during the championship runs, he'd be hands down the best center in the league today. And it probably wouldn't be close.


I agree.


Agree as well. Damn those injuries. Although he was a bit of a space cadet/head case, but talent was going to be unbelievable if not for those injuries.

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PostPosted: Fri May 22, 2015 5:30 am    Post subject:

Fallout wrote:
If want to compare Bynum and whoever, compare Bynum at the same age with them. Not peak Bynum against rookies.


This.
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PostPosted: Fri May 22, 2015 7:18 am    Post subject:

RCS926 wrote:
Megaton wrote:
Towns or Okafor>Bynum.

Bynum was a one time all star. Okafor or Towns have the potential to be multiple time all star superstars.

Bynum somehow has gotten REALLY overrated here for the past couple days. Seriously.


You forget how good Drew looked in 07/08 when he finally put his athleticism and post skills together. He was on his way to being an absolute monster on both ends of the court. He was too big to handle on the block with his size, strength and soft touch around the basket. He was a nightmare on the PNR with his ability to finish over the top with lobs. He was an elite rim protector. He was turning into an elite man defender both in the post and on the perimeter (don't forget how well he guarded JO and Bosh that year).

Okafor and Towns might be greater than a post-injury Drew, but neither come close to a pre-injury, circa 2008 Drew who was bigger, stronger, longer and more athletic than either with a very good base of skills to build upon.


Drew had the potential to be an all time great top 10 C of all time IMO. Injuries, congenital knee issues and a warped ego did him in, but if the center we draft is as good as Bynum and can stay healthy, I'll be dancing jigs. Bynum was a monster at his best.
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PostPosted: Fri May 22, 2015 8:04 am    Post subject:

LandsbergerRules wrote:
Fallout wrote:
If want to compare Bynum and whoever, compare Bynum at the same age with them. Not peak Bynum against rookies.


This.


07-08 Bynum was only 20 and in his 3rd season. In his rookie season, despite doing a lot of work to shed weight, he was still carrying around some baby fat. He did a lot of conditioning work in the summer prior to his 2nd season and really transformed his body. However, he was still extremely uncoordinated. I remember how off his timing was on alley-oops. Things really didn't come together until his 3rd season (07-08) when he finally developed the proper timing and instincts to use his athletic gifts.

At any rate, the point is that Drew needed 2 years to get his body right and learn how to play the game of basketball, so it is fair to compare a 20 year old Drew to Towns and Okafor at 19. The 2 bigs in this year's draft already know how to play ball and don't have a ton of work to do physically.

Pre-injury Drew had most of salivating at what he could be. I'll backtrack now and say that I think Okafor has a chance to do the same provided he can fix his issues on defense. With Towns, I think everyone will be happy with the production he gives us, but I have my doubts as to whether he'll ever have the potential to be the best big in the league. That doesn't make him an undesirable player because I'd love to have a Horford-esque player on my team.
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PostPosted: Fri May 22, 2015 8:11 am    Post subject:

RCS926 wrote:
LandsbergerRules wrote:
Fallout wrote:
If want to compare Bynum and whoever, compare Bynum at the same age with them. Not peak Bynum against rookies.


This.


07-08 Bynum was only 20 and in his 3rd season. In his rookie season, despite doing a lot of work to shed weight, he was still carrying around some baby fat. He did a lot of conditioning work in the summer prior to his 2nd season and really transformed his body. However, he was still extremely uncoordinated. I remember how off his timing was on alley-oops. Things really didn't come together until his 3rd season (07-08) when he finally developed the proper timing and instincts to use his athletic gifts.

At any rate, the point is that Drew needed 2 years to get his body right and learn how to play the game of basketball, so it is fair to compare a 20 year old Drew to Towns and Okafor at 19. The 2 bigs in this year's draft already know how to play ball and don't have a ton of work to do physically.

Pre-injury Drew had most of salivating at what he could be. I'll backtrack now and say that I think Okafor has a chance to do the same provided he can fix his issues on defense. With Towns, I think everyone will be happy with the production he gives us, but I have my doubts as to whether he'll ever have the potential to be the best big in the league. That doesn't make him an undesirable player because I'd love to have a Horford-esque player on my team.


The point is that Towns and Okafor put in that work in high school. Bynum skated on size. In fact, considering that Towns went to the same high school as Bynum just shows that given the same opportunities, he has already done more.
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PostPosted: Fri May 22, 2015 8:45 am    Post subject:

ElginBaylor wrote:
It's really a tragedy what happened to Bynum. His injuries are directly related to his attitude. Had he not had knees of glass he probably would have become our franchise center. After he got traded and then couldn't stay on the court things spiraled.


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PostPosted: Fri May 22, 2015 8:57 am    Post subject:

Like others said, this is a silly silly thread. If you want to compare, compare them to a 19 YO Bynum.
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PostPosted: Fri May 22, 2015 9:18 am    Post subject:

Mike@LG wrote:
Timeout.

So, Bynum at 19 with very limited skills and some athletic abilities (Lakers really transformed him)

vs.

Karl Towns at 19 with proven two-way ability

OR

Okafor at 19 with proven elite post play ability and defensive tools

Not comparable.


Because of our bad luck the last few years people have forgotten that the Lakers "transformed Andrew", we are doing with Jordan Clarkson right now.
Bet on the Lakers to take players with proven ability to take them to the next level.
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PostPosted: Fri May 22, 2015 9:25 am    Post subject:

I expect either of these two bigs to end up better than AB. Main reason, AB didn't really seem to love the game. It was completely obvious in his approach and sometime lack of professionalism. He played basketball because he was big and had the coordination to be good at it. The Lakers turned him into a very good player. Both Okafor and Towns are basketball players who happen to be bigs. And are also very talented.
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