Is this team worse then last years team?
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Omar Little
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 30, 2015 7:07 pm    Post subject:

greenfrog wrote:
Ed Davis (last season), or Randle (this season)... which will be better?


Randle.
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 30, 2015 7:23 pm    Post subject:

greenfrog wrote:
Ed Davis (last season), or Randle (this season)... which will be better?


I hope Randle. By my guess is he's going to struggle at first, so if I had to bet my money would be on Davis.
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 30, 2015 8:00 pm    Post subject:

greenfrog wrote:
25 wins.

I'm interested to see what the Vegas line will be.


I'd say 36 or 37 for Vegas, their line tends to be very optimistic due to all of the pro-Laker bettors out there. They'll still be accused of being haters for putting it so low though
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 30, 2015 11:01 pm    Post subject:

I've been going back and forth on this. On one hand, no one has really won many games with so many rookies or near rookies in the rotation (not even if their names are Durant, Westbrook, Ibaka, and Green, as noted above). Lin, Boozer, and Davis were not ideal, but they were vets who had their moments and were harder to push around than younger guys.

Also, the coaching staff is completely unchanged, which means we can expect to continue to see counterproductive schemes, slow or questionable adjustments, bad out of timeout calls, etc. etc.

On the other hand, we have a clear upgrade in talent, and we got rid of our biggest minus player in Hill. Some of our losses last year were due to deliberate tanking, which shouldn't happen this year. Most importantly, the pieces we have seem to fit together a lot better, and will cover some of our coaching staff's worse tendencies.

Hibbert's rim protection is obviously the biggest factor. He's always going to be back there, so you'll see less high hedging on pick and rolls with bad/no weak side help that lead to open runs at the rim and/or open 3s. I also have high hopes for Russell, despite being a rookie, being an upgrade on wing help defense over Wes Johnson, who had the tools but lacked any sort of awareness or focus.

We'll have four starters who can handle the ball on the perimeter, three of which are pretty good at running the PnR- which means we don't have to continually bash our heads against the wall watching Wes pretending he's a point guard on some of Byron's sets.

Last year's team was much better when they played uptempo, and this year's will be no different. Only now, there will be fewer excuses to slow the pace down (assuming we ditch the Princeton sooner than later), and less of the guys who tend to kill the pace and the spacing.

So all in all I expect a slow start but modest improvement overall, and would be reasonably happy with anything in the mid 30s or above, showing some progress as a franchise.
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 31, 2015 12:55 am    Post subject:

textbook wrote:
price/Lin vs. Dlo/clarkson
Ellington/Clark vs. Clarkson/Williams
Johnson/Young vs. Kobe/Young
Boozer/Davis vs. Bass/Randle
Hill/Sacre vs. Hibbert/Black

IN: Russell, Kobe, Williams, Bass, Hibbert, Randle, Brown, Nance, Upshaw*

OUT: Lin, Price, Ellington, Johnson, Hill, Davis.

Yeah, I think we got a little better.


PG - worse this year. Due to the impact of Lin. Russell will just start to learn.
SG - probably slightly better this year. Thanks to Williams.
SF - slight edge this year. Wes was just too inconsistent. But we got weaker defensively.
PF - even at most. Randle is still a rook. There is a learning curve.
C - better. At least we have a starting caliber C now.
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 31, 2015 6:56 am    Post subject:

s_habe wrote:
textbook wrote:
price/Lin vs. Dlo/clarkson
Ellington/Clark vs. Clarkson/Williams
Johnson/Young vs. Kobe/Young
Boozer/Davis vs. Bass/Randle
Hill/Sacre vs. Hibbert/Black

IN: Russell, Kobe, Williams, Bass, Hibbert, Randle, Brown, Nance, Upshaw*

OUT: Lin, Price, Ellington, Johnson, Hill, Davis.

Yeah, I think we got a little better.


PG - worse this year. Due to the impact of Lin. Russell will just start to learn.
SG - probably slightly better this year. Thanks to Williams.
SF - slight edge this year. Wes was just too inconsistent. But we got weaker defensively.
PF - even at most. Randle is still a rook. There is a learning curve.
C - better. At least we have a starting caliber C now.


PG- Is our strongest position Lin was terrible, lost his starting job to Ronny "Freaking" Price. When Russell struggles early Scott will move Clarkson to the point and bring in Lou Williams. Tell me how anything we had last year is better than Russell, Clarkson, Lou Williams, and Kobe at the guard spots. Come on people if you are going to make a point that we are worse please look at it objectively.
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 31, 2015 7:30 am    Post subject:

Lin was not terrible. He just wasn't very fun to watch. Frankly I would be pleased if Russell this season could put up his numbers.
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 31, 2015 7:58 am    Post subject:

greenfrog wrote:
Lin was not terrible. He just wasn't very fun to watch. Frankly I would be pleased if Russell this season could put up his numbers.


he was terrible. i never cared for lin but he was a TO machine.

He really was the MVP of the tank thread with J Hill
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 31, 2015 8:01 am    Post subject:

lakerMark wrote:
s_habe wrote:
textbook wrote:
price/Lin vs. Dlo/clarkson
Ellington/Clark vs. Clarkson/Williams
Johnson/Young vs. Kobe/Young
Boozer/Davis vs. Bass/Randle
Hill/Sacre vs. Hibbert/Black

IN: Russell, Kobe, Williams, Bass, Hibbert, Randle, Brown, Nance, Upshaw*

OUT: Lin, Price, Ellington, Johnson, Hill, Davis.

Yeah, I think we got a little better.


PG - worse this year. Due to the impact of Lin. Russell will just start to learn.
SG - probably slightly better this year. Thanks to Williams.
SF - slight edge this year. Wes was just too inconsistent. But we got weaker defensively.
PF - even at most. Randle is still a rook. There is a learning curve.
C - better. At least we have a starting caliber C now.


PG- Is our strongest position Lin was terrible, lost his starting job to Ronny "Freaking" Price. When Russell struggles early Scott will move Clarkson to the point and bring in Lou Williams. Tell me how anything we had last year is better than Russell, Clarkson, Lou Williams, and Kobe at the guard spots. Come on people if you are going to make a point that we are worse please look at it objectively.


I see Jabari Parker getting some minutes with Clarkson if Russell struggles.
I would like to see Anthony Brown develop into a good player, he could definitely be an improvement at the 3.
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 31, 2015 8:03 am    Post subject:

Jim99187 wrote:
greenfrog wrote:
Lin was not terrible. He just wasn't very fun to watch. Frankly I would be pleased if Russell this season could put up his numbers.


he was terrible. i never cared for lin but he was a TO machine.

He really was the MVP of the tank thread with J Hill


Russell may be a turnover machine once the game speeds up, so we may want Lin back.
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 31, 2015 8:05 am    Post subject:

LoyalLakerfan44 wrote:
Jim99187 wrote:
greenfrog wrote:
Lin was not terrible. He just wasn't very fun to watch. Frankly I would be pleased if Russell this season could put up his numbers.


he was terrible. i never cared for lin but he was a TO machine.

He really was the MVP of the tank thread with J Hill


Russell may be a turnover machine once the game speeds up, so we may want Lin back.


sure but Russell is a rookie with limitless potential. we have to take the bumps with his growth.

Lin is who he is and we knew he was here only for a yr since he/byron didnt get along
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 31, 2015 8:14 am    Post subject:

I think there's going to be a lot experimentation with the line-ups early. I don't know how Russell, Clarkson, Kobe, Randle, and Hibbert will do as starters. It seems like the spacing will be a problem particularly when running the Princeton. Lanes will be clogged, and the ball movement will be sluggish, lots of one on one basketball, while not enough perimeter shooting. I see Scott working on a lot of different options. It doesn't look good to me, in fact I see quite a few blow outs.
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 31, 2015 8:16 am    Post subject:

LoyalLakerfan44 wrote:
I think there's going to be a lot experimentation with the line-ups early. I don't know how Russell, Clarkson, Kobe, Randle, and Hibbert will do as starters. It seems like the spacing will be a problem particularly when running the Princeton. Lanes will be clogged, and the ball movement will be sluggish, lots of one on one basketball, while not enough perimeter shooting. I see Scott working on a lot of different options. It doesn't look good to me, in fact I see quite a few blow outs.


i think the fans will be ok with because these guys Clarkson, Russell, randle and even hibbert will be here for long term .
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 31, 2015 12:49 pm    Post subject:

LoyalLakerfan44 wrote:
I think there's going to be a lot experimentation with the line-ups early. I don't know how Russell, Clarkson, Kobe, Randle, and Hibbert will do as starters. It seems like the spacing will be a problem particularly when running the Princeton. Lanes will be clogged, and the ball movement will be sluggish, lots of one on one basketball, while not enough perimeter shooting. I see Scott working on a lot of different options. It doesn't look good to me, in fact I see quite a few blow outs.


I can easily see a lot of guys just trying to get "theirs" on some nights.
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 31, 2015 1:20 pm    Post subject:

lakerMark wrote:
s_habe wrote:
textbook wrote:
price/Lin vs. Dlo/clarkson
Ellington/Clark vs. Clarkson/Williams
Johnson/Young vs. Kobe/Young
Boozer/Davis vs. Bass/Randle
Hill/Sacre vs. Hibbert/Black

IN: Russell, Kobe, Williams, Bass, Hibbert, Randle, Brown, Nance, Upshaw*

OUT: Lin, Price, Ellington, Johnson, Hill, Davis.

Yeah, I think we got a little better.


PG - worse this year. Due to the impact of Lin. Russell will just start to learn.
SG - probably slightly better this year. Thanks to Williams.
SF - slight edge this year. Wes was just too inconsistent. But we got weaker defensively.
PF - even at most. Randle is still a rook. There is a learning curve.
C - better. At least we have a starting caliber C now.


PG- Is our strongest position Lin was terrible, lost his starting job to Ronny "Freaking" Price. When Russell struggles early Scott will move Clarkson to the point and bring in Lou Williams. Tell me how anything we had last year is better than Russell, Clarkson, Lou Williams, and Kobe at the guard spots. Come on people if you are going to make a point that we are worse please look at it objectively.


Lin lost nothing. It was all about weird coaching.
Russell has nothing but a hype so far while Lin was one of the most efficient PGs of the entire league.
Hoepefully Russell will learn and develop as fast as Clarkson did, but I would not bet on this. Lin is a proven entity. Very solid when coached correctly.
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 31, 2015 1:41 pm    Post subject:

textbook wrote:
price/Lin vs. Dlo/clarkson
Ellington/Clark vs. Clarkson/Williams
Johnson/Young vs. Kobe/Young
Boozer/Davis vs. Bass/Randle
Hill/Sacre vs. Hibbert/Black

IN: Russell, Kobe, Williams, Bass, Hibbert, Randle, Brown, Nance, Upshaw*

OUT: Lin, Price, Ellington, Johnson, Hill, Davis.


Yeah, I think we got a little better.


Price/Lin vs. Dlo/clarkson
-- Offense: Better, just based on pure confidence and assertiveness by the youngsters.
-- Defense: Slightly better, since Price was a veteran D and hustle guy and DAR is still learning the ropes, but Clarkson is bigger and more aggressive than Lin ever was on both ends.

Ellington/Clark vs. Clarkson/Williams
-- O: Better thanks to Williams, but opposing Ds won't be caught by surprise by Clarkson in his 2nd year.
-- D: A wash, as any D gains by the this year's guys will likely be because they're making the opposition work harder guarding them, and DC is still learning how to use his quicks and strength on D.

Johnson/Young vs. Kobe/Young
-- O: Better, so long as Kobe can actually play.
-- D: A wash, as their best D strategy is to tire out the other guy guarding them.

Boozer/Davis vs. Bass/Randle
-- O: Better, but for certain only by virtue of Bass' FT percentage. The key is whether Randle can figure out when to drive and when/ how to pull-up.
-- D: A little worse, as we lose Davis' length and Boozer's sheer mass and occasional savvy. Bass and Randle will likely be quicker on the floor and thus more aggressive on the boards, but bigger PFs will be a major test.

Hill/Sacre vs. Hibbert/Black
-- O: A wash. Hill may have forgotten how to post or clean the O glass by the end, but his midrange was nice. How Hibbert can barely score double figures at his size is a concern.
-- D: Better, even if only on rep and intimidation alone.

Overall, better on O 1-4, but only significantly better on D at 5.
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 31, 2015 3:33 pm    Post subject:

Jim99187 wrote:
greenfrog wrote:
Lin was not terrible. He just wasn't very fun to watch. Frankly I would be pleased if Russell this season could put up his numbers.


he was terrible. i never cared for lin but he was a TO machine.

He really was the MVP of the tank thread with J Hill


I guess that you don't like Lin, but please be objective.
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 31, 2015 4:15 pm    Post subject:

Lakersprime wrote:
Jim99187 wrote:
greenfrog wrote:
Lin was not terrible. He just wasn't very fun to watch. Frankly I would be pleased if Russell this season could put up his numbers.


he was terrible. i never cared for lin but he was a TO machine.

He really was the MVP of the tank thread with J Hill


I guess that you don't like Lin, but please be objective.


Pretty sure every single Laker fan would rather have DLO out there than Lin, very few people would consider that a downgrade buddy.
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 31, 2015 5:02 pm    Post subject:

The_Dynasty24 wrote:
Lakersprime wrote:
Jim99187 wrote:
greenfrog wrote:
Lin was not terrible. He just wasn't very fun to watch. Frankly I would be pleased if Russell this season could put up his numbers.


he was terrible. i never cared for lin but he was a TO machine.

He really was the MVP of the tank thread with J Hill


I guess that you don't like Lin, but please be objective.


Pretty sure every single Laker fan would rather have DLO out there than Lin, very few people would consider that a downgrade buddy.


Not sure that's what LP was saying ... Might have had more to do with the MVP of the tank thread comment
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 31, 2015 7:07 pm    Post subject:

ice_cold wrote:
The_Dynasty24 wrote:
Lakersprime wrote:
Jim99187 wrote:
greenfrog wrote:
Lin was not terrible. He just wasn't very fun to watch. Frankly I would be pleased if Russell this season could put up his numbers.


he was terrible. i never cared for lin but he was a TO machine.

He really was the MVP of the tank thread with J Hill


I guess that you don't like Lin, but please be objective.


Pretty sure every single Laker fan would rather have DLO out there than Lin, very few people would consider that a downgrade buddy.


Not sure that's what LP was saying ... Might have had more to do with the MVP of the tank thread comment


Lin was not terrible, but he's a role player who needs to dominate the ball to be effective. But the truth is he's not young enough to develop, and not good enough to be a floor general, and his shooting ability is just average, that makes him only better fit on a team which have no other ball-dominated player.
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 31, 2015 8:04 pm    Post subject:

24 wrote:
greenfrog wrote:
Ed Davis (last season), or Randle (this season)... which will be better?


Randle.

On offense.
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 31, 2015 8:13 pm    Post subject:

No, it will be more fun to watch than last year.....with their crappy predictable offense and long range 2's......it didn't help that we had guys who were un-athletic, past their primes and not fun to watch. No team is scared of Boozer popping off 20 foot jumpers at his stage of his career.
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 31, 2015 8:30 pm    Post subject:

lakerMark wrote:
s_habe wrote:
textbook wrote:
price/Lin vs. Dlo/clarkson
Ellington/Clark vs. Clarkson/Williams
Johnson/Young vs. Kobe/Young
Boozer/Davis vs. Bass/Randle
Hill/Sacre vs. Hibbert/Black

IN: Russell, Kobe, Williams, Bass, Hibbert, Randle, Brown, Nance, Upshaw*

OUT: Lin, Price, Ellington, Johnson, Hill, Davis.

Yeah, I think we got a little better.


PG - worse this year. Due to the impact of Lin. Russell will just start to learn.
SG - probably slightly better this year. Thanks to Williams.
SF - slight edge this year. Wes was just too inconsistent. But we got weaker defensively.
PF - even at most. Randle is still a rook. There is a learning curve.
C - better. At least we have a starting caliber C now.


PG- Is our strongest position Lin was terrible, lost his starting job to Ronny "Freaking" Price. When Russell struggles early Scott will move Clarkson to the point and bring in Lou Williams. Tell me how anything we had last year is better than Russell, Clarkson, Lou Williams, and Kobe at the guard spots. Come on people if you are going to make a point that we are worse please look at it objectively.


I don't think Lin lost his spot because he wasn't good, Price was just the fit he wanted. He would cover for Kobe defensively but not take the ball out of his hands on offense.

It didn't win any more games than the Kobe and Lin backcourt did but it met Byron's preference.
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 31, 2015 10:41 pm    Post subject:

I love the optimism in this thread and the trust in the rookies/sophomores.

But they are still only rookies and will only start to adjust to the NBA game. It will take time and there will be some serious disappointments at least in the first half of the season.

Hopefully it will be a fun to watch!
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 31, 2015 11:06 pm    Post subject:

s_habe wrote:
I love the optimism in this thread and the trust in the rookies/sophomores.

But they are still only rookies and will only start to adjust to the NBA game. It will take time and there will be some serious disappointments at least in the first half of the season.

Hopefully it will be a fun to watch!


It's definitely be fun because you need to know that watching players development is always better than a bunch of one year contract scrub.

The difference is you have hope and something to cheer for rather than just think about tanking.
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