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Car54
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 Posted: Mon Aug 03, 2015 1:14 pm Post subject: Coaching and Kobe will decide how many games we win |
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I see a lot of people looking at the roster and predicting win total. We have a team that could win 30 or 50 games. Coaching and Kobe's approach will be bigger deciding factors than the rookies or Young and Lou Williams etc... If Kobe can approach the season like the old man he is (in basketball years) he could dial it back a lil bit and lead differently we could be in the playoffs. First I would like to see Kobe post up more for his points and to facilitate from the post. On defense I would like to see him gamble less and stay on his man.
With Coach Scott I would like to see him be more versatile with the offense to free Dangelo. Offensive systems sometimes hand cuff the point guard like the triangle did to Gary. If he's a good pg your offense should cater to his strengths because his strengths is making the game easier for his team mates.
We'll have a middle to top level bench with two 6 men in Lou and Swaggy. We have one of the best backups at PF in Bass (eventually) we also have Brown.
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BobbyB
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| Posted: Mon Aug 03, 2015 1:24 pm Post subject: |
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| I agree. Kobe needs to be a good teammate first and foremost. I know he has been injured the past few years and been in and out of the lineup but the impression I have gotten is the young guys do not enjoy when he is on the court. He needs to play hard on both ends of the floor, pass to the open man regardless of if he trusts them or not and stop complaining to the refs everytime he doesn't get a call. I think part of it will have to do with Coaching staff, Management and media calling him out if they notice these things. |
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nash
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| Posted: Mon Aug 03, 2015 1:45 pm Post subject: |
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A 17-4-4 version of Kobe shooting 45% should be great. No more hero ball, he did everything a player could do, it´s time to play smart not forcing anything.
Last edited by nash on Mon Aug 03, 2015 5:33 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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kikanga
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| Posted: Mon Aug 03, 2015 1:58 pm Post subject: Re: Coaching and Kobe will decide how many games we win |
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| Car54 wrote: | I see a lot of people looking at the roster and predicting win total. We have a team that could win 30 or 50 games. Coaching and Kobe's approach will be bigger deciding factors than the rookies or Young and Lou Williams etc... If Kobe can approach the season like the old man he is (in basketball years) he could dial it back a lil bit and lead differently we could be in the playoffs. First I would like to see Kobe post up more for his points and to facilitate from the post. On defense I would like to see him gamble less and stay on his man.
With Coach Scott I would like to see him be more versatile with the offense to free Dangelo. Offensive systems sometimes hand cuff the point guard like the triangle did to Gary. If he's a good pg your offense should cater to his strengths because his strengths is making the game easier for his team mates.
We'll have a middle to top level bench with two 6 men in Lou and Swaggy. We have one of the best backups at PF in Bass (eventually) we also have Brown. |
1) We are not a 50 win team. We lack the defenders. Hibbert and (maybe) Bass I can see being above average defenders. But everyone else either has a bad track record defensively or are rookies/inexperienced.
2) DLo won't be catered too, and he probably shouldn't be. He should be treated somewhat similarly to the way Clarkson was last year. Bring him along slowly and don't throw a ton of responsibilities his way early on. I think the offense will be geared toward the strengths of our veterans moreso than DLo. But his time will come.
But I'm not trying to be a downer.
I agree, Kobe should work out of the post.
And we have depth offensively this year.
We have taken a major step forward compared to last year.
If only we were in the Eastern Conference, then I'd say we're a lock for the post season.
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Birmingham
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| Posted: Mon Aug 03, 2015 2:37 pm Post subject: Re: Coaching and Kobe will decide how many games we win |
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| Car54 wrote: | | Coaching and Kobe will decide how many games we win |
I agree.  |
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Jim99187
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Joined: 03 Jan 2014
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| Posted: Mon Aug 03, 2015 2:43 pm Post subject: |
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| BobbyB wrote: | | I agree. Kobe needs to be a good teammate first and foremost. I know he has been injured the past few years and been in and out of the lineup but the impression I have gotten is the young guys do not enjoy when he is on the court. He needs to play hard on both ends of the floor, pass to the open man regardless of if he trusts them or not and stop complaining to the refs everytime he doesn't get a call. I think part of it will have to do with Coaching staff, Management and media calling him out if they notice these things. |
what young guys? all losers from last yr are gone. all 3 young guys: Russell, Randle and Clarkson adore Kobe. They all have yet to play a min with kobe at the same time on court |
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activeverb
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| Posted: Mon Aug 03, 2015 2:43 pm Post subject: Re: Coaching and Kobe will decide how many games we win |
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| Car54 wrote: | | I see a lot of people looking at the roster and predicting win total. We have a team that could win 30 or 50 games. Coaching and Kobe's approach will be bigger deciding factors than the rookies or Young and Lou Williams etc... If |
I think the chances of us winning 50 are slight; and really I don't care how many games we win. I am more concerned about the development of the young players. This is a transition season, not a competing one. I'd happily sacrifice wins for player development. |
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Aeneas Hunter
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| Posted: Mon Aug 03, 2015 2:46 pm Post subject: |
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| I agree that the number of wins is less important than player development, but I sure would like to give the Sixers a lousy draft pick. |
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Kava
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| Posted: Mon Aug 03, 2015 3:01 pm Post subject: |
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If you're a fan of this team focused on record I'm afraid you may be disappointed. Right now, it's all about developing the young talent.
The moment we loose 3 games in a row folks here will want B Scott fired, Mitch as well for not picking up a big man, and Kobe just to go away because of his contract.
Patience will be a virtue unseen on this board! |
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KindCrippler2000
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| Posted: Mon Aug 03, 2015 3:08 pm Post subject: |
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I agree.
Free D'Angelo! |
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defense
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| Posted: Mon Aug 03, 2015 3:40 pm Post subject: |
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| One of the goals for next season should be to give Philly the worst pick possible. |
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70sdude
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| Posted: Mon Aug 03, 2015 3:58 pm Post subject: |
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| I'm on the fence with respect to the OP's assertion about the level expected for Kobe's impact. Frankly, I think he's pretty close to being a non-factor now in terms of the Lakers being a better team with him on court this season - or without him. Too close to call, really. |
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laker50
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| Posted: Mon Aug 03, 2015 4:07 pm Post subject: The facilitator Kobe has to show up |
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This is the only way he can continue his legacy if he wants to play.
chucking up 30 shots a game and hitting a low percentage is not good for this Lakers team.
He has to be the mentor. He has done everything. Now he has to show others how to do it. this is his role.
Just hope he is smart enough to realize it. |
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Car54
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| Posted: Mon Aug 03, 2015 4:23 pm Post subject: Re: Coaching and Kobe will decide how many games we win |
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| kikanga wrote: | | Car54 wrote: | I see a lot of people looking at the roster and predicting win total. We have a team that could win 30 or 50 games. Coaching and Kobe's approach will be bigger deciding factors than the rookies or Young and Lou Williams etc... If Kobe can approach the season like the old man he is (in basketball years) he could dial it back a lil bit and lead differently we could be in the playoffs. First I would like to see Kobe post up more for his points and to facilitate from the post. On defense I would like to see him gamble less and stay on his man.
With Coach Scott I would like to see him be more versatile with the offense to free Dangelo. Offensive systems sometimes hand cuff the point guard like the triangle did to Gary. If he's a good pg your offense should cater to his strengths because his strengths is making the game easier for his team mates.
We'll have a middle to top level bench with two 6 men in Lou and Swaggy. We have one of the best backups at PF in Bass (eventually) we also have Brown. |
1) We are not a 50 win team. We lack the defenders. Hibbert and (maybe) Bass I can see being above average defenders. But everyone else either has a bad track record defensively or are rookies/inexperienced.
2) DLo won't be catered too, and he probably shouldn't be. He should be treated somewhat similarly to the way Clarkson was last year. Bring him along slowly and don't throw a ton of responsibilities his way early on. I think the offense will be geared toward the strengths of our veterans moreso than DLo. But his time will come.
But I'm not trying to be a downer.
I agree, Kobe should work out of the post.
And we have depth offensively this year.
We have taken a major step forward compared to last year.
If only we were in the Eastern Conference, then I'd say we're a lock for the post season. |
How many above avg defenders did GSW have? Bogut Iggy and Klay they won 60+ games. We have Hibbert who's better than any of their defenders and we have Bass Nance DLO has shown he can be a good defender as well. Defense is about schemes. that GSW wasn't playing defense before Mark Jackson. Again we can be a 30 win team we can be a 50 win team.
I don't know if you're aware of this but Clarkson is a second round pick DLO is the second (overall ) pick. Scott has suggested starting him he never suggested that for Clarkson prior to injuries, so already he's being treated differently.
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Car54
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Posts: 14424
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| Posted: Mon Aug 03, 2015 4:26 pm Post subject: Re: Coaching and Kobe will decide how many games we win |
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| activeverb wrote: | | Car54 wrote: | | I see a lot of people looking at the roster and predicting win total. We have a team that could win 30 or 50 games. Coaching and Kobe's approach will be bigger deciding factors than the rookies or Young and Lou Williams etc... If |
I think the chances of us winning 50 are slight; and really I don't care how many games we win. I am more concerned about the development of the young players. This is a transition season, not a competing one. I'd happily sacrifice wins for player development. |
I agree but if we're gonna chase free agents we're gonna need to win some games. 29 yr old players aint signing on to play with the 3 amigos potential. I'm ok with not chasing big name free agents and just watching these guys grow.
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defense
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| Posted: Mon Aug 03, 2015 4:31 pm Post subject: Re: Coaching and Kobe will decide how many games we win |
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| Car54 wrote: | | kikanga wrote: | | Car54 wrote: | I see a lot of people looking at the roster and predicting win total. We have a team that could win 30 or 50 games. Coaching and Kobe's approach will be bigger deciding factors than the rookies or Young and Lou Williams etc... If Kobe can approach the season like the old man he is (in basketball years) he could dial it back a lil bit and lead differently we could be in the playoffs. First I would like to see Kobe post up more for his points and to facilitate from the post. On defense I would like to see him gamble less and stay on his man.
With Coach Scott I would like to see him be more versatile with the offense to free Dangelo. Offensive systems sometimes hand cuff the point guard like the triangle did to Gary. If he's a good pg your offense should cater to his strengths because his strengths is making the game easier for his team mates.
We'll have a middle to top level bench with two 6 men in Lou and Swaggy. We have one of the best backups at PF in Bass (eventually) we also have Brown. |
1) We are not a 50 win team. We lack the defenders. Hibbert and (maybe) Bass I can see being above average defenders. But everyone else either has a bad track record defensively or are rookies/inexperienced.
2) DLo won't be catered too, and he probably shouldn't be. He should be treated somewhat similarly to the way Clarkson was last year. Bring him along slowly and don't throw a ton of responsibilities his way early on. I think the offense will be geared toward the strengths of our veterans moreso than DLo. But his time will come.
But I'm not trying to be a downer.
I agree, Kobe should work out of the post.
And we have depth offensively this year.
We have taken a major step forward compared to last year.
If only we were in the Eastern Conference, then I'd say we're a lock for the post season. |
How many above avg defenders did GSW have? Bogut Iggy and Klay they won 60+ games. We have Hibbert who's better than any of their defenders and we have Bass Nance DLO has shown he can be a good defender as well. Defense is about schemes. that GSW wasn't playing defense before Mark Jackson. Again we can be a 30 win team we can be a 50 win team.
I don't know if you're aware of this but Clarkson is a second round pick DLO is the second (overall ) pick. Scott has suggested starting him he never suggested that for Clarkson prior to injuries, so already he's being treated differently. |
The Warriors are one of the best defensive teams. They have proven defenders, lots of them. We have really only one guy who has been a proven defender. The rest are either average or worse. I think comparing this team to the Warriors defensively is laughable. That doesn't mean we cant be a good defensive team but they actually have to play games before they are compared to one of the best defensive teams last season. |
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Car54
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Joined: 10 Aug 2005
Posts: 14424
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| Posted: Mon Aug 03, 2015 4:52 pm Post subject: Re: Coaching and Kobe will decide how many games we win |
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| defense wrote: | | Car54 wrote: | | kikanga wrote: | | Car54 wrote: | I see a lot of people looking at the roster and predicting win total. We have a team that could win 30 or 50 games. Coaching and Kobe's approach will be bigger deciding factors than the rookies or Young and Lou Williams etc... If Kobe can approach the season like the old man he is (in basketball years) he could dial it back a lil bit and lead differently we could be in the playoffs. First I would like to see Kobe post up more for his points and to facilitate from the post. On defense I would like to see him gamble less and stay on his man.
With Coach Scott I would like to see him be more versatile with the offense to free Dangelo. Offensive systems sometimes hand cuff the point guard like the triangle did to Gary. If he's a good pg your offense should cater to his strengths because his strengths is making the game easier for his team mates.
We'll have a middle to top level bench with two 6 men in Lou and Swaggy. We have one of the best backups at PF in Bass (eventually) we also have Brown. |
1) We are not a 50 win team. We lack the defenders. Hibbert and (maybe) Bass I can see being above average defenders. But everyone else either has a bad track record defensively or are rookies/inexperienced.
2) DLo won't be catered too, and he probably shouldn't be. He should be treated somewhat similarly to the way Clarkson was last year. Bring him along slowly and don't throw a ton of responsibilities his way early on. I think the offense will be geared toward the strengths of our veterans moreso than DLo. But his time will come.
But I'm not trying to be a downer.
I agree, Kobe should work out of the post.
And we have depth offensively this year.
We have taken a major step forward compared to last year.
If only we were in the Eastern Conference, then I'd say we're a lock for the post season. |
How many above avg defenders did GSW have? Bogut Iggy and Klay they won 60+ games. We have Hibbert who's better than any of their defenders and we have Bass Nance DLO has shown he can be a good defender as well. Defense is about schemes. that GSW wasn't playing defense before Mark Jackson. Again we can be a 30 win team we can be a 50 win team.
I don't know if you're aware of this but Clarkson is a second round pick DLO is the second (overall ) pick. Scott has suggested starting him he never suggested that for Clarkson prior to injuries, so already he's being treated differently. |
The Warriors are one of the best defensive teams. They have proven defenders, lots of them. We have really only one guy who has been a proven defender. The rest are either average or worse. I think comparing this team to the Warriors defensively is laughable. That doesn't mean we cant be a good defensive team but they actually have to play games before they are compared to one of the best defensive teams last season. |
Before this season what guys was proven defenders besides Iggy and Klay? GSW was bad defensively with those same players on the roster.
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greenfrog
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| Posted: Mon Aug 03, 2015 4:58 pm Post subject: |
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Holy (bleep)... was Draymond Green just a figment of my imagination.  |
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activeverb
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| Posted: Mon Aug 03, 2015 5:07 pm Post subject: |
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| Car54 wrote: | | defense wrote: | | Car54 wrote: | | kikanga wrote: | | Car54 wrote: | I see a lot of people looking at the roster and predicting win total. We have a team that could win 30 or 50 games. Coaching and Kobe's approach will be bigger deciding factors than the rookies or Young and Lou Williams etc... If Kobe can approach the season like the old man he is (in basketball years) he could dial it back a lil bit and lead differently we could be in the playoffs. First I would like to see Kobe post up more for his points and to facilitate from the post. On defense I would like to see him gamble less and stay on his man.
With Coach Scott I would like to see him be more versatile with the offense to free Dangelo. Offensive systems sometimes hand cuff the point guard like the triangle did to Gary. If he's a good pg your offense should cater to his strengths because his strengths is making the game easier for his team mates.
We'll have a middle to top level bench with two 6 men in Lou and Swaggy. We have one of the best backups at PF in Bass (eventually) we also have Brown. |
1) We are not a 50 win team. We lack the defenders. Hibbert and (maybe) Bass I can see being above average defenders. But everyone else either has a bad track record defensively or are rookies/inexperienced.
2) DLo won't be catered too, and he probably shouldn't be. He should be treated somewhat similarly to the way Clarkson was last year. Bring him along slowly and don't throw a ton of responsibilities his way early on. I think the offense will be geared toward the strengths of our veterans moreso than DLo. But his time will come.
But I'm not trying to be a downer.
I agree, Kobe should work out of the post.
And we have depth offensively this year.
We have taken a major step forward compared to last year.
If only we were in the Eastern Conference, then I'd say we're a lock for the post season. |
How many above avg defenders did GSW have? Bogut Iggy and Klay they won 60+ games. We have Hibbert who's better than any of their defenders and we have Bass Nance DLO has shown he can be a good defender as well. Defense is about schemes. that GSW wasn't playing defense before Mark Jackson. Again we can be a 30 win team we can be a 50 win team.
I don't know if you're aware of this but Clarkson is a second round pick DLO is the second (overall ) pick. Scott has suggested starting him he never suggested that for Clarkson prior to injuries, so already he's being treated differently. |
The Warriors are one of the best defensive teams. They have proven defenders, lots of them. We have really only one guy who has been a proven defender. The rest are either average or worse. I think comparing this team to the Warriors defensively is laughable. That doesn't mean we cant be a good defensive team but they actually have to play games before they are compared to one of the best defensive teams last season. |
Before this season what guys was proven defenders besides Iggy and Klay? GSW was bad defensively with those same players on the roster. |
Last year, the Warriors had the fourth best defensive rating in the league, and four of their players got votes for the all-defensive team.
You've seen them gradually improve on defense over the past three years as they added players and their young players got experience; it's not like they came out of nowhere last year.
Their defensive rating approval went from 27th (Thomson's rookie year) to 14th (added Bogut; Green's rookie season) to 4th to 1st. |
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USCandLakers
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| Posted: Mon Aug 03, 2015 5:14 pm Post subject: |
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Those are not the two things that will determine how many games we win. There are too many variables, too many unknowns. I'd say Randle and Russell are the two biggest determining factors. Kobe will be Kobe and Scott will be Scott. Be we have no idea what Randle or Russell will be.
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greenfrog
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| Posted: Mon Aug 03, 2015 5:15 pm Post subject: |
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| To address the OP's point, regulated "high volume shooting" similar to the setup Woodsen had with Melo in NY would be the best way to use Kobe. Give him the greenlight to take basically any shot that he wants with that caveat that he doesn't bring the ball up the floor anymore, or eat up the shot clock jab steps, excessive dribbling and holding. This way Russell's confidence and development would not be seriously impeded, and Kobe could still average over 20 without the pace being slowed to a crawl. |
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Car54
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Joined: 10 Aug 2005
Posts: 14424
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| Posted: Mon Aug 03, 2015 5:17 pm Post subject: |
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| activeverb wrote: | | Car54 wrote: | | defense wrote: | | Car54 wrote: | | kikanga wrote: | | Car54 wrote: | I see a lot of people looking at the roster and predicting win total. We have a team that could win 30 or 50 games. Coaching and Kobe's approach will be bigger deciding factors than the rookies or Young and Lou Williams etc... If Kobe can approach the season like the old man he is (in basketball years) he could dial it back a lil bit and lead differently we could be in the playoffs. First I would like to see Kobe post up more for his points and to facilitate from the post. On defense I would like to see him gamble less and stay on his man.
With Coach Scott I would like to see him be more versatile with the offense to free Dangelo. Offensive systems sometimes hand cuff the point guard like the triangle did to Gary. If he's a good pg your offense should cater to his strengths because his strengths is making the game easier for his team mates.
We'll have a middle to top level bench with two 6 men in Lou and Swaggy. We have one of the best backups at PF in Bass (eventually) we also have Brown. |
1) We are not a 50 win team. We lack the defenders. Hibbert and (maybe) Bass I can see being above average defenders. But everyone else either has a bad track record defensively or are rookies/inexperienced.
2) DLo won't be catered too, and he probably shouldn't be. He should be treated somewhat similarly to the way Clarkson was last year. Bring him along slowly and don't throw a ton of responsibilities his way early on. I think the offense will be geared toward the strengths of our veterans moreso than DLo. But his time will come.
But I'm not trying to be a downer.
I agree, Kobe should work out of the post.
And we have depth offensively this year.
We have taken a major step forward compared to last year.
If only we were in the Eastern Conference, then I'd say we're a lock for the post season. |
How many above avg defenders did GSW have? Bogut Iggy and Klay they won 60+ games. We have Hibbert who's better than any of their defenders and we have Bass Nance DLO has shown he can be a good defender as well. Defense is about schemes. that GSW wasn't playing defense before Mark Jackson. Again we can be a 30 win team we can be a 50 win team.
I don't know if you're aware of this but Clarkson is a second round pick DLO is the second (overall ) pick. Scott has suggested starting him he never suggested that for Clarkson prior to injuries, so already he's being treated differently. |
The Warriors are one of the best defensive teams. They have proven defenders, lots of them. We have really only one guy who has been a proven defender. The rest are either average or worse. I think comparing this team to the Warriors defensively is laughable. That doesn't mean we cant be a good defensive team but they actually have to play games before they are compared to one of the best defensive teams last season. |
Before this season what guys was proven defenders besides Iggy and Klay? GSW was bad defensively with those same players on the roster. |
Last year, the Warriors had the fourth best defensive rating in the league, and four of their players got votes for the all-defensive team.
You've seen them gradually improve on defense over the past three years as they added players and their young players got experience; it's not like they came out of nowhere last year.
Their defensive rating approval went from 27th (Thomson's rookie year) to 14th (added Bogut; Green's rookie season) to 4th to 1st. |
But where do we disagree? I believe the lakers can be around 15th in defense with the moves made. is that unrealistic?
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Car54
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| Posted: Mon Aug 03, 2015 5:18 pm Post subject: |
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| USCandLakers wrote: | | Those are not the two things that will determine how many games we win. There are too many variables, too many unknowns. I'd say Randle and Russell are the two biggest determining factors. Kobe will be Kobe and Scott will be Scott. Be we have no idea what Randle or Russell will be. |
Kobe's power on this team can make Randle and Russell non existent.
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Goldenwest
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| Posted: Mon Aug 03, 2015 5:24 pm Post subject: |
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Kobe will be a factor but not the main factor. Kobe's not going to carry the team. He can't take over like he used to. Nor will he sabotage it. I think Kobe's smart enough to know his limitation now and will allow the new blood to develop.
I don't see Scott doing anything that much different than what he did last year. Except this will be an all-out no tanking year. He's going to rely on his assistants who will do their best to put the players in a position to win.
To me, Russell and Hibbert are the biggest factors in determining whether this will be a good year or another bad year. Russell is setting the offense and Hibbert is in charge of the paint and rim. It all starts with those two. |
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greenfrog
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| Posted: Mon Aug 03, 2015 5:32 pm Post subject: |
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| Goldenwest wrote: | Kobe will be a factor but not the main factor. Kobe's not going to carry the team. He can't take over like he used to. Nor will he sabotage it. I think Kobe's smart enough to know his limitation now and will allow the new blood to develop.
I don't see Scott doing anything that much different than what he did last year. Except this will be an all-out no tanking year. He's going to rely on his assistants who will do their best to put the players in a position to win.
To me, Russell and Hibbert are the biggest factors in determining whether this will be a good year or another bad year. Russell is setting the offense and Hibbert is in charge of the paint and rim. It all starts with those two. |
Playing at a slow deliberate pace (basically Byron's Princeton) is sabotaging it. Unless you care about another one-year rental in Hibbert or Robert Sacre, nobody benefits from that style. |
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