Kobe’s Final Years (2014-Current) Will History Be Kind or Unkind?

yinoma2001 · Retired Number Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487

Couple of provisos:

1. I’m hoping and cheering for Kobe to have a healthy and good year. By that I’m hoping for 65 games, 20/5/5. That’s just my hope.
2. It’s unlikely we make the playoffs, and may be another lottery bound team (though I think we will be much better on the court).
3. Let’s assume he retires after this season, or maybe after 2016 where his stats go down further.

Other examples of HOF, top-25 all-time players with less than stellar final seasons (using SLAM magazine’s top 500 list, circa 2011 http://www.basketball-reference.com/awards/slam_500_greatest.html)

Shaq: his final 5 years (2006-2011) were mediocre. He didn’t hit over 20 ppg, only averaged over 10 rpg once, and generally played less than 50% of the games. I think history has been kind to him by basically erasing these final years.

Hakeem: he was a shell of himself in his final 3 years (2000-02, ages 37-39). Averaged around 9 ppg. Actually, looking back at his final 5 years, averaged 52 games a season. History has pretty much written off these years when considering the Dream.

Dr. J: His relative decline started at age 34, where he averaged 20 ppg (then his lowest), 18 ppg, and 16.8 ppg. He was relatively healthy playing around 70 games a season. I think his durability and continued production was helpful to his legacy.

Elgin Baylor: his final 2 years were terrible due to nagging injuries. At age 36 and 37, he played a TOTAL of 11 games, averaging around 10 ppg.

Charles Barkley: his final 3 years (age 34-36) were well below his standards. Averaged 43 games a season, and around 15 ppg.

Of course you had other top-25 all-time players who finished out their careers on better notes, but these players also show that history hasn’t been unkind to their legacies even when their performance drop precipitously. I hope that history will similarly be kind to Kobe and his final years. He was definitely balling in 2012-13 before he tore his Achilles. I have little reason to doubt he would have played better in 2014 and 2015 if he wasn’t hurt (duh). However, even taking this into account, it would be unfair and a double standard to use Kobe’s final years against him.

Unfortunately, I think history will be unkind to Kobe when it uses the final years against him when the discussion is about the best player ever. But for purposes of the top 10 (where Kobe should be firmly in place), I don't think these final years will be a decisive knock against him.
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audioaxes · Franchise Player Joined: 26 Apr 2004 Posts: 12573

athletes slowing down is a fact of life. Nobody holds that against them

yinoma2001 · Retired Number Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487

Gwyn · Star Player Joined: 11 Oct 2012 Posts: 3499

The people who would hold it against him, are probably the same dicks who hold his earlier success with Shaq against him.
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Lakers win record when Kobe goes for 40+ points

God bless Kobe Bean Bryant and Gianna Maria Onore Bryant.

yinoma2001 · Retired Number Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487

SuperboyReformed · Star Player Joined: 07 Oct 2012 Posts: 4083

it almost sounded like you were asking if history is going to be kind to Kobe's career. but what you are really asking is how well is he going to play these last few years. which is an odd question the way you phrased it because it's not really a matter of history being kind or unkind, but just basically how well is he going to play.

ok...to answer your intended question...i don't know! lol.

i don't know because this is a strange team to me. i've never seen kobe play on this kind of a team. this is very different than any laker team i've ever seen. all young guys, all unknown commodities. even the guys we've seen play, we've only seen them play on a tanking team, which doesn't really indicate how they would play on a serious team.

and we know kobe is not going to play his usual role, he might play sf or pf sometimes, so there are too many unknowns for me to have much of an idea how he will play. i'm guessing and hoping he's going to play off a lot of screens and do a lot more post play. whatever he does, i'm sure he will be great at it, as he always is. hopefully no injuries.

the unfortunate thing now is that people have gotten used to looking at numbers and making conclusions (ridiculous conclusions) about players. so in that sense, the numbers are most likely not going to do him any favors going forward. but who cares, i don't think kobe cares. i don't care. the great thing, though, is that this is the youtube age, and no matter what the numbers say, we have loads of video to show how great kobe is. so even if he has poor numbers in old man mode, we'll still be able to watch the video repeatedly to really see if those numbers reflect badness or goodness. kobe wants to win, and if he shoots the ball at a 20% clip and wins a ring, he's going to do that. we'll see...i really have no idea, and it's actually one of the very few things left in the nba that is making me look forward to this upcoming season.

ocho · Retired Number Joined: 24 May 2005 Posts: 53790

I don't think anyone is remembered by their worst years. In terms of Kobe's place in history, it should be noted that even his most of his biggest detractors still have him as a Top 10 player All Time.

SuperboyReformed · Star Player Joined: 07 Oct 2012 Posts: 4083

yinoma2001 · Retired Number Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487

SuperboyReformed · Star Player Joined: 07 Oct 2012 Posts: 4083

dries · Starting Rotation Joined: 14 Mar 2005 Posts: 711

Can't wait to see the result of kobe working out his lower body this summer. He seemed very optimistic about his legs in interviews.

thejet24 · Star Player Joined: 06 Nov 2007 Posts: 3020

ReaListik · Star Player Joined: 08 Jun 2008 Posts: 6553

Kobe is one of the most despised athletes of all time, except in China. He has always been a "I'll do what I want, when I want, because I believe in myself and what I'm doing. If you don't like who I am then (bleep) off." I love this approach to not just basketball, but to life. People who are followers of the latest fad or idiots just don't like Kobe. They will treat him terrible in the history books and continue to attack in the MJ vs Kobe discussion. Bottomline is anyone who knows basketball knows Kobe's been one of the greatest ever.
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SuperboyReformed · Star Player Joined: 07 Oct 2012 Posts: 4083

Surfitall · Posted: Fri Aug 07, 2015 6:36 pm Post subject:

I remember watching Dr. J in his final years and wondering as a youngster, "He's ok, he has a cool name, but he isn't that great." I wish I could have seen him in his prime. Youngsters may say that about Kobe, they may not. We'll have to see how Kobe does this year, but I don't expect it to be worse than that.

ringfinger · Retired Number Joined: 08 Oct 2013 Posts: 29418

Agent P · Posted: Fri Aug 07, 2015 6:59 pm Post subject:

If his legs are healthy and strong like he says, I can see him playing really well this year and then wanting another shot next year too. I'll never count Vino out.

Vin · Posted: Sat Aug 08, 2015 3:26 am Post subject:

Part of me thinks he's done but another part of me still hope he can still produce at a high level with the young guys.

Nobody · Posted: Sat Aug 08, 2015 3:05 pm Post subject:

The answer to your question is actually a question: Who gives a flying (bleep) about Jordan's stint with the Wizards? That's right... nobody.

999 · Franchise Player Joined: 19 Oct 2006 Posts: 20266

compared to lebron the media has been unkind to kobe his entire career

SuperboyReformed · Star Player Joined: 07 Oct 2012 Posts: 4083

LandsbergerRules · Posted: Sat Aug 08, 2015 6:07 pm Post subject:

Aeneas Hunter · Retired Number Joined: 12 Jul 2005 Posts: 31763

SuperboyReformed · Star Player Joined: 07 Oct 2012 Posts: 4083

Tony Anapolis · Star Player Joined: 05 Jan 2015 Posts: 3331

I would have to say realistically Kobe was probably the best player in the world 12 out of his 19 years. There have been all time greats that careers have only been 12-13 years. The man was/is a machine.

People forget Jordan was chucking up around 23 shots a game at a point in Washington. I am interested to see how Kobe goes out. 20/5/5 and finish 10th-8th in the west would be a great finish to a rare career.