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2019 Franchise Player
Joined: 03 Dec 2014 Posts: 10786
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Posted: Wed May 25, 2016 1:54 pm Post subject: |
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KobeRe-Loaded wrote: | 2019 wrote: | AC Green's V-Card wrote: | Mike@LG wrote: | Quote: | What makes people think that Ingram is a harder worker than Simmons? I've not seen anything to indicate Simmons isn't a hard worker or that he doesn't have a high work ethic on his basketball skills.
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Simple.
Gained 20 pounds prior to season start.
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Unless he's doing TRT or has a membership to Balco, this is not possible to do in the short amount of time he had to do it. He weighed 190 as a senior at Kinston according to MaxPreps, weighed in at 195.8 (but I'll round to) 196 for the Nike Hoops Summit, and listed at 190 on the official Duke website. Twenty pounds on his frame would be a significant difference, over a 10% increase from April 2015 to November 2015.
For photo comparison:
Giannis - 6'11, 220
Jakarr Sampson - 6'9, 214
Chris McCullough - 6'9, 210
Brandon Ingam
Not to say he's not a hard worker given all that, but I think the 20lbs between senior year at Kinston and freshman year at Duke is a misnomer. Of course he didn't go to the combine, but I think we'll get official measurements once Ingram comes in for a workout in LA. |
A 17-18 year old kid who is 6'9 gaining 20 pounds is nothing crazy. Hell, that's probably a great deal of natural growth + lifting and eating right for the fist time in his life as he knew college was approaching.
I can't even begin to comprehend how weight gain indicates he's a harder worker than Simmons.
Honestly, that's the silliest thing I've heard in a while. |
Seriously! |
If he wasn't putting on weight at this age and phase of his life, I'd have major concerns.
If people want to argue Ingram's skills are better fit or they think he's got a higher ceiling, or that he's got more room to improve, then whatever.
But to claim Simmons has poor work ethic becuase Ingram gained weight--- ummmmm, there are plenty of words to describe how off that is.
As far as Ingram "improving during the year", okay fine. But he also had poor stretches and when it was all said and done, Simmons dwarfed him in every category outside shooting. |
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kaoss128 Franchise Player
Joined: 09 Apr 2006 Posts: 13058 Location: Morgantown, WV
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Posted: Wed May 25, 2016 1:59 pm Post subject: |
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Except for Ingram didn't even gain weight. Unless he was gaining back weight that he lost. |
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CamReddish Star Player
Joined: 23 Jun 2015 Posts: 7783
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Posted: Wed May 25, 2016 2:00 pm Post subject: |
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kaoss128 wrote: | Except for Ingram didn't even gain weight. Unless he was gaining back weight that he lost. |
What do you mean, he put on like 20 pounds before Duke's season. |
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pjiddy Retired Number
Joined: 12 Dec 2005 Posts: 29016
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Posted: Wed May 25, 2016 2:01 pm Post subject: |
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Ainge wouldn't take Randle for the #3, so we can put that to bed.
Whatever you think Randle could become, the fact he only has two years of rookie control left is huge. The lost rookie year, plus what was nearly a lost year under Byron (developmentally) means we'll still be puzzling over what he is when extension talk comes up. Meanwhile, the #3 pick will have 4 years under Brad Stevens to grow into something. |
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kaoss128 Franchise Player
Joined: 09 Apr 2006 Posts: 13058 Location: Morgantown, WV
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Posted: Wed May 25, 2016 2:09 pm Post subject: |
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Russell1 wrote: | kaoss128 wrote: | Except for Ingram didn't even gain weight. Unless he was gaining back weight that he lost. |
What do you mean, he put on like 20 pounds before Duke's season. |
Except he didn't. Ingram weighed in at 196 pounds at last year's hoops summit. He told Chad Ford a couple days ago that he is now up to 197 pounds. |
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Car54 Franchise Player
Joined: 10 Aug 2005 Posts: 14424
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Posted: Wed May 25, 2016 2:10 pm Post subject: |
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Jules may or may not be worth the 3rd pick but who cares? We want to fix positions that need to be fixed instead swapping one out for another. #freeagencyFix _________________ Coach Vogel, Kidd, Hollins
Max slot : Kawhi |
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Dr. Funkbot Star Player
Joined: 24 Sep 2001 Posts: 8188 Location: Eagle Rock
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Posted: Wed May 25, 2016 2:25 pm Post subject: |
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lakerfanaticPT wrote: | RMBAA wrote: | Assuming we stay at #32 is Zhou Qi, Onuaku, Hammons, or Bentil the better choice?
If we were able to jump to #25, Thon or Diallo?
I really see the Lakers adding a big man prospect with their second pick |
Agree 100%. Should look at a back up big man at 32. Hammons, Maker, Qi, Onuaku.
Maybe buy another late first or early to mid second for another prospect wing. Pretty deep draft on that front. |
At 32 I like Onaku a lot. Plays both ends of the floor and has surprising hops for his size. I don't think that Qi or Maker last into the second round. I am not sold on Bentil.
I would take Maker at 25 over Diallo mainly due to us having Nance already and us having a great need at center. But, if we get a FA center or if Daillo wows at the workouts I would not be opposed.
It is a deep draft, we will get good value at 32. I think that the Mock Drafts so far are really not going to be accurate due to the large number of NBA roster players in this draft. It will be very exciting to see how this plays out.
I think there will be more than a few Larry Nance Jr. type players who seemingly come out of nowhere and move into the first round and I also think a lot of NBA players will go undrafted. There will be good pickin's for the D-Fenders out there. _________________ R.I.P. Doc Buss |
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Dilla_ Star Player
Joined: 25 Oct 2015 Posts: 1274
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Posted: Wed May 25, 2016 2:28 pm Post subject: |
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Anyone heard of Emmanuel Malou or know much about him? I was reading an article about Ben Simmons and Thon Maker and saw him name mentioned. The article I read said it's expected Malou will go undrafted but it's the first I've heard of him. _________________ Coach MWP. |
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FreakofNature Star Player
Joined: 28 Sep 2007 Posts: 9187 Location: Maui ...
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Posted: Wed May 25, 2016 2:36 pm Post subject: |
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Any reported info on the workouts thus far? Any news on when Simmons and Ingram come in? |
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Karmaloop Star Player
Joined: 24 Jun 2008 Posts: 2387
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Posted: Wed May 25, 2016 2:38 pm Post subject: |
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FreakofNature wrote: | Any reported info on the workouts thus far? Any news on when Simmons and Ingram come in? |
They're not supposed to start doing workouts until mid-next week. |
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FreakofNature Star Player
Joined: 28 Sep 2007 Posts: 9187 Location: Maui ...
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Posted: Wed May 25, 2016 2:42 pm Post subject: |
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Dr. Funkbot wrote: | lakerfanaticPT wrote: | RMBAA wrote: | Assuming we stay at #32 is Zhou Qi, Onuaku, Hammons, or Bentil the better choice?
If we were able to jump to #25, Thon or Diallo?
I really see the Lakers adding a big man prospect with their second pick |
Agree 100%. Should look at a back up big man at 32. Hammons, Maker, Qi, Onuaku.
Maybe buy another late first or early to mid second for another prospect wing. Pretty deep draft on that front. |
At 32 I like Onaku a lot. Plays both ends of the floor and has surprising hops for his size. I don't think that Qi or Maker last into the second round. I am not sold on Bentil.
I would take Maker at 25 over Diallo mainly due to us having Nance already and us having a great need at center. But, if we get a FA center or if Daillo wows at the workouts I would not be opposed.
It is a deep draft, we will get good value at 32. I think that the Mock Drafts so far are really not going to be accurate due to the large number of NBA roster players in this draft. It will be very exciting to see how this plays out.
I think there will be more than a few Larry Nance Jr. type players who seemingly come out of nowhere and move into the first round and I also think a lot of NBA players will go undrafted. There will be good pickin's for the D-Fenders out there. |
I wonder if we trade Lou and the 32nd to get into the later teens?
if we do retain the #32, and get a 25 or so, i would like a big with the 25th pick, and at #32 I hope the lakers at least give kay felder a good look, you know, the guy that was 4th in scoring in the nation, and 1st in assists.
Picks 15 to 45 are real deep, the first 2 picks of course, and then it gets thin for the most part, but from 15 or so into middle 2nd round it is deep.
Some real good players are going to go un drafted, I hope the lakers invite a few to Summer league...
Last edited by FreakofNature on Wed May 25, 2016 2:45 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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FreakofNature Star Player
Joined: 28 Sep 2007 Posts: 9187 Location: Maui ...
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Posted: Wed May 25, 2016 2:43 pm Post subject: |
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Karmaloop wrote: | FreakofNature wrote: | Any reported info on the workouts thus far? Any news on when Simmons and Ingram come in? |
They're not supposed to start doing workouts until mid-next week. |
Oh really, i guess getting scheduling together and all.... Thanks for the tip.. |
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PHILosophize Franchise Player
Joined: 05 Nov 2012 Posts: 10758
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Posted: Wed May 25, 2016 2:43 pm Post subject: |
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If Lou and the 32nd nets us Thon Maker, WE NEED TO DO IT! |
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FreakofNature Star Player
Joined: 28 Sep 2007 Posts: 9187 Location: Maui ...
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Posted: Wed May 25, 2016 2:47 pm Post subject: |
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PHILosophize wrote: | If Lou and the 32nd nets us Thon Maker, WE NEED TO DO IT! |
OH YES! I agree 100%.
I bet he goes middle teens? And when all the dust settles, still be a steal for the team that drafts him .... |
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PHILosophize Franchise Player
Joined: 05 Nov 2012 Posts: 10758
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Posted: Wed May 25, 2016 2:51 pm Post subject: |
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Yep middle to late teens sounds about right. But it is possible someone could take a chance on him slightly earlier. |
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KobeRe-Loaded Franchise Player
Joined: 09 Dec 2003 Posts: 14944
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Posted: Wed May 25, 2016 2:52 pm Post subject: |
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2019 wrote: | KobeRe-Loaded wrote: | 2019 wrote: | AC Green's V-Card wrote: | Mike@LG wrote: | Quote: | What makes people think that Ingram is a harder worker than Simmons? I've not seen anything to indicate Simmons isn't a hard worker or that he doesn't have a high work ethic on his basketball skills.
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Simple.
Gained 20 pounds prior to season start.
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Unless he's doing TRT or has a membership to Balco, this is not possible to do in the short amount of time he had to do it. He weighed 190 as a senior at Kinston according to MaxPreps, weighed in at 195.8 (but I'll round to) 196 for the Nike Hoops Summit, and listed at 190 on the official Duke website. Twenty pounds on his frame would be a significant difference, over a 10% increase from April 2015 to November 2015.
For photo comparison:
Giannis - 6'11, 220
Jakarr Sampson - 6'9, 214
Chris McCullough - 6'9, 210
Brandon Ingam
Not to say he's not a hard worker given all that, but I think the 20lbs between senior year at Kinston and freshman year at Duke is a misnomer. Of course he didn't go to the combine, but I think we'll get official measurements once Ingram comes in for a workout in LA. |
A 17-18 year old kid who is 6'9 gaining 20 pounds is nothing crazy. Hell, that's probably a great deal of natural growth + lifting and eating right for the fist time in his life as he knew college was approaching.
I can't even begin to comprehend how weight gain indicates he's a harder worker than Simmons.
Honestly, that's the silliest thing I've heard in a while. |
Seriously! |
If he wasn't putting on weight at this age and phase of his life, I'd have major concerns.
If people want to argue Ingram's skills are better fit or they think he's got a higher ceiling, or that he's got more room to improve, then whatever.
But to claim Simmons has poor work ethic becuase Ingram gained weight--- ummmmm, there are plenty of words to describe how off that is.
As far as Ingram "improving during the year", okay fine. But he also had poor stretches and when it was all said and done, Simmons dwarfed him in every category outside shooting. |
To catch you up, Mike ( a t ) LG has been a big proponent of the Lakers drafting Ingram _________________ #11/08/16 America became GREAT again
#Avatar-gate |
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FreakofNature Star Player
Joined: 28 Sep 2007 Posts: 9187 Location: Maui ...
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Posted: Wed May 25, 2016 2:55 pm Post subject: |
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PHILosophize wrote: | Yep middle to late teens sounds about right. But it is possible someone could take a chance on him slightly earlier. |
I think so. And you know what? I would if I was at 10 or 12. I think he is going to be a real nice player, and even better than that. |
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FreakofNature Star Player
Joined: 28 Sep 2007 Posts: 9187 Location: Maui ...
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Posted: Wed May 25, 2016 3:01 pm Post subject: |
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KobeRe-Loaded wrote: | 2019 wrote: | KobeRe-Loaded wrote: | 2019 wrote: | AC Green's V-Card wrote: | Mike@LG wrote: | Quote: | What makes people think that Ingram is a harder worker than Simmons? I've not seen anything to indicate Simmons isn't a hard worker or that he doesn't have a high work ethic on his basketball skills.
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Simple.
Gained 20 pounds prior to season start.
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Unless he's doing TRT or has a membership to Balco, this is not possible to do in the short amount of time he had to do it. He weighed 190 as a senior at Kinston according to MaxPreps, weighed in at 195.8 (but I'll round to) 196 for the Nike Hoops Summit, and listed at 190 on the official Duke website. Twenty pounds on his frame would be a significant difference, over a 10% increase from April 2015 to November 2015.
For photo comparison:
Giannis - 6'11, 220
Jakarr Sampson - 6'9, 214
Chris McCullough - 6'9, 210
Brandon Ingam
Not to say he's not a hard worker given all that, but I think the 20lbs between senior year at Kinston and freshman year at Duke is a misnomer. Of course he didn't go to the combine, but I think we'll get official measurements once Ingram comes in for a workout in LA. |
A 17-18 year old kid who is 6'9 gaining 20 pounds is nothing crazy. Hell, that's probably a great deal of natural growth + lifting and eating right for the fist time in his life as he knew college was approaching.
I can't even begin to comprehend how weight gain indicates he's a harder worker than Simmons.
Honestly, that's the silliest thing I've heard in a while. |
Seriously! |
If he wasn't putting on weight at this age and phase of his life, I'd have major concerns.
If people want to argue Ingram's skills are better fit or they think he's got a higher ceiling, or that he's got more room to improve, then whatever.
But to claim Simmons has poor work ethic becuase Ingram gained weight--- ummmmm, there are plenty of words to describe how off that is.
As far as Ingram "improving during the year", okay fine. But he also had poor stretches and when it was all said and done, Simmons dwarfed him in every category outside shooting. |
To catch you up, Mike AT LG has been a big proponent of the Lakers drafting Ingram |
If Ingram was smart, and I am betting he is. he would have started up on a real heavy duty weightlifting session this past month already. Then with June through September, another 4 months, continue on, with real lean muscle mass growth in the 5 months in total can or could get 25 real lean muscle on that frame. That 190 pound kid can be 215 by training camp in October... |
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Don Draper Retired Number
Joined: 21 Feb 2008 Posts: 28422 Location: LA --> Bay Area
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Posted: Wed May 25, 2016 3:07 pm Post subject: |
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25 pounds of muscle in 5 months might be possible if he has the genetics for that, but some guys just can't put on weight very quickly unless they eat 5,000 calories a day. |
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Don Draper Retired Number
Joined: 21 Feb 2008 Posts: 28422 Location: LA --> Bay Area
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Posted: Wed May 25, 2016 3:10 pm Post subject: |
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If Ingram has never really weight trained before and REALLY goes hard in the gym, he might be able to put on 25 pounds of muscle over a year. |
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KobeRe-Loaded Franchise Player
Joined: 09 Dec 2003 Posts: 14944
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Posted: Wed May 25, 2016 3:15 pm Post subject: |
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D'Alphalo wrote: | 25 pounds of muscle in 5 months might be possible if he has the genetics for that, but some guys just can't put on weight very quickly unless they eat 5,000 calories a day. |
I would bet the FARM on the under 215 by the start of camp.
That kid has one of those "Ectomorph" type of body that is just long and lean. Very difficult for him to pack on weight, especially 25 pounds in 5 months.
I do believe once his body matures and he's on an NBA program, he will be around 225-235 but that will probably be in at least 2-3 years.
But hey, I don't think they check for HGH in the NBA so ... have a go kid _________________ #11/08/16 America became GREAT again
#Avatar-gate |
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kobe_luver Franchise Player
Joined: 08 Feb 2008 Posts: 11644 Location: LA
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Posted: Wed May 25, 2016 3:20 pm Post subject: |
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FreakofNature wrote: | PHILosophize wrote: | If Lou and the 32nd nets us Thon Maker, WE NEED TO DO IT! |
OH YES! I agree 100%.
I bet he goes middle teens? And when all the dust settles, still be a steal for the team that drafts him .... |
I really want us to get Thon Maker!!
We need to figure out how to get a high pick to nab him (hopefully around #10) and hope he's not taken by then!! |
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kaoss128 Franchise Player
Joined: 09 Apr 2006 Posts: 13058 Location: Morgantown, WV
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Posted: Wed May 25, 2016 3:23 pm Post subject: |
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D'Alphalo wrote: | If Ingram has never really weight trained before and REALLY goes hard in the gym, he might be able to put on 25 pounds of muscle over a year. |
The kid just spent a year at Duke. You don't think he was weight training? |
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kaoss128 Franchise Player
Joined: 09 Apr 2006 Posts: 13058 Location: Morgantown, WV
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Posted: Wed May 25, 2016 3:29 pm Post subject: |
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Dilla_ wrote: | Anyone heard of Emmanuel Malou or know much about him? I was reading an article about Ben Simmons and Thon Maker and saw him name mentioned. The article I read said it's expected Malou will go undrafted but it's the first I've heard of him. |
Incredible athlete and definitely worth picking up in the 50 to 60 range to see if he develops. Not sure if he'll stay in the draft. He committed to Iowa State and then entered the draft in case the NCAA rules him ineligible.
Here are his JUCO highlights.
Link
I'm a WVU fan and we were recruiting him for a while so I'm familiar with him. |
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FreakofNature Star Player
Joined: 28 Sep 2007 Posts: 9187 Location: Maui ...
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Posted: Wed May 25, 2016 3:31 pm Post subject: |
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D'Alphalo wrote: | If Ingram has never really weight trained before and REALLY goes hard in the gym, he might be able to put on 25 pounds of muscle over a year. |
If he gets the proper trainer, and gets his mind on it 100% he can gain that 5 pounds per month. It is up to him. Now sure it could be 17/18 pounds, depending on the person, but I know he can gain the strength needed, this besides the weight.
I have lived my life in training, it is a way of life for me,hence the name "freakofnature"...
It's up to him. I know that once it's all about hoops in october through the season he will go into a more cardio specific regime, but off season going full on full tilt heavy lifting, he can put the muscle on quick enough. Of course you do not want to push it too far he is a basketball player and young, but with time after this initial gain, he can pick his spots when to add lean muscle mass. |
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