Steph Curry 2nd greatest pg of all time?
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lakersken80
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 13, 2015 12:56 pm    Post subject:

activeverb wrote:
carlosLisboa wrote:

CP3...2nd round...any all NBA first team?
.


CP3 has made 4 all-NBA first teams, 2 second teams, and one third team in 11 seasons.

Curry has made 1 all-NBA first team and 1 second team in 7 seasons.


If we go by averages, CP3 has better averages over the course of his career....but Steph has reached milestones that few NBA players ever get in their career like winning an NBA Finals and league MVP in the same season.
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 13, 2015 12:57 pm    Post subject:

kikanga wrote:
^ I don't move players because they play non-traditionally at the position so I consider Curry and Jerry West PGs.
I do sometimes wonder how Alonzo Mourning ranks against all-time PFs instead of all-time Cs.
He was smaller than Hakeem, Ewing, Smits (true 7 footers), but he could space the floor well enough to play 4 in the NBA nowadays.



West is an odd situation. He played in an era where players weren't narrowly classified as PG or SG, so people argue whether he or Goodrich was the PG. Generally, though, the consensus is he belongs as a shooting guard
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activeverb
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 13, 2015 1:07 pm    Post subject:

lakersken80 wrote:
activeverb wrote:
carlosLisboa wrote:

CP3...2nd round...any all NBA first team?
.


CP3 has made 4 all-NBA first teams, 2 second teams, and one third team in 11 seasons.

Curry has made 1 all-NBA first team and 1 second team in 7 seasons.


If we go by averages, CP3 has better averages over the course of his career....but Steph has reached milestones that few NBA players ever get in their career like winning an NBA Finals and league MVP in the same season.


Well, Curry's career is just getting going. Before last year, no one would have thought to even start this thread.
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 13, 2015 1:46 pm    Post subject:

He just entered his prime so he has a good chance.
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LakerLogic
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 13, 2015 2:01 pm    Post subject:

Best shooter ever by a large margin when you factor shooting off the dribble with people in his face. Some of the best handles ever. Great passer. His defense is pretty darn good too.
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 13, 2015 2:17 pm    Post subject:

I like curry, I really do. But it's now obvious he is getting overhyped. all this "best ever" talk is unwarranted right now, no matter what you believe. he can't be the best ever yet! he hasn't done enough!

he's a great distance shooter, i won't argue with saying he's the best in the league.
He's playing in a system designed to get him open. It's a good system overall, probably the best in the league also. There should be more praises to whoever architected that team, more so than these ideas that curry is the best ever at something.

in the finals, it was iguodala who was the best player in a lot of cases (notice, a TALL guy).

I felt lebron was hugely overhyped throughout his career. his career never validated the hype. we are doing the same for curry now. i really hope he can live up to it because i like his game, i'm a skills guy, and i want the best players to be skilled guys, not just great athletes. so curry is a skills guy. but i do feel he's too short to be the best ever as far as shooting or scoring. Now, best pg? i don't think he's anywhere near the discussion for the best pg ever or around there for his passing and offense orchestration. sorry, not close. he's good, decent, very good, whatever...but not even in the discussion for best ever pg.

but i know from experience, this is going to be a lost cause. curry is the next thing to overhype now i guess in the nba. Yes! best shooter ever, it's not even close! ray allen is like dj mbenga compared to this guy.
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ringfinger
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 13, 2015 2:39 pm    Post subject:

I agree he isn't the best traditional PG, but I think while the discussions around best PG are early, they're justified. He's doing things no one else does. It's not even a matter of just shooting better. The guy is, unbelievable.

So I don't think he's the best, nor even near one of the best PGs. But, I do think he's one of the best players to play at the PG spot to have ever played.
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 13, 2015 3:08 pm    Post subject:

venturalakersfan wrote:
non-player zealot wrote:
Why Chris Paul? Curry's a known winner. Paul, not as much.


You are talking about teams, not players.


Chris has a good team now. It was LAC, GS, SA last year. Curry won out. Unless you're telling me GS's support cast was that much greater than LAC's.
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 13, 2015 4:43 pm    Post subject:

ringfinger wrote:
Curry is ridiculous.

So, last season, Westbrook led all players in 20+ pt quarters with 4.

This year, Curry's played 10 games and already has 4.


To do 4 times in a career would be impressive.

4 times in 10 games (all wins) is simply ridiculous.
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 13, 2015 4:48 pm    Post subject:

KBH wrote:
kikanga wrote:
^ I don't move players because they play non-traditionally at the position so I consider Curry and Jerry West PGs.
I do sometimes wonder how Alonzo Mourning ranks against all-time PFs instead of all-time Cs.
He was smaller than Hakeem, Ewing, Smits (true 7 footers), but he could space the floor well enough to play 4 in the NBA nowadays.


Zo would definitely be a center in today's game, though. He'd be the perfect modern C. Strong enough to body the modern game's few elite post scorers, athletic enough to shut down the paint and defend pick and rolls. Elite post game and he had that midrange J you mentioned.


I think the Admiral would have been the perfect modern C. elite mobility and shot blocking, face up game, mid range jumper.
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 13, 2015 4:58 pm    Post subject:

activeverb wrote:
70sdude wrote:
Top five all-time:

Cousy
Robertson
Frazier
Magic Johnson
Isiah Thomas

Next tier:
John Stockton
Dennis Johnson
Gary Payton
Chris Paul
Jason Kidd

Next tier:
Mo Cheeks
Steve Nash
Kevin Johnson
Nate Archibald
Mark Price

Guys whose playing time reflect mid-career status (Curry, Westbrook, etc.) or played less distinctly as point-guard only (perhaps as much play both off the ball as scorers as directing the offense (Jerry West, Dwayne Wade, Sidney Moncrief, Fat Lever and yes, LeBron James) are left off my list of point guards.


-- I'd most most people put Stockton in the first tier and not Frazier

-- Cousy is an odd case. You put him on the list for historical reasons (like Mikan at center) but it's hard to really know where he belongs.

-- I'd say Nash is commonly in the second tier and Dennis Johnson is not. That said, after Magic opinions on how point guards should be ranked can be all over the place.

-- Jerry West, Dwayne Wade, Sidney Moncrief, and Fat Lever are generally regarded as shooting guards and LeBron James as a small forward.


Cousy an odd case ? Wow. Did you see him play ? Did you review his awards and honors ? He was dominant at the position for about ten years, which puts him top rank for me too.
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 13, 2015 9:41 pm    Post subject:

LakerLanny wrote:
ringfinger wrote:
Curry is ridiculous.

So, last season, Westbrook led all players in 20+ pt quarters with 4.

This year, Curry's played 10 games and already has 4.


To do 4 times in a career would be impressive.

4 times in 10 games (all wins) is simply ridiculous.

again, all i want to say is a lot of this credit should be going to the system and the teammates. This is phoenix on steroids. This is NOT Kobe in his smush years, and this is not MJ during the mid 80s, and this is not Wilt on his non championship teams.

In other words, I am not seeing anything from Curry that tells me that if you were to put him on a team with worse teammates and a worse system, would he carry them this way.
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 13, 2015 10:09 pm    Post subject:

SuperboyReformed wrote:
LakerLanny wrote:
ringfinger wrote:
Curry is ridiculous.

So, last season, Westbrook led all players in 20+ pt quarters with 4.

This year, Curry's played 10 games and already has 4.


To do 4 times in a career would be impressive.

4 times in 10 games (all wins) is simply ridiculous.

again, all i want to say is a lot of this credit should be going to the system and the teammates. This is phoenix on steroids. This is NOT Kobe in his smush years, and this is not MJ during the mid 80s, and this is not Wilt on his non championship teams.

In other words, I am not seeing anything from Curry that tells me that if you were to put him on a team with worse teammates and a worse system, would he carry them this way.


IMO he's in the echelon of most dangerous skills with the ball in his hands of all time. He's ISO-ing and coming off simple PnR and knocking 3s in your eye at will - that's not system. And you don't need the Warriors system to run him off screens like more prototypical deadeye shooters. With those two things said - I think he could be this good in any system.
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 13, 2015 10:29 pm    Post subject:

ksmgf wrote:
Prime CP3 or prime Curry? Who's better?


Curry 100%.

Title and MVP something CP3 doesn't have. CP3 has also had a better team with him even the year the Warriors won the title, and he still can't get it done. The guy never even got past the 2nd round.

CP3 is a great player too but Curry has already done more than CP3 has. Curry even broke his own 3 point season record...2 times. And with the way he is playing right now, it looks like he will crush it again lol.
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 13, 2015 11:06 pm    Post subject:

Dell Curry........1,245 Made 3-pointers in his career (1,083 games)
Steph Curry.....1,243 Made 3-pointers in his career (426 games)

And Dell was in the league because of how well he could shoot.
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 14, 2015 3:00 am    Post subject:

GoldenThroat wrote:
Dell Curry........1,245 Made 3-pointers in his career (1,083 games)
Steph Curry.....1,243 Made 3-pointers in his career (426 games)

And Dell was in the league because of how well he could shoot.


Dell's release had to be the fastest of anyone's - ever, as greasy as his son's is. Dell just flicked it as it soon as it touched his hands if he was already standing in the spot from where the shot was going up. It was a weird looking movement the whole way, very little bending of his body during the shooting motion as you see with practically anyone else. Reggie was similarly skinny, but he had a standard "up" motion even if his release was fugg. Dell's son is probably the closest to looking like him in the way that his shot seems so quick and effortless, both of them being slim and weaker than they appear. I'm gonna assume it's from his daddy working with him as a kid, thus molding characteristics that looked like his own. I say that because actual DNA rarely seems to translate to the NBA when you consider that Dolph and Danny Schayes are at or near the top of the list of father/son players that were decent-to-good.
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 14, 2015 4:18 am    Post subject:

non-player zealot wrote:
Reggie was similarly skinny, but he had a standard "up" motion even if his release was fugg.


I don't understand how Reggie's form developed. His shh is Picasso:


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 14, 2015 9:06 am    Post subject:

C M B wrote:
non-player zealot wrote:
Reggie was similarly skinny, but he had a standard "up" motion even if his release was fugg.


I don't understand how Reggie's form developed. His shh is Picasso:



Now that you mention it, his face and ears are Picasso, too. He's a walking, shooting Picasso. Whether Reggie is one of Picasso's celebrated early works or his latter cash-strapped, lesser junk is up to interpretation.

at 1:16, that's a perfect example of Dell's shot. Look how little he bent to jump off the ground on that shot. It's practically all arms.



My favorite form was from Mark Price and Ricky Pierce, who was an a-hole, but had a perfect textbook form, from planted feet to release. It was highly repeatable. Mark had the same thing. If you recall that fight with Seattle in 1993 at the Forum, Pierce instigated it by standing over Sedale after he fell while trying to stop him from laying it in. Doug Christie came up and Ricky grabbed him by the throat and Peeler grabbed Pierce with his arm and yanked him onto the scorer's table and Kemp and Worthy got Ts for participation.



Price at 94 contest:


Another beautiful shooting form was had by Allan Houston. Couldn't get any more perfect, but NOT worth 120 million.
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 14, 2015 1:08 pm    Post subject:

44TheLogo wrote:
KBH wrote:
kikanga wrote:
^ I don't move players because they play non-traditionally at the position so I consider Curry and Jerry West PGs.
I do sometimes wonder how Alonzo Mourning ranks against all-time PFs instead of all-time Cs.
He was smaller than Hakeem, Ewing, Smits (true 7 footers), but he could space the floor well enough to play 4 in the NBA nowadays.


Zo would definitely be a center in today's game, though. He'd be the perfect modern C. Strong enough to body the modern game's few elite post scorers, athletic enough to shut down the paint and defend pick and rolls. Elite post game and he had that midrange J you mentioned.


I think the Admiral would have been the perfect modern C. elite mobility and shot blocking, face up game, mid range jumper.


Agreed.
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 14, 2015 1:10 pm    Post subject:

SuperboyReformed wrote:
LakerLanny wrote:
ringfinger wrote:
Curry is ridiculous.

So, last season, Westbrook led all players in 20+ pt quarters with 4.

This year, Curry's played 10 games and already has 4.


To do 4 times in a career would be impressive.

4 times in 10 games (all wins) is simply ridiculous.

again, all i want to say is a lot of this credit should be going to the system and the teammates. This is phoenix on steroids. This is NOT Kobe in his smush years, and this is not MJ during the mid 80s, and this is not Wilt on his non championship teams.

In other words, I am not seeing anything from Curry that tells me that if you were to put him on a team with worse teammates and a worse system, would he carry them this way.


No one said it was. You really incapable of handling conversations where someone other than Kobe is being praised.
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 14, 2015 1:11 pm    Post subject:

KeepItRealOrElse wrote:
SuperboyReformed wrote:
LakerLanny wrote:
ringfinger wrote:
Curry is ridiculous.

So, last season, Westbrook led all players in 20+ pt quarters with 4.

This year, Curry's played 10 games and already has 4.


To do 4 times in a career would be impressive.

4 times in 10 games (all wins) is simply ridiculous.

again, all i want to say is a lot of this credit should be going to the system and the teammates. This is phoenix on steroids. This is NOT Kobe in his smush years, and this is not MJ during the mid 80s, and this is not Wilt on his non championship teams.

In other words, I am not seeing anything from Curry that tells me that if you were to put him on a team with worse teammates and a worse system, would he carry them this way.


IMO he's in the echelon of most dangerous skills with the ball in his hands of all time. He's ISO-ing and coming off simple PnR and knocking 3s in your eye at will - that's not system. And you don't need the Warriors system to run him off screens like more prototypical deadeye shooters. With those two things said - I think he could be this good in any system.


Exactly. But certain people can't handle anyone other than their favorite players, or those who have their preferred play styles, receive praise.
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 14, 2015 1:26 pm    Post subject:

KBH wrote:
KeepItRealOrElse wrote:
SuperboyReformed wrote:
LakerLanny wrote:
ringfinger wrote:
Curry is ridiculous.

So, last season, Westbrook led all players in 20+ pt quarters with 4.

This year, Curry's played 10 games and already has 4.


To do 4 times in a career would be impressive.

4 times in 10 games (all wins) is simply ridiculous.

again, all i want to say is a lot of this credit should be going to the system and the teammates. This is phoenix on steroids. This is NOT Kobe in his smush years, and this is not MJ during the mid 80s, and this is not Wilt on his non championship teams.

In other words, I am not seeing anything from Curry that tells me that if you were to put him on a team with worse teammates and a worse system, would he carry them this way.


IMO he's in the echelon of most dangerous skills with the ball in his hands of all time. He's ISO-ing and coming off simple PnR and knocking 3s in your eye at will - that's not system. And you don't need the Warriors system to run him off screens like more prototypical deadeye shooters. With those two things said - I think he could be this good in any system.


Exactly. But certain people can't handle anyone other than their favorite players, or those who have their preferred play styles, receive praise.

it seems that way because you guys are so eager to label something the "best ever", so immediately we think about kobe, mj, magic, etc. curry is not best ever for anything yet.
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 14, 2015 2:20 pm    Post subject:

Superboy? Oh, of course Kobe sneaks into the discussion.
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 14, 2015 3:07 pm    Post subject:

Superboy is straight up insufferable... like... it's insane
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 14, 2015 3:08 pm    Post subject:

What the (bleep) about Lebron is overhyped? Dude couldn't be any more dense
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