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Batguano
Star Player
Joined: 19 Mar 2015
Posts: 2260
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 Posted: Sun Nov 08, 2015 10:15 am Post subject: |
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| ringfinger wrote: | | 55 wrote: | | ringfinger wrote: | | Batguano wrote: | | ringfinger wrote: | | 55 wrote: | I have one question for all the Laker lovers / Kobe haters:
If you had to do it all over again, would you want Kobe to have played for the Lakers or not? All the good with the bad, including the famous harped about contract, 20 years, 5 championships, history broken time and again, jump out of your seat moments, and everything in between.
It's a simple yes or no question. |
Define hater.
Because round these sensitive parts, a hater is anyone who has criticized at least once.
I can't imagine ANY true fan of the team, holding actual hatred for someone who has brought so much glory (and excitement) to this franchise. |
Hater: (*see SGV-Laker's posts) |
I don't think he holds hatred for Kobe. Sure, his posts slant negative as of late, but he said he'd want Kobe, in his prime, on the Lakers. If he doesn't want the current him on the Lakers anymore, it sounds like it's because he doesn't think it's what's best for the Lakers as opposed to being purely out of spite.
The term has been so diluted that it applies to anyone who doesn't have unconditional love. That isn't hatred. That's just ... Conditional love. |
There's no picking and choosing parts of someone's career. A career is singular. All or nothing is the question presented. |
So if Kobe wants a max extension this year, and someone don't want that, that makes them a hater? That doesn't seem fair. |
No, but if you say that you wouldn't even take a PRIME Kobe in the modern NBA and give some halfassed reasons, then yeah, it makes you a hater. Or just extremely lacking in basketball knowledge. |
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ringfinger
Retired Number
Joined: 08 Oct 2013
Posts: 29418
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| Posted: Sun Nov 08, 2015 10:33 am Post subject: |
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| Batguano wrote: | | ringfinger wrote: | | 55 wrote: | | ringfinger wrote: | | Batguano wrote: | | ringfinger wrote: | | 55 wrote: | I have one question for all the Laker lovers / Kobe haters:
If you had to do it all over again, would you want Kobe to have played for the Lakers or not? All the good with the bad, including the famous harped about contract, 20 years, 5 championships, history broken time and again, jump out of your seat moments, and everything in between.
It's a simple yes or no question. |
Define hater.
Because round these sensitive parts, a hater is anyone who has criticized at least once.
I can't imagine ANY true fan of the team, holding actual hatred for someone who has brought so much glory (and excitement) to this franchise. |
Hater: (*see SGV-Laker's posts) |
I don't think he holds hatred for Kobe. Sure, his posts slant negative as of late, but he said he'd want Kobe, in his prime, on the Lakers. If he doesn't want the current him on the Lakers anymore, it sounds like it's because he doesn't think it's what's best for the Lakers as opposed to being purely out of spite.
The term has been so diluted that it applies to anyone who doesn't have unconditional love. That isn't hatred. That's just ... Conditional love. |
There's no picking and choosing parts of someone's career. A career is singular. All or nothing is the question presented. |
So if Kobe wants a max extension this year, and someone don't want that, that makes them a hater? That doesn't seem fair. |
No, but if you say that you wouldn't even take a PRIME Kobe in the modern NBA and give some halfassed reasons, then yeah, it makes you a hater. Or just extremely lacking in basketball knowledge. |
He didn't say modern NBA. I thought he said modern CBA. In either case, I don't agree with him either.
I'd just think that a person who hates another, would have NO conditions under which they'd want any part of that player under any condition. Take Byron Scott as head coach for example.
He could coach for $1 and I don't think people would want him coaching this team. That's hate. And in his case, probably warranted. Haha |
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purple8goldvanessa
Star Player
Joined: 24 Oct 2005
Posts: 3168
Location: San Francisco
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| Posted: Sun Nov 08, 2015 11:13 am Post subject: |
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| good for kobe |
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55
Franchise Player
Joined: 04 Jan 2008
Posts: 12092
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| Posted: Sun Nov 08, 2015 11:16 am Post subject: |
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| ringfinger wrote: | | 55 wrote: | | ringfinger wrote: | | Batguano wrote: | | ringfinger wrote: | | 55 wrote: | I have one question for all the Laker lovers / Kobe haters:
If you had to do it all over again, would you want Kobe to have played for the Lakers or not? All the good with the bad, including the famous harped about contract, 20 years, 5 championships, history broken time and again, jump out of your seat moments, and everything in between.
It's a simple yes or no question. |
Define hater.
Because round these sensitive parts, a hater is anyone who has criticized at least once.
I can't imagine ANY true fan of the team, holding actual hatred for someone who has brought so much glory (and excitement) to this franchise. |
Hater: (*see SGV-Laker's posts) |
I don't think he holds hatred for Kobe. Sure, his posts slant negative as of late, but he said he'd want Kobe, in his prime, on the Lakers. If he doesn't want the current him on the Lakers anymore, it sounds like it's because he doesn't think it's what's best for the Lakers as opposed to being purely out of spite.
The term has been so diluted that it applies to anyone who doesn't have unconditional love. That isn't hatred. That's just ... Conditional love. |
There's no picking and choosing parts of someone's career. A career is singular. All or nothing is the question presented. |
So if Kobe wants a max extension this year, and someone don't want that, that makes them a hater? That doesn't seem fair. |
You're seriously going to deflect the answer by asking a question about a scenario that hasn't happened?
Come on, it's a simple question... yes or no? I know it's hard for you cause you don't want to step off the rope you're been straddling regarding Kobe but I believe in you - you can do it. |
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ringfinger
Retired Number
Joined: 08 Oct 2013
Posts: 29418
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| Posted: Sun Nov 08, 2015 11:20 am Post subject: |
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| 55 wrote: | | ringfinger wrote: | | 55 wrote: | | ringfinger wrote: | | Batguano wrote: | | ringfinger wrote: | | 55 wrote: | I have one question for all the Laker lovers / Kobe haters:
If you had to do it all over again, would you want Kobe to have played for the Lakers or not? All the good with the bad, including the famous harped about contract, 20 years, 5 championships, history broken time and again, jump out of your seat moments, and everything in between.
It's a simple yes or no question. |
Define hater.
Because round these sensitive parts, a hater is anyone who has criticized at least once.
I can't imagine ANY true fan of the team, holding actual hatred for someone who has brought so much glory (and excitement) to this franchise. |
Hater: (*see SGV-Laker's posts) |
I don't think he holds hatred for Kobe. Sure, his posts slant negative as of late, but he said he'd want Kobe, in his prime, on the Lakers. If he doesn't want the current him on the Lakers anymore, it sounds like it's because he doesn't think it's what's best for the Lakers as opposed to being purely out of spite.
The term has been so diluted that it applies to anyone who doesn't have unconditional love. That isn't hatred. That's just ... Conditional love. |
There's no picking and choosing parts of someone's career. A career is singular. All or nothing is the question presented. |
So if Kobe wants a max extension this year, and someone don't want that, that makes them a hater? That doesn't seem fair. |
You're seriously going to deflect the answer by asking a question about a scenario that hasn't happened?
Come on, it's a simple question... yes or no? I know it's hard for you cause you don't want to step off the rope you're been straddling regarding Kobe but I believe in you - you can do it. |
I think you need to define hater first. It appears that most reasonable fans have a line somewhere which if crossed, wouldn't want Kobe back. I don't think that makes them haters. That doesn't seem reasonable to me. |
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KingKobe20
Franchise Player
Joined: 14 Jul 2006
Posts: 18674
Location: L.A County, 26 miles away from Staples Center
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| Posted: Sun Nov 08, 2015 11:26 am Post subject: |
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Kobe with the obvious quote.
Kobe is a die hard Laker just as much as I'm a die hard Lakers fan.
Sedate Threat off the pick and pop from Vlade's screen!!!!!!!
_________________
"Tryin' to get that Kobe number, One Over Jordan"
-Kanye
aka ILLWiLL20
R.I.P PHIL |
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55
Franchise Player
Joined: 04 Jan 2008
Posts: 12092
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| Posted: Sun Nov 08, 2015 11:50 am Post subject: |
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| ringfinger wrote: | | I think you need to define hater first. |
Here you go - removed the part that you keep clinging to. Are you able to answer it now or do you need further clarification in order to avoid the answer?
If you had to do it all over again, would you want Kobe to have played for the Lakers or not? All the good with the bad, including the famous harped about contract, 20 years, 5 championships, history broken time and again, jump out of your seat moments, and everything in between.
It's a simple yes or no question. |
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ringfinger
Retired Number
Joined: 08 Oct 2013
Posts: 29418
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| Posted: Sun Nov 08, 2015 11:54 am Post subject: |
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| 55 wrote: | | ringfinger wrote: | | I think you need to define hater first. |
Here you go - removed the part that you keep clinging to. Are you able to answer it now or do you need further clarification in order to avoid the answer?
If you had to do it all over again, would you want Kobe to have played for the Lakers or not? All the good with the bad, including the famous harped about contract, 20 years, 5 championships, history broken time and again, jump out of your seat moments, and everything in between.
It's a simple yes or no question. |
Course I would. I can imagine any Laker fan would want to undo that kind of amazing team success Kobe helped deliver. |
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Tony Almeida
Retired
Joined: 05 Jan 2006
Posts: 12072
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| Posted: Sun Nov 08, 2015 12:04 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks guys. Appreciate it, for real. Always cool to see some of the old LG crew/vets.
JB, 55, DrZ...how about we grab some beers and go bowling with our friend Bynum one of these days? I hear he has some free time right now.  Maybe have angrypuppy and hectorthepup come by too! |
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Tony Almeida
Retired
Joined: 05 Jan 2006
Posts: 12072
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| Posted: Sun Nov 08, 2015 12:05 pm Post subject: |
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| L4L wrote: | Throughout my life, I've had, and will have, exactly one sports "hero": Kobe Bean Bryant.
My mother raised me to value two traits above all others -- happiness and kindness. Most wealth, beauty, talent and intelligence, among other coveted qualities, are primarily a matter of good fortune. Whether that fortune be genetic or environmental in nature is irrelevant. Happiness and kindness on the other hand are a direct reflection of your character. You either make the choice or you do not.
As I've grown older, I've found those particular choices increasingly difficult to make and, at times, subject to the seeming whims of my neurobiology. However, a third quality, a quality I've come to value above all others, has always been my friend when no other friends could be found: work ethic. If I couldn't be happy or kind in a particular moment, at least I could work towards being so.
Twenty years into one of the greatest careers in the history of sports, Bryant appears to have finally lost the war against father time. Finally, after twenty years, the detractors have legitimate ammo to fire. Finally, after twenty years, Kobe really is shooting too much. Finally, after twenty years the "ball hog" is shooting his way out of the league.
However, as far as I'm concerned, this final chapter is every bit as inspiring as the rest of the book. I fear history will remember Bryant as yet another spectacular athlete with damning moral flaws. While the public at large focuses on adultery and semi-narcissistic tendencies, I see something else entirely -- perhaps the hardest working individual in any field that I've ever studied.
For twenty years, Bryant has slept 3-4 hours per night and trained to be at his peak basketball ability 12-14 hours per day. Through being drafted directly out of high school at eighteen years of age, through assault allegations, through the Shaq era, through the post Shaq era, from Bynum to Pau, and from a torn Achilles to his twentieth year in the league, Bryant has worked every single day with a single-minded determination that is unmatched in virtually any other field with similar publicity and international implications. Only someone who has put in an 80-100 hour work week in service of their life's primary ambition can truly comprehend the gravity of that level of commitment. Over the course of two decades, against every obstacle possible, ranging from opponents to biology itself, that work ethic has never wavered.
Perhaps there have been more successful, more talented and greater athletes than Bryant. That's not a particularly difficult case to argue. However, that's never what made those of us who admire Kobe feel the way we do in the first place. This comes down to work ethic. As far as basketball is concerned, nobody has out worked Bryant in the past twenty years. That spirit carries beyond the court.
As will all basketball fans, I will remember the five championships, the 81 point game, the four straight games of 50+ points, the ten straight games over 40 points, and the never-ending highlight reel of surreal athletic supremacy. However, above all else, I'll remember the tales of an 18 year old who watched game tape on prom night, the 21 year old who would rather practice more than go clubbing with teammates, the player who started taking jumpers before the lights even went on at the Forum, the man who hit the gym three times a day to add strength and size, and the player who calmly sank two free throws with a torn Achilles.
I'm not one to idolize another human being. In the end, we are all fallible. Nonetheless, I'd be lying if I said that I didn't find that level of commitment and work ethic inspirational. I remember waking up with roaches, I remember having crackheads for neighbors, and I remember my own 100+ hour weeks. The level of respect I hold for someone who has done that for twenty years in the service of exactly one cause is... immeasurable. The amount of gratitude I have for being exposed to even one individual who proved it was possible is... infinite.
I'm really too old at this point of my life to ever have another hero. Ball hog? Selfish? Chucker? It doesn't matter. It never did. It stopped being about basketball a long time ago. I'll do the same as I've always done: enjoy the privilege of watching manifest greatness for at least one last year.
In perhaps the greatest compliment I can pay to Bryant, his career, which is easily amongst the ten greatest to ever play his sport, pails in comparison to his discipline, dedication, and determination. Kobe is the hardest worker I've ever known of.
Results be damned, Kobe will always be my favorite athlete and the only sports "hero" I will ever have.
#24 |
Whoa. Phenomenal post, man. Awesome stuff. Why do you have less than 100 posts in 8 years?! |
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Tony Almeida
Retired
Joined: 05 Jan 2006
Posts: 12072
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| Posted: Sun Nov 08, 2015 12:09 pm Post subject: |
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| DrumR wrote: | | very very well articulated. Can we sticky and lock this before the trolls come in with the "what have you done for us lately" narrative to ruin yet another thread. Wish you posted more Tony or I had access to the rumored "hidden forum here" I've been lurking since the early 2000s and this new tone in here is so depressing sometimes. I think Laker fans often forget sports are supposed to be about entertainment and legacy imo. |
Thanks man. I still like to swing by once a year or so...although normally it's when I go to my annual Lakers game, which is coming up next month here in Michigan vs. the Pistons!
And agreed...I really feel the entertainment / storyline aspect is just as important as anything else in sports. It's what makes teams and the individuals who make up the team so compelling. How many times have we broke the F5 key trying to get the latest bit of drama regarding Kobe? Felt bad for my keyboard the night of the achillies injury. Or the (bleep) up basketball reasons (bleep) which altered the course of Kobe's legacy and Laker history. |
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Tony Almeida
Retired
Joined: 05 Jan 2006
Posts: 12072
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| Posted: Sun Nov 08, 2015 12:10 pm Post subject: |
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What up, man!
Hope all is well with ya. :cheerswiththecubsmug:  |
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Tony Almeida
Retired
Joined: 05 Jan 2006
Posts: 12072
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| Posted: Sun Nov 08, 2015 12:14 pm Post subject: |
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| K28 wrote: | Coming out of retirement to tell Tony and L4L:
Thank You...for writing these. I really needed to read these.
Kobe has been inspiration to me in so many ways. Most importantly in the work ethic and never say die motto that he embodies. He is the most single minded, iron willed and courageous athlete I have ever witnessed. He never let the naysayers get to him.
I broke my heart to hear his comments after the Dallas game. That was the first time he agreed with his critics, or gave any indication that he too battles with self doubt.
Kobe isn't just losing the war with Father Time, he's losing the war with his fears and doubts, and that bothers me a lot. |
I'm begrudgingly ok with it. The Kobe we know and loved effectively ended the night he tore his achilles. But it was one hell of a way to go out. Literally gave every thing he had, left it all out there. I can't ask for any more. The guy's work ethic is that of legend, the stories are (bleep) insane. It's been all a bonus for awhile now, just seeing him lace it up and get out there.
It sucks seeing he hasn't been able to be the Kobe we are used to, but it has to end at some point. I'm still holding out hope he pulls out of this slump...betting on The Mamba has been a winning one for 2 decades...so I'll roll with him one more time.
Last edited by Tony Almeida on Sun Nov 08, 2015 12:31 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Tony Almeida
Retired
Joined: 05 Jan 2006
Posts: 12072
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| Posted: Sun Nov 08, 2015 12:15 pm Post subject: |
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OLD SNAKE!  |
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Tony Almeida
Retired
Joined: 05 Jan 2006
Posts: 12072
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| Posted: Sun Nov 08, 2015 12:24 pm Post subject: |
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| spflakers wrote: | | Fantastic post, Tony. Awesome. One minor factual correction, only to add to Kobe's legacy. He actually averaged 40 points in a month four times. No one else has done it since Wilt and Elgin and he did it four times: February 2003, January 2006, April 2006, March 2007. The April 2006 one was only eight games, but I remember when he did it in 07 ESPN or Elias said the minimum was five games for it to count. For what it's worth. But even if that one drops, it'd be three times. Which is insane. Like so much of his career. |
Haha you're right! Which isn't surprising...spflakers is always on point.
The dude averaged 40 a month multiple times...what the (bleep), man. It's hard to even comprehend some of the stuff this guy did in his career. Just silly. I was watching some of his best games and highlights when he was #8...a completely different player and a time period that seems like it was decades ago. Baseline windmill dunks against the Knicks and Wolves? FILTHY. Who had the call, "What have you got for us this time, Kobe?"? Was that the "Relax, I got this" takeover game against the Pacers? (bleep), that was 15 years ago...15! |
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City_Dawg
Retired Number
Joined: 14 Jul 2006
Posts: 46878
Location: Coming soon and striking at your borders.
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| Posted: Sun Nov 08, 2015 12:37 pm Post subject: |
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| Tony Almeida wrote: |
OLD SNAKE! |
Always good to see you drop by Tony. 
_________________
*sighs*
!... |
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Kobe2Clark
Star Player
Joined: 15 Feb 2004
Posts: 6047
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| Posted: Sun Nov 08, 2015 1:00 pm Post subject: |
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Great post. My sentiments exactly
_________________
"My thirst for domination is fed only by the game. I refuse to get distracted by outside forces." - Kobe Bryant |
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Tony Almeida
Retired
Joined: 05 Jan 2006
Posts: 12072
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| Posted: Sun Nov 08, 2015 1:01 pm Post subject: |
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| City_Dawg wrote: | | Tony Almeida wrote: |
OLD SNAKE! |
Always good to see you drop by Tony. |
A bit early this year...got the Lakers game against the Pistons coming up in a month. HYPED, man. |
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LakerBeastmode
Starting Rotation
Joined: 15 Aug 2012
Posts: 588
Location: Los Angeles Center of the Universe
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| Posted: Sun Nov 08, 2015 1:20 pm Post subject: |
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| Pedophilia nancy |
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L4L
Starting Rotation
Joined: 28 Nov 2007
Posts: 291
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| Posted: Mon Nov 09, 2015 7:39 am Post subject: |
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| Tony Almeida wrote: |
Whoa. Phenomenal post, man. Awesome stuff. Why do you have less than 100 posts in 8 years?! |
Thank you and likewise!
Perhaps if I had a few sentiments as worthy of sharing as your OP in this thread I'd have a few more posts. As it stands, I have less than one of those under my belt.
Thanks for the great read my man.
Go Lakers! |
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55
Franchise Player
Joined: 04 Jan 2008
Posts: 12092
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| Posted: Mon Nov 09, 2015 8:28 am Post subject: |
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| L4L wrote: | Throughout my life, I've had, and will have, exactly one sports "hero": Kobe Bean Bryant.
My mother raised me to value two traits above all others -- happiness and kindness. Most wealth, beauty, talent and intelligence, among other coveted qualities, are primarily a matter of good fortune. Whether that fortune be genetic or environmental in nature is irrelevant. Happiness and kindness on the other hand are a direct reflection of your character. You either make the choice or you do not.
As I've grown older, I've found those particular choices increasingly difficult to make and, at times, subject to the seeming whims of my neurobiology. However, a third quality, a quality I've come to value above all others, has always been my friend when no other friends could be found: work ethic. If I couldn't be happy or kind in a particular moment, at least I could work towards being so.
Twenty years into one of the greatest careers in the history of sports, Bryant appears to have finally lost the war against father time. Finally, after twenty years, the detractors have legitimate ammo to fire. Finally, after twenty years, Kobe really is shooting too much. Finally, after twenty years the "ball hog" is shooting his way out of the league.
However, as far as I'm concerned, this final chapter is every bit as inspiring as the rest of the book. I fear history will remember Bryant as yet another spectacular athlete with damning moral flaws. While the public at large focuses on adultery and semi-narcissistic tendencies, I see something else entirely -- perhaps the hardest working individual in any field that I've ever studied.
For twenty years, Bryant has slept 3-4 hours per night and trained to be at his peak basketball ability 12-14 hours per day. Through being drafted directly out of high school at eighteen years of age, through assault allegations, through the Shaq era, through the post Shaq era, from Bynum to Pau, and from a torn Achilles to his twentieth year in the league, Bryant has worked every single day with a single-minded determination that is unmatched in virtually any other field with similar publicity and international implications. Only someone who has put in an 80-100 hour work week in service of their life's primary ambition can truly comprehend the gravity of that level of commitment. Over the course of two decades, against every obstacle possible, ranging from opponents to biology itself, that work ethic has never wavered.
Perhaps there have been more successful, more talented and greater athletes than Bryant. That's not a particularly difficult case to argue. However, that's never what made those of us who admire Kobe feel the way we do in the first place. This comes down to work ethic. As far as basketball is concerned, nobody has out worked Bryant in the past twenty years. That spirit carries beyond the court.
As will all basketball fans, I will remember the five championships, the 81 point game, the four straight games of 50+ points, the ten straight games over 40 points, and the never-ending highlight reel of surreal athletic supremacy. However, above all else, I'll remember the tales of an 18 year old who watched game tape on prom night, the 21 year old who would rather practice more than go clubbing with teammates, the player who started taking jumpers before the lights even went on at the Forum, the man who hit the gym three times a day to add strength and size, and the player who calmly sank two free throws with a torn Achilles.
I'm not one to idolize another human being. In the end, we are all fallible. Nonetheless, I'd be lying if I said that I didn't find that level of commitment and work ethic inspirational. I remember waking up with roaches, I remember having crackheads for neighbors, and I remember my own 100+ hour weeks. The level of respect I hold for someone who has done that for twenty years in the service of exactly one cause is... immeasurable. The amount of gratitude I have for being exposed to even one individual who proved it was possible is... infinite.
I'm really too old at this point of my life to ever have another hero. Ball hog? Selfish? Chucker? It doesn't matter. It never did. It stopped being about basketball a long time ago. I'll do the same as I've always done: enjoy the privilege of watching manifest greatness for at least one last year.
In perhaps the greatest compliment I can pay to Bryant, his career, which is easily amongst the ten greatest to ever play his sport, pails in comparison to his discipline, dedication, and determination. Kobe is the hardest worker I've ever known of.
Results be damned, Kobe will always be my favorite athlete and the only sports "hero" I will ever have.
#24 |
Excellent post! |
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yinoma2001
Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010
Posts: 119487
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| Posted: Mon Nov 09, 2015 8:52 am Post subject: |
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| Tony Almeida wrote: | | City_Dawg wrote: | | Tony Almeida wrote: |
OLD SNAKE! |
Always good to see you drop by Tony. |
A bit early this year...got the Lakers game against the Pistons coming up in a month. HYPED, man. |
Pistons looking real nice right now. If they can snag a few players in FA, should be interesting times.
_________________
From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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Darth Los Angeles
Star Player
Joined: 06 Dec 2011
Posts: 2181
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| Posted: Mon Nov 09, 2015 9:31 am Post subject: |
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I've echoed these same sentiments over Kobe's career...
I truly appreciate talented and driven people. I appreciate people who are so driven by the voice within them that they are willing to forsake social acceptance in order to be all they are called to be.
Kobe rubs a lot of people the wrong way. But it's only because he scares people. Those who believe in remaining the same and not pushing the limits that society has preset for us are offended by Kobe.
As a young pup he challenged not only the game of Michael Jordan, he challenged the mysticism and people hated him for it.
As a seasoned veteran he was tired of living in the "shadow" of Shaq and accepted the challenge of being greater and people hated him for it.
As an old dogg he defied the physical constraints that derailed many others and beat his flesh into submission in order to perform.
Through the journey, he has become much more than a basketball player. He has become a legend perfectly and carefully designed by his own merits.
At this point... If you hate Kobe Bryant, you probably hate life as well.
_________________
“There are no limits. There are plateaus, but you must not stay there, you must go beyond them. If it kills you, it kills you. A man must constantly exceed his level.” ―Bruce Lee |
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ChefLinda
Moderator
Joined: 20 Sep 2006
Posts: 24166
Location: Boston
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| Posted: Mon Nov 09, 2015 1:31 pm Post subject: |
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| FYI: There is now a Kobe P&M thread so people can take those sorts of comments over there. Further P&M comments in this thread will be deleted. |
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Vancouver Fan
Franchise Player
Joined: 17 Apr 2006
Posts: 17740
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| Posted: Mon Nov 09, 2015 1:32 pm Post subject: |
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Wouldn't want it any other way.
_________________
Music is my medicine |
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