Why you don't "wait" until 2008, but you build starting NOW...

 
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kobebynum2008
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2006 1:27 pm    Post subject: Why you don't "wait" until 2008, but you build starting NOW...

Ok, I'm tired of hearing ppl keep bringing up "we gotta wait until 2007/2008 to sign some free agents and then we'll start playing well", like the lakers are supposed to just kill time for 2 straight seasons until we get some cash...that really makes me mad, because we have the greatest player in the game right now potentially in his prime, and it seems like we're just gonna do nothing during it...

No the lakers can't win a championship this year, they can't win one next year. They might not even make the playoffs. But what they can do, is start building. That's why its now the time to start taking some risks, and that starts with moving Odom. We seriously need to get a decent player to run the offense. I don't care if we don't get a star player out of an Odom deal, I just want a guard that can pass with little turnovers who plays D and maybe a consistent shooter. I think that's realistic instead of expecting a Rashard Lewis deal or something.

I find it really sad that a month ago, guys like Kwame and Devean were actually pulling out 15 pt games (kwame showing some good defense), and it prolly woulda been wise to try to move these guys. Now it looks like we're stuck with them. I think it's time to consider having Bynum play considerable minutes right now. We need to also get Turiaf some minutes too.

Our only hope for this Laker team to get into the playoffs this year:

Bynum + Kobe become an effective duo
Turiaf grabs 10 boards a game
Smush and Chris put up 10 ppg consistently
B Cook gets out of his slump

I've given up on Devean, Luke, and Odom...No way we resign these guys...

These next few games will be crucial, especially when Turiaf gets some minutes...

But it's stupid to just wait until 2008 and not do something now to start moving in the right direction...
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showtime1308
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2006 1:33 pm    Post subject:

Well we can trade Odom without messing with the 2007 plan. His contract will still be on the books with enough cap room to ofeer someone a max deal. I agree there needs to be moves made but who would want to trade for our cba players that have trouble playing when they are wide open all of the time.

The shaq and caron trades were absolutely horrible. They are as one sided as it gets. Because of this we will be suffering the next two years. Hopefully in 2007 they can make some better decisions. Kobe's legacy is in their hands. That scares me at this point in time.
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tgf5
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2006 1:34 pm    Post subject:

Quote:
Ok, I'm tired of hearing ppl keep bringing up "we gotta wait until 2007/2008 to sign some free agents and then we'll start playing well", like the lakers are supposed to just kill time for 2 straight seasons until we get some cash...that really makes me mad, because we have the greatest player in the game right now potentially in his prime, and it seems like we're just gonna do nothing during it...


Where have I heard that before...

Quote:
I don't care if we don't get a star player out of an Odom deal, I just want a guard that can pass with little turnovers who plays D and maybe a consistent shooter. I think that's realistic instead of expecting a Rashard Lewis deal or something.


There's plenty out there, Mitch just isn't looking for "trade".

Quote:
Bynum + Kobe become an effective duo
Turiaf grabs 10 boards a game
Smush and Chris put up 10 ppg consistently
B Cook gets out of his slump


That's asking a lot for a guy who hasn't played a second in the NBA.
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bambam
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2006 1:41 pm    Post subject: Re: Why you don't "wait" until 2008, but you build starting NOW...

kobebynum2008 wrote:
Our only hope for this Laker team to get into the playoffs this year:

Bynum + Kobe become an effective duo
Turiaf grabs 10 boards a game
Smush and Chris put up 10 ppg consistently
B Cook gets out of his slump



Bynum isnt going to be part of any duo. He isnt ready.

Turiaf get 10 boards a game???? He will be lucky to average 10 minutes a game.
Why do people expect so much from a guy that has never played in the NBA? Turiaf is in for a serious adjustment... I can see this guy plagued w/ foul trouble.
Smush/Chris geting 10 points a game consistently i can see happening
what slump is b-cook in exactly? The reason he doesnt play is because he doesnt play D or rebound.
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GameCock-MD
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2006 1:42 pm    Post subject:

It's not the 2007 plan that's the problem...it's the inability of management to make competent personnel decisions in the meantime...

I'd say that if they could add a good player for some of the bad fit players, we'd be right back in the hunt...


Patience is a virtue but it should NEVER be used as a crutch or an excuse, which is what is going on now...
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kobebynum2008
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2006 1:47 pm    Post subject:

"Bynum isnt going to be part of any duo. He isnt ready.

Turiaf get 10 boards a game???? He will be lucky to average 10 minutes a game. "

Well whats more likely at this point? Expecting Kwame to become a beast or Bynum?

Expecting Devean or Luke to be consistent scorers or Turiaf getting a lotta rebounds?

Something just makes me feel better about the latter of those...
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Sage_10
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2006 1:47 pm    Post subject:

Actually if this team just starts playing solid defense you will see a dramatic difference in their play. It is just difficult to get young players to buy into playing defense.
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2006 1:48 pm    Post subject:

GameCock-MD wrote:
It's not the 2007 plan that's the problem...it's the inability of management to make competent personnel decisions in the meantime...

I'd say that if they could add a good player for some of the bad fit players, we'd be right back in the hunt...


Patience is a virtue but it should NEVER be used as a crutch or an excuse, which is what is going on now...


Oh please, you people act like it's the easiest thing in the world to make a trade. Just cause you can do it on realgm doesn't mean it'll happen in real life.

Tell us what bad fitting players could we trade away for good players? And tell us why it works and why the other team would do it as well. Seems more like patience has taken the backseat to indulgence.
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kobebynum2008
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2006 1:51 pm    Post subject:

I still think its possible to move Odom for a quality player...

It woulda maybe been possible to move Kwame to some teams that need a big...

Devean will be here for a few more months, and Luke....ughhh
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bambam
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2006 2:07 pm    Post subject:

kobebynum2008 wrote:
"Bynum isnt going to be part of any duo. He isnt ready.

Turiaf get 10 boards a game???? He will be lucky to average 10 minutes a game. "

Well whats more likely at this point? Expecting Kwame to become a beast or Bynum?

Expecting Devean or Luke to be consistent scorers or Turiaf getting a lotta rebounds?

Something just makes me feel better about the latter of those...


its reasonable to think turiaf will get alot of boards. But people.. like they did with LUKE before he came back from injury... are expecting him to fix everything. 10 rebounds? come on...
They guy hasnt even played in the NBA. Hes going to need time to adjust especially with his foul prone play in the SPL. Its reasonable to think hes going to have the same issues in the NBA while getting his conditioning, strength and just plain being a ROOKIE.
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bambam
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2006 2:09 pm    Post subject:

Sage_10 wrote:
Actually if this team just starts playing solid defense you will see a dramatic difference in their play. It is just difficult to get young players to buy into playing defense.

that is a major part of it.
There is a lot of lazy defense out there since the end of december.
many of the players are going for steals instead of moving feet.
smush is a big violator of this, kobe @ times too.
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msb212
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2006 2:09 pm    Post subject:

the only thing worse than recent lakers play is threads like these
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Freakout
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2006 2:12 pm    Post subject:

It's honestly too late now. It's sink or swim till 2007/2008 unless we get extremely lucky or Odom is dealt.
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bambam
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2006 2:15 pm    Post subject:

kobebynum2008 wrote:
I still think its possible to move Odom for a quality player...

It woulda maybe been possible to move Kwame to some teams that need a big...

Devean will be here for a few more months, and Luke....ughhh


Odom is a quality player. The lakers see him as a key component in having the ability to force a sign and trade. He isnt going anywhere unless its blockbuster.

why would the lakers (a team in need of a big) trade kwame to a team that needs a big?

Im hoping the lakers somehow manage to find a deal for the expiring K's. @ this point i seriously doubt any key players are moved.
george may go hes probably the best player they move.., hopefully they can move slava for a player that can actually dress for the game.
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mrdectown
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2006 2:35 pm    Post subject:

bambam wrote:
kobebynum2008 wrote:
I still think its possible to move Odom for a quality player...

It woulda maybe been possible to move Kwame to some teams that need a big...

Devean will be here for a few more months, and Luke....ughhh


Odom is a quality player. The lakers see him as a key component in having the ability to force a sign and trade. He isnt going anywhere unless its blockbuster.

why would the lakers (a team in need of a big) trade kwame to a team that needs a big?

Im hoping the lakers somehow manage to find a deal for the expiring K's. @ this point i seriously doubt any key players are moved.
george may go hes probably the best player they move.., hopefully they can move slava for a player that can actually dress for the game.


Does slava even come to games anymore?
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bambam
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2006 2:37 pm    Post subject:

mrdectown wrote:
bambam wrote:
kobebynum2008 wrote:
I still think its possible to move Odom for a quality player...

It woulda maybe been possible to move Kwame to some teams that need a big...

Devean will be here for a few more months, and Luke....ughhh


Odom is a quality player. The lakers see him as a key component in having the ability to force a sign and trade. He isnt going anywhere unless its blockbuster.

why would the lakers (a team in need of a big) trade kwame to a team that needs a big?

Im hoping the lakers somehow manage to find a deal for the expiring K's. @ this point i seriously doubt any key players are moved.
george may go hes probably the best player they move.., hopefully they can move slava for a player that can actually dress for the game.


Does slava even come to games anymore?


havent seen him.
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Narigon
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2006 2:53 pm    Post subject: Everyone keeps missing the obvious.

It's not the trade situation that is the main culprit here. It's Mitch and his crappy Scouts that have handicapped the Lakers with their inane picks.
Other than the surprise of Andrew Bynum, the rest of it has been crappy throughout. Maybe Turiaf is a beast, but I would expect coming off of heart surgery, it will take him awhile to accilmate to NBA life and games.

If they just drafted more competently, then maybe this trade-talk wouldn't be as big a deal.
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Ank
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2006 3:30 pm    Post subject:

GameCock-MD wrote:
It's not the 2007 plan that's the problem...it's the inability of management to make competent personnel decisions in the meantime...

I'd say that if they could add a good player for some of the bad fit players, we'd be right back in the hunt...


Patience is a virtue but it should NEVER be used as a crutch or an excuse, which is what is going on now...


I totally agree We have made moves that decreased talent. We had Butler, Jones, Payton, Horry. We now have no talent anyone wants except Odom.
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Manu
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2006 3:53 pm    Post subject:

I think everyone just needs to take a 'pill.' Given the 'mismanagement' some of you claim, we're still 7th in the West, ranked in the top 10 in the league.

What moves can we make right now? Something that moves us to top 4? 4th seed?

The organization could care less about how deep into the playoffs we go unless it ends with a title. Thats whats key. I think as fans, thats what we expect as well.

Odom for Artest, that is something that I see that could have potentially propelled us to that level, but outside of that, what, Boozer would take us there? Antonio Daniels would take us there? I think people just need to relax...
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B-Scott
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2006 4:14 pm    Post subject:

Personally i would have traded both Bynum and Lamar to build the best possible team around kobe while in his prime. Everyone will disagree,but i think if you built the right team around Kobe NOW,he has the ability to take that to the next level. Just give him the squad.

1 Bynum George slava for Jeff foster and ron artest.. TO LATE NOW

2. Lamar 1# pick for Paul pierce


C Jeff foster
PF Kwame brown
SF Paul pierce
G Artest
G Kobe

lets play ball. Foster would replace Lamars rebounding. When ehalthy he can get you 10 to 12 rebounds,and good low post D. Kwame is a solid low post defender.With this team Kwame would not have the pressure to be a scorer,because we would have 3 all stars in the starting lineup who can take care of that.

55-27 for the next 5 yrs. Would they win the title?. Who knows All you can do as GM is give your superstar a 55 win caliber team,and see if he can take it to that next level. Isnt Kobe better then Dirk nowiskti? YUP

That squad would be better then Dallas. Kobe artest pierce....Dirk Josh howard Jason terry. Plus Jeff foster and Mihm are better then crappy Eric dampier.
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RG73
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2006 4:19 pm    Post subject:

bambam wrote:
Odom is a quality player.


In another system.

Quote:
The lakers see him as a key component in having the ability to force a sign and trade.


But they are delusional.

Quote:
He isnt going anywhere unless its blockbuster.


Delusional. He isn't an all-star, thus, he cannot fetch an all-star. He can fetch an almost all-star talent. Lamar will not net KG, Bosh, Lebron, etc.

Quote:
why would the lakers (a team in need of a big) trade kwame to a team that needs a big?


Because Kwame doesn't play big.

Quote:
Im hoping the lakers somehow manage to find a deal for the expiring K's. @ this point i seriously doubt any key players are moved.


The fact is that there is one key player on this team. Other than that, everyone is expendable, save Bynum who gets the save based on potential because he's a 7 footer with soft hands who likes to play defense. Those key players have had every opportunity to step up and prove they are actually key.
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bambam
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2006 4:28 pm    Post subject:

RG73 wrote:
bambam wrote:
Odom is a quality player.


In another system.

Quote:
The lakers see him as a key component in having the ability to force a sign and trade.


But they are delusional.

Quote:
He isnt going anywhere unless its blockbuster.


Delusional. He isn't an all-star, thus, he cannot fetch an all-star. He can fetch an almost all-star talent. Lamar will not net KG, Bosh, Lebron, etc.

Quote:
why would the lakers (a team in need of a big) trade kwame to a team that needs a big?


Because Kwame doesn't play big.

Quote:
Im hoping the lakers somehow manage to find a deal for the expiring K's. @ this point i seriously doubt any key players are moved.


The fact is that there is one key player on this team. Other than that, everyone is expendable, save Bynum who gets the save based on potential because he's a 7 footer with soft hands who likes to play defense. Those key players have had every opportunity to step up and prove they are actually key.


i agree with most of the things you said.
I do think lamar is a quality player. But its not the system. He and kobe dont compliment each other @ all in any system.

And as for the Kwame thing...He doesnt play big, why would a team wanting a big go for him? What would they trade for w/ a team that doesnt have size themselves?
They are stuck with him unless they rip off someone.
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RG73
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2006 4:35 pm    Post subject:

bambam wrote:
i agree with most of the things you said.
I do think lamar is a quality player. But its not the system. He and kobe dont compliment each other @ all in any system.


I agree with that as well, but I also don't think Odom would thrive in the tri with or without Kobe. Agreed he and Kobe are bad together period, but I just don't think the tri plays to his strengths either.

Quote:
And as for the Kwame thing...He doesnt play big, why would a team wanting a big go for him? What would they trade for w/ a team that doesnt have size themselves?
They are stuck with him unless they rip off someone.


Yeah, Kwame hasn't helped his own value much with his play thus far. You might be able to unload him another big with a bad contract--and this is really a stretch, but Utah could possibly take Kwame just to get out of Boozer's deal and get a live body on the floor. Given Boozer's inability to suit up the last two seasons and his awful contract, that's probably an awful move on our part. But that's probably as good as it gets for his trade value. Just have to ride out his contract now.
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