Joined: 25 Jul 2013 Posts: 9577 Location: Salem, OR
Posted: Sun Jan 24, 2016 3:41 pm Post subject:
Did we ever try starting Jones and Kobe together at the wings? If so how did that work out? I know that we were starting Ceballos and Fox during Kobe's stint off the bench along with Eddie at the 2. Hopefully Russell can learn some tips from Kobe.
Kobe hated Del, Kobe hated Phil. Kobe gave Mike Brown a death stare. Kobe didn't care about Mike D'Antoni. Is there a trend here or is that all these coaches don't know Kobe?
I'd just chalk it up to Kobe being Kobe. He was pretty much uncoachable most of his career. All time great. Maybe the greatest scorer ever. However other than Phil Jackson, I don't think a single coach in his tenure as Lakers head coach was ever given a fair deal by Kobe. And the only reason I think Phil was able to get through to Kobe was that he had come with a rep of 6 rings and Jordan kissed Phil's ass (I'm assuming at least, in all conversations the two had about Phil)
People who hate Byron Scott should ask themselves do you know why Lakers even had to hire a Byron? So he would cater to every Kobe need in his retirement years. That's why Byron is primarily here.
On Del, I loved young Kobe and hated Del as well. But years later I realized Del was right. Del didn't have good schemes on O, and for some reason didn't get his teams to play good enough defense. However, his use of Bryant was quite smart. He handed him nothing and brought him along slowly, often inserting him in situations where he could succeed vs fail. Even when Kobe was starting at the ASG, he knew Kobe hadn't truly earned it, it was a popularity contest. He wanted Kobe to play in a certain way, a certain dedication, when guys like Eddie Jones were doing so. Veterans like Rick Fox had taken veteran mins to come try and win a ring in LA. He managed Kobe well, IMO. The converse (A franchise just handing a young guy everything at 18) hasn't exactly shown to be successful either. I always thought the job Del did with the young Lakers and then transitioning to them with Shaq/Kobe was awesome. He just wasn't anything more than that. Great re-build era coach who you then replace when you have a team that can actually contend. 10 times the teacher and coach Byron is.
It was a pathetic combative tone to the media. This is a paraphrase but it was something to the effect of "You all wanted me to play him all season and now I do".
He still defends it to this day sadly. Last time I saw him asked he said something about, "you didn't put Van Exel up against John Stockton at that point in his career". Never understood it. Nick was clutch. Made so many huge shots during that era. It was just way too much to put on the shoulders of a teenage young rookie who he had barely played for most of the season and was averaging less than 15 minutes per game in the playoffs. If Kobe was a weaker person those airballs could have derailed his career.
I still remember when Karl absolutely bludgeoned Nick across both arms on a 3 point attempt at the end of one of those playoff games. I put a hole through our apartment wall I was so pissed.
It was a pathetic combative tone to the media. This is a paraphrase but it was something to the effect of "You all wanted me to play him all season and now I do".
He still defends it to this day sadly. Last time I saw him asked he said something about, "you didn't put Van Exel up against John Stockton at that point in his career". Never understood it. Nick was clutch. Made so many huge shots during that era. It was just way too much to put on the shoulders of a teenage young rookie who he had barely played for most of the season and was averaging less than 15 minutes per game in the playoffs. If Kobe was a weaker person those airballs could have derailed his career.
I still remember when Karl absolutely bludgeoned Nick across both arms on a 3 point attempt at the end of one of those playoff games. I put a hole through our apartment wall I was so pissed.
boy, am i glad you said it. I remember that so clearly. It was ridiculous, I was so angry too. no call nothing. Didn't karl joke about it afterwards when asked if he fouled him? he danced around the answer by saying something like...well, i am a 1st team defense player.
Joined: 23 Jun 2005 Posts: 8488 Location: The (real) short corner
Posted: Sun Jan 24, 2016 7:22 pm Post subject:
SuperboyReformed wrote:
jonnybravo wrote:
J.C. Smith wrote:
jonnybravo wrote:
It was a pathetic combative tone to the media. This is a paraphrase but it was something to the effect of "You all wanted me to play him all season and now I do".
He still defends it to this day sadly. Last time I saw him asked he said something about, "you didn't put Van Exel up against John Stockton at that point in his career". Never understood it. Nick was clutch. Made so many huge shots during that era. It was just way too much to put on the shoulders of a teenage young rookie who he had barely played for most of the season and was averaging less than 15 minutes per game in the playoffs. If Kobe was a weaker person those airballs could have derailed his career.
I still remember when Karl absolutely bludgeoned Nick across both arms on a 3 point attempt at the end of one of those playoff games. I put a hole through our apartment wall I was so pissed.
boy, am i glad you said it. I remember that so clearly. It was ridiculous, I was so angry too. no call nothing. Didn't karl joke about it afterwards when asked if he fouled him? he danced around the answer by saying something like...well, i am a 1st team defense player.
I was outraged. Couldn't believe that NBA refs could be so blatant.
Joined: 16 Jun 2005 Posts: 40345 Location: Dirty South
Posted: Sun Jan 24, 2016 8:23 pm Post subject:
If I recall, Del was closer to Divac than any of the players. I think Vlade would actually get rides home after the games from Del every once in a while. I know it sounds stupid, but I have some memory of reading that years ago. Not sure if it is related, but Divac and even some within the Lakers organization felt the Vlade situation was not ideally handled when he was traded for Kobe, so maybe there was some level of projection towards Kobe from Del. I always felt like Del was a good guy, and a solid basketball guy.....just never seemed comfortable with the attention the head coach must deal with.
It was a pathetic combative tone to the media. This is a paraphrase but it was something to the effect of "You all wanted me to play him all season and now I do".
He still defends it to this day sadly. Last time I saw him asked he said something about, "you didn't put Van Exel up against John Stockton at that point in his career". Never understood it. Nick was clutch. Made so many huge shots during that era. It was just way too much to put on the shoulders of a teenage young rookie who he had barely played for most of the season and was averaging less than 15 minutes per game in the playoffs. If Kobe was a weaker person those airballs could have derailed his career.
I still remember when Karl absolutely bludgeoned Nick across both arms on a 3 point attempt at the end of one of those playoff games. I put a hole through our apartment wall I was so pissed.
boy, am i glad you said it. I remember that so clearly. It was ridiculous, I was so angry too. no call nothing. Didn't karl joke about it afterwards when asked if he fouled him? he danced around the answer by saying something like...well, i am a 1st team defense player.
I was outraged. Couldn't believe that NBA refs could be so blatant.
Definitely more blatant than Bosh fouling Green at the end of Game 6 in 2014. At least that contact came after the block.
Both non-calls are possibly justified by the "Tower Philosophy", i.e. refs do not reward low percentage plays with foul calls. If the foul prevents a reasonable scoring opportunity, only then are FTs rewarded. Wasn't Nick shooting a turnaround 3 over Malone from 30 feet?
Joined: 23 Jun 2005 Posts: 8488 Location: The (real) short corner
Posted: Sun Jan 24, 2016 8:50 pm Post subject:
Laker_Dynasty_01 wrote:
fiendishoc wrote:
SuperboyReformed wrote:
jonnybravo wrote:
J.C. Smith wrote:
jonnybravo wrote:
It was a pathetic combative tone to the media. This is a paraphrase but it was something to the effect of "You all wanted me to play him all season and now I do".
He still defends it to this day sadly. Last time I saw him asked he said something about, "you didn't put Van Exel up against John Stockton at that point in his career". Never understood it. Nick was clutch. Made so many huge shots during that era. It was just way too much to put on the shoulders of a teenage young rookie who he had barely played for most of the season and was averaging less than 15 minutes per game in the playoffs. If Kobe was a weaker person those airballs could have derailed his career.
I still remember when Karl absolutely bludgeoned Nick across both arms on a 3 point attempt at the end of one of those playoff games. I put a hole through our apartment wall I was so pissed.
boy, am i glad you said it. I remember that so clearly. It was ridiculous, I was so angry too. no call nothing. Didn't karl joke about it afterwards when asked if he fouled him? he danced around the answer by saying something like...well, i am a 1st team defense player.
I was outraged. Couldn't believe that NBA refs could be so blatant.
Definitely more blatant than Bosh fouling Green at the end of Game 6 in 2014. At least that contact came after the block.
Both non-calls are possibly justified by the "Tower Philosophy", i.e. refs do not reward low percentage plays with foul calls. If the foul prevents a reasonable scoring opportunity, only then are FTs rewarded. Wasn't Nick shooting a turnaround 3 over Malone from 30 feet?
If that's the case, then the Spurs should have tripped Nick the Quick as he was taking that running one handed three at the buzzer.
It was a pathetic combative tone to the media. This is a paraphrase but it was something to the effect of "You all wanted me to play him all season and now I do".
He still defends it to this day sadly. Last time I saw him asked he said something about, "you didn't put Van Exel up against John Stockton at that point in his career". Never understood it. Nick was clutch. Made so many huge shots during that era. It was just way too much to put on the shoulders of a teenage young rookie who he had barely played for most of the season and was averaging less than 15 minutes per game in the playoffs. If Kobe was a weaker person those airballs could have derailed his career.
I still remember when Karl absolutely bludgeoned Nick across both arms on a 3 point attempt at the end of one of those playoff games. I put a hole through our apartment wall I was so pissed.
It was game 2 and Utah was up 3 when Van Exel should have been awarded 3 free throws.
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