ESPN names Kobe 12th best all time
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3 ... 13, 14, 15 ... 23, 24, 25  Next
 
Post new topic    LakersGround.net Forum Index -> LA Lakers Lounge Reply to topic
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
MJST
Retired Number
Retired Number


Joined: 06 Jul 2014
Posts: 26084

PostPosted: Tue Feb 09, 2016 11:27 pm    Post subject:

*sighs*

Kobe is top 3 all time, entire NBA career.

It goes for me personally

Kareem
Jordan
Kobe

Kobe has surpassed Magic. Only nostalgia is what keeps him ahead in some people's minds. But if you doubt Kobe is the greatest Laker of all time. Well take a look.

Kobe Bryant Lakers Ranks

Seasons: 1st
Playoffs Seasons: 1st
All-Star Appearances: 1st
NBA First Team: 1st
NBA Defensive First Team: 1st
Games: 1st
Season Points: 1st
Playoff Points: 1st
Points in a Season: 1st (2,832)
Points in a Game: 1st (81)
Points in a Half: 1st (55)
Points in a Quarter: 1st (30) twice
60 Point Games: 1st (5)
50 Point Games(career): 1st (24)
50 Point Games(Season): 1st (10)
Consecutive 50 Point Games: 1st (4)
40 Point Games(career): 1st (121)
40 Point Games(Season): 1st (27)
Consecutive 40 Point Games: 1st (9)
Field Goals Made in a Quarter: 1st
Field Goals Made in a Half: 1st
Field Goals Made in a game: 1st
Free Throws: 1st
Free Throws(Consecutive Playoff Record): 1st
Steals: 1st
Steals(Half): 1st (6)
Steals(Quarter): 1st (3)
Minutes: 1st
Minutes(Playoffs): 1st
Most Points Scored in Christmas Games: 1st (All-Time)
Championships: 1st (Tied)
All-Star MVP's won: 1st (tied all time)
All-Star Points Scored(Career): 1st
3-Pointers Made in a Single Game: 1st
Only Laker(and Player) in NBA History to have over 30,000 Points and 6,000 Assists
On Pace to be the only Player and Laker in NBA History to have over 30,000 Points, 7,000 Rebounds and 6,000 Assists

And most recently: Lakers All-Time Assist Leaders: 2nd

Greatest Laker of All-Time: Kobe Bryant



It's inarguable. Kobe is the greatest Laker of all time, and has passed Magic on the all-time list. Thus he is number 3 on the GOAT list behind Kareem and Jordan. There's no question.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
activeverb
Retired Number
Retired Number


Joined: 17 Jun 2006
Posts: 37470

PostPosted: Tue Feb 09, 2016 11:37 pm    Post subject:

MJST wrote:
It's inarguable. Kobe is the greatest Laker of all time, and has passed Magic on the all-time list.


Of course, it's arguable. You could put together a similarly impressive list for Magic.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
ducasse
Star Player
Star Player


Joined: 05 Sep 2002
Posts: 8125

PostPosted: Tue Feb 09, 2016 11:42 pm    Post subject:

greenfrog wrote:
Lebron's by far the most difficult to rank because it's not just what he's done but what you expect he will do. I have no doubt when this list is done in another 10 years he'll be top 5.


It's not difficult. Players should be ranked on what they have done up until now, not what you think they might do. Lebron is not top 5 based on what he has done.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
moonriver24
Franchise Player
Franchise Player


Joined: 21 Oct 2007
Posts: 15265

PostPosted: Tue Feb 09, 2016 11:43 pm    Post subject:

the association wrote:
P.K. wrote:
moonriver24 wrote:
P.K. wrote:
moonriver24 wrote:
P.K. wrote:
moonriver24 wrote:

If Curry gets 30 plus easily on this great advanced defense era, how would a prime mamba fare in todays era?

Today's era began in 2002 with the NBA removing the last barriers to the zone defense and was complete by 2004, when they started calling fouls for even incidental contact on perimeter players away from the basket.

Kobe was 24 in 2004 - how much more "prime" can he be?

Have you watched basketball from 2000 thru like 2012 or even 2013?

Have you?
Do you think there's been some major rule change in the last 4 years that suddenly let Curry start making 34' 3ptrs?
The rules have been the same since 2004. It did take teams a while to figure out how to implement the zone, but Kobe's been playing under both the "no contact" rules and the zone rules for 12 years now.

Curry's lighting it up because he's an unreal shooter with an exceptionally quick trigger who can shoot incredibly accurately from up to 35' - those are 3 things Kobe never was.
in the curry thread I posted names of retired players while Kobe is still playing now. You might want to check those names before you begin to compare curry n kobe in their prime. Hints; Yao, Kidd, Artest, Battier, Kirlinko, Shaq, just to name a few. Soon to retire include duncan kg pierce. You know how good they were in their prime days.

You've already forgotten what you said?
you're the person that said "If Curry gets 30 plus easily on this great advanced defense era, how would a prime mamba fare in todays era"

The only thing I've said is:
1. that Kobe WAS in his prime during this era
2. and the reason Curry scores so easily is that he's a great shooter with a lightning fast release and long distance range, and that Kobe was never a great shooter - he's more known as a volume shooter who's kind of inefficient, and wasn't all that great from 3pt land.

so, you saying that a "prime" kobe would light it up in this era like Curry is wrong on so many fronts - not the least of which is that Kobe played in this era, and absolutely didn't light it up like Curry


81 points; 62 points through three quarters (singlehandedly outscoring the team that deserved to win the chip that year, but for the D Whistle legerdemain express); four consecutive 50+ point games; nine 40-point games in one month (or maybe it's nine consecutive games of 40+ points?); more playoff series wins over 50-win teams than anyone else; closest to the legendary MJ (ergo, IMMEDIATELY behind MJ in the pantheon [if not immediately before, who REALLY knows?]); real Lakers threepeat MVP b/c Portland + Sacramento + San Antonio; and I was 12 when he entered the NBA, which is amazing b/c that's only four more than his first number, which also equals the product of the digits in his second number; I win, you lose, the end.

Did I get it right? I think I did ... oh, yeah ... also footwork; clutch gene; hardest worker ever; beloved in China; YouTube videos; disfigured fingers + bad knees + shoulder and wrist injuries + gout + GIRD + TMJ + IBS; 12 selections to the All Defense teams; and even Magic said he's the best Laker ever. Also, LeBron's a douche and undeserving of the adoration bestowed on him. I think I got most of it. Boom, let's fight ...

Let me chip in

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_40-plus_point_games_by_Kobe_Bryant

Check on the minutes and number of quarters kobe played while scoring at least 40 points.

If he would just make a name for himself, this dude would have scored 70s and 80s multiple times playing more minutes and more quarters.

We have not yet checked on 30 - 39 point games he had produced which I am sure could easily go to 40s and 50s if he had played full quarters.

Look at today's games. All above 100 point games.

Advanced Defensive era my arsh.

_________________
Kobe's Top 5 Dunks, 81 points, MJ last gm @Staples


Last edited by moonriver24 on Tue Feb 09, 2016 11:52 pm; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
P.K.
Retired Number
Retired Number


Joined: 10 Jul 2003
Posts: 29641

PostPosted: Tue Feb 09, 2016 11:50 pm    Post subject:

the association wrote:
P.K. wrote:
moonriver24 wrote:
P.K. wrote:
moonriver24 wrote:
P.K. wrote:
moonriver24 wrote:

If Curry gets 30 plus easily on this great advanced defense era, how would a prime mamba fare in todays era?

Today's era began in 2002 with the NBA removing the last barriers to the zone defense and was complete by 2004, when they started calling fouls for even incidental contact on perimeter players away from the basket.

Kobe was 24 in 2004 - how much more "prime" can he be?

Have you watched basketball from 2000 thru like 2012 or even 2013?

Have you?
Do you think there's been some major rule change in the last 4 years that suddenly let Curry start making 34' 3ptrs?
The rules have been the same since 2004. It did take teams a while to figure out how to implement the zone, but Kobe's been playing under both the "no contact" rules and the zone rules for 12 years now.

Curry's lighting it up because he's an unreal shooter with an exceptionally quick trigger who can shoot incredibly accurately from up to 35' - those are 3 things Kobe never was.
in the curry thread I posted names of retired players while Kobe is still playing now. You might want to check those names before you begin to compare curry n kobe in their prime. Hints; Yao, Kidd, Artest, Battier, Kirlinko, Shaq, just to name a few. Soon to retire include duncan kg pierce. You know how good they were in their prime days.

You've already forgotten what you said?
you're the person that said "If Curry gets 30 plus easily on this great advanced defense era, how would a prime mamba fare in todays era"

The only thing I've said is:
1. that Kobe WAS in his prime during this era
2. and the reason Curry scores so easily is that he's a great shooter with a lightning fast release and long distance range, and that Kobe was never a great shooter - he's more known as a volume shooter who's kind of inefficient, and wasn't all that great from 3pt land.

so, you saying that a "prime" kobe would light it up in this era like Curry is wrong on so many fronts - not the least of which is that Kobe played in this era, and absolutely didn't light it up like Curry


81 points; 62 points through three quarters (singlehandedly outscoring the team that deserved to win the chip that year, but for the D Whistle legerdemain express); four consecutive 50+ point games; nine 40-point games in one month (or maybe it's nine consecutive games of 40+ points?); more playoff series wins over 50-win teams than anyone else; closest to the legendary MJ (ergo, IMMEDIATELY behind MJ in the pantheon [if not immediately before, who REALLY knows?]); real Lakers threepeat MVP b/c Portland + Sacramento + San Antonio; and I was 12 when he entered the NBA, which is amazing b/c that's only four more than his first number, which also equals the product of the digits in his second number; I win, you lose, the end.

Did I get it right? I think I did ... oh, yeah ... also footwork; clutch gene; hardest worker ever; beloved in China; YouTube videos; disfigured fingers + bad knees + shoulder and wrist injuries + gout + GIRD + TMJ + IBS; 12 selections to the All Defense teams; and even Magic said he's the best Laker ever. Also, LeBron's a douche and undeserving of the adoration bestowed on him. I think I got most of it. Boom, let's fight ...

No fight at all.
Kobe is a scorer who's known for his volume shooting @ a somewhat inefficient level. Which is exactly what I said
Curry's not the volume scorer that Kobe tries to be, but he is a whole lot more efficient - especially from 3pt land.

Moonriver said that if Kobe was in his prime, he could be like Curry in this era....Kobe played in this era, and he's never shot like Curry
But, no one's arguing Kobe couldn't score a lot of points

Kobe FG% .448
Curry FG% .475

Bryant 3pt% .330
Curry 3pt% .443
(that right there illustrates on of my original points. 1/3rd of .330 is .110. Meaning Curry's is slightly more than 33% BETTER than Kobe from 3pt land)

Bryant FT% .837
Curry FT% .902

Kobe could score whenever he wanted too. But the OP saying that this era gave Curry an advantage was bull, since they play in the same era since 2004. Saying Kobe could score like Curry if "kobe was in his prime in this era" was also inaccurate. Kobe could score will, but it wasn't like Curry, and it isn't anywhere near his efficiency level
_________________
LBJ + AD = More rings
Never argue with a fool - listeners can't tell you apart
Wilt's unstoppable fadeaway: www.youtube.com/watch?v=8O9MgNfcGJA
NPZ's Magic Johnson mix: www.youtube.com/watch?v=q8Qbo0WqvOI
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
MJST
Retired Number
Retired Number


Joined: 06 Jul 2014
Posts: 26084

PostPosted: Tue Feb 09, 2016 11:50 pm    Post subject:

moonriver24 wrote:
the association wrote:
P.K. wrote:
moonriver24 wrote:
P.K. wrote:
moonriver24 wrote:
P.K. wrote:
moonriver24 wrote:

If Curry gets 30 plus easily on this great advanced defense era, how would a prime mamba fare in todays era?

Today's era began in 2002 with the NBA removing the last barriers to the zone defense and was complete by 2004, when they started calling fouls for even incidental contact on perimeter players away from the basket.

Kobe was 24 in 2004 - how much more "prime" can he be?

Have you watched basketball from 2000 thru like 2012 or even 2013?

Have you?
Do you think there's been some major rule change in the last 4 years that suddenly let Curry start making 34' 3ptrs?
The rules have been the same since 2004. It did take teams a while to figure out how to implement the zone, but Kobe's been playing under both the "no contact" rules and the zone rules for 12 years now.

Curry's lighting it up because he's an unreal shooter with an exceptionally quick trigger who can shoot incredibly accurately from up to 35' - those are 3 things Kobe never was.
in the curry thread I posted names of retired players while Kobe is still playing now. You might want to check those names before you begin to compare curry n kobe in their prime. Hints; Yao, Kidd, Artest, Battier, Kirlinko, Shaq, just to name a few. Soon to retire include duncan kg pierce. You know how good they were in their prime days.

You've already forgotten what you said?
you're the person that said "If Curry gets 30 plus easily on this great advanced defense era, how would a prime mamba fare in todays era"

The only thing I've said is:
1. that Kobe WAS in his prime during this era
2. and the reason Curry scores so easily is that he's a great shooter with a lightning fast release and long distance range, and that Kobe was never a great shooter - he's more known as a volume shooter who's kind of inefficient, and wasn't all that great from 3pt land.

so, you saying that a "prime" kobe would light it up in this era like Curry is wrong on so many fronts - not the least of which is that Kobe played in this era, and absolutely didn't light it up like Curry


81 points; 62 points through three quarters (singlehandedly outscoring the team that deserved to win the chip that year, but for the D Whistle legerdemain express); four consecutive 50+ point games; nine 40-point games in one month (or maybe it's nine consecutive games of 40+ points?); more playoff series wins over 50-win teams than anyone else; closest to the legendary MJ (ergo, IMMEDIATELY behind MJ in the pantheon [if not immediately before, who REALLY knows?]); real Lakers threepeat MVP b/c Portland + Sacramento + San Antonio; and I was 12 when he entered the NBA, which is amazing b/c that's only four more than his first number, which also equals the product of the digits in his second number; I win, you lose, the end.

Did I get it right? I think I did ... oh, yeah ... also footwork; clutch gene; hardest worker ever; beloved in China; YouTube videos; disfigured fingers + bad knees + shoulder and wrist injuries + gout + GIRD + TMJ + IBS; 12 selections to the All Defense teams; and even Magic said he's the best Laker ever. Also, LeBron's a douche and undeserving of the adoration bestowed on him. I think I got most of it. Boom, let's fight ...

Let me chip in

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_40-plus_point_games_by_Kobe_Bryant

Check on the minutes and number of quarters kobe played while scoring at least 40 points.

If he would just make a name for himself, this dude would have scored 70s and 80s multiple times playing more minutes and more quarters.

Look at today's games. All above 100 point games.

Advanced Defensive era my arsh.


The majority of the top defensive teams of all time come from Kobe's era. So there's that too. Zone has a lot to do with that, something specifically designed to stop superstars.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
P.K.
Retired Number
Retired Number


Joined: 10 Jul 2003
Posts: 29641

PostPosted: Tue Feb 09, 2016 11:56 pm    Post subject:

moonriver24 wrote:
the association wrote:
P.K. wrote:
moonriver24 wrote:
P.K. wrote:
moonriver24 wrote:
P.K. wrote:
moonriver24 wrote:

If Curry gets 30 plus easily on this great advanced defense era, how would a prime mamba fare in todays era?

Today's era began in 2002 with the NBA removing the last barriers to the zone defense and was complete by 2004, when they started calling fouls for even incidental contact on perimeter players away from the basket.

Kobe was 24 in 2004 - how much more "prime" can he be?

Have you watched basketball from 2000 thru like 2012 or even 2013?

Have you?
Do you think there's been some major rule change in the last 4 years that suddenly let Curry start making 34' 3ptrs?
The rules have been the same since 2004. It did take teams a while to figure out how to implement the zone, but Kobe's been playing under both the "no contact" rules and the zone rules for 12 years now.

Curry's lighting it up because he's an unreal shooter with an exceptionally quick trigger who can shoot incredibly accurately from up to 35' - those are 3 things Kobe never was.
in the curry thread I posted names of retired players while Kobe is still playing now. You might want to check those names before you begin to compare curry n kobe in their prime. Hints; Yao, Kidd, Artest, Battier, Kirlinko, Shaq, just to name a few. Soon to retire include duncan kg pierce. You know how good they were in their prime days.

You've already forgotten what you said?
you're the person that said "If Curry gets 30 plus easily on this great advanced defense era, how would a prime mamba fare in todays era"

The only thing I've said is:
1. that Kobe WAS in his prime during this era
2. and the reason Curry scores so easily is that he's a great shooter with a lightning fast release and long distance range, and that Kobe was never a great shooter - he's more known as a volume shooter who's kind of inefficient, and wasn't all that great from 3pt land.

so, you saying that a "prime" kobe would light it up in this era like Curry is wrong on so many fronts - not the least of which is that Kobe played in this era, and absolutely didn't light it up like Curry


81 points; 62 points through three quarters (singlehandedly outscoring the team that deserved to win the chip that year, but for the D Whistle legerdemain express); four consecutive 50+ point games; nine 40-point games in one month (or maybe it's nine consecutive games of 40+ points?); more playoff series wins over 50-win teams than anyone else; closest to the legendary MJ (ergo, IMMEDIATELY behind MJ in the pantheon [if not immediately before, who REALLY knows?]); real Lakers threepeat MVP b/c Portland + Sacramento + San Antonio; and I was 12 when he entered the NBA, which is amazing b/c that's only four more than his first number, which also equals the product of the digits in his second number; I win, you lose, the end.

Did I get it right? I think I did ... oh, yeah ... also footwork; clutch gene; hardest worker ever; beloved in China; YouTube videos; disfigured fingers + bad knees + shoulder and wrist injuries + gout + GIRD + TMJ + IBS; 12 selections to the All Defense teams; and even Magic said he's the best Laker ever. Also, LeBron's a douche and undeserving of the adoration bestowed on him. I think I got most of it. Boom, let's fight ...

Let me chip in

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_40-plus_point_games_by_Kobe_Bryant

Check on the minutes and number of quarters kobe played while scoring at least 40 points.

If he would just make a name for himself, this dude would have scored 70s and 80s multiple times playing more minutes and more quarters.

Look at today's games. All above 100 point games.

Advanced Defensive era my arsh.

Moonriver, you're doing what you always do when your inaccuracies get biotchslapped - you're changing your argument - which is why I keep copying in exactly what you said, and exactly how I refute your original nonsense.
If you want to start another post about Kobe having the most 40 point games, no one would argue with you...because, possibly for the first time ever, you'd actually have posted something that's accurate.
_________________
LBJ + AD = More rings
Never argue with a fool - listeners can't tell you apart
Wilt's unstoppable fadeaway: www.youtube.com/watch?v=8O9MgNfcGJA
NPZ's Magic Johnson mix: www.youtube.com/watch?v=q8Qbo0WqvOI
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
moonriver24
Franchise Player
Franchise Player


Joined: 21 Oct 2007
Posts: 15265

PostPosted: Tue Feb 09, 2016 11:58 pm    Post subject:

P.K. wrote:
the association wrote:
P.K. wrote:
moonriver24 wrote:
P.K. wrote:
moonriver24 wrote:
P.K. wrote:
moonriver24 wrote:

If Curry gets 30 plus easily on this great advanced defense era, how would a prime mamba fare in todays era?

Today's era began in 2002 with the NBA removing the last barriers to the zone defense and was complete by 2004, when they started calling fouls for even incidental contact on perimeter players away from the basket.

Kobe was 24 in 2004 - how much more "prime" can he be?

Have you watched basketball from 2000 thru like 2012 or even 2013?

Have you?
Do you think there's been some major rule change in the last 4 years that suddenly let Curry start making 34' 3ptrs?
The rules have been the same since 2004. It did take teams a while to figure out how to implement the zone, but Kobe's been playing under both the "no contact" rules and the zone rules for 12 years now.

Curry's lighting it up because he's an unreal shooter with an exceptionally quick trigger who can shoot incredibly accurately from up to 35' - those are 3 things Kobe never was.
in the curry thread I posted names of retired players while Kobe is still playing now. You might want to check those names before you begin to compare curry n kobe in their prime. Hints; Yao, Kidd, Artest, Battier, Kirlinko, Shaq, just to name a few. Soon to retire include duncan kg pierce. You know how good they were in their prime days.

You've already forgotten what you said?
you're the person that said "If Curry gets 30 plus easily on this great advanced defense era, how would a prime mamba fare in todays era"

The only thing I've said is:
1. that Kobe WAS in his prime during this era
2. and the reason Curry scores so easily is that he's a great shooter with a lightning fast release and long distance range, and that Kobe was never a great shooter - he's more known as a volume shooter who's kind of inefficient, and wasn't all that great from 3pt land.

so, you saying that a "prime" kobe would light it up in this era like Curry is wrong on so many fronts - not the least of which is that Kobe played in this era, and absolutely didn't light it up like Curry


81 points; 62 points through three quarters (singlehandedly outscoring the team that deserved to win the chip that year, but for the D Whistle legerdemain express); four consecutive 50+ point games; nine 40-point games in one month (or maybe it's nine consecutive games of 40+ points?); more playoff series wins over 50-win teams than anyone else; closest to the legendary MJ (ergo, IMMEDIATELY behind MJ in the pantheon [if not immediately before, who REALLY knows?]); real Lakers threepeat MVP b/c Portland + Sacramento + San Antonio; and I was 12 when he entered the NBA, which is amazing b/c that's only four more than his first number, which also equals the product of the digits in his second number; I win, you lose, the end.

Did I get it right? I think I did ... oh, yeah ... also footwork; clutch gene; hardest worker ever; beloved in China; YouTube videos; disfigured fingers + bad knees + shoulder and wrist injuries + gout + GIRD + TMJ + IBS; 12 selections to the All Defense teams; and even Magic said he's the best Laker ever. Also, LeBron's a douche and undeserving of the adoration bestowed on him. I think I got most of it. Boom, let's fight ...

No fight at all.
Kobe is a scorer who's known for his volume shooting @ a somewhat inefficient level. Which is exactly what I said
Curry's not the volume scorer that Kobe tries to be, but he is a whole lot more efficient - especially from 3pt land.

Moonriver said that if Kobe was in his prime, he could be like Curry in this era....Kobe played in this era, and he's never shot like Curry
But, no one's arguing Kobe couldn't score a lot of points

Kobe FG% .448
Curry FG% .475

Bryant 3pt% .330
Curry 3pt% .443
(that right there illustrates on of my original points. 1/3rd of .330 is .110. Meaning Curry's is slightly more than 33% BETTER than Kobe from 3pt land)

Bryant FT% .837
Curry FT% .902

Kobe could score whenever he wanted too. But the OP saying that this era gave Curry an advantage was bull, since they play in the same era since 2004. Saying Kobe could score like Curry if "kobe was in his prime in this era" was also inaccurate. Kobe could score will, but it wasn't like Curry, and it isn't anywhere near his efficiency level

You still don't get it. Keep harping on Curry's efficiency. That's undeniable because he plays in this defenseless era. As I pointed out, look at today's games. NOT A SINGLE ONE BELOW 100 POINTS.
_________________
Kobe's Top 5 Dunks, 81 points, MJ last gm @Staples
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
P.K.
Retired Number
Retired Number


Joined: 10 Jul 2003
Posts: 29641

PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2016 12:06 am    Post subject:

moonriver24 wrote:
P.K. wrote:
the association wrote:
P.K. wrote:
moonriver24 wrote:
P.K. wrote:
moonriver24 wrote:
P.K. wrote:
moonriver24 wrote:

If Curry gets 30 plus easily on this great advanced defense era, how would a prime mamba fare in todays era?

Today's era began in 2002 with the NBA removing the last barriers to the zone defense and was complete by 2004, when they started calling fouls for even incidental contact on perimeter players away from the basket.

Kobe was 24 in 2004 - how much more "prime" can he be?

Have you watched basketball from 2000 thru like 2012 or even 2013?

Have you?
Do you think there's been some major rule change in the last 4 years that suddenly let Curry start making 34' 3ptrs?
The rules have been the same since 2004. It did take teams a while to figure out how to implement the zone, but Kobe's been playing under both the "no contact" rules and the zone rules for 12 years now.

Curry's lighting it up because he's an unreal shooter with an exceptionally quick trigger who can shoot incredibly accurately from up to 35' - those are 3 things Kobe never was.
in the curry thread I posted names of retired players while Kobe is still playing now. You might want to check those names before you begin to compare curry n kobe in their prime. Hints; Yao, Kidd, Artest, Battier, Kirlinko, Shaq, just to name a few. Soon to retire include duncan kg pierce. You know how good they were in their prime days.

You've already forgotten what you said?
you're the person that said "If Curry gets 30 plus easily on this great advanced defense era, how would a prime mamba fare in todays era"

The only thing I've said is:
1. that Kobe WAS in his prime during this era
2. and the reason Curry scores so easily is that he's a great shooter with a lightning fast release and long distance range, and that Kobe was never a great shooter - he's more known as a volume shooter who's kind of inefficient, and wasn't all that great from 3pt land.

so, you saying that a "prime" kobe would light it up in this era like Curry is wrong on so many fronts - not the least of which is that Kobe played in this era, and absolutely didn't light it up like Curry


81 points; 62 points through three quarters (singlehandedly outscoring the team that deserved to win the chip that year, but for the D Whistle legerdemain express); four consecutive 50+ point games; nine 40-point games in one month (or maybe it's nine consecutive games of 40+ points?); more playoff series wins over 50-win teams than anyone else; closest to the legendary MJ (ergo, IMMEDIATELY behind MJ in the pantheon [if not immediately before, who REALLY knows?]); real Lakers threepeat MVP b/c Portland + Sacramento + San Antonio; and I was 12 when he entered the NBA, which is amazing b/c that's only four more than his first number, which also equals the product of the digits in his second number; I win, you lose, the end.

Did I get it right? I think I did ... oh, yeah ... also footwork; clutch gene; hardest worker ever; beloved in China; YouTube videos; disfigured fingers + bad knees + shoulder and wrist injuries + gout + GIRD + TMJ + IBS; 12 selections to the All Defense teams; and even Magic said he's the best Laker ever. Also, LeBron's a douche and undeserving of the adoration bestowed on him. I think I got most of it. Boom, let's fight ...

No fight at all.
Kobe is a scorer who's known for his volume shooting @ a somewhat inefficient level. Which is exactly what I said
Curry's not the volume scorer that Kobe tries to be, but he is a whole lot more efficient - especially from 3pt land.

Moonriver said that if Kobe was in his prime, he could be like Curry in this era....Kobe played in this era, and he's never shot like Curry
But, no one's arguing Kobe couldn't score a lot of points

Kobe FG% .448
Curry FG% .475

Bryant 3pt% .330
Curry 3pt% .443
(that right there illustrates on of my original points. 1/3rd of .330 is .110. Meaning Curry's is slightly more than 33% BETTER than Kobe from 3pt land)

Bryant FT% .837
Curry FT% .902

Kobe could score whenever he wanted too. But the OP saying that this era gave Curry an advantage was bull, since they play in the same era since 2004. Saying Kobe could score like Curry if "kobe was in his prime in this era" was also inaccurate. Kobe could score will, but it wasn't like Curry, and it isn't anywhere near his efficiency level

You still don't get it. Keep harping on Curry's efficiency. That's undeniable because he plays in this defenseless era. As I pointed out, look at today's games. NOT A SINGLE ONE BELOW 100 POINTS.

yes, because as I patiently explained to you they implemented the zone rules in 2002 and the "no contact on the perimeter" changes in 2004. The "no contact rules" were specifically intended to open up scoring. The zone rules were specifically designed to get away from the single player post up that brought games to a crawl - because they wanted MORE points and more exciting games. The games go over 100 because of the rule changes that WERE INTENDED specifically to increase scoring - so, they succeeded in getting exactly what they wanted.

and you said "If Curry gets 30 plus easily on this great advanced defense era, how would a prime mamba fare in todays era"
and, again...this era began in earnest in 2004, so Kobe's prime was IN THIS EXACT ERA

So, Kobe would fare exactly as he did fare since 2004...
_________________
LBJ + AD = More rings
Never argue with a fool - listeners can't tell you apart
Wilt's unstoppable fadeaway: www.youtube.com/watch?v=8O9MgNfcGJA
NPZ's Magic Johnson mix: www.youtube.com/watch?v=q8Qbo0WqvOI
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
the association
Star Player
Star Player


Joined: 03 Feb 2015
Posts: 1982

PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2016 12:18 am    Post subject:

P.K. wrote:
the association wrote:
P.K. wrote:
moonriver24 wrote:
P.K. wrote:
moonriver24 wrote:
P.K. wrote:
moonriver24 wrote:

If Curry gets 30 plus easily on this great advanced defense era, how would a prime mamba fare in todays era?

Today's era began in 2002 with the NBA removing the last barriers to the zone defense and was complete by 2004, when they started calling fouls for even incidental contact on perimeter players away from the basket.

Kobe was 24 in 2004 - how much more "prime" can he be?

Have you watched basketball from 2000 thru like 2012 or even 2013?

Have you?
Do you think there's been some major rule change in the last 4 years that suddenly let Curry start making 34' 3ptrs?
The rules have been the same since 2004. It did take teams a while to figure out how to implement the zone, but Kobe's been playing under both the "no contact" rules and the zone rules for 12 years now.

Curry's lighting it up because he's an unreal shooter with an exceptionally quick trigger who can shoot incredibly accurately from up to 35' - those are 3 things Kobe never was.
in the curry thread I posted names of retired players while Kobe is still playing now. You might want to check those names before you begin to compare curry n kobe in their prime. Hints; Yao, Kidd, Artest, Battier, Kirlinko, Shaq, just to name a few. Soon to retire include duncan kg pierce. You know how good they were in their prime days.

You've already forgotten what you said?
you're the person that said "If Curry gets 30 plus easily on this great advanced defense era, how would a prime mamba fare in todays era"

The only thing I've said is:
1. that Kobe WAS in his prime during this era
2. and the reason Curry scores so easily is that he's a great shooter with a lightning fast release and long distance range, and that Kobe was never a great shooter - he's more known as a volume shooter who's kind of inefficient, and wasn't all that great from 3pt land.

so, you saying that a "prime" kobe would light it up in this era like Curry is wrong on so many fronts - not the least of which is that Kobe played in this era, and absolutely didn't light it up like Curry


81 points; 62 points through three quarters (singlehandedly outscoring the team that deserved to win the chip that year, but for the D Whistle legerdemain express); four consecutive 50+ point games; nine 40-point games in one month (or maybe it's nine consecutive games of 40+ points?); more playoff series wins over 50-win teams than anyone else; closest to the legendary MJ (ergo, IMMEDIATELY behind MJ in the pantheon [if not immediately before, who REALLY knows?]); real Lakers threepeat MVP b/c Portland + Sacramento + San Antonio; and I was 12 when he entered the NBA, which is amazing b/c that's only four more than his first number, which also equals the product of the digits in his second number; I win, you lose, the end.

Did I get it right? I think I did ... oh, yeah ... also footwork; clutch gene; hardest worker ever; beloved in China; YouTube videos; disfigured fingers + bad knees + shoulder and wrist injuries + gout + GIRD + TMJ + IBS; 12 selections to the All Defense teams; and even Magic said he's the best Laker ever. Also, LeBron's a douche and undeserving of the adoration bestowed on him. I think I got most of it. Boom, let's fight ...

No fight at all.
Kobe is a scorer who's known for his volume shooting @ a somewhat inefficient level. Which is exactly what I said
Curry's not the volume scorer that Kobe tries to be, but he is a whole lot more efficient - especially from 3pt land.

Moonriver said that if Kobe was in his prime, he could be like Curry in this era....Kobe played in this era, and he's never shot like Curry
But, no one's arguing Kobe couldn't score a lot of points

Kobe FG% .448
Curry FG% .475

Bryant 3pt% .330
Curry 3pt% .443
(that right there illustrates on of my original points. 1/3rd of .330 is .110. Meaning Curry's is slightly more than 33% BETTER than Kobe from 3pt land)

Bryant FT% .837
Curry FT% .902

Kobe could score whenever he wanted too. But the OP saying that this era gave Curry an advantage was bull, since they play in the same era since 2004. Saying Kobe could score like Curry if "kobe was in his prime in this era" was also inaccurate. Kobe could score will, but it wasn't like Curry, and it isn't anywhere near his efficiency level


Hey, I somehow crossed the streams ... my bad, the intent was to bring light humor to an otherwise riveting display of cognitive distortion. And not directed at you (or anyone else, really) ... but, hey, this conversation re: legacies cannot escape the reality distortion field anyway ... it's simply much bigger than one man. In that regard, our favorite son here is, indeed, the GOAT.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
moonriver24
Franchise Player
Franchise Player


Joined: 21 Oct 2007
Posts: 15265

PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2016 12:29 am    Post subject:

P.K. wrote:
Moonriver, you're doing what you always do when your inaccuracies get biotchslapped - you're changing your argument - which is why I keep copying in exactly what you said, and exactly how I refute your original nonsense.
If you want to start another post about Kobe having the most 40 point games, no one would argue with you...because, possibly for the first time ever, you'd actually have posted something that's accurate.

It's really pointless to argue with you. You still don't get the sarcastic ADVANCED DEFENSE ERA. You still don't get it when I tried to tell you the players Kobe had faced in his prime time.

You think as if Curry and Kobe played in the same era and set of players, defensive schemes and so on. Nope they are not. Yet, Kobe still produced great numbers against Spurs, Kings, Houston, Boston of the world where names like Duncan, Robinson, Tony parker, Ginobli, Webber, Divac, Bibby, Pierce, KG, Yao Ming, Kidd, Tmac, VInce Carter, Iverson, Mutombo, Hakeem (still good), Sabonis, Steve Smith, Steve Francis, Mobley, Reggie Miller, Mark Jackson, Gary Payton, Rasheed Wallace, Pippen, MJ (almost there), Rip Hamilton, Big Ben, Ray Allen, Dirk, Nash, Amare, Stoudamire (Portland), Wade, Bron, Bosh, Jalen Rose, and even Shaq himself in Miami, Kobe stoppers (Battier, Bowen, Artest, Pippen, Paterson, Durant, Lebron, etc, etc), and so on when they were still at the top.

Who are Curry facing now?
Almost past prime Bron, Durant, Paul Brothers.

KG, Duncan, Pierce are about to retire. And soon Wade and Bosh would be washed up. And where is that Coward? vanish.

Who are the great centers of today?

Now it's not fair for me to not let you list your own. Please, enlighten me.
_________________
Kobe's Top 5 Dunks, 81 points, MJ last gm @Staples
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
P.K.
Retired Number
Retired Number


Joined: 10 Jul 2003
Posts: 29641

PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2016 12:58 am    Post subject:

moonriver24 wrote:
P.K. wrote:
Moonriver, you're doing what you always do when your inaccuracies get biotchslapped - you're changing your argument - which is why I keep copying in exactly what you said, and exactly how I refute your original nonsense.
If you want to start another post about Kobe having the most 40 point games, no one would argue with you...because, possibly for the first time ever, you'd actually have posted something that's accurate.

It's really pointless to argue with you. You still don't get the sarcastic ADVANCED DEFENSE ERA. You still don't get it when I tried to tell you the players Kobe had faced in his prime time.

You think as if Curry and Kobe played in the same era and set of players, defensive schemes and so on. Nope they are not. Yet, Kobe still produced great numbers against Spurs, Kings, Houston, Boston of the world where names like Duncan, Robinson, Tony parker, Ginobli, Webber, Divac, Bibby, Pierce, KG, Yao Ming, Kidd, Tmac, VInce Carter, Iverson, Mutombo, Hakeem (still good), Sabonis, Steve Smith, Steve Francis, Mobley, Reggie Miller, Mark Jackson, Gary Payton, Rasheed Wallace, Pippen, MJ (almost there), Rip Hamilton, Big Ben, Ray Allen, Dirk, Nash, Amare, Stoudamire (Portland), Wade, Bron, Bosh, Jalen Rose, and even Shaq himself in Miami, Kobe stoppers (Battier, Bowen, Artest, Pippen, Paterson, Durant, Lebron, etc, etc), and so on when they were still at the top.

Who are Curry facing now?
Almost past prime Bron, Durant, Paul Brothers.

KG, Duncan, Pierce are about to retire. And soon Wade and Bosh would be washed up. And where is that Coward? vanish.

Who are the great centers of today?

Now it's not fair for me to not let you list your own. Please, enlighten me.

We don't really argue, Moonriver
You say something that's either completely irrational, utterly incoherent, or 100% factually inaccurate. Most of the time I just laugh at it, but occasionally I'll attempt to correct all your mistakes - that's when we get into this situation where you realize you're wrong and look silly, so you start changing what you want to argue about to something you think you can win. That usually doesn't work out for you either, because even your 2nd or 3rd attempt is usually completely wrong also.
In this case, your 2nd point might have actually been valid
but, as usual, the first was completely ridiculous.
_________________
LBJ + AD = More rings
Never argue with a fool - listeners can't tell you apart
Wilt's unstoppable fadeaway: www.youtube.com/watch?v=8O9MgNfcGJA
NPZ's Magic Johnson mix: www.youtube.com/watch?v=q8Qbo0WqvOI
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
moonriver24
Franchise Player
Franchise Player


Joined: 21 Oct 2007
Posts: 15265

PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2016 1:25 am    Post subject:

P.K. wrote:
moonriver24 wrote:
P.K. wrote:
Moonriver, you're doing what you always do when your inaccuracies get biotchslapped - you're changing your argument - which is why I keep copying in exactly what you said, and exactly how I refute your original nonsense.
If you want to start another post about Kobe having the most 40 point games, no one would argue with you...because, possibly for the first time ever, you'd actually have posted something that's accurate.

It's really pointless to argue with you. You still don't get the sarcastic ADVANCED DEFENSE ERA. You still don't get it when I tried to tell you the players Kobe had faced in his prime time.

You think as if Curry and Kobe played in the same era and set of players, defensive schemes and so on. Nope they are not. Yet, Kobe still produced great numbers against Spurs, Kings, Houston, Boston of the world where names like Duncan, Robinson, Tony parker, Ginobli, Webber, Divac, Bibby, Pierce, KG, Yao Ming, Kidd, Tmac, VInce Carter, Iverson, Mutombo, Hakeem (still good), Sabonis, Steve Smith, Steve Francis, Mobley, Reggie Miller, Mark Jackson, Gary Payton, Rasheed Wallace, Pippen, MJ (almost there), Rip Hamilton, Big Ben, Ray Allen, Dirk, Nash, Amare, Stoudamire (Portland), Wade, Bron, Bosh, Jalen Rose, and even Shaq himself in Miami, Kobe stoppers (Battier, Bowen, Artest, Pippen, Paterson, Durant, Lebron, etc, etc), and so on when they were still at the top.

Who are Curry facing now?
Almost past prime Bron, Durant, Paul Brothers.

KG, Duncan, Pierce are about to retire. And soon Wade and Bosh would be washed up. And where is that Coward? vanish.

Who are the great centers of today?

Now it's not fair for me to not let you list your own. Please, enlighten me.

We don't really argue, Moonriver
You say something that's either completely irrational, utterly incoherent, or 100% factually inaccurate. Most of the time I just laugh at it, but occasionally I'll attempt to correct all your mistakes - that's when we get into this situation where you realize you're wrong and look silly, so you start changing what you want to argue about to something you think you can win. That usually doesn't work out for you either, because even your 2nd or 3rd attempt is usually completely wrong also.
In this case, your 2nd point might have actually been valid
but, as usual, the first was completely ridiculous.

Well, the ridiculous part is your failure to provide me with even just a short list of players.
I havent even touched the different defenses in each era as I am afraid it will become another part of my incoherent n irrelevant arguement.
_________________
Kobe's Top 5 Dunks, 81 points, MJ last gm @Staples
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
SuperboyReformed
Star Player
Star Player


Joined: 07 Oct 2012
Posts: 4083

PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2016 1:50 am    Post subject:

MJST wrote:
*sighs*

Kobe is top 3 all time, entire NBA career.

It goes for me personally

Kareem
Jordan
Kobe

Kobe has surpassed Magic. Only nostalgia is what keeps him ahead in some people's minds. But if you doubt Kobe is the greatest Laker of all time. Well take a look.

Kobe Bryant Lakers Ranks

Seasons: 1st
Playoffs Seasons: 1st
All-Star Appearances: 1st
NBA First Team: 1st
NBA Defensive First Team: 1st
Games: 1st
Season Points: 1st
Playoff Points: 1st
Points in a Season: 1st (2,832)
Points in a Game: 1st (81)
Points in a Half: 1st (55)
Points in a Quarter: 1st (30) twice
60 Point Games: 1st (5)
50 Point Games(career): 1st (24)
50 Point Games(Season): 1st (10)
Consecutive 50 Point Games: 1st (4)
40 Point Games(career): 1st (121)
40 Point Games(Season): 1st (27)
Consecutive 40 Point Games: 1st (9)
Field Goals Made in a Quarter: 1st
Field Goals Made in a Half: 1st
Field Goals Made in a game: 1st
Free Throws: 1st
Free Throws(Consecutive Playoff Record): 1st
Steals: 1st
Steals(Half): 1st (6)
Steals(Quarter): 1st (3)
Minutes: 1st
Minutes(Playoffs): 1st
Most Points Scored in Christmas Games: 1st (All-Time)
Championships: 1st (Tied)
All-Star MVP's won: 1st (tied all time)
All-Star Points Scored(Career): 1st
3-Pointers Made in a Single Game: 1st
Only Laker(and Player) in NBA History to have over 30,000 Points and 6,000 Assists
On Pace to be the only Player and Laker in NBA History to have over 30,000 Points, 7,000 Rebounds and 6,000 Assists

And most recently: Lakers All-Time Assist Leaders: 2nd

Greatest Laker of All-Time: Kobe Bryant



It's inarguable. Kobe is the greatest Laker of all time, and has passed Magic on the all-time list. Thus he is number 3 on the GOAT list behind Kareem and Jordan. There's no question.

This is excellent.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
paulsung123
Starting Rotation
Starting Rotation


Joined: 05 Dec 2008
Posts: 740

PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2016 2:16 am    Post subject:

Haven't done this in years. Will be fun updating my own personal top 15ish list and reasons therein.

[Players can be swapped within tier and not cause much issue]

Tier 1 (consensus top 3)
1. MJ (GOAT, duh)
2. Magic (D holds him back, transcendent)
3. Kareem (legit GOAT 1B alternative)

Tier 2 (titans of the past)
4. Wilt (100 point game, most dominant player ever status overcomes relative low chip count)
5. Russell (too many rings not to be this high)

Tier 3 (current living legends)
6. Kobe (5 chips, greatest scorer perhaps ever)
7. Duncan (5 chips, the yin to kobe's yang)
8. Lebron (statistical god, 2 chips, still time to add hardware)

Tier 3.5
9. Bird (only guy who could arguably be tier 3, but only won 3 chips)

Tier 4 (best of the rest)
10. Oscar
11. Shaq
12. Hakeem
13. Dr. J
14. Jerry West
_________________
... I don't think that's Jack in those pictures ...
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
MJST
Retired Number
Retired Number


Joined: 06 Jul 2014
Posts: 26084

PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2016 3:48 am    Post subject:

SuperboyReformed wrote:
MJST wrote:
*sighs*

Kobe is top 3 all time, entire NBA career.

It goes for me personally

Kareem
Jordan
Kobe

Kobe has surpassed Magic. Only nostalgia is what keeps him ahead in some people's minds. But if you doubt Kobe is the greatest Laker of all time. Well take a look.

Kobe Bryant Lakers Ranks

Seasons: 1st
Playoffs Seasons: 1st
All-Star Appearances: 1st
NBA First Team: 1st
NBA Defensive First Team: 1st
Games: 1st
Season Points: 1st
Playoff Points: 1st
Points in a Season: 1st (2,832)
Points in a Game: 1st (81)
Points in a Half: 1st (55)
Points in a Quarter: 1st (30) twice
60 Point Games: 1st (5)
50 Point Games(career): 1st (24)
50 Point Games(Season): 1st (10)
Consecutive 50 Point Games: 1st (4)
40 Point Games(career): 1st (121)
40 Point Games(Season): 1st (27)
Consecutive 40 Point Games: 1st (9)
Field Goals Made in a Quarter: 1st
Field Goals Made in a Half: 1st
Field Goals Made in a game: 1st
Free Throws: 1st
Free Throws(Consecutive Playoff Record): 1st
Steals: 1st
Steals(Half): 1st (6)
Steals(Quarter): 1st (3)
Minutes: 1st
Minutes(Playoffs): 1st
Most Points Scored in Christmas Games: 1st (All-Time)
Championships: 1st (Tied)
All-Star MVP's won: 1st (tied all time)
All-Star Points Scored(Career): 1st
3-Pointers Made in a Single Game: 1st
Only Laker(and Player) in NBA History to have over 30,000 Points and 6,000 Assists
On Pace to be the only Player and Laker in NBA History to have over 30,000 Points, 7,000 Rebounds and 6,000 Assists

And most recently: Lakers All-Time Assist Leaders: 2nd

Greatest Laker of All-Time: Kobe Bryant



It's inarguable. Kobe is the greatest Laker of all time, and has passed Magic on the all-time list. Thus he is number 3 on the GOAT list behind Kareem and Jordan. There's no question.

This is excellent.


Thank you ^_^ it gets tiring to see people try to act like Kobe isn't the greatest Laker of all time.

Nostalgia glasses are heavy, but when everything is laid out in front of you, there's no question. When you own nearly every Lakers record and are even 2nd in assists when you weren't even a point guard and will be the only Laker and Player in NBA History to have over 30,000 Points and 6,000 Assists and are on pace to be the only player in NBA History to have over 30,000 Points, 7,000 Rebounds and 6,000 Assists you are not just solidified as the greatest Laker ever but that puts you up in the top 3-4 as far as I'm concerned.

And as Kobe has surpassed Magic, I have him 3rd.

My Current Top 7

1) Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
2) Michael Jordan
3) Kobe Bryant
4) Magic Johnson
5) Wilt Chamberlain
6) Larry Bird
7) Shaq


8-10 fluctuate a lot though. Hard not to include Tim Duncan or Hakeem, Oscar or Jerry West in those regions. You could even argue Tim Duncan at 7th and move Shaq to 8th if you wanted to go that route.

But yes, imo Kobe has passed Magic and is unquestionably and statistically the greatest Laker of all time and that's something to celebrate that we got to witness it all.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
PrplReign
Star Player
Star Player


Joined: 19 Aug 2005
Posts: 2796

PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2016 5:13 am    Post subject:

paulsung123 wrote:
Haven't done this in years. Will be fun updating my own personal top 15ish list and reasons therein.

[Players can be swapped within tier and not cause much issue]

Tier 1 (consensus top 3)
1. MJ (GOAT, duh)
2. Magic (D holds him back, transcendent)
3. Kareem (legit GOAT 1B alternative)

Tier 2 (titans of the past)
4. Wilt (100 point game, most dominant player ever status overcomes relative low chip count)
5. Russell (too many rings not to be this high)

Tier 3 (current living legends)
6. Kobe (5 chips, greatest scorer perhaps ever)
7. Duncan (5 chips, the yin to kobe's yang)
8. Lebron (statistical god, 2 chips, still time to add hardware)

Tier 3.5
9. Bird (only guy who could arguably be tier 3, but only won 3 chips)

Tier 4 (best of the rest)
10. Oscar
11. Shaq
12. Hakeem
13. Dr. J
14. Jerry West


I like your list and do not know that I would change it much, if at all. Excellent post!
_________________
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mu3vkwP3GHQ
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
methdxman
Star Player
Star Player


Joined: 31 Jan 2002
Posts: 6879
Location: Los Angeles/Barcelona

PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2016 6:17 am    Post subject:

PrplReign wrote:
paulsung123 wrote:
Haven't done this in years. Will be fun updating my own personal top 15ish list and reasons therein.

[Players can be swapped within tier and not cause much issue]

Tier 1 (consensus top 3)
1. MJ (GOAT, duh)
2. Magic (D holds him back, transcendent)
3. Kareem (legit GOAT 1B alternative)

Tier 2 (titans of the past)
4. Wilt (100 point game, most dominant player ever status overcomes relative low chip count)
5. Russell (too many rings not to be this high)

Tier 3 (current living legends)
6. Kobe (5 chips, greatest scorer perhaps ever)
7. Duncan (5 chips, the yin to kobe's yang)
8. Lebron (statistical god, 2 chips, still time to add hardware)

Tier 3.5
9. Bird (only guy who could arguably be tier 3, but only won 3 chips)

Tier 4 (best of the rest)
10. Oscar
11. Shaq
12. Hakeem
13. Dr. J
14. Jerry West


I like your list and do not know that I would change it much, if at all. Excellent post!


I can't rank Magic over Kobe.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message AIM Address MSN Messenger Reply with quote
Aeneas Hunter
Retired Number
Retired Number


Joined: 12 Jul 2005
Posts: 31763

PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2016 6:49 am    Post subject:

business101 wrote:
Aeneas Hunter wrote:
business101 wrote:
You like to hide under a Lakers banner. Come to a real basketball site and we can talk about Kobe talent vs the rest of the guy above him. See how many agree with you.


I wasn't talking about Kobe. I doubt that you have any idea where I would rank him. I was talking about your silly spreadsheet ranking system that, among other things, refuses to give credit to some of Bill Russell's MVP seasons because he didn't have a PER of 20 (or whatever it was). I'm sure that goes over well on whatever "real basketball site" you choose to hang out on.

What you mean I don't give him credit for his MVP season? He got 5 MVP and those MVP is already calculated in that talent-accomplishment point-system. You might disagree with how I evaluate the point system from a balance perspective, that is irrelevant. It was not intent to be the final solution to the GOAT rank but one that contributes to a rank with the least subjective criteria involved, as much as possible.


We went through this in past threads. Your system got ripped up and down by multiple posters. It surprises me that you still show your face around here.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
Sina
Star Player
Star Player


Joined: 12 Jul 2015
Posts: 1793

PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2016 7:01 am    Post subject:

Kobe is at very least a top 10 player.

In term of talent and achievement, he is a top 5 player, slightly ahead of magic imo.

However, he is not kind of player that never seen before. And it may affect his ranking.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
venturalakersfan
Retired Number
Retired Number


Joined: 14 Apr 2001
Posts: 144432
Location: The Gold Coast

PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2016 8:49 am    Post subject:

activeverb wrote:
MJST wrote:
It's inarguable. Kobe is the greatest Laker of all time, and has passed Magic on the all-time list.


Of course, it's arguable. You could put together a similarly impressive list for Magic.


When TWC counted down the top Laker guards, Kobe was 2nd and Magic was 1st.
_________________
RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
activeverb
Retired Number
Retired Number


Joined: 17 Jun 2006
Posts: 37470

PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2016 8:58 am    Post subject:

venturalakersfan wrote:
activeverb wrote:
MJST wrote:
It's inarguable. Kobe is the greatest Laker of all time, and has passed Magic on the all-time list.


Of course, it's arguable. You could put together a similarly impressive list for Magic.


When TWC counted down the top Laker guards, Kobe was 2nd and Magic was 1st.


I don't think I've ever seen Kobe ranked above Magic on any poll, media list, or list with input from multiple people. On lists of individual Internet posters, it seems to run about 9-1 in Magic's favor.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
greenfrog
Retired Number
Retired Number


Joined: 02 Jan 2011
Posts: 36081
Location: 502 Bad Gateway

PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2016 9:45 am    Post subject:

ducasse wrote:
greenfrog wrote:
Lebron's by far the most difficult to rank because it's not just what he's done but what you expect he will do. I have no doubt when this list is done in another 10 years he'll be top 5.


It's not difficult. Players should be ranked on what they have done up until now, not what you think they might do. Lebron is not top 5 based on what he has done.


You can judge him solely based on the total league dominance of his prime, which I guess is concluded, and still make the case the he's top 5. Depending on what school of thought you subscribe to (some people don't think Sandy Koufax belongs in the Hall of Fame!), longevity totals don't really tell the story about what kind of player you were.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
evetssteve10
Star Player
Star Player


Joined: 10 Nov 2004
Posts: 3099

PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2016 10:16 am    Post subject:

moonriver24 wrote:
business101 wrote:
dmorans1 wrote:
business101 wrote:
dmorans1 wrote:
business101 wrote:
dmorans1 wrote:
business101 wrote:
From a career standpoint, he's 8 on the list. From a pure basketball, talent, and impact wise, he's 12. So I guess they are talking from a pure talent standpoint.


From a talent standpoint there are three players that stand out above the rest, MJ, Kobe, and Kareem. Not sure what the heck you are talking about.

There is nothing unique about Kobe talent.


Irrelevant. Uniqueness has nothing to do with talent.

He is the master of incorporating other skills but yet master of none type of talent. He is not the fastest, doesn't have the greatest vision, not the greatest shot maker or the greatest shooter, nor the greatest athlete. But he works extra hard to make up for what his GOAT peers are naturally born with. So #12 are about right. Most because he didn't have any season which stand out among his GOAT peers. No advance metric to back up his seasonal dominance against his peer. Although I think #11 might be more appropriate. Not a big fan of Big-0 game.


Irrelevant again. So you would pick a guy who is a master at one thing over a guy who is a master in every single aspect of the game?

And what's so wrong about the second part? A guy actually working hard to get where he is today? Man sorry this guy wasn't born to be a 7'2" 350 pound underachieving giant.

I let you what. I rather pick 10 guys over Kobe any day if there is a draft for it. That tell you something. It is not so much as he is good at everything. We know Kobe can do everything. So effectively did that impact the game compare to his GOAT peers is the question you should ask yourself? For instance, 90% of non-Lakers fan would pick Magic over Kobe even though Kobe is a more well, skill player than Magic. What Magic have that nobody can match is his court vision and a feel for the game that is unrivaled. Those two attributions alone are enough to impact the game a lot more than Kobe putting up 40+ppt run. It is fun to watch but not effective for a team.

The shallowness of your preference is easily exposed. Pair Magic with kwame smush odom george mihm atkins vs kobe plus worthy kareem byron etc.

Magic needed great finishers to get his assists. Otherwise he had to be mj or kobe to propel his team to win. Talk about efficiency n effectiveness if magic played with the likes of kwame.



I love how he says 90% of people would pick magic and then proceeds to back it up with not one shred of evidence. I guess I just have no option but to take his word for it!!!
_________________
"Bryant has been the second best player in the NBA for over a decade, but the number 1 player changes every other year. Somehow the number 1 player always seems to fall down the list but Kobe just never moves up. ". The Art of Hating Kobe Bryant
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message AIM Address Reply with quote
evetssteve10
Star Player
Star Player


Joined: 10 Nov 2004
Posts: 3099

PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2016 10:18 am    Post subject:

greenfrog wrote:
ducasse wrote:
greenfrog wrote:
Lebron's by far the most difficult to rank because it's not just what he's done but what you expect he will do. I have no doubt when this list is done in another 10 years he'll be top 5.


It's not difficult. Players should be ranked on what they have done up until now, not what you think they might do. Lebron is not top 5 based on what he has done.


You can judge him solely based on the total league dominance of his prime, which I guess is concluded, and still make the case the he's top 5. Depending on what school of thought you subscribe to (some people don't think Sandy Koufax belongs in the Hall of Fame!), longevity totals don't really tell the story about what kind of player you were.



There is not a single way you can skew the facts in either peak value or longevity that doesn't put Kobe over Lebron in the top 5 let alone putting Kobe at 12. There isn't a single argument that can be made for Kobe being that low
_________________
"Bryant has been the second best player in the NBA for over a decade, but the number 1 player changes every other year. Somehow the number 1 player always seems to fall down the list but Kobe just never moves up. ". The Art of Hating Kobe Bryant
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message AIM Address Reply with quote
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic    LakersGround.net Forum Index -> LA Lakers Lounge All times are GMT - 8 Hours
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3 ... 13, 14, 15 ... 23, 24, 25  Next
Page 14 of 25
Jump to:  

 
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum






Graphics by uberzev
© 1995-2018 LakersGround.net. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy. Terms of Use.
LakersGround is an unofficial news source serving the fan community since 1995.
We are in no way associated with the Los Angeles Lakers or the National Basketball Association.


Powered by phpBB