2016 NBA Draft Brandon Ingram Scouting Report

 
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Mike@LG
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 23, 2016 4:41 pm    Post subject: 2016 NBA Draft Brandon Ingram Scouting Report

I haven't done one of these in a long time. Personally, I don't even think it's finished because Ingram improved dramatically across the board.

I welcome constructive feedback so I can get better at this.

Brandon Ingram

Age: 9/2/1997, 18.5 years old as of March 23rd.
Size: Compares in height and length to: Giannis Antetokoumpo. Giannis was listed by Draftexpress in their 2013 scouting video as 6'9", 196 pounds, 7'3" wingspan.

Brandon Ingram is currently listed as 6'8" w/o shoes, 7'3" wingspan, 196 pounds. He often gets compared to Kevin Durant because of his skinny frame, but he has bulked up to his current 196 pound weight.
Unlike most small forwards, both Ingram and Antetokounmpo have the standing reach of a power forward or center. Ingram has a listed standing reach of 9'1.5", equivalent to Andre Drummond, Steven Adams, and Myles Turner.

General athleticism: I like to breakdown athleticism into multiple categories, directional quickness (first step), lateral quickness, sprint speed, vertical ability, reflexes/timing, and strength.

In terms of athleticism, like Giannis as a rookie, Brandon doesn't have an explosive first step. Often, he'll attack the basket and the defender will be right on his hip or along his side. The defender can wall off dribble penetration relatively easily. Giannis was similar as a raw 18-year old prospect. Both players used long strides to accelerate and attack the hoop, but Ingram doesn't drive downhill in a half-court set unless he has space. Giannis, on the other hand, shows what happens with proper NBA training. Not only does he look quick and fast off-the-dribble, but he can Euro-step with speed and still explode up off of a Euro-step.

Ingram's lateral agility is good, although it may be tough for him to cover quick, stronger prospects such as Kevin Durant, LeBron James, and Paul George. Early on, he'll need to use wingspan and standing reach to add extra space to deny dribble penetration, while being able to contest perimeter shots.

In the open court, Ingram has very good speed. There is a possibility that he can get faster with added strength.
In terms of vertical ability, Ingram has shown that he can actually power up and finish when he gathers up.

With his wingspan, he has more confidence with his ability to finish over defenders. Adding strength only helped his vertical ability. This also shows when he comes to block a shot along the weakside or extend up for rebounds. His hands can often be found near the top of the backboard square, roughly the 11' mark.

Although Ingram is considered very lightweight by NBA standards, he is stronger than most think. He entered his freshman season just above the 170 pound mark, and bulked up to his current 196 pounds. While he is considered light, he has a surprisingly strong base. He does not get pushed around too much and can hold his own in the painted area. If anything, he projects well as a high output rebounder with his given wingspan, length, and current base. He will lapse in terms of boxing out. It seems like half the time, he forgets to just seal off his assignment while going for the rebound. He plays heavy minutes at 34.5 per game, but averages just 7. The physical tools are all there for improvement.

Offensive skill set:


Painted area: When Ingram is able to attack the basket effectively, there are three pet moves he goes to. When he attacks going right, he is able to use his length and finish at the cup. When he attacks going left, his left-handed dribble isn't a lead dribble, but instead, it's protected with his body. Lamar Odom had this same issue going right. Since he doesn't accelerate going left as he does right, he will often pull up for a contested 7' to 10' shot. He clearly has the length and wingspan to shoot over defenders, but a tightly contested shot, especially when the defender is making contact around his base, affects his shot. This is a big reason why his 2-point field goal percentage is 46% and not higher.

His third move is to utilize a spin move. When he feels the defender cut off his initial line to the hoop, he'll make a spin move that puts him right in front of the basket, where he can finish on pure reach alone.

Mid-range to Long 2: As said earlier, he has a limited amount of moves. He has one move that is similar to Kobe Bryant, and it is his most basic move; a jab step into a pull up shot. Ingram's physical tools simply allow him to shoot over ever NCAA SF or PF that is out to defend him. With the extra bit of space after a jab step, he can get his shot off. If a defender bites on a fake, he'll go straight into his dribble penetration move. See above.

3-point range:
Right now, he is a flat out spot up shooter. He isn't too comfortable shooting the ball off-the-dribble from extended range. Throughout the season, his shot pocket has altered slightly, raising up and leading to a higher release point. Before, the release point would have his arm at a 45* angle. Now? It's more like 50*, with full follow through. His 3-point percentage went up as the season progressed, and instead of being a mid-30% shooter, he is now up to 41.6%, excellent at the NCAA level.

Playmaking: Ingram is an average playmaker right now. He is unselfish with the basketball, but has a good understanding of when the team needs him to score. Grayson Allen is the #1 option for Duke, but Ingram likes to isolate on the left side of the floor in high post position or in a face up position to create a shot. He understands the upside of advancing the ball up in transition and kicking out to shooters. A bit more time is needed to find open players in post position, but a borderline A/TO of 1:1 is indicative of solid hoop IQ. He is advanced by age considering he is the age of a HS senior.

Defensive skill set:


If there was one way to define how he plays defense, it's very simple. He's getting by on basic defensive IQ and all of his phyiscal tools.
Laterally, he moves well, But as mentioned earlier, he needs to back up a bit to deny dribble penetration. When his opponent attacks the basket, he has issues keeping up, and his lack of upper body strength gets him out of position. The man attacking the basket can shed him off a bit with a shoulder bump, a strength and balance issue.

Under the rim, he does a fair job of rim protection. He's not the type that will cut across the key and gather up for a weakside block. With modern NCAA rules, he can sit in the paint and jump up vertically for the swat.
Considering his athletic ability and defensive tools, he is definitely more mindful of protecting the rim than stealing the basketball along the perimeter. He has played at the top of a 3-2 zone, man-to-man defense, and underneath the hoop. Further development is needed in regards to handling perimeter players and denying dribble penetration as well as passing lanes.

When someone squares up to shoot, Ingram is great at chasing down and contesting the shot without fouling.

Rebounding:


There are rebounders, there are guys that get rebounds, and there are guys that have rebounds fall to them. Unfortunately, Ingram is of the latter, not the former. He has an average rebound rate of nearly 7 per game with 34.5 minutes of play. That is just above average for a power forward, but as mentioned earlier, could easily become 10-12rpg given his physical tools. His base is stronger than expected. He has excellent reach. He has a solid vertical, and can explode up when he's on the run. Ideally, he would be like having a 3rd bigman rebounder in the front line, especially with his standing reach and athletic ability.

Conclusion:

Brandon Ingram is a player of tremendous upside. He may not have the hype of Ben Simmons or Andrew Wiggins, but he does a lot with his basic skill level. Usually, that is a foundation of someone indicative of a tremendous upside. With those basic skills, he is already the 2nd leading scorer for Duke and maximizes his effectiveness mostly as a scorer, but also as a rebounder and interior defender.

What kind of player could he be in the future? It could go several ways. While he compares size-wise to Antetokounmpo, they have very different styles of basketball skills. Giannis was essentially a point forward out of Greece that loved to attack the hoop. He looked like a guy that had never seen a gym before.

Ingram, on the other hand, already has shown range, basic moves to become an effective scorer, and already bulked up to his curent 196 pound weight. How much more weight can he add on early in his career? Will it add more athleticism as well? I'm not a kinesiology major, but I do know that every player's body takes weight training differently. Antetokoumpo is completely transformed. It also helps to have the hands the size of a center. Ingram may not have as much of an effect.
But, if Ingram is able to gain up to 80% of Giannis' athletic ability, develop a few counters along the perimeter, and have a better idea of how to play the perimeter defensively, he can become a matchup nightmare for NBA teams.
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70sdude
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 24, 2016 9:12 am    Post subject:

Thanks for the considerable time, thought and effort you put into this.

I think you described him rather well. He's come on fast this season and he is an unusual physical being too.

I'd add that his play demonstrates something that's hard to label quickly in terms of strictly either "General athleticism" or "IQ" but reflects to some degree a lot of each.

John Wooden called a player "balanced, centered when playing under control at full speed" when the player used excellent body control in any particular activity. I think some of that is physical and some is either hoops IQ or recognition of one's limits. Instinct maybe.

I think Ingram has shown a lot of this for somene just eighteen and a half years old. Jamaal Wilkes had heaps of this early on too: rarely stumbling, tripping, goofy-flailing or falling but nearly always moving at very high rates of speed with a recognizable level of control, grace, continuity, placement. It suggests something about having a feel for the game and his physicality and high ability - to me.
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 25, 2016 11:04 am    Post subject:

Great post, Mike! Really appreciate your analysis.
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 25, 2016 3:05 pm    Post subject:

Mike, what's the ideal offense you'd envision for Ingram, Russell, Randle, and Clarkson together?
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 25, 2016 6:37 pm    Post subject:

MelJBB wrote:
Mike, what's the ideal offense you'd envision for Ingram, Russell, Randle, and Clarkson together?


The Princeton 😂😂😂
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 25, 2016 7:34 pm    Post subject:

22 wrote:
MelJBB wrote:
Mike, what's the ideal offense you'd envision for Ingram, Russell, Randle, and Clarkson together?


The Princeton 😂😂😂


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XbGE2RIB3bs&index=16&list=PL427E196AFC293754

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cv_oVBqEOrs&list=PL427E196AFC293754&index=17

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yjhId_4t9cA&list=PL427E196AFC293754&index=18

https://youtu.be/-0SXPZUeL08?list=PL427E196AFC293754

It wouldn't be that bad.
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2016 6:45 pm    Post subject:

Just wanted a reference point.

Goldenthroat write:

One note before you read this list...BPM overvalues low usage players. In college, those are almost always defensive oriented bigs. So keep that in mind if guys like WCS, Zeller, or Adams make you scratch your head.

Freshman Year BPMs of Notable NBA Players + '16 Prospects (only available since 2010-11)

Anthony Davis.......+18.7
Karl Towns............+17.3
Joel Embiid...........+14.9
Willie Cauley-Stein.+14.7
Nerlens Noel.........+14.6
Kyrie Irving..........+14.3
Cody Zeller...........+12.5
Marcus Smart.......+12.0
Steven Adams......+11.9
D'Angelo Russell....+11.7
Ben Simmons.....+11.6
Tristan Thompson..+11.1
Jahlil Okafor..........+10.9
Jakob Poeltl........+10.7
Deyonta Davis....+10.7
Justise Winslow.....+10.4
Ben McLemore......+10.2
Stanley Johnson....+10.2
Aaron Gordon.........+9.6
Otto Porter.............+9.3
Michael Kidd-Gil......+9.1
Jared Sullinger........+9.1
Jamal Murray.......+9.1
Devin Booker..........+8.9
Trey Lyles...............+8.9
Ivan Rabb..............+8.8
Myles Turner...........+8.7
Bradley Beal...........+8.6
Andrew Wiggins......+8.5
Anthony Bennett.....+8.5
Gary Harris.............+8.3
Michael Carter-Will...+8.2
Jeremy Lamb...........+8.2
Cory Joseph............+7.7
Brandon Ingram...+7.5
Harrison Barnes.......+7.4
Julius Randle...........+7.1
Terrence Ross..........+7.0
Jabari Parker...........+6.6
Victor Oladipo.........+6.6
Frank Kaminsky.......+6.5
Kentavious Pope......+6.3
Andre Drummond....+6.0
Brandon Knight.......+5.9
Buddy Hield............+5.8
Trey Burke..............+5.6
Dion Waiters...........+5.6
Tobias Harris...........+5.5
Skal Labissiere.....+5.2
Kris Dunn.............+4.2
Alex Len.................+3.8
Will Barton..............+3.8
Austin Rivers...........+3.7
Rodney Hood..........+3.5
Zach Lavine............+3.5
Kendall Marshall......+3.5
Jaylen Brown.......+3.5
Henry Ellenson.....+3.5
Shabazz Muham......+2.7
Cameron Payne.......+2.0
Demetrius Jacksn.+0.7
Jordan Clarkson.......-0.4
Meyers Leonard.......-0.9
Elfrid Payton............-1.7
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2016 7:57 pm    Post subject:

Mike@LG wrote:
22 wrote:
MelJBB wrote:
Mike, what's the ideal offense you'd envision for Ingram, Russell, Randle, and Clarkson together?


The Princeton 😂😂😂


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XbGE2RIB3bs&index=16&list=PL427E196AFC293754

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cv_oVBqEOrs&list=PL427E196AFC293754&index=17

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yjhId_4t9cA&list=PL427E196AFC293754&index=18

https://youtu.be/-0SXPZUeL08?list=PL427E196AFC293754

It wouldn't be that bad.


All we'd need is a legit sized center who can shoot from outside, fire pinpoint passes from the top of the key, and handle the ball. Those grow on trees right?

(Not trying to be antagonistic. Just not a fan of the Princeton.)
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 18, 2016 10:19 pm    Post subject:

Should do a Ben Simmons report
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 19, 2016 1:15 pm    Post subject:

dcarter4kobe wrote:
Should do a Ben Simmons report


Thanks for the suggestion. I'll need to isolate a huge block of time to do it, but I want to.
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 16, 2016 10:09 am    Post subject:

thanks Mike! I really value your input.
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 16, 2016 11:04 am    Post subject:

Thanks Mike.

How does he compare to Rashard Lewis?
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 07, 2016 7:03 am    Post subject:

Fan0Bynum17 wrote:
Thanks Mike.

How does he compare to Rashard Lewis?


Rashard Lewis was more raw out of HS. Brandon Ingram does a lot more off the dribble, especially in terms of shot creation. Rashard played a lot of C out of HS, so he had to transition into a PF/SF quickly. All of that was based around his jumpshot.

Ingram, on the other hand, has the jumpshot, as well as some slashing ability to go with it. While the skills are relatively limited, he is highly effective with his moves.
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2017 5:37 pm    Post subject:

This was pretty much spot on Mike. Good (bleep)
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2017 6:10 pm    Post subject:

tox wrote:
This was pretty much spot on Mike. Good (bleep)


Planning to do more of these this season.

Just a matter of time, timing, and energy.

Appreciate the compliment.
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2017 9:15 am    Post subject:

Mike, could you do a season wrap up of Ingram too?
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2017 6:19 pm    Post subject:

yinoma2001 wrote:
Mike, could you do a season wrap up of Ingram too?


Will do. I'll try to find the correlation between this scouting report and how the season ended.

Just working on a few projects right now.
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LAL ended w 3 of 4 guys of my '17 Draft list.

My summer league spirit player is Brady Heslip.

https://hoop-math.com/
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