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pio2u Retired Number
Joined: 26 Dec 2012 Posts: 54519
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Golden_Emperor_24K Star Player
Joined: 23 Nov 2008 Posts: 3480
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Posted: Thu Feb 16, 2017 9:51 am Post subject: |
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it's simple Luke
Dlo
Nick Young or JC, i don't mind
Ingram
Nance
Zubac
move randle and jc for a stretch 4 or a defensive anchor. |
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pmacla Star Player
Joined: 31 Aug 2012 Posts: 7849 Location: Los Angeles, CA
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Posted: Thu Feb 16, 2017 10:05 am Post subject: |
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I am assuming we are trading Lou if so
Start
Dlo
Nick
Ingram
Nance
Zubac
bench
JC
Deng
Randle- can replace Lou as primary scorer off bench
Black
we dont need 10 man rotation 9 is fine split the minutes at PG/SG between DLo nick and JC |
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Villain6Activated Star Player
Joined: 22 Dec 2011 Posts: 6697
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Posted: Thu Feb 16, 2017 10:17 am Post subject: |
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Golden_Emperor_24K wrote: |
it's simple Luke
Dlo
Nick Young or JC, i don't mind
Ingram
Nance
Zubac
move randle and jc for a stretch 4 or a defensive anchor. |
If I was Mitch, I would call to see the value for Randle. I wouldn't prefer a Randle trade and I actually have some faith in him but at this point, it's worth a shot to see what we could get for him |
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justsomelakerfan Franchise Player
Joined: 16 Jul 2016 Posts: 10939
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pmacla Star Player
Joined: 31 Aug 2012 Posts: 7849 Location: Los Angeles, CA
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Posted: Thu Feb 16, 2017 11:16 am Post subject: |
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Luke is a true rookie head coach, he too will have growing pains as we have seen, remember he has never been a head coach at any level before this and definitely never had to develop young guys as tasked with here also
My hope is he develops into a top coach and is here for 15 years or whenever he wants to stop coaching |
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justsomelakerfan Franchise Player
Joined: 16 Jul 2016 Posts: 10939
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Posted: Thu Feb 16, 2017 11:40 am Post subject: |
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pmacla wrote: | Luke is a true rookie head coach, he too will have growing pains as we have seen, remember he has never been a head coach at any level before this and definitely never had to develop young guys as tasked with here also
My hope is he develops into a top coach and is here for 15 years or whenever he wants to stop coaching |
Do adult brains develop like 20 year old basketball players? It's not like we're waiting for his brain to fill out in a couple years.
Also I have no idea what I'm talking about regarding Luke and I will be the first person to admit that. I would love for him to become our coach for a long time, I was so excited about his hire. I'm just looking at our scores on offense and feeling bummed out. Maybe he's better than what we're seeing. I get he's trying to install complexity within the offense and all, but is he getting through to his players? Don't good coaches get the best out of his players? Some guys are having career years, but the kids who matter haven't really taken big steps forward (outside for Julius in terms of his approach on offense). Would we have been better off getting an experienced coach who knows what he's doing to develop young guys who are crucial to our future? _________________ Austin Reaves
Tweeter: @sarah_dotbiz |
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AC Green's V-Card Star Player
Joined: 09 Aug 2012 Posts: 3063
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Posted: Sat Feb 18, 2017 1:50 pm Post subject: |
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MJST wrote: | The point is to try to win every game. When you start pulling moves to intentionally start losing you make it part of your culture. That is NOTHING the Lakers are about to introduce to their culture. |
I've seen this posted a lot, but I can't agree with it one bit. At the end of 2012, the Warriors had a Top 7 protected pick and pulled moves which would make Sam Hinkie shed tears of tanking joy.
Here's a primer if you don't recall:
Quote: | The Golden State Warriors launched one of the most egregious tanking campaigns in recent NBA history last year.
They were 18-21 — the third-worst record in the conference — with 26 games left when they completely and willfully collapsed.
They traded Monta Ellis for an injured Andrew Bogut, shut down Stephen Curry for the season, and benched David Lee with an ambiguous-sounding injury in the final weeks.
They went 5-22 to end the year. |
http://www.businessinsider.com/golden-state-warriors-nba-tanking-2013-5
David Lee, Steph Curry, Andrew Bogut, Klay Thompson, and Brandon Rush were all on that '12 tank team. Did they suddenly forget how to play basketball and inherit a losing culture for the rest of their careers? I think their championship rings might say otherwise. |
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ringfinger Retired Number
Joined: 08 Oct 2013 Posts: 29418
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Posted: Sat Feb 18, 2017 2:18 pm Post subject: |
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AC Green's V-Card wrote: | MJST wrote: | The point is to try to win every game. When you start pulling moves to intentionally start losing you make it part of your culture. That is NOTHING the Lakers are about to introduce to their culture. |
I've seen this posted a lot, but I can't agree with it one bit. At the end of 2012, the Warriors had a Top 7 protected pick and pulled moves which would make Sam Hinkie shed tears of tanking joy.
Here's a primer if you don't recall:
Quote: | The Golden State Warriors launched one of the most egregious tanking campaigns in recent NBA history last year.
They were 18-21 — the third-worst record in the conference — with 26 games left when they completely and willfully collapsed.
They traded Monta Ellis for an injured Andrew Bogut, shut down Stephen Curry for the season, and benched David Lee with an ambiguous-sounding injury in the final weeks.
They went 5-22 to end the year. |
http://www.businessinsider.com/golden-state-warriors-nba-tanking-2013-5
David Lee, Steph Curry, Andrew Bogut, Klay Thompson, and Brandon Rush were all on that '12 tank team. Did they suddenly forget how to play basketball and inherit a losing culture for the rest of their careers? I think their championship rings might say otherwise. |
I think you missed the point. The concept isn't that if you do it once, you're automatically banished as a cellar dweller forever.
The idea is that the more often you allow losing to be an acceptable part of your culture, the more likely that losing will become part of your culture. |
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pio2u Retired Number
Joined: 26 Dec 2012 Posts: 54519
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Posted: Sat Feb 18, 2017 3:37 pm Post subject: |
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Luke Walton handling closeout time differently for Brandon Ingram, D’Angelo Russell
Quote: | The Lakers have seen him both grow and shrink. But lately, Lakers rookie forward Brandon Ingram has mostly stayed on the court in crunch time so he can fully blossom.
The Lakers have seen him show both flashes of greatness and inconsistency. But lately, Lakers second-year guard D’Angelo Russell has mostly sat on the bench without an opportunity to provide a happy ending.
While Ingram and Russell might represent two key pieces of the Lakers’ young core, they also represent contrasting views on how Lakers coach Luke Walton wants to develop them. |
http://bleacherreport.com/tb/dcf8h?utm_source=newsletter&utm_medium=newsletter&utm_campaign=los-angeles-lakers |
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pio2u Retired Number
Joined: 26 Dec 2012 Posts: 54519
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Posted: Sat Feb 18, 2017 3:39 pm Post subject: |
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Luke Walton Believes ‘Consistency Isn’t There Yet’ For D’Angelo Russell, Brandon Ingram
Quote: | “They’re both progressing and getting better, but the consistency isn’t there yet,” Lakers coach Luke Walton said. “That’s one of the hardest things to get in this league.”
Walton understands that being consistently great is extremely difficult, especially for young players, and that’s why he maintains hope in his young guys, noting that everyone figures it out at their own pace. |
http://www.lakersnation.com/luke-walton-believes-consistency-isnt-there-yet-for-dangelo-russell-brandon-ingram/2017/02/18/ |
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kikanga Retired Number
Joined: 15 Sep 2012 Posts: 29150 Location: La La Land
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Posted: Sat Feb 18, 2017 8:47 pm Post subject: |
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pio2u wrote: | Luke Walton Believes ‘Consistency Isn’t There Yet’ For D’Angelo Russell, Brandon Ingram
Quote: | “They’re both progressing and getting better, but the consistency isn’t there yet,” Lakers coach Luke Walton said. “That’s one of the hardest things to get in this league.”
Walton understands that being consistently great is extremely difficult, especially for young players, and that’s why he maintains hope in his young guys, noting that everyone figures it out at their own pace. |
http://www.lakersnation.com/luke-walton-believes-consistency-isnt-there-yet-for-dangelo-russell-brandon-ingram/2017/02/18/ |
All the good-great veteran players talk about their in-season "routine". It's not just about the 2-3 hours of game time they have on certain days throughout the season. But the other 20+ hours a day. Doing the little things to be physically and mentally prepared for all 82 games. Ice baths, nutrition, sleep schedule, customized weight lifting regimen, mental awareness when reviewing film, drills and stretching leading up to game time. Alot of factors. Takes a while to figure out the right schedule or "routine". And each player figures it out at their own pace.
Those little things are important if you want to be consistent on the floor. _________________ "Every hurt is a lesson, and every lesson makes you better” |
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AC Green's V-Card Star Player
Joined: 09 Aug 2012 Posts: 3063
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Posted: Sun Feb 19, 2017 2:24 pm Post subject: |
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ringfinger wrote: | The idea is that the more often you allow losing to be an acceptable part of your culture, the more likely that losing will become part of your culture. |
Bad players and/or bad coaching will turn a winning culture into a losing team.
Good players and/or good coaching will turn a losing culture into a winning team.
Just look at the Wizards' season records since 2008-09.
2008 - 19-63 (Good players, bad coaches -- Jordan/Tapscott)
2009 - 26-56 (Good players, hire bad coach -- Flip Saunders, Arenas gun incident)
2010 - 23-59 (Wall's rookie year)
2011 - 20-46 (Fire Flip Saunders)
2012 - 29-54 (Beal's rookie year, hire Randy Wittman)
2013 - 44-38 (Porter's rookie year, Acquire Gortat, make playoffs)
2014 - 46-36 (Make playoffs)
2015 - 41-41 (Acquire Markieff Morris, miss playoffs, fire Wittman)
2016 - 34-21 (Scott Brooks' first year as coach -- 3rd place in east)
The Wizards developed their young players, made shrewd veteran acquisitions at affordable prices, and have upgraded their coaches from Eddie Jordan to Flip Saundes to Randy Wittman to Scott Brooks.
You can grow out of being the cellar dweller even if the young players were on crappy teams for multiple seasons. John Wall is still great despite the 'losing culture' that was there when he joined the team 7 years ago. And there are many more examples than just the Wizards.
It's my belief the Lakers are in a better position than the Wizards because Luke Walton can and will be a solid coach moving forward. But trading away Lou Williams and/or Nick Young to keep our protected pick will not build a losing culture with any sort of permanence. |
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MJST Retired Number
Joined: 06 Jul 2014 Posts: 26082
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Posted: Sun Feb 19, 2017 2:38 pm Post subject: |
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Injuries effected those numbers too. |
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Tony Anapolis Star Player
Joined: 05 Jan 2015 Posts: 3331
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Posted: Sun Feb 19, 2017 2:41 pm Post subject: |
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First off I want to say I love Luke Walton. That said, Byron got alot of flack for not playing the young players more. Luke has played Russell even less than Scott did. He plays Randle the same amount of time. Neither of them play in the 4th quarters.
What do people feel about this? |
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JeezyXVII Star Player
Joined: 07 Jul 2014 Posts: 1835
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Posted: Tue Feb 21, 2017 10:55 am Post subject: |
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Lukes probably thinking what the hell did I get myself into ?!?
I left a championship team with structure from top to bottom in the FO to return to LA and deal with a young team and a headless FO. |
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justsomelakerfan Franchise Player
Joined: 16 Jul 2016 Posts: 10939
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Posted: Tue Feb 21, 2017 10:55 am Post subject: |
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JeezyXVII wrote: | Lukes probably thinking what the hell did I get myself into ?!?
I left a championship team with structure from top to bottom in the FO to return to LA and deal with a young team and a headless FO. |
I feel so bad for him. The people who hired him are now fired. His job is vulnerable a lot sooner than he imagined. Not talking this year, but if there's another losing season, who's in charge of him? Who didn't hire him...? _________________ Austin Reaves
Tweeter: @sarah_dotbiz |
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Username Star Player
Joined: 22 Apr 2004 Posts: 4718 Location: Out There
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Posted: Tue Feb 21, 2017 10:57 am Post subject: |
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Tony Anapolis wrote: | First off I want to say I love Luke Walton. That said, Byron got alot of flack for not playing the young players more. Luke has played Russell even less than Scott did. He plays Randle the same amount of time. Neither of them play in the 4th quarters.
What do people feel about this? |
Maybe it takes a second coach coming in and seeing the same thing for people to eventually realize these young guys aren't as good – yet – as they think. |
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2019 Franchise Player
Joined: 03 Dec 2014 Posts: 10786
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Posted: Tue Feb 21, 2017 10:57 am Post subject: |
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justsomelakerfan wrote: | JeezyXVII wrote: | Lukes probably thinking what the hell did I get myself into ?!?
I left a championship team with structure from top to bottom in the FO to return to LA and deal with a young team and a headless FO. |
I feel so bad for him. The people who hired him are now fired. His job is vulnerable a lot sooner than he imagined. Not talking this year, but if there's another losing season, who's in charge of him? Who didn't hire him...? |
and the people who are now in charge completely trust him and love him so much so they said they want him part of the rebuilding efforts along with Magic. |
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justsomelakerfan Franchise Player
Joined: 16 Jul 2016 Posts: 10939
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Posted: Tue Feb 21, 2017 11:03 am Post subject: |
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2019 wrote: | justsomelakerfan wrote: | JeezyXVII wrote: | Lukes probably thinking what the hell did I get myself into ?!?
I left a championship team with structure from top to bottom in the FO to return to LA and deal with a young team and a headless FO. |
I feel so bad for him. The people who hired him are now fired. His job is vulnerable a lot sooner than he imagined. Not talking this year, but if there's another losing season, who's in charge of him? Who didn't hire him...? |
and the people who are now in charge completely trust him and love him so much so they said they want him part of the rebuilding efforts along with Magic. |
Everything is fine now until there's another losing season... _________________ Austin Reaves
Tweeter: @sarah_dotbiz |
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Villain6Activated Star Player
Joined: 22 Dec 2011 Posts: 6697
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Posted: Tue Feb 21, 2017 12:00 pm Post subject: |
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How is the Magic Johnson and Luke Walton relationship? I want to know how much say Luke is going to have on the basketball decisions and how much faith Magic has in Luke |
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dcarter4kobe Franchise Player
Joined: 30 Jul 2005 Posts: 17656
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Posted: Wed Feb 22, 2017 6:35 am Post subject: |
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Will be interesting to see what is Luke's new rotation now w/o Lou. _________________ "He's a Zen master, so he can speak to you, and he doesn't need a microphone; you can hear him in your head, 'Ron, don't shoot, don't shoot.' Whatever, pow, three. I love the Zen, though." |
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dcarter4kobe Franchise Player
Joined: 30 Jul 2005 Posts: 17656
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Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2017 8:34 pm Post subject: |
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Am I the only person that finds it weird that BShaw has been "sick" for almost 2 weeks? _________________ "He's a Zen master, so he can speak to you, and he doesn't need a microphone; you can hear him in your head, 'Ron, don't shoot, don't shoot.' Whatever, pow, three. I love the Zen, though." |
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ringfinger Retired Number
Joined: 08 Oct 2013 Posts: 29418
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Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2017 8:42 pm Post subject: |
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AC Green's V-Card wrote: | ringfinger wrote: | The idea is that the more often you allow losing to be an acceptable part of your culture, the more likely that losing will become part of your culture. |
Bad players and/or bad coaching will turn a winning culture into a losing team.
Good players and/or good coaching will turn a losing culture into a winning team.
Just look at the Wizards' season records since 2008-09.
2008 - 19-63 (Good players, bad coaches -- Jordan/Tapscott)
2009 - 26-56 (Good players, hire bad coach -- Flip Saunders, Arenas gun incident)
2010 - 23-59 (Wall's rookie year)
2011 - 20-46 (Fire Flip Saunders)
2012 - 29-54 (Beal's rookie year, hire Randy Wittman)
2013 - 44-38 (Porter's rookie year, Acquire Gortat, make playoffs)
2014 - 46-36 (Make playoffs)
2015 - 41-41 (Acquire Markieff Morris, miss playoffs, fire Wittman)
2016 - 34-21 (Scott Brooks' first year as coach -- 3rd place in east)
The Wizards developed their young players, made shrewd veteran acquisitions at affordable prices, and have upgraded their coaches from Eddie Jordan to Flip Saundes to Randy Wittman to Scott Brooks.
You can grow out of being the cellar dweller even if the young players were on crappy teams for multiple seasons. John Wall is still great despite the 'losing culture' that was there when he joined the team 7 years ago. And there are many more examples than just the Wizards.
It's my belief the Lakers are in a better position than the Wizards because Luke Walton can and will be a solid coach moving forward. But trading away Lou Williams and/or Nick Young to keep our protected pick will not build a losing culture with any sort of permanence. |
The Wizards are your example of what a winning culture looks like? That's odd, no? |
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tnell Star Player
Joined: 23 Jun 2011 Posts: 3185 Location: Over the River And Through The Woods
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Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2017 8:42 pm Post subject: |
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dcarter4kobe wrote: | Am I the only person that finds it weird that BShaw has been "sick" for almost 2 weeks? |
This crossed my mind earlier. Hope it isn't anything serious. |
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