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Vancouver Fan
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Joined: 17 Apr 2006
Posts: 17740
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 Posted: Mon Apr 25, 2016 4:49 pm Post subject: Re: The Lakers fired the wrong guys |
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| USCandLakers wrote: | | Vancouver Fan wrote: | | USCandLakers wrote: | | Vancouver Fan wrote: | | USCandLakers wrote: | | Vancouver Fan wrote: | | All_Star_Laker wrote: | | USCandLakers wrote: | | Yet, if it were up to Mitch, we'd have Carmelo right now. |
oh come on, Mitch is top 5 GM in this league easily. prob top 3. |
If Mitch were let go, he'd have no problem finding work for 29 other teams. Believe that. |
Take him. |
Absolutely not. We got him. What's your solution? Phil. Yikes. |
My solution is to get this man that clearly doesn't know what he's doing and has no plan the hell out of our front office.
Despite what you believe, no, it can't get much worse. There is nothing to set back to. There is no plan underway that is currently being enacted, there is just luck, and the wishing for it. Wishing for luck in the draft and wishing for luck in free agency. Wishing for a top 3 pick. Wishing for Durant. Last season we were wishing for a top 5 pick and wishing for LMA. The season before that, wishing for luck in the draft, wishing for Melo.
But apparently, getting rid of this man is going to set us back.
As if. |
I think the plan is pretty obvious imo. It just seems you don't like it. Which is cool too. |
With our last 3 coaching hires in mind, what would you say is the system and style of basketball we're trying to play going forward? |
With MDA, I think the doc wanted some.exciting ball with the acquisition of Nash and Dwight before he passed. With Byron, again, imo, it was more of a way to get a coach Kobe approved of during his last hurrah. I've never been on record for praising the FO's coaching hires. If there is one thing to knock, coaching hires are it. However, when it comes to drafting and trades. Mitch is that dude, imo.
Where our team currently is, young with lots of potential, I think you'll get a clearer picture of what style of basketball we'll play going forward. Kobe retiring is a huge factor as well.
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Last edited by Vancouver Fan on Mon Apr 25, 2016 4:54 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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akk7
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Joined: 15 Oct 2005
Posts: 3013
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| Posted: Mon Apr 25, 2016 4:49 pm Post subject: Re: The Lakers fired the wrong guys |
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| USCandLakers wrote: | | Vancouver Fan wrote: | | USCandLakers wrote: | | Vancouver Fan wrote: | | All_Star_Laker wrote: | | USCandLakers wrote: | | Yet, if it were up to Mitch, we'd have Carmelo right now. |
oh come on, Mitch is top 5 GM in this league easily. prob top 3. |
If Mitch were let go, he'd have no problem finding work for 29 other teams. Believe that. |
Take him. |
Absolutely not. We got him. What's your solution? Phil. Yikes. |
My solution is to get this man that clearly doesn't know what he's doing and has no plan the hell out of our front office.
Despite what you believe, no, it can't get much worse. There is nothing to set back to. There is no plan underway that is currently being enacted, there is just luck, and the wishing for it. Wishing for luck in the draft and wishing for luck in free agency. Wishing for a top 3 pick. Wishing for Durant. Last season we were wishing for a top 5 pick and wishing for LMA. The season before that, wishing for luck in the draft, wishing for Melo.
But apparently, getting rid of this man is going to set us back.
As if. |
How does this man not know what he's doing?
You know he did a great job building a championship roster around Kobe not too long ago right? He also pulled off getting CP3, but unfortunately something uncontrollable happened. He had a vision of Kobe, Dwight, and CP3 and he executed it. That man definitely has no idea what he's doing.
They went all in to contend with Kobe's waning prime. It didn't work out and after that they had to rebuild. Tough to rebuild with the contract (which I believe was a good move). It depends on what reports you believe, it was Jeanie's call, it was Mitch/Jim's call, etc, but overall it doesn't matter to me. Thought it was a good move.
Now during these rebuilding years, they've set up a boatload of cap space with young talent. On top of that I don't think this performance incentive type contract and being able to get out of it corresponding with Kobe's contract ending was a coincidence.
Sure, there have been missteps, but there has been a lot of good too in this rebuilding phase.
Now most important what would you have done these past few years. You seem to have the answers in every post and I'm seriously curious on your perspective |
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44TheLogo
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Joined: 21 Feb 2009
Posts: 6364
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| Posted: Mon Apr 25, 2016 4:52 pm Post subject: Re: The Lakers fired the wrong guys |
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| USCandLakers wrote: | | Vancouver Fan wrote: | | USCandLakers wrote: | | Vancouver Fan wrote: | | All_Star_Laker wrote: | | USCandLakers wrote: | | Yet, if it were up to Mitch, we'd have Carmelo right now. |
oh come on, Mitch is top 5 GM in this league easily. prob top 3. |
If Mitch were let go, he'd have no problem finding work for 29 other teams. Believe that. |
Take him. |
Absolutely not. We got him. What's your solution? Phil. Yikes. |
My solution is to get this man that clearly doesn't know what he's doing and has no plan the hell out of our front office.
Despite what you believe, no, it can't get much worse. There is nothing to set back to. There is no plan underway that is currently being enacted, there is just luck, and the wishing for it. Wishing for luck in the draft and wishing for luck in free agency. Wishing for a top 3 pick. Wishing for Durant. Last season we were wishing for a top 5 pick and wishing for LMA. The season before that, wishing for luck in the draft, wishing for Melo.
But apparently, getting rid of this man is going to set us back.
As if. |
wait so trying to acquire players through the draft or free agency aren't legitimate? the only other way to get a player is through trades. how exactly do you want us to get players if you are not down with going after players through the draft or FA?
wtf? |
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tox
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Joined: 16 Nov 2015
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| Posted: Mon Apr 25, 2016 4:56 pm Post subject: |
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Keep dodging the question of the Nets --- a clear example of how you can be worse off than the Lakers are right now.
22 wins > 17 wins amirite? |
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sogood.
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| Posted: Mon Apr 25, 2016 5:06 pm Post subject: |
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| Can Oram permanently replace Worthy? |
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USCandLakers
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Joined: 13 Mar 2008
Posts: 19955
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| Posted: Mon Apr 25, 2016 5:06 pm Post subject: Re: The Lakers fired the wrong guys |
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| 44TheLogo wrote: | | USCandLakers wrote: | | Vancouver Fan wrote: | | USCandLakers wrote: | | Vancouver Fan wrote: | | All_Star_Laker wrote: | | USCandLakers wrote: | | Yet, if it were up to Mitch, we'd have Carmelo right now. |
oh come on, Mitch is top 5 GM in this league easily. prob top 3. |
If Mitch were let go, he'd have no problem finding work for 29 other teams. Believe that. |
Take him. |
Absolutely not. We got him. What's your solution? Phil. Yikes. |
My solution is to get this man that clearly doesn't know what he's doing and has no plan the hell out of our front office.
Despite what you believe, no, it can't get much worse. There is nothing to set back to. There is no plan underway that is currently being enacted, there is just luck, and the wishing for it. Wishing for luck in the draft and wishing for luck in free agency. Wishing for a top 3 pick. Wishing for Durant. Last season we were wishing for a top 5 pick and wishing for LMA. The season before that, wishing for luck in the draft, wishing for Melo.
But apparently, getting rid of this man is going to set us back.
As if. |
wait so trying to acquire players through the draft or free agency aren't legitimate? the only other way to get a player is through trades. how exactly do you want us to get players if you are not down with going after players through the draft or FA?
what the heck? |
You think selling a superstar free agent entering the tail end of their prime a 20 win team is legitimate? And you thinking banking your entire free agents plans on this event(which one can only describe as a miracle) happening is legitimate?
You would think a 30 year old star player looking to win a ring isn't about to sign onto a (bleep) 21 win team that would be capped out after they signed you.
Think about this. We are about to do the same exact thing that we failed miserably at the past 3 years again. Sell Durant on a 17 win team.
If you think this is how championship teams are formed, well, I can see why you would defend Mitch Kupchak.
He's had it good his entire career with Kobe Bryant. That ended in 2013 when, ironically, Kobe was injured trying to will another one of his poorly constructed teams into the playoffs.
Now he's showing that he indeed does not know what he's doing. You're about to lure a superstar away from a contending team with his superstar teammate with a damn 17 win team and a couple of second year players. This is nonsense.
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Vancouver Fan
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Joined: 17 Apr 2006
Posts: 17740
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| Posted: Mon Apr 25, 2016 5:11 pm Post subject: Re: The Lakers fired the wrong guys |
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| USCandLakers wrote: | | 44TheLogo wrote: | | USCandLakers wrote: | | Vancouver Fan wrote: | | USCandLakers wrote: | | Vancouver Fan wrote: | | All_Star_Laker wrote: | | USCandLakers wrote: | | Yet, if it were up to Mitch, we'd have Carmelo right now. |
oh come on, Mitch is top 5 GM in this league easily. prob top 3. |
If Mitch were let go, he'd have no problem finding work for 29 other teams. Believe that. |
Take him. |
Absolutely not. We got him. What's your solution? Phil. Yikes. |
My solution is to get this man that clearly doesn't know what he's doing and has no plan the hell out of our front office.
Despite what you believe, no, it can't get much worse. There is nothing to set back to. There is no plan underway that is currently being enacted, there is just luck, and the wishing for it. Wishing for luck in the draft and wishing for luck in free agency. Wishing for a top 3 pick. Wishing for Durant. Last season we were wishing for a top 5 pick and wishing for LMA. The season before that, wishing for luck in the draft, wishing for Melo.
But apparently, getting rid of this man is going to set us back.
As if. |
wait so trying to acquire players through the draft or free agency aren't legitimate? the only other way to get a player is through trades. how exactly do you want us to get players if you are not down with going after players through the draft or FA?
what the heck? |
You think selling a superstar free agent entering the tail end of their prime a 20 win team is legitimate? And you thinking banking your entire free agents plans on this event(which one can only describe as a miracle) happening is legitimate?
You would think a 30 year old star player looking to win a ring isn't about to sign onto a (bleep) 21 win team that would be capped out after they signed you.
Think about this. We are about to do the same exact thing that we failed miserably at the past 3 years again. Sell Durant on a 17 win team.
If you think this is how championship teams are formed, well, I can see why you would defend Mitch Kupchak.
He's had it good his entire career with Kobe Bryant. That ended in 2013 when, ironically, Kobe was injured trying to will another one of his poorly constructed teams into the playoffs.
Now he's showing that he indeed does not know what he's doing. You're about to lure a superstar away from a contending team with his superstar teammate with a damn 17 win team and a couple of second year players. This is nonsense. |
kobe, nash, dwight, and Pau should be a contender. Everything is easy to say in retrospect. Majority of NBA fans thought we were a lock to win it all. When we acquired both Nash and Dwight, LG was rejoicing. But anyways....it's all good USC.
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70sdude
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| Posted: Mon Apr 25, 2016 5:13 pm Post subject: |
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| tox wrote: | Keep dodging the question of the Nets --- a clear example of how you can be worse off than the Lakers are right now.
22 wins > 17 wins amirite? |
Well, the math may be partially correct (Nets actually had only 21 wins but hey.) That said, 22 wins stinks just a little less than 17 wins, right ? Both teams were sent down the toilet intentionally, and we Laker fans held our noses all season.
In retrospect, it's obvious to me that the Lakers hired a trusted old bag man in B-Scott to take the heat for a couple seasons then exit after keeping the team in the cellar. Draft position was the game for two years now, not basketball.
The idea of "legitimizing" tanking so as to earn favorable lottery positions is the issue. The Lakers can't admit to doing it and they had to have a HC who could button his lip about it for a long time. They had that. It's the only thing Scott did well, actually: keep a straight face while he screwed over the team on court enough to lose. Mission accomplished, from a franchise perspective. From this fan's perspective, it's a huge loss of respect for the club. |
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LakeShow06
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| Posted: Mon Apr 25, 2016 5:17 pm Post subject: |
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Was starting to believe the Lakers would NOT make this move. I was shocked when I saw this news on my Twitter TL yesterday. Shocked and just a fraction sad for Scott, but SO SO SO very happy at the same time. The Lakers HAD to make this move and do it quickly. The time is NOW to move on to a new era, a modern era. I don't get the hate for Mitch in this thread. Do Not Get.
Now, the decision to hire the right Coach. last 3 have been plain terrible. I do think its either Luke Walton or perhaps, Messina and maybe JVG.
Interesting times ahead...
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TDRock
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| Posted: Mon Apr 25, 2016 5:29 pm Post subject: |
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| sogood. wrote: | | Can Oram permanently replace Worthy? |
I like Oram on the show. I think BGJ needs to take some time off and re-center himself next season before returning to the desk... |
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bandiger
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Joined: 02 Apr 2014
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| Posted: Mon Apr 25, 2016 5:32 pm Post subject: |
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| Can't believe he is the first interview, stark difference from two years ago. |
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Laker's Fan
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Joined: 27 Jun 2002
Posts: 12850
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| Posted: Mon Apr 25, 2016 5:32 pm Post subject: |
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We should call it like it is. Byron was a Tanking Consigliere who had a special ability to serve the KFT agenda. Those two things are over and so is his tenure.
A performance clause was put in his contract to limit the cost of the transition and costs in general were managed for the last couple years (team didn't even use the room exception).
Now they try to turn the page by making the first logical step of spending a mint on a high quality coach. That sets the scene to use their $60 million in cap room and recently vacated alpha role to bring in talent. If their lucky, they may even net a draft asset that will help hasten the recovery, likely in trade. |
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Megaton
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Vancouver Fan
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Joined: 17 Apr 2006
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| Posted: Mon Apr 25, 2016 5:50 pm Post subject: |
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| Laker's Fan wrote: | We should call it like it is. Byron was a Tanking Consigliere who had a special ability to serve the KFT agenda. Those two things are over and so is his tenure.
A performance clause was put in his contract to limit the cost of the transition and costs in general were managed for the last couple years (team didn't even use the room exception).
Now they try to turn the page by making the first logical step of spending a mint on a high quality coach. That sets the scene to use their $60 million in cap room and recently vacated alpha role to bring in talent. If their lucky, they may even net a draft asset that will help hasten the recovery, likely in trade. |
Smart move by the FO.
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KindCrippler2000
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Joined: 02 May 2003
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| Posted: Mon Apr 25, 2016 6:42 pm Post subject: |
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| bandiger wrote: | | Can't believe he is the first interview, stark difference from two years ago. |
Don't jinx it! Vinny Del Negro might get the next 3 interviews. |
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tox
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Joined: 16 Nov 2015
Posts: 17876
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| Posted: Mon Apr 25, 2016 7:12 pm Post subject: |
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| 70sdude wrote: | | tox wrote: | Keep dodging the question of the Nets --- a clear example of how you can be worse off than the Lakers are right now.
22 wins > 17 wins amirite? |
Well, the math may be partially correct (Nets actually had only 21 wins but hey.) That said, 22 wins stinks just a little less than 17 wins, right ? Both teams were sent down the toilet intentionally, and we Laker fans held our noses all season.
In retrospect, it's obvious to me that the Lakers hired a trusted old bag man in B-Scott to take the heat for a couple seasons then exit after keeping the team in the cellar. Draft position was the game for two years now, not basketball.
The idea of "legitimizing" tanking so as to earn favorable lottery positions is the issue. The Lakers can't admit to doing it and they had to have a HC who could button his lip about it for a long time. They had that. It's the only thing Scott did well, actually: keep a straight face while he screwed over the team on court enough to lose. Mission accomplished, from a franchise perspective. From this fan's perspective, it's a huge loss of respect for the club. |
What? You're missing my point. He keeps saying --- how can you get worse than 3 lottery seasons, culminating in this year's 17 win season? My point is the Nets are in a far, far worse position: less talent, fewer draft picks, worse salary cap situation --- even though they won 22 (i.e. more than 17) games. But under his philosophy, he ignores all the stuff that Mitch did right (like get young talent and clear the salary cap). So therefore, he must be arguing the Nets are in a better position than the Lakers, since they won more games.
Tanking has nothing to do with my point. Though Brooklyn is so sad that they couldn't tank if they wanted to. |
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LakerLanny
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Joined: 24 Oct 2001
Posts: 47580
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| Posted: Mon Apr 25, 2016 7:27 pm Post subject: Re: The Lakers fired the wrong guys |
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| Megaton wrote: | | laker50 wrote: | Byron Scott is just a scrapegoat for the lousy decisions of the Lakers FO.
Mich Kupchak and Jim Buss should be fired.
They were the ones responsible for the state of the team and the rooster.
No coach in the world could have won with that lineup. |
Is this an actual serious post? For the sake of my sanity I hope that post was sarcasm. |
Of course he was serious.
Byron inherited a 27 win team, it wasn't like he inherited the Kobe-Shaq duo that Mitch did for instance when he became GM.
Granted Byron did a bad job and followed up the 27 wins with 21 and then an embarrassing 17, but to me that was more on a lack of defensive pride from the players than it was the coach.
And Byron didn't select those players, that was Mitch.
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LakerLanny
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| Posted: Mon Apr 25, 2016 7:38 pm Post subject: |
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| kwase wrote: | | I hope everyone is happy. I don't want to hear any griping next season about coaching . |
Yes, at what point does that stop?
Stop the constant coaching complaints, last I checked Byron didn't sign one of these guys to a contact or miss a single shot or defensive assignment on the floor this season.
No more coach excuse, agreed?
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venturalakersfan
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Location: The Gold Coast
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| Posted: Mon Apr 25, 2016 7:47 pm Post subject: Re: The Lakers fired the wrong guys |
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| LakerLanny wrote: | | Megaton wrote: | | laker50 wrote: | Byron Scott is just a scrapegoat for the lousy decisions of the Lakers FO.
Mich Kupchak and Jim Buss should be fired.
They were the ones responsible for the state of the team and the rooster.
No coach in the world could have won with that lineup. |
Is this an actual serious post? For the sake of my sanity I hope that post was sarcasm. |
Of course he was serious.
Byron inherited a 27 win team, it wasn't like he inherited the Kobe-Shaq duo that Mitch did for instance when he became GM.
Granted Byron did a bad job and followed up the 27 wins with 21 and then an embarrassing 17, but to me that was more on a lack of defensive pride from the players than it was the coach.
And Byron didn't select those players, that was Mitch. |
From all reports Byron didn't coach those players defensively, either.
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CBaller8
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Joined: 17 Feb 2002
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Location: Reseda, CA
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| Posted: Mon Apr 25, 2016 7:51 pm Post subject: |
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| I just heard what James Worthy said about Bryon's departure. James Worthy needs to gtfo. Massive hypocrite. |
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LakerLanny
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Joined: 24 Oct 2001
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| Posted: Mon Apr 25, 2016 7:54 pm Post subject: |
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| TDRock wrote: | | sogood. wrote: | | Can Oram permanently replace Worthy? |
I like Oram on the show. I think BGJ needs to take some time off and re-center himself next season before returning to the desk... |
Worthy was a great player and a great Laker, but he is a horrible analyst. Oram on his first day was light years better than James after however many years he has been on.
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fiendishoc
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Location: The (real) short corner
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| Posted: Mon Apr 25, 2016 9:50 pm Post subject: |
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| Vancouver Fan wrote: | http://www.si.com/nba/2016/04/25/lakers-byron-scott-fired-kobe-bryant-dangelo-russell-nick-young
I thought this article was an accurate depiction of what has transpired. |
This guy gets it.
| Quote: | Bryant’s departure, telegraphed well in advance, was bound to shift the Lakers’ power balance towards Russell and the other youngers. Consequently, it’s been clear since at least midseason that Scott would be left on the wrong side of the leverage equation, with no leg to stand on.
He certainly couldn’t point to his 38–126 record: his two–year Lakers tenure featured the two lowest winning percentages in the 68–year history of the franchise, and he’s coached five straight sub–25 win teams dating back to his time with the Cavaliers.
He couldn’t point to progress: L.A. ranked No. 23 in offense and No. 29 in defense in 2014–15, only to slip to No. 29 and No. 30, respectively, in 2015–16.
He couldn’t point to his vision of the game: In an era of passing and three–point shooting, the Lakers ranked dead last in assist rate and dead last in three–point percentage and Scott regularly espoused old–school, traditionalist ideas. |
Perfectly said. |
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lakersgirl
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Joined: 04 Jan 2013
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Location: Los Angeles, CA
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| Posted: Mon Apr 25, 2016 10:09 pm Post subject: |
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| TDRock wrote: | | Practice wrote: | | Mitch is going to be interviewed about the decision on Access SportsNet: Lakers at 3:30. |
OK the phone interview with Big Game James was crazy. He totally went out guns blazing. He's maintained that Byron "didn't have anything to work with". He went off on D'Antoni - like went off. "if Byron had the talent D'Antoni had" he would've done this or that and "he would never have benched Pau and he wouldn't of been sitting around waiting for Steve Nash..." Somehow BGJ worked going off on New York Knicks into the interview.... He was defensive about Scott AND his nonexistent analysis of Scott as a coach...That interview was bananas. |
Smh. Worthy needs to get a grip.
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LandsbergerRules
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| Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2016 1:02 am Post subject: |
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| lakersgirl wrote: | | TDRock wrote: | | Practice wrote: | | Mitch is going to be interviewed about the decision on Access SportsNet: Lakers at 3:30. |
OK the phone interview with Big Game James was crazy. He totally went out guns blazing. He's maintained that Byron "didn't have anything to work with". He went off on D'Antoni - like went off. "if Byron had the talent D'Antoni had" he would've done this or that and "he would never have benched Pau and he wouldn't of been sitting around waiting for Steve Nash..." Somehow BGJ worked going off on New York Knicks into the interview.... He was defensive about Scott AND his nonexistent analysis of Scott as a coach...That interview was bananas. |
Smh. Worthy needs to get a grip. |
Great player and seems like a very loyal friend. That said, I don't really want to see him on TWC anymore.
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tox
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Joined: 16 Nov 2015
Posts: 17876
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| Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2016 1:03 am Post subject: |
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| LandsbergerRules wrote: | | lakersgirl wrote: | | TDRock wrote: | | Practice wrote: | | Mitch is going to be interviewed about the decision on Access SportsNet: Lakers at 3:30. |
OK the phone interview with Big Game James was crazy. He totally went out guns blazing. He's maintained that Byron "didn't have anything to work with". He went off on D'Antoni - like went off. "if Byron had the talent D'Antoni had" he would've done this or that and "he would never have benched Pau and he wouldn't of been sitting around waiting for Steve Nash..." Somehow BGJ worked going off on New York Knicks into the interview.... He was defensive about Scott AND his nonexistent analysis of Scott as a coach...That interview was bananas. |
Smh. Worthy needs to get a grip. |
Great player and seems like a very loyal friend. That said, I don't really want to see him on TWC anymore. |
With Byron gone he should be more tolerable now, though. Not that I ever really liked his analysis to begin with. |
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