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| Who Do You Hope the Lakers Draft? |
| Ben Simmons |
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45% |
[ 205 ] |
| Brandon Ingram |
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54% |
[ 243 ] |
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| Total Votes : 448 |
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Snaq O'Meal888
Rookie
Joined: 18 May 2016
Posts: 23
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 Posted: Tue May 24, 2016 9:47 pm Post subject: |
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| Fastbreak32 wrote: | | Snaq O'Meal888 wrote: | | I chose simmons bc ingrams tats looks gehtto and not to mention he has a body of 13 yr old girl lol |
Where else but LG can you get a scouting report like this?  |
Thats why i get paid the big bucks baby  |
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misterrunon
Star Player
Joined: 19 Jun 2010
Posts: 1904
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| Posted: Tue May 24, 2016 10:11 pm Post subject: |
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This is nuts.. how did Ingram take the lead? Simmons was winning for a while. I'm guessing that most of us assume that Simmons will go #1, so we're a little bias since we already think that Ingram is ours.
I've wanted Ingram this whole time though. |
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Mike@LG
Moderator
Joined: 10 Apr 2001
Posts: 65135
Location: Orange County, CA
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| Posted: Tue May 24, 2016 10:14 pm Post subject: |
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| misterrunon wrote: | This is nuts.. how did Ingram take the lead? Simmons was winning for a while. I'm guessing that most of us assume that Simmons will go #1, so we're a little bias since we already think that Ingram is ours.
I've wanted Ingram this whole time though. |
http://forums.lakersground.net/viewtopic.php?t=175655&start=17800
Simmons really didn't close his season well.
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tom
Star Player
Joined: 24 Jun 2009
Posts: 7251
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| Posted: Tue May 24, 2016 10:15 pm Post subject: |
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| Mike@LG wrote: | | misterrunon wrote: | This is nuts.. how did Ingram take the lead? Simmons was winning for a while. I'm guessing that most of us assume that Simmons will go #1, so we're a little bias since we already think that Ingram is ours.
I've wanted Ingram this whole time though. |
http://forums.lakersground.net/viewtopic.php?t=175655&start=17800
Simmons really didn't close his season well. |
I'm worried Simmons might be a poor man LO |
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misterrunon
Star Player
Joined: 19 Jun 2010
Posts: 1904
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| Posted: Tue May 24, 2016 10:16 pm Post subject: |
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| Mike@LG wrote: | | misterrunon wrote: | This is nuts.. how did Ingram take the lead? Simmons was winning for a while. I'm guessing that most of us assume that Simmons will go #1, so we're a little bias since we already think that Ingram is ours.
I've wanted Ingram this whole time though. |
http://forums.lakersground.net/viewtopic.php?t=175655&start=17800
Simmons really didn't close his season well. |
This thread was started on April the 30th though. |
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Mike@LG
Moderator
Joined: 10 Apr 2001
Posts: 65135
Location: Orange County, CA
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| Posted: Tue May 24, 2016 10:19 pm Post subject: |
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| tom wrote: | | Mike@LG wrote: | | misterrunon wrote: | This is nuts.. how did Ingram take the lead? Simmons was winning for a while. I'm guessing that most of us assume that Simmons will go #1, so we're a little bias since we already think that Ingram is ours.
I've wanted Ingram this whole time though. |
http://forums.lakersground.net/viewtopic.php?t=175655&start=17800
Simmons really didn't close his season well. |
I'm worried Simmons might be a poor man LO |
I just think Simmons has all of this great instincts but can't imagine the guy doing better than 16/10/4, kind of like Odom as a starter. He's too talented to just put up those numbers. He showed it for one month during the NCAA season.
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Lakers_Jester
Star Player
Joined: 17 Sep 2012
Posts: 5366
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| Posted: Tue May 24, 2016 10:25 pm Post subject: |
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Randle
Nance
Ingram
Clarkson
Dlo
Walton |
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tox
Franchise Player
Joined: 16 Nov 2015
Posts: 17876
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| Posted: Tue May 24, 2016 10:48 pm Post subject: |
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| Omar Little wrote: |
Per favors bigs |
That said, who cares what PER favors? It's a crap stat, using it as a one-in-all stat to compare players betrays a serious lack of understanding of advanced stats.
Even if you don't trust my word on it, just take an empirical view of the stat: do people believe that Westbrook last year was better than Kobe in any year of his career? Anthony Davis? Come on. |
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Omar Little
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Joined: 02 May 2005
Posts: 90306
Location: Formerly Known As 24
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| Posted: Wed May 25, 2016 12:32 am Post subject: |
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| tox wrote: | | Omar Little wrote: |
Per favors bigs |
That said, who cares what PER favors? It's a crap stat, using it as a one-in-all stat to compare players betrays a serious lack of understanding of advanced stats.
Even if you don't trust my word on it, just take an empirical view of the stat: do people believe that Westbrook last year was better than Kobe in any year of his career? Anthony Davis? Come on. |
You're preaching to the choir. I was just responding to a specific assertion. Fwiw, I don't like any all in one stats thus far.
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Vin
Star Player
Joined: 03 Jan 2013
Posts: 6005
Location: France
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| Posted: Wed May 25, 2016 1:12 am Post subject: |
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| Omar Little wrote: | | nash wrote: | | Practice wrote: | | nash wrote: | | OC Lakerfan wrote: | | LakerLanny wrote: | | ocho wrote: |
It's not crapping on him, it's just looking deeper than. PPG. Okafor is skilled at one thing in particular and it's an inherently inefficient offensive play. He's not a great rebounder or passer and he's a terrible defender. He's got off court issues if you want to get into that. He's a high usage, inefficient player. It's not personal. |
Problem with your argument is when you look deeper than PPG, Okafor still was far better than Russell in pretty much every area. Better efg, better PER, you name it. I have pointed this out before and all the analytics guys scurry away, but it is the painful reality.
The reality is the Lakers got cute and blew last year's pick. No need to cry over spilled milk, it is what it is. Okafor was first team all rookie, Russell was fortunate to make the second team.
I am just hoping Mitch doesn't try and get cute again this year and do something like take Bender over Ingram/Simmons. |
Don't centers typically have better EFG/PER? |
Someone forgot to tell Curry about that and Lebron before him. |
To be fair, he said "typically" and you brought up the two best players in the NBA. |
Not really if you consider that there are no centers in the top 6 PER among players with at least 20 MPG and Whiteside is the only center among top 10 unless you consider Anthony Davis a center. |
Per favors bigs |
No problemas. |
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tox
Franchise Player
Joined: 16 Nov 2015
Posts: 17876
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| Posted: Wed May 25, 2016 3:20 am Post subject: |
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| Omar Little wrote: | | tox wrote: | | Omar Little wrote: |
Per favors bigs |
That said, who cares what PER favors? It's a crap stat, using it as a one-in-all stat to compare players betrays a serious lack of understanding of advanced stats.
Even if you don't trust my word on it, just take an empirical view of the stat: do people believe that Westbrook last year was better than Kobe in any year of his career? Anthony Davis? Come on. |
You're preaching to the choir. I was just responding to a specific assertion. Fwiw, I don't like any all in one stats thus far. |
Oh yeah, I meant that as an extension of what you said. But I guess it comes off as lecturing when I chopped the rest of the quote tree. But yeah, using PER as an argument for one player being better than another is just really weak. Unless, like, you're arguing someone with a PER of 30 is better than someone with a PER of 8.
Agreed on all-in-one stats. You and GT have made me bigger fans of play type and lineup data though.  |
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nash
Star Player
Joined: 23 Oct 2001
Posts: 8194
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| Posted: Wed May 25, 2016 3:47 am Post subject: |
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| tox wrote: | | Omar Little wrote: | | tox wrote: | | Omar Little wrote: |
Per favors bigs |
That said, who cares what PER favors? It's a crap stat, using it as a one-in-all stat to compare players betrays a serious lack of understanding of advanced stats.
Even if you don't trust my word on it, just take an empirical view of the stat: do people believe that Westbrook last year was better than Kobe in any year of his career? Anthony Davis? Come on. |
You're preaching to the choir. I was just responding to a specific assertion. Fwiw, I don't like any all in one stats thus far. |
Oh yeah, I meant that as an extension of what you said. But I guess it comes off as lecturing when I chopped the rest of the quote tree. But yeah, using PER as an argument for one player being better than another is just really weak. Unless, like, you're arguing someone with a PER of 30 is better than someone with a PER of 8.
Agreed on all-in-one stats. You and GT have made me bigger fans of play type and lineup data though. |
I'd trade our entire roster for Westbrook and Davis in less than a heart beat, it's not even something to think about. |
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LandsbergerRules
Franchise Player
Joined: 29 Aug 2004
Posts: 11197
Location: The Other Perspective
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| Posted: Wed May 25, 2016 5:02 am Post subject: |
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| Mike@LG wrote: |
I just think Simmons has all of this great instincts but can't imagine the guy doing better than 16/10/4, kind of like Odom as a starter. |
If he never develops a jumpshot, I can see this happening.
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KobeRe-Loaded
Franchise Player
Joined: 09 Dec 2003
Posts: 14944
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| Posted: Wed May 25, 2016 7:37 am Post subject: |
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| LandsbergerRules wrote: | | Mike@LG wrote: |
I just think Simmons has all of this great instincts but can't imagine the guy doing better than 16/10/4, kind of like Odom as a starter. |
If he never develops a jumpshot, I can see this happening. |
Right, that's his "downside"
So I imagine if he developed a jumper he'd be 20/10/5
If he REALLY developed an offensive game 24/10/6
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Vancouver Fan
Franchise Player
Joined: 17 Apr 2006
Posts: 17740
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| Posted: Wed May 25, 2016 7:41 am Post subject: |
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| KobeRe-Loaded wrote: | | LandsbergerRules wrote: | | Mike@LG wrote: |
I just think Simmons has all of this great instincts but can't imagine the guy doing better than 16/10/4, kind of like Odom as a starter. |
If he never develops a jumpshot, I can see this happening. |
Right, that's his "downside"
So I imagine if he developed a jumper he'd be 20/10/5
If he REALLY developed an offensive game 24/10/6 |
I think youre in love 
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Music is my medicine |
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LakerLuke
Starting Rotation
Joined: 28 Apr 2016
Posts: 630
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| Posted: Wed May 25, 2016 10:18 am Post subject: |
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| Mike@LG wrote: | | misterrunon wrote: | This is nuts.. how did Ingram take the lead? Simmons was winning for a while. I'm guessing that most of us assume that Simmons will go #1, so we're a little bias since we already think that Ingram is ours.
I've wanted Ingram this whole time though. |
http://forums.lakersground.net/viewtopic.php?t=175655&start=17800
Simmons really didn't close his season well. |
Neither did Ingram. |
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venturalakersfan
Retired Number
Joined: 14 Apr 2001
Posts: 144461
Location: The Gold Coast
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| Posted: Wed May 25, 2016 10:38 am Post subject: |
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| nash wrote: | | kikanga wrote: | He's shown enough flashes for me to know he's not a bust.
But he wasn't consistent enough this season for me to think he's a future all star. |
Yes. He had flashes of a great scorer in the making, but has to prove he has tools to be a starting PG because his AST/TO ratio is poor. |
No surprise when you are the #1 iso team in the league.
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Fastbreak32
Star Player
Joined: 11 Oct 2011
Posts: 4746
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| Posted: Wed May 25, 2016 11:01 am Post subject: |
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| venturalakersfan wrote: | | nash wrote: | | kikanga wrote: | He's shown enough flashes for me to know he's not a bust.
But he wasn't consistent enough this season for me to think he's a future all star. |
Yes. He had flashes of a great scorer in the making, but has to prove he has tools to be a starting PG because his AST/TO ratio is poor. |
No surprise when you are the #1 iso team in the league. |
Yeah, just a minor detail. 
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nash
Star Player
Joined: 23 Oct 2001
Posts: 8194
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| Posted: Wed May 25, 2016 12:31 pm Post subject: |
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| venturalakersfan wrote: | | nash wrote: | | kikanga wrote: | He's shown enough flashes for me to know he's not a bust.
But he wasn't consistent enough this season for me to think he's a future all star. |
Yes. He had flashes of a great scorer in the making, but has to prove he has tools to be a starting PG because his AST/TO ratio is poor. |
No surprise when you are the #1 iso team in the league. |
Too many excuses, too many.
I try to racionalize everything, so I agree about the lack of assists being a consequence of our ISO heavy system and lack of adequate PnR partner, but the poor AST/TO ratio is product of sloppy ball handling and sometimes because he was trying to make the flashy pass not the most efetive one.
Jokic had better PG stats than our starting PG, so I'm not telling he is unable to be a great PG in the future, but under Luke he has still to prove he can place numbers compatible with a starting material PG because most of his positive stats are telling us he is a scorer. |
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kaoss128
Franchise Player
Joined: 09 Apr 2006
Posts: 13058
Location: Morgantown, WV
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| Posted: Wed May 25, 2016 12:38 pm Post subject: |
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| Mike@LG wrote: | | tom wrote: | | Mike@LG wrote: | | misterrunon wrote: | This is nuts.. how did Ingram take the lead? Simmons was winning for a while. I'm guessing that most of us assume that Simmons will go #1, so we're a little bias since we already think that Ingram is ours.
I've wanted Ingram this whole time though. |
http://forums.lakersground.net/viewtopic.php?t=175655&start=17800
Simmons really didn't close his season well. |
I'm worried Simmons might be a poor man LO |
I just think Simmons has all of this great instincts but can't imagine the guy doing better than 16/10/4, kind of like Odom as a starter. He's too talented to just put up those numbers. He showed it for one month during the NCAA season. |
And what do you see Ingram being? I don't ever see him being more than 18 and 6 with elite defense. |
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Vottomatic
Starting Rotation
Joined: 20 Feb 2015
Posts: 385
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| Posted: Wed May 25, 2016 12:53 pm Post subject: |
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| This is how it was last year too, we all wanted Towns, but as soon as we got the 2nd pick we knew we weren't getting towns and we were trying to convince ourselves that Okafor was better than towns... |
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22
Franchise Player
Joined: 05 Apr 2013
Posts: 17063
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| Posted: Wed May 25, 2016 12:58 pm Post subject: |
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| Vottomatic wrote: | | This is how it was last year too, we all wanted Towns, but as soon as we got the 2nd pick we knew we weren't getting towns and we were trying to convince ourselves that Okafor was better than towns... |
Not even close. Most wanted Okafor until the predraft workouts and the tides turned in Towns' favor
http://forums.lakersground.net/viewtopic.php?t=170780 |
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nash
Star Player
Joined: 23 Oct 2001
Posts: 8194
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| Posted: Wed May 25, 2016 1:10 pm Post subject: |
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| Vottomatic wrote: | | This is how it was last year too, we all wanted Towns, but as soon as we got the 2nd pick we knew we weren't getting towns and we were trying to convince ourselves that Okafor was better than towns... |
Are you trying to make a case for Bender?
Last edited by nash on Wed May 25, 2016 1:33 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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lkjhf
Star Player
Joined: 01 Jun 2012
Posts: 1166
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| Posted: Wed May 25, 2016 1:15 pm Post subject: |
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| Smh you guys are talking about bender like he's chopped liver. We could use our own WCS |
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av3773
Star Player
Joined: 11 Dec 2011
Posts: 3751
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| Posted: Wed May 25, 2016 1:26 pm Post subject: |
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I think we're lucky whichever we get, I feel they are both going to be great in different ways.
I think Philly recognizes that Simmons will give them an identity as a team. Oddly like Okafor I think in order to maximize his talents you really have to build a specific kind of team around him, so it will be interesting to see what the 76ers do overall, not with just their number 1, but certainly I see Simmons being a face of the franchise guy for the them so that's why I see that happening
Ingram on the other hand for me is pretty equivalent in talent, although I don't necessarily see a "face of the franchise guy" with him, even though I think in terms of talent he is going to bring pretty equivalent top shelf skills to the NBA as Simmons. It's this other quality which isn't good or bad, it's just different, it's the ease with which his skills would seem to translate well pretty much with any team. It's not a great metaphor but putting him on our team I see a crazy Golden State/OKC hybrid and no I don't mean he is like Durant on the warriors. He is going to make our team really interesting as he develops because of how skills can be maximized over time with what we already have.
Net year we still may get pounded but I think we are definitely go to be a lot more interesting to watch and in a couple of years going to be looking like a really dangerous team |
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