|
| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
Basketball Fan
Franchise Player
Joined: 03 Feb 2004
Posts: 24761
|
 Posted: Sun May 22, 2016 9:30 am Post subject: LOTR star Elijah Wood says Hollywood is gripped by a powerful pedophile ring |
|
|
| Quote: | Lord of the Rings star Elijah Wood says Hollywood is gripped by a powerful pedophile ring and Tinseltown is covering up a 'seedy' underbelly full of predatory 'vipers'
Elijah Wood, 35, claims young actors are being abused in Hollywood
Says Tinseltown is allegedly sheltering around '100 active abusers'
Lord of the Rings star Elijah Wood claims that young actors in Hollywood are being sexually abused by predatory high-powered 'vipers' working in the industry..
The Hobbit actor, 35, told The Sunday Times that the child abuse is 'probably still happening'.
Shocking allegations that top Hollywood figures have been protecting child abusers have circulated widely in recent years.
Several industry figures have been convicted following claims of sex abuse and former child actors - including The Goonies actor Corey Feldman, 44 - claimed he was 'surrounded' by molesters when he was a teenager.
Anne Henry, co-founder of Bizparentz - a group to help young actors - said that Tinseltown is currently sheltering around '100 active abusers'.
Wood, who stars in his new film The Trust told The Sunday Times that his mother had protected him from abuse when he first arrived in Hollywood aged eight.
But he said: 'I've been led down dark paths to realise that these things are probably still happening.'
The actor, who played Frodo Baggins in Lord of the Rings, believes that other actors remain in danger.
He added: 'If you're innocent, you have very little knowledge of the world and you want to succeed.
'People with parasitic interests will see you as their prey. What upsets me about these situations is that the victims can't speak as loudly as the people in power.'
Wood was talking to the Sunday Times about Jimmy Savile, a British entertainer who sexually abused dozens of victims over five decades.
He was knighted by the Queen and his crimes were only revealed after his death, despite years of rumor and innuendo and led to allegations of a cover-up by government figures and broadcasting chiefs.
Henry believes that around three quarters of child actors that 'went off the rails' later in their life had been abused in Hollywood.
Scroll down for video
She said: 'This problem has been endemic in Hollywood for a long time and it's finally coming to light.
'Very bad people are still working here, protected by their friends.'
In the last 10 years, several wealthy and significant people involved in the industry have been convicted.
Some have left prison and returned to Hollywood and continued to work with children.
Wood, who now knows he was lucky to avoid being abused, compared the allegations in Hollywood to the claims linked to Savile following his death in October 2011.
Wood said: 'You all grew up with Savile - Jesus, it must have been devastating. Clearly something major was going on in Hollywood. It was all organised.
'There are a lot of vipers in this industry. There is a darkness in the underbelly - if you can imagine it, it's probably happened.'
Feldman, who was one of the biggest child stars in the 1980s, was abused when he was a young actor.
He said: 'The No 1 problem in Hollywood was and is - and always will be - pedophilia.'
Other child actors were reportedly told by adults that it was perfectly normal for older men and younger boys in the industry to have sexual relations.
Feldman told a British tabloid four years ago: 'When I was 14 and 15, things were happening to me. These older men were leching around me like vultures.'
He went on to suffer with alcoholism, mental health problems and became addicted to drugs.
His friend, Corey Haim, another child actor, died of pnemonia aged 38 in 2010. Feldman claims a 'Hollywood mogul' is to blame for his friend's death.
He said abusers are still working and are some of the richest and most powerful people in the business.
It was also claimed that a number of pool parties were held in Los Angeles during the late 1990s - primarily hosted by millionaire businessman Marc Collins-Rector.
At these parties, Collins-Rector and other men are said to have sexually assaulted teenage boys, according to lawsuits filed in 2000 and 2014. |
Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3603386/Lord-Rings-star-Elijah-Wood-says-Hollywood-gripped-powerful-pedophile-ring-Tinseltown-covering-seedy-underbelly-predatory-vipers.html#ixzz49PHTll4H |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
Fan0Bynum17
Franchise Player
Joined: 30 Nov 2005
Posts: 15436
|
| Posted: Sun May 22, 2016 9:39 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Dailymail, but it's pretty believable. I hope some people get some courage to start naming names and exposing who it is. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
shnxx
Star Player
Joined: 09 May 2013
Posts: 3402
|
| Posted: Sun May 22, 2016 11:41 am Post subject: |
|
|
Sickening.
I hope pedophilloic behavior never becomes legal.
One interesting question is what would happen when we have sex robots.
Do these people get to have sex robots resembling underage children?
Currently, I think they aren't allowed to consume pedophilic digital content, but this might be actually harmful to discouraging them from real life pedophilic behavior. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Fan0Bynum17
Franchise Player
Joined: 30 Nov 2005
Posts: 15436
|
| Posted: Sun May 22, 2016 11:48 am Post subject: |
|
|
| shnxx wrote: | Sickening.
I hope pedophilloic behavior never becomes legal.
One interesting question is what would happen when we have sex robots.
Do these people get to have sex robots resembling underage children?
Currently, I think they aren't allowed to consume pedophilic digital content, but this might be actually harmful to discouraging them from real life pedophilic behavior. |
I think as long as no one is actually getting hurt, it should be legal (re: child-resembling sex-dolls/bots, and animated child porn,) but whether those things increase or decrease the likelihood of pedophiles offending in real life, I have no idea. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ocho
Retired Number
Joined: 24 May 2005
Posts: 53790
|
| Posted: Sun May 22, 2016 11:55 am Post subject: |
|
|
He's not the first person to say this.
_________________
14-5-3-12 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Huey Lewis & The News
Star Player
Joined: 18 Dec 2015
Posts: 5234
Location: So what's the uh...topic of discussion?
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Reflexx
Franchise Player
Joined: 25 Jun 2005
Posts: 11163
|
| Posted: Sun May 22, 2016 12:40 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| ocho wrote: | | He's not the first person to say this. |
Yup. And look at how Hollywood still loves Polanski.
We hear about guys like Cosby taking advantage of young women, but he may be tame compared to many others. And these others may be known to have these habits, but people just look the other way.
One thing that pisses me off is that there have been people that say this is happening, but they refuse to name names. That's almost as bad as nit saying anything at all.
But I'm sure the stars that look the other way would have no problem vilifying people that dont happen to support their pet causes.
I will say that from stories it appears to be more prevalent in bigger productions, like being in a movie or something. Also you hear more accusations about it happening to young boys, but Polanski shows it happens to girls too. My relative was a Nickelodeon/Disney actress and didn't experience that stuff. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ocho
Retired Number
Joined: 24 May 2005
Posts: 53790
|
| Posted: Sun May 22, 2016 12:57 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Reflexx wrote: | | Also you hear more accusations about it happening to young boys, but Polanski shows it happens to girls too. |
I think any industry or organization where there are young people involved, it becomes a target for predators. It's not just a Hollywood thing. Look at Penn State.
_________________
14-5-3-12 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
shnxx
Star Player
Joined: 09 May 2013
Posts: 3402
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Fan0Bynum17
Franchise Player
Joined: 30 Nov 2005
Posts: 15436
|
| Posted: Sun May 22, 2016 1:21 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Having an attraction to children, on its own, doesn't make someone a monster. What is he supposed to do about it beyond not act on it? Seriously, what do you want him to do about it? Kill himself? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
shnxx
Star Player
Joined: 09 May 2013
Posts: 3402
|
| Posted: Sun May 22, 2016 2:05 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Fan0Bynum17 wrote: |
Having an attraction to children, on its own, doesn't make someone a monster. What is he supposed to do about it beyond not act on it? Seriously, what do you want him to do about it? Kill himself? |
Giving a pedophile babysitter (true story, apparently) a platform, where he talks about relieving himself in the bathroom after seeing a beautiful little girl is definitely crossing the line. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
non-player zealot
Franchise Player
Joined: 05 Nov 2007
Posts: 21365
|
| Posted: Sun May 22, 2016 2:18 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| ocho wrote: | | He's not the first person to say this. |
I recall hearing that the director of the 1995 movie Powder was a convicted pedo. (Edit: checking the wiki page now). It does say he molested a child actor during production of another movie less than a decade prior. Some protested his presence in the industry and his ability to profit. The character in the movie was weird enough to make me suspect it was some kind of representation of himself. He also blatantly ripped a scene from Starman where Jeff Bridges brought a deer back to life by touching it with his magic powers.
The film's production by Disney resulted in a controversy over the choice of writer-director Victor Salva, who had been convicted of molesting a 12-year-old child actor during the production of his previous film, Clownhouse, in 1988. When Powder was released, the victim, Nathan Forrest Winters, came forward again in an attempt to get others to boycott the film in protest at Disney's hiring Salva. Since then, Disney has not picked up any more pictures by Salva. In 2015, Barry Crimmins criticized the plot of the movie on 'The Joe Rogan Experience' as being an allusion to a child having power over an adult, in reference to Salva's history as a sex offender.[3][4][5]
--
Also the pedo from the preachy TV show 7th Heaven (appropriately playing a preacher). He has also been in films.
_________________
GOAT MAGIC REEL
SEDALE TRIBUTE
EDDIE DONX! |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
non-player zealot
Franchise Player
Joined: 05 Nov 2007
Posts: 21365
|
| Posted: Sun May 22, 2016 2:35 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Fan0Bynum17 wrote: | | Having an attraction to children, on its own, doesn't make someone a monster. What is he supposed to do about it beyond not act on it? Seriously, what do you want him to do about it? Kill himself? |
If such people have any remaining shred of integrity and responsibility, absent of killing themselves (we're talking both male and female pedos), they should be in psychological counseling where they make their thoughts and actions known, so it's put on record. Then they should attempt to avoid any and all things that may cause a relapse in those thoughts and behaviors. That much is something they can control, a psychologist's job is to assist any patient in fostering socially acceptable pathways and an issue like having really bad thoughts and desires is way too dangerous to others to be left untreated. A pedo may even be doing themselves a favor by not letting those thoughts fester into action. Problem is that these types are notorious for being died in the wool in thought and their paraphilias are often deeply rooted from childhood age. Most important thing I think is for them to out themselves to a psychiatrist/psychologist so at least they are aware of the individual's issues. Worse than a person who was outed as a pedo and has made an attempt to change his/her thought patterns is a closeted one who typifies the song "Little Girls" by Oingo Boingo.
_________________
GOAT MAGIC REEL
SEDALE TRIBUTE
EDDIE DONX!
Last edited by non-player zealot on Sun May 22, 2016 3:04 pm; edited 2 times in total |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Fan0Bynum17
Franchise Player
Joined: 30 Nov 2005
Posts: 15436
|
| Posted: Sun May 22, 2016 2:54 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| shnxx wrote: | | Fan0Bynum17 wrote: |
Having an attraction to children, on its own, doesn't make someone a monster. What is he supposed to do about it beyond not act on it? Seriously, what do you want him to do about it? Kill himself? |
Giving a pedophile babysitter (true story, apparently) a platform, where he talks about relieving himself in the bathroom after seeing a beautiful little girl is definitely crossing the line. |
It's the internet, anyone can have a platform if they want it. Plus, it raises awareness and understanding, if you're interested in it, I don't see how that hurts. If hearing about those kinds of thoughts are something you can't handle, then okay, you can excuse yourself from it. No one is going to make you read about it, but thoughts are not criminal, nor are they immoral. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Fan0Bynum17
Franchise Player
Joined: 30 Nov 2005
Posts: 15436
|
| Posted: Sun May 22, 2016 2:57 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| non-player zealot wrote: | | Fan0Bynum17 wrote: | | Having an attraction to children, on its own, doesn't make someone a monster. What is he supposed to do about it beyond not act on it? Seriously, what do you want him to do about it? Kill himself? |
If such people have any remaining shred of integrity and responsibility, absent of killing themselves (we're talking both male and female pedos), they should be in psychological counseling where they make their thoughts and actions known, so it's put on record. Then they should attempt to avoid any and all things that may cause a relapse in those thoughts and behaviors. That much is something they can control, a psychologist's job is to assist any patient in fostering socially acceptable pathways and an issue like having really bad thoughts and desires is way too dangerous to others to be left untreated. A pedo may even be doing themselves a favor by not letting those thoughts fester into action. Problem is that these types are notorious for being died in the wool in thought and their paraphilias are often deeply rooted from childhood age. Most important thing I think is for them to out themselves to a psychiatrist/psychologist so at least they are aware of the individual's issues. Worst than a person who was outed as a pedo and has made an attempt to change his/her thought patterns is a closeted one who typifies the song "Little Girls" by Oingo Boingo. |
And those would be incredibly responsible and proactive actions for a pedophile to take, admirable ones even. However, the bottom line here is that they don't offend, and if they don't offend, they're not monsters, they're just unfortunate people. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
non-player zealot
Franchise Player
Joined: 05 Nov 2007
Posts: 21365
|
| Posted: Sun May 22, 2016 3:25 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Fan0Bynum17 wrote: |
And those would be incredibly responsible and proactive actions for a pedophile to take, admirable ones even. However, the bottom line here is that they don't offend, and if they don't offend, they're not monsters, they're just unfortunate. |
I don't think it's wise for that kind of material to be made easy via the internet. Representational scenes as well, cartoons, etc. I don't think it's possible to put any positive spin on that stuff. The only inevitable result it seems to me, and to most others I would think, is that such material only serves to strengthen their paraphilia(s) and thus makes them a potential danger to society. After how much exposure to that sh does one of them finally decide to act? It's the most heinous kind of sexual disorder and a mental disorder to boot, but the same goes for any paraphilia. The more that the affected indulge in it, the less chance they'll ever revert back to consensual-adult sexuality. If they don't offend, they don't offend, but unfortunately, a lot of them DO offend and they don't change. Many of them are very manipulative and have good interpersonal skills. You can tell they're lying in wait for an opportunity like a spider. I've worked in institutions. It's no more of a good idea to give inmates in for non-sexual offenses access to standard porn mags. You don't want to encourage the mental imagery and negative views on women that porn inspires even in "normal" men.
_________________
GOAT MAGIC REEL
SEDALE TRIBUTE
EDDIE DONX! |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Fan0Bynum17
Franchise Player
Joined: 30 Nov 2005
Posts: 15436
|
| Posted: Sun May 22, 2016 4:07 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| non-player zealot wrote: | | Fan0Bynum17 wrote: |
And those would be incredibly responsible and proactive actions for a pedophile to take, admirable ones even. However, the bottom line here is that they don't offend, and if they don't offend, they're not monsters, they're just unfortunate. |
I don't think it's wise for that kind of material to be made easy via the internet. Representational scenes as well, cartoons, etc. I don't think it's possible to put any positive spin on that stuff. The only inevitable result it seems to me, and to most others I would think, is that such material only serves to strengthen their paraphilia(s) and thus makes them a potential danger to society. After how much exposure to that sh does one of them finally decide to act? It's the most heinous kind of sexual disorder and a mental disorder to boot, but the same goes for any paraphilia. The more that the affected indulge in it, the less chance they'll ever revert back to consensual-adult sexuality. If they don't offend, they don't offend, but unfortunately, a lot of them DO offend and they don't change. Many of them are very manipulative and have good interpersonal skills. You can tell they're lying in wait for an opportunity like a spider. I've worked in institutions. It's no more of a good idea to give inmates in for non-sexual offenses access to standard porn mags. You don't want to encourage the mental imagery and negative views on women that porn inspires even in "normal" men. |
It may or may not be good for them in their pursuit of non-offending, but it should be legal because of freedom of speech, and freedom of thought. I don't believe in thought crime, and I never will.
I don't know whether a pedophile can revert, nor do I know if reverting (as opposed to converting) is even an applicable term for them, because it assumes they ever had normal adult consent-based sexuality. I believe there is some merit to the saying "resistance is persistence," it's often been true for me in my life.
What evidence do you have that porn even inspires negative thoughts of women? Or that allowing them porn even leads to a worse result? And I often find that objection sexist, as if how porn affects the image of women should be of the highest concern, as if how it affects the image of men is of no consequence.
Also, having these views of pedophiles, as if they're just monsters from the word go, can have a self-fulfilling prophecy effect. The more you malign them and lump non-offending pedophiles in with offending ones, the more you ostracize them and discourage them from the societal support that can help them not offend. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
non-player zealot
Franchise Player
Joined: 05 Nov 2007
Posts: 21365
|
| Posted: Sun May 22, 2016 4:39 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Fan0Bynum17 wrote: |
I don't know whether a pedophile can revert, nor do I know if reverting (as opposed to converting) is even an applicable term for them, because it assumes they ever had normal adult consent-based sexuality. I believe there is some merit to the saying "resistance is persistence," it's often been true for me in my life. |
Valid points, you could very well be right, please don't think I'm trying to force you to yield to my opinions. I will say that I don't assume that they're stuck forever, everyone's an individual and I do believe they can change given the effort and willingness required. Somehow I think they must internalize the "wrongness" of any thoughts that go to those places. Maybe I have the typical societal attitude towards them as a group to an extent, but as far as I go, I think it's the severity of this as a social problem that gets to me. I'll admit there are some gut level feelings behind my views. You're right to point out that not everyone has the same background, maybe I didn't express that well enough. I do realize that there's a lot of complexity inherent in a sexual disorder that profound. It could be a ingrained pattern of thought and feelings from childhood, and it also could've sprung from the adult being victimized themselves as a child, thus their lives were tainted through no fault of their own.
Not to lump this in with that, but numerous serial killers were traumatized as children and their sexual confusion was formed around age 10. Richard Ramirez had an absolutely chilling background in his formative years, it's no wonder he was so bleepd up. If someone who was victimized as a child and became an adult who reverted/converted (if applicable...) to functional, consensual adult sexuality, it would be a real achievement.
_________________
GOAT MAGIC REEL
SEDALE TRIBUTE
EDDIE DONX! |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Reflexx
Franchise Player
Joined: 25 Jun 2005
Posts: 11163
|
| Posted: Sun May 22, 2016 5:39 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| shnxx wrote: | | Fan0Bynum17 wrote: |
Having an attraction to children, on its own, doesn't make someone a monster. What is he supposed to do about it beyond not act on it? Seriously, what do you want him to do about it? Kill himself? |
Giving a pedophile babysitter (true story, apparently) a platform, where he talks about relieving himself in the bathroom after seeing a beautiful little girl is definitely crossing the line. |
Just the fact that the person would take a job as a babysitter is wrong and extremely risky. It's like an alcoholic taking a job as a bartender and fanaticizing about drinking during his breaks. It's only a matter of time before they crack. It's irresponsible to put himself in that situation and he knows it. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
shnxx
Star Player
Joined: 09 May 2013
Posts: 3402
|
| Posted: Sun May 22, 2016 8:29 pm Post subject: |
|
|
One thing that is worrisome is that we know that human sexuality is not entirely binary.
Depending on how socially accepted a sexual preference is, the prevalence in society increases or decreases.
This may be simply a function of the criminalized behavior being hidden from statistics because of the punishment, but it may also reflect a bona fide change in prevalence, simply due to social influence.
Although I believe in objective biological reality of most sexual preferences, I also do think that it's plausible that some portion of the population is somewhat plastic and these pedophiles having public platforms to speak positively (i.e. he was talking about masturbating after seeing a young girl) about pedophilia may lead to increased acceptance and thus increased prevalence in society.
Just as we do not tolerate openly racist hate speech (at least, when it comes from whites), as a society we should not tolerate openly pedophilloic speech.
If we are going to let pedophilloic free speech, then I don't see why any type of vile ideas should not have free speech. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
unleasHell
Franchise Player
Joined: 16 Apr 2001
Posts: 11591
Location: Stay Thirsty my Friends
|
| Posted: Sun May 22, 2016 8:59 pm Post subject: |
|
|
FINALLY, an allegation that doesn't involve Bill Cosby!!!
_________________
“Always remember... Rumors are carried by haters, spread by fools, and accepted by idiots.” |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
LakerLuke
Starting Rotation
Joined: 28 Apr 2016
Posts: 630
|
| Posted: Sun May 22, 2016 9:25 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Huey Lewis & The News wrote: | >pedophile ring
ONE RING TO RULE THEM ALL |
 So wrong, but well played sir. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Fan0Bynum17
Franchise Player
Joined: 30 Nov 2005
Posts: 15436
|
| Posted: Sun May 22, 2016 10:35 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| shnxx wrote: | One thing that is worrisome is that we know that human sexuality is not entirely binary.
Depending on how socially accepted a sexual preference is, the prevalence in society increases or decreases.
This may be simply a function of the criminalized behavior being hidden from statistics because of the punishment, but it may also reflect a bona fide change in prevalence, simply due to social influence.
Although I believe in objective biological reality of most sexual preferences, I also do think that it's plausible that some portion of the population is somewhat plastic and these pedophiles having public platforms to speak positively (i.e. he was talking about (bleep) after seeing a young girl) about pedophilia may lead to increased acceptance and thus increased prevalence in society.
Just as we do not tolerate openly racist hate speech (at least, when it comes from whites), as a society we should not tolerate openly pedophilloic speech.
If we are going to let pedophilloic free speech, then I don't see why any type of vile ideas should not have free speech. |
They should, and they do. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Fan0Bynum17
Franchise Player
Joined: 30 Nov 2005
Posts: 15436
|
| Posted: Sun May 22, 2016 10:42 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| non-player zealot wrote: | | Fan0Bynum17 wrote: |
I don't know whether a pedophile can revert, nor do I know if reverting (as opposed to converting) is even an applicable term for them, because it assumes they ever had normal adult consent-based sexuality. I believe there is some merit to the saying "resistance is persistence," it's often been true for me in my life. |
Valid points, you could very well be right, please don't think I'm trying to force you to yield to my opinions. I will say that I don't assume that they're stuck forever, everyone's an individual and I do believe they can change given the effort and willingness required. Somehow I think they must internalize the "wrongness" of any thoughts that go to those places. Maybe I have the typical societal attitude towards them as a group to an extent, but as far as I go, I think it's the severity of this as a social problem that gets to me. I'll admit there are some gut level feelings behind my views. You're right to point out that not everyone has the same background, maybe I didn't express that well enough. I do realize that there's a lot of complexity inherent in a sexual disorder that profound. It could be a ingrained pattern of thought and feelings from childhood, and it also could've sprung from the adult being victimized themselves as a child, thus their lives were tainted through no fault of their own.
Not to lump this in with that, but numerous serial killers were traumatized as children and their sexual confusion was formed around age 10. Richard Ramirez had an absolutely chilling background in his formative years, it's no wonder he was so bleepd up. If someone who was victimized as a child and became an adult who reverted/converted (if applicable...) to functional, consensual adult sexuality, it would be a real achievement. |
I'm sure there are multiple ways to reach that brain state, and what they're capable of in terms of altering it probably depends a lot on the individual. I think this should be left up to professional psychologists to determine, and we won't learn more about it if we basically demonize them for their thoughts and feelings, which will force them in the shadows and be distrustful of people (including psychologists.) I don't know if telling them their feelings are wrong is the best way to go. We don't want them to self-hate and judge themselves for things that are not their fault (those things rarely lead to anything good,) but an intellectual understanding of who they are and why acting on these feelings is wrong, is probably the best way to go. That's only my amateur opinion though, which comes from my long history in therapy. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Kazaam
Star Player
Joined: 04 Aug 2005
Posts: 1909
|
| Posted: Mon May 23, 2016 6:39 am Post subject: |
|
|
Most of hollywood... well I don't really have to say which way they lean...
Horrible, narcissistic, deviant's and I hope to see the all exposed for what they are. A bunch of smug, elitist, scumbags. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
|
|
