Did you guys listen to Mason and Ireland right now? Ireland said speaking to Luke and pelinka he came away that the Lakers will be making sweeping changes in the offseason and Ingram most likely player to be moved since he's the one everyone asking about.
Sounds like Ireland reaching the wrong conclusion- nothing new there.
I have no doubt about sweeping changes being made, but I'll be surprised if Ingram is the one who gets dealt. He's getting the most interest from rival GMs because he's got the highest upside of the Lakers' players and none of the attitude/entitlement/work ethic issues that hover around DLo.
Based on the above, the things Magic has said about Ingram and DLo, plus other things (DLo's benching, the heavy partying rumors, etc) I think it's much more likely that DLo gets dealt than Ingram.
Notice how Ingram has been talking lately about becoming more of a leader for this team ? Where do you think that's coming from ? I think that's coming from his talks with Magic and that Magic is pushing him into a leadership role.
Why would the Lakers/media go out of their way to trash DLO if the plan is to trade him? He is not being buttered up one bit, and if anything his value is lowered.
Meanwhile, buttering up Ingram also serves and nice purpose too. I find it curious that PG13 shares agents with DLO and Jules.
I don't think the LAkers as an org have trashed DLo in the media. (Byron is a different story.) The whole benching story was a much bigger deal on LG than it ever was anywhere else- it didn't really get any national play, as opposed to the Swaggy snapchat which was the #1 story nationally for a while. That incident and his attitude with the media is what has driven most of the national perception of Russel. DLo's issues with the media are largely self-created.
The questions around DLo center on his maturity (or lack thereof) and that lowers his trade value vs if there were none of those questions. But those questions have been around since last year- it's not like it's something the new regime has propagated.
But I don't think they are dead set on trading him. In their preferred scenario, DLo would respond well to the prodding he's getting (as he seems to have responded to the benching), and they'd be able to land George as a FA, keeping both Ingram and DLo.
I was just saying that if one of the two is traded, I think it's more likely that DLo would be traded than Ingram.
Personally, I hope neither one gets traded and that the sweeping changes involve Moz Deng getting moved somehow.
Yeah, the ideal would be PG13 + DLO/Ingram as a core. Just don't see this FO being that patient. The agent angle IMO is what makes me also think that Ingram may be the one going out. Just a guess. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals
Did you guys listen to Mason and Ireland right now? Ireland said speaking to Luke and pelinka he came away that the Lakers will be making sweeping changes in the offseason and Ingram most likely player to be moved since he's the one everyone asking about.
Whoa.
My prediction is Ingram + JC for PG13.
Apparently DLO/PG13/Jules are all repped by same agency.
Been trying to tell people about the agent angle for a minute now. You'd have to figure that they'd be angling hard to have arguably the 3 most important players on the Lakers.
That said, I think either Ingram or Russell is an overpay for George, unless you're attaching Mozgov or Deng to them.
Agreed.
Way too much for a guy in the last year of his deal who has a well-publicized desire to play for his hometown Lakers.
Joined: 15 Jul 2009 Posts: 18492 Location: The Garden Island
Posted: Tue Mar 28, 2017 2:08 pm Post subject:
yinoma2001 wrote:
Yeah, the ideal would be PG13 + DLO/Ingram as a core. Just don't see this FO being that patient. The agent angle IMO is what makes me also think that Ingram may be the one going out. Just a guess.
With Pelinka involved, he knows the dangers of an agency having too much influence on a team, so I trust him to navigate those waters.
And we heard the rumor that PG's camp apparently said "Don't trade away the young guys- wait until PG comes in FA." Now that also preserves PG's last shot at getting a super-max deal next year, so there may be a dual purpose to it, but if PG really does want to come to LA, it would make sense that he would want as much talent on the roster as possible.
I think this is Ireland misinterpreting what "sweeping changes" are going to be made. The Lakers getting more calls on BI than anyone else doesn't mean he's going to get traded. It just means he has real value.
I wouldn't be surprised to see them make a hard push for Blake this summer though. That's the type of splash I could see them going for. But that's where those deals for Deng and Moz really come back to bite us. If those were 2 year deals, they'd have plenty of room in 2018 for PG. It will be much harder to create that space unless they can find a willing partner by adding some assets (Clarkson most likely) to move one of those deals.
Yeah, the ideal would be PG13 + DLO/Ingram as a core. Just don't see this FO being that patient. The agent angle IMO is what makes me also think that Ingram may be the one going out. Just a guess.
With Pelinka involved, he knows the dangers of an agency having too much influence on a team, so I trust him to navigate those waters.
And we heard the rumor that PG's camp apparently said "Don't trade away the young guys- wait until PG comes in FA." Now that also preserves PG's last shot at getting a super-max deal next year, so there may be a dual purpose to it, but if PG really does want to come to LA, it would make sense that he would want as much talent on the roster as possible.
I think this is Ireland misinterpreting what "sweeping changes" are going to be made. The Lakers getting more calls on BI than anyone else doesn't mean he's going to get traded. It just means he has real value.
I wouldn't be surprised to see them make a hard push for Blake this summer though. That's the type of splash I could see them going for. But that's where those deals for Deng and Moz really come back to bite us. If those were 2 year deals, they'd have plenty of room in 2018 for PG. It will be much harder to create that space unless they can find a willing partner by adding some assets (Clarkson most likely) to move one of those deals.
I haven't run the numbers but maxing Blake would require us to move an asset or 2 THIS summer, let alone having enough for 2018 (which I don't think is possible unless we magically move Deng/Moz/JC/Jules without anything coming back salary wise). _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals
He has played a lot of minutes and he had some injuries which should require him to rest.
I'm okay with this, although the games aren't fun to watch without him. Despite playing the same amount of games as each other, Ingram still leads Malcolm Brogdan by 205 minutes. Brogdan needs to play 25 minutes a game the rest of the way to surpass him. Brogdan is undeniably having the better season, but he's a 24 year old "vet".
He has played a lot of minutes and he had some injuries which should require him to rest.
I'm okay with this, although the games aren't fun to watch without him. Despite playing the same amount of games as each other, Ingram still leads Malcolm Brogdan by 205 minutes. Brogdan needs to play 25 minutes a game the rest of the way to surpass him. Brogdan is undeniably having the better season, but he's a 24 year old "vet".
Yeah, he's basically the same age as JC, who's been in the league 3 seasons already...
From all the Lakers stuff I hear from team reporters, Ingram is the one the team is high on the most. Based on work ethic and potential. I know everyone in the league (except for a select few) can be traded for a price, but I hope he stays a Laker for a long, long time.
With that said, we should rest him against the Wolves, Kings, Pelicans, Wolves again, and maybe Golden State if we haven't clinched the second worst record by then...
Joined: 02 Jan 2011 Posts: 36081 Location: 502 Bad Gateway
Posted: Wed Mar 29, 2017 12:35 pm Post subject:
He has potentially the most unguardable shot on the team if he can get a post fadeaway down. His post numbers in general are incredible. It would suck to trade him.
He has potentially the most unguardable shot on the team if he can get a post fadeaway down. His post numbers in general are incredible. It would suck to trade him.
From all the Lakers stuff I hear from team reporters, Ingram is the one the team is high on the most. Based on work ethic and potential. I know everyone in the league (except for a select few) can be traded for a price, but I hope he stays a Laker for a long, long time.
With that said, we should rest him against the Wolves, Kings, Pelicans, Wolves again, and maybe Golden State if we haven't clinched the second worst record by then...
If he wasn't traded for Cousins then I doubt he would be for George.
I think Ingram is the least likely of our young core to be traded.
Joined: 02 Jan 2011 Posts: 36081 Location: 502 Bad Gateway
Posted: Wed Mar 29, 2017 12:47 pm Post subject:
KindCrippler2000 wrote:
greenfrog wrote:
He has potentially the most unguardable shot on the team if he can get a post fadeaway down. His post numbers in general are incredible. It would suck to trade him.
He has potentially the most unguardable shot on the team if he can get a post fadeaway down. His post numbers in general are incredible. It would suck to trade him.
So people talk about Ingram's footwork limiting his scoring potential. Can anyone break down what they mean by that? Because I don't really get it.
Paging GT...
He has difficulty going from being on the move to being an immediate scoring threat, and has to gather himself, which allows the defense to recover. How often do you see him coming around a screen and go up with a quality jumper? He's very inefficient when pulling up off of the pick & roll as well.
IMO, you have to be able to do freakish athletic things to be a fantastic scorer without being able to do that. The question, which I can't answer with certainty either way, is how fixable that is.
He has potentially the most unguardable shot on the team if he can get a post fadeaway down. His post numbers in general are incredible. It would suck to trade him.
Pretty neat. Zubac's isn't too shabby either (75.1 percentile). I wonder if Luke will take a more inside-out approach when Zubac and Ingram are on the court next season. If they can generate offense in the post, it should open up more three point shots for the rest of the team. I think they'll be fine offensively. Defensively, they will need an additional 2-3 seasons to come along.
So people talk about Ingram's footwork limiting his scoring potential. Can anyone break down what they mean by that? Because I don't really get it.
Paging GT...
He has difficulty going from being on the move to being an immediate scoring threat, and has to gather himself, which allows the defense to recover. How often do you see him coming around a screen and go up with a quality jumper? He's very inefficient when pulling up off of the pick & roll as well.
IMO, you have to be able to do freakish athletic things to be a fantastic scorer without being able to do that. The question, which I can't answer with certainty either way, is how fixable that is.
I see. Yeah, that makes sense to me. Honest question -- we've seen the Dirk comparison. How often did Dirk do that kind of stuff?
I'm watching this video:
and honestly I don't many shots off of screens either? It's just length + shooting... though obviously Dirk's a GOAT shooter and that's a tough task for anyone to replicate.
So people talk about Ingram's footwork limiting his scoring potential. Can anyone break down what they mean by that? Because I don't really get it.
His footwork is poor, he is often out of balance. I'm not concerned because most young players don't have a good footwork and a couple of sessions with Kobe followed by a lot of training can take care of this in a single offseason. Later in the season his level of aggressiveness was higher, that is the main point to to believe he is going to be a scorer. I got the impression that what was limiting his aggressiveness was his high IQ, he know he didn't have the skillset to score at this level, but through the season he has developed a few skills and as a consequence he has been more aggressive and if that is the case about his early lack of aggression I don't think we may put a cap on his ceiling because he has the physical tools and is a hard worker, so it is a matter of how much he can improve through workouts. I can't predict he is going to be a great player because at this point he don't have the skills, but I believe he can because I don't see any huge red flag and I think he is going to be able to bulk up too to eventually play the PF spot where I believe his skillset can make him a dangerous player.
So people talk about Ingram's footwork limiting his scoring potential. Can anyone break down what they mean by that? Because I don't really get it.
Paging GT...
He has difficulty going from being on the move to being an immediate scoring threat, and has to gather himself, which allows the defense to recover. How often do you see him coming around a screen and go up with a quality jumper? He's very inefficient when pulling up off of the pick & roll as well.
IMO, you have to be able to do freakish athletic things to be a fantastic scorer without being able to do that. The question, which I can't answer with certainty either way, is how fixable that is.
I see. Yeah, that makes sense to me. Honest question -- we've seen the Dirk comparison. How often did Dirk do that kind of stuff?
I'm watching this video:
and honestly I don't many shots off of screens either? It's just length + shooting... though obviously Dirk's a GOAT shooter and that's a tough task for anyone to replicate.
This is the exact reason why Dirk has been my offensive archetype for him to follow since the summer. Other guys that he's compared to, like George, Durant, or even Kawhi had a fluidity at that age that he doesn't possess w/his footwork. Or Giannis, who's athleticism was more freakish for his size.
But what Ingram does have is triple threat/high post ability, hence the Dirk comparison. You're right, Dirk's probably the GOAT shooter amongst bigs (with a high degree of usage anyway), so it's gonna be hard for Ingram to replicate that, but it's possible. And at the very worst, it's the right developmental path to go down, and if he turns out to be 70% of what Dirk is you still have a damn good offensive player to go along w/his defensive potential.
So people talk about Ingram's footwork limiting his scoring potential. Can anyone break down what they mean by that? Because I don't really get it.
Paging GT...
He has difficulty going from being on the move to being an immediate scoring threat, and has to gather himself, which allows the defense to recover. How often do you see him coming around a screen and go up with a quality jumper? He's very inefficient when pulling up off of the pick & roll as well.
IMO, you have to be able to do freakish athletic things to be a fantastic scorer without being able to do that. The question, which I can't answer with certainty either way, is how fixable that is.
I see. Yeah, that makes sense to me. Honest question -- we've seen the Dirk comparison. How often did Dirk do that kind of stuff?
I'm watching this video:
and honestly I don't many shots off of screens either? It's just length + shooting... though obviously Dirk's a GOAT shooter and that's a tough task for anyone to replicate.
This is the exact reason why Dirk has been my offensive archetype for him to follow since the summer. Other guys that he's compared to, like George, Durant, or even Kawhi had a fluidity at that age that he doesn't possess w/his footwork. Or Giannis, who's athleticism was more freakish for his size.
But what Ingram does have is triple threat/high post ability, hence the Dirk comparison. You're right, Dirk's probably the GOAT shooter amongst bigs (with a high degree of usage anyway), so it's gonna be hard for Ingram to replicate that, but it's possible. And at the very worst, it's the right developmental path to go down, and if he turns out to be 70% of what Dirk is you still have a damn good offensive player to go along w/his defensive potential.
Got it. I can see where you're coming from, then, in terms of BI not being a huge volume scorer. It's pretty telling that his career high is 22, and that he hasn't had the kind of explosive scoring games that we saw from Russell as a rookie.
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I can see where you're coming from, then, in terms of BI not being a huge volume scorer. It's pretty telling that his career high is 22, and that he hasn't had the kind of explosive scoring games that we saw from Russell as a rookie.
