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Yellow Starting Rotation
Joined: 31 Oct 2018 Posts: 265
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Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 7:22 am Post subject: |
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ZachLowe wrote: | My Ingram optimism has taken a slight hit. He has recorded only 9.3 drives per 100 possessions, down from 15 last season, and his assist rate has cratered. Some of that is the predictable result of playing alongside LeBron, and of Ingram not getting enough lead ball-handling duty among bench mobs.
But teaming with LeBron in an ultra-fast attack should nudge any wing toward more efficient shot selection. Ingram's shot profile is almost identical to last season's. Some of that is on him.
He settles for long 2s way too often both on the pick-and-roll, and when he has a size mismatch in the post.
Yeah, Ingram is skinny and J.J. Barea is an irritant, but still: Even a run-of-the-mill face-up drive keeps the offense moving, and might produce a hockey assist.
The Lakers are scoring only 0.78 points per possession when Ingram shoots out of a pick-and-roll, or dishes to a teammate who shoots right away -- one of the lowest marks in the league, per Second Spectrum. Only 16 percent of ball screens for Ingram have led to those one-pass-away shots for teammates -- the fourth-lowest figure among 174 ball-handlers who have run at least 20 pick-and-rolls, per Second Spectrum.
In other words: Ingram is either taking blah shots after slithering around picks, or making unproductive passes. He's barely snagging rebounds. He needs to do more stuff.
I'm still bullish on Ingram's versatility, vision, and creativity. The LeBron transition is hard for everyone. But Ingram's first seven games this season haven't been encouraging. |
http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/25219366/zach-lowe-10-things-like-including-jayson-tatum-nba |
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Inspector Gadget Retired Number
Joined: 18 Apr 2016 Posts: 46491
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Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 8:09 am Post subject: |
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Yellow wrote: | ZachLowe wrote: | My Ingram optimism has taken a slight hit. He has recorded only 9.3 drives per 100 possessions, down from 15 last season, and his assist rate has cratered. Some of that is the predictable result of playing alongside LeBron, and of Ingram not getting enough lead ball-handling duty among bench mobs.
But teaming with LeBron in an ultra-fast attack should nudge any wing toward more efficient shot selection. Ingram's shot profile is almost identical to last season's. Some of that is on him.
He settles for long 2s way too often both on the pick-and-roll, and when he has a size mismatch in the post.
Yeah, Ingram is skinny and J.J. Barea is an irritant, but still: Even a run-of-the-mill face-up drive keeps the offense moving, and might produce a hockey assist.
The Lakers are scoring only 0.78 points per possession when Ingram shoots out of a pick-and-roll, or dishes to a teammate who shoots right away -- one of the lowest marks in the league, per Second Spectrum. Only 16 percent of ball screens for Ingram have led to those one-pass-away shots for teammates -- the fourth-lowest figure among 174 ball-handlers who have run at least 20 pick-and-rolls, per Second Spectrum.
In other words: Ingram is either taking blah shots after slithering around picks, or making unproductive passes. He's barely snagging rebounds. He needs to do more stuff.
I'm still bullish on Ingram's versatility, vision, and creativity. The LeBron transition is hard for everyone. But Ingram's first seven games this season haven't been encouraging. |
http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/25219366/zach-lowe-10-things-like-including-jayson-tatum-nba |
BI has been playing very well, Lowe should focus on his Boston Celtics and there underachieving young players in Brown/Tatum. |
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AirTupac Star Player
Joined: 04 Feb 2018 Posts: 1234
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Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 8:20 am Post subject: |
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Tatum had 2 points, 7 rebounds on 11% last night vs Suns and Brown is averaging 11 points on 31% for the season. Ingram is doing just fine on a new team with new pieces. |
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VicXLakers Franchise Player
Joined: 08 Feb 2006 Posts: 11823
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Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 8:44 am Post subject: |
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AirTupac wrote: | Tatum had 2 points, 7 rebounds on 11% last night vs Suns and Brown is averaging 11 points on 31% for the season. Ingram is doing just fine on a new team with new pieces. |
Does Jayson Tatum need a shot selection intervention?
http://www.celticslife.com/2018/11/does-jayson-tatum-need-shot-selection.html
More than half his shots have been pull-up jumpers, too, and while some of those have been open treys, a lot have not, and as much as Jayson may be one of the better offensive options on Boston's roster, he's showing some really concerning tendencies with how he's using that talent.
Dave DuFour
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@DaveDuFourNBA
Tatum needs to drop the Kobe stuff man.
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6:52 PM - Nov 5, 2018
Ben Detrick
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@bdetrick
nothing is funnier than watching tatum brick fadeaway midrange jumpers after he spent last summer under the tutelage of maestro kobe
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8:53 PM - Nov 5, 2018 |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 8:45 am Post subject: |
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at how they blame Kobe for Tatum's struggles.
Man does NBA twitter just hate the Lakers. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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VicXLakers Franchise Player
Joined: 08 Feb 2006 Posts: 11823
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Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 8:46 am Post subject: |
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yinoma2001 wrote: | at how they blame Kobe for Tatum's struggles.
Man does NBA twitter just hate the Lakers. |
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Inspector Gadget Retired Number
Joined: 18 Apr 2016 Posts: 46491
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Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 9:00 am Post subject: |
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AirTupac wrote: | Tatum had 2 points, 7 rebounds on 11% last night vs Suns and Brown is averaging 11 points on 31% for the season. Ingram is doing just fine on a new team with new pieces. |
Even BI seemed to have admit that the suspension messed up flow when a reporter asked him about it after the Minny game, it’s obvious that BI is ahead of the curve in development compared to Tatum/Brown/Josh Jackson. |
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numero-ocho Franchise Player
Joined: 27 Jul 2004 Posts: 18190 Location: Los Angeles, CA
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Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 9:24 am Post subject: |
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VicXLakers wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | at how they blame Kobe for Tatum's struggles.
Man does NBA twitter just hate the Lakers. |
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Both Duke boys. Let's blame Coach K. _________________ "Suck it up. Don't be a baby. Do your job." - Kobe Bryant |
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venturalakersfan Retired Number
Joined: 14 Apr 2001 Posts: 144432 Location: The Gold Coast
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Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 9:31 am Post subject: |
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Inspector Gadget wrote: | AirTupac wrote: | Tatum had 2 points, 7 rebounds on 11% last night vs Suns and Brown is averaging 11 points on 31% for the season. Ingram is doing just fine on a new team with new pieces. |
Even BI seemed to have admit that the suspension messed up flow when a reporter asked him about it after the Minny game, it’s obvious that BI is ahead of the curve in development compared to Tatum/Brown/Josh Jackson. |
It is far from obvious and Ingram should be smarter and not get suspended for a cheap shot. _________________ RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023. |
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Inspector Gadget Retired Number
Joined: 18 Apr 2016 Posts: 46491
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Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 9:34 am Post subject: |
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venturalakersfan wrote: | Inspector Gadget wrote: | AirTupac wrote: | Tatum had 2 points, 7 rebounds on 11% last night vs Suns and Brown is averaging 11 points on 31% for the season. Ingram is doing just fine on a new team with new pieces. |
Even BI seemed to have admit that the suspension messed up flow when a reporter asked him about it after the Minny game, it’s obvious that BI is ahead of the curve in development compared to Tatum/Brown/Josh Jackson. |
It is far from obvious and Ingram should be smarter and not get suspended for a cheap shot. |
Maybe if the Refs didn’t swallow there whistle, BI wouldn’t have overreacted with frustration, even the most realistic fans with a eye test are admitting that the officiating has been horrid this year. |
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JerryMagicKobe Moderator
Joined: 28 Jul 2005 Posts: 15100
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Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 9:38 am Post subject: |
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Inspector Gadget wrote: | venturalakersfan wrote: | Inspector Gadget wrote: | AirTupac wrote: | Tatum had 2 points, 7 rebounds on 11% last night vs Suns and Brown is averaging 11 points on 31% for the season. Ingram is doing just fine on a new team with new pieces. |
Even BI seemed to have admit that the suspension messed up flow when a reporter asked him about it after the Minny game, it’s obvious that BI is ahead of the curve in development compared to Tatum/Brown/Josh Jackson. |
It is far from obvious and Ingram should be smarter and not get suspended for a cheap shot. |
Maybe if the Refs didn’t swallow there whistle, BI wouldn’t have overreacted with frustration, even the most realistic fans with a eye test are admitting that the officiating has been horrid this year. |
Somehow every other player managed not to get bounced for 4 games. |
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LakerLogic Franchise Player
Joined: 27 Mar 2005 Posts: 17886
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Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 9:38 am Post subject: |
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So much for Tatum being far ahead of BI.
Celtics had no pressure to win last year and they had cupcake opponents in the playoffs. Hayward looks terrible as well. |
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SDLakersFan Star Player
Joined: 01 Apr 2012 Posts: 2044
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Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 9:42 am Post subject: |
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The other night Minnesota was smacking us around. Luke benches Ingram/Ball and we go on a run.
Rondo and Hart simply have more heart and give more effort on both ends. Those two need to put their egos to the side and come off the bench.
McGee / Chandler
Kuzma
Lebron / Ingram
Hart / Stepenson
Rondo / Ball
It’s best for everybody. Ingram is not a 2 and Lebron can’t play the 4 in this conference. And if Zo wants to pout up & down the court - ship his ass out. |
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numero-ocho Franchise Player
Joined: 27 Jul 2004 Posts: 18190 Location: Los Angeles, CA
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Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 9:51 am Post subject: |
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LakerLogic wrote: | So much for Tatum being far ahead of BI.
Celtics had no pressure to win last year and they had cupcake opponents in the playoffs. Hayward looks terrible as well. |
It's not like the Lakers had pressure to win last season either.
Both are struggling to find their respective roles with new players but when Brandon performs in the playoffs like Tatum did then we can say the playing field is level. _________________ "Suck it up. Don't be a baby. Do your job." - Kobe Bryant |
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Sentient Meat Franchise Player
Joined: 04 Jul 2014 Posts: 12978
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Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 9:56 am Post subject: |
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Ingram has a completely new team, has been disrupted by a suspension and is scoring more efficiently than Tatum or Donovan Mitchell.
Yet somehow people know BI should be traded but the other two are bonafide stars. |
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Inspector Gadget Retired Number
Joined: 18 Apr 2016 Posts: 46491
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Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 9:57 am Post subject: |
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LakerLogic wrote: | So much for Tatum being far ahead of BI.
Celtics had no pressure to win last year and they had cupcake opponents in the playoffs. Hayward looks terrible as well. |
FWIW, GT called Brad Stevens overrated, I will take his word as he knows his ish regarding basketball stuff, IMO unless BOS ends up with the Kings pick this year (Top 3).. we will pass them in level of play and championships especially if KD or Kawhi commit to the Lakers next summer or we swing a trade for AD. a lot of people hate to admit it but the Lakers are very close to owning the league and being the top dog again. |
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RG73 Franchise Player
Joined: 14 Jul 2001 Posts: 11508
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Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 10:08 am Post subject: |
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Inspector Gadget wrote: |
Maybe if the Refs didn’t swallow there whistle, BI wouldn’t have overreacted with frustration, even the most realistic fans with a eye test are admitting that the officiating has been horrid this year. |
One of the things we first teach kids in kindergarten is that you cannot let your frustrations escalate into physical violence against someone else. That isn't an excuse for an adult. |
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manlisten Star Player
Joined: 09 Jul 2004 Posts: 3169
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Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 10:09 am Post subject: |
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Yellow wrote: | ZachLowe wrote: | My Ingram optimism has taken a slight hit. He has recorded only 9.3 drives per 100 possessions, down from 15 last season, and his assist rate has cratered. Some of that is the predictable result of playing alongside LeBron, and of Ingram not getting enough lead ball-handling duty among bench mobs.
But teaming with LeBron in an ultra-fast attack should nudge any wing toward more efficient shot selection. Ingram's shot profile is almost identical to last season's. Some of that is on him.
He settles for long 2s way too often both on the pick-and-roll, and when he has a size mismatch in the post.
Yeah, Ingram is skinny and J.J. Barea is an irritant, but still: Even a run-of-the-mill face-up drive keeps the offense moving, and might produce a hockey assist.
The Lakers are scoring only 0.78 points per possession when Ingram shoots out of a pick-and-roll, or dishes to a teammate who shoots right away -- one of the lowest marks in the league, per Second Spectrum. Only 16 percent of ball screens for Ingram have led to those one-pass-away shots for teammates -- the fourth-lowest figure among 174 ball-handlers who have run at least 20 pick-and-rolls, per Second Spectrum.
In other words: Ingram is either taking blah shots after slithering around picks, or making unproductive passes. He's barely snagging rebounds. He needs to do more stuff.
I'm still bullish on Ingram's versatility, vision, and creativity. The LeBron transition is hard for everyone. But Ingram's first seven games this season haven't been encouraging. |
http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/25219366/zach-lowe-10-things-like-including-jayson-tatum-nba |
I don't read Lowe that often but he seems to rely heavily on stats and then just rationalizes from there. I rarely get the impression that he really watches what he writes about, which is tough when you're supposed to cover all 30 teams. _________________ It was reminiscent of one of those Most Interesting Man in the World advertisements: "I don't always shoot 6-for-28 from the field, but when I do, I become the youngest player in league history to score 28,000 career points." |
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Inspector Gadget Retired Number
Joined: 18 Apr 2016 Posts: 46491
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Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 10:12 am Post subject: |
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RG73 wrote: | Inspector Gadget wrote: |
Maybe if the Refs didn’t swallow there whistle, BI wouldn’t have overreacted with frustration, even the most realistic fans with a eye test are admitting that the officiating has been horrid this year. |
One of the things we first teach kids in kindergarten is that you cannot let your frustrations escalate into physical violence against someone else. That isn't an excuse for an adult. |
So if someone is upsetting you, you are taught to ignore it? That would mean bullies can take over the world without people defending themselves cause they are taught to be respectful. |
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Jesusdelonla Franchise Player
Joined: 24 Jan 2018 Posts: 15430
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Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 10:28 am Post subject: |
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It's funny how an accurate observation from Zach Lowe turned into bi vs Tatum/brown.
Good job ig. |
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Inspector Gadget Retired Number
Joined: 18 Apr 2016 Posts: 46491
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Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 10:37 am Post subject: |
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Jesusdelonla wrote: | It's funny how an accurate observation from Zach Lowe turned into bi vs Tatum/brown.
Good job ig. |
It’s accurate to you because you even want BI coming off the bench, it is obvious that BI is better then a lot of young prospects right now and that includes Simmons who doesn’t look as good as last year, once BI gets back his rhythm that he’s capable of displaying this team is gonna rock the league. |
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epak Retired Number
Joined: 30 Aug 2005 Posts: 34147
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Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 11:20 am Post subject: |
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Yellow wrote: | ZachLowe wrote: | My Ingram optimism has taken a slight hit. He has recorded only 9.3 drives per 100 possessions, down from 15 last season, and his assist rate has cratered. Some of that is the predictable result of playing alongside LeBron, and of Ingram not getting enough lead ball-handling duty among bench mobs.
But teaming with LeBron in an ultra-fast attack should nudge any wing toward more efficient shot selection. Ingram's shot profile is almost identical to last season's. Some of that is on him.
He settles for long 2s way too often both on the pick-and-roll, and when he has a size mismatch in the post.
Yeah, Ingram is skinny and J.J. Barea is an irritant, but still: Even a run-of-the-mill face-up drive keeps the offense moving, and might produce a hockey assist.
The Lakers are scoring only 0.78 points per possession when Ingram shoots out of a pick-and-roll, or dishes to a teammate who shoots right away -- one of the lowest marks in the league, per Second Spectrum. Only 16 percent of ball screens for Ingram have led to those one-pass-away shots for teammates -- the fourth-lowest figure among 174 ball-handlers who have run at least 20 pick-and-rolls, per Second Spectrum.
In other words: Ingram is either taking blah shots after slithering around picks, or making unproductive passes. He's barely snagging rebounds. He needs to do more stuff.
I'm still bullish on Ingram's versatility, vision, and creativity. The LeBron transition is hard for everyone. But Ingram's first seven games this season haven't been encouraging. |
http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/25219366/zach-lowe-10-things-like-including-jayson-tatum-nba |
I didnt know a Boston fan (ZL) would join LG. Welcome, Mr. Lowe. |
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Yellow Starting Rotation
Joined: 31 Oct 2018 Posts: 265
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Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 12:25 pm Post subject: |
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Inspector Gadget wrote: | Yellow wrote: | ZachLowe wrote: | My Ingram optimism has taken a slight hit. He has recorded only 9.3 drives per 100 possessions, down from 15 last season, and his assist rate has cratered. Some of that is the predictable result of playing alongside LeBron, and of Ingram not getting enough lead ball-handling duty among bench mobs.
But teaming with LeBron in an ultra-fast attack should nudge any wing toward more efficient shot selection. Ingram's shot profile is almost identical to last season's. Some of that is on him.
He settles for long 2s way too often both on the pick-and-roll, and when he has a size mismatch in the post.
Yeah, Ingram is skinny and J.J. Barea is an irritant, but still: Even a run-of-the-mill face-up drive keeps the offense moving, and might produce a hockey assist.
The Lakers are scoring only 0.78 points per possession when Ingram shoots out of a pick-and-roll, or dishes to a teammate who shoots right away -- one of the lowest marks in the league, per Second Spectrum. Only 16 percent of ball screens for Ingram have led to those one-pass-away shots for teammates -- the fourth-lowest figure among 174 ball-handlers who have run at least 20 pick-and-rolls, per Second Spectrum.
In other words: Ingram is either taking blah shots after slithering around picks, or making unproductive passes. He's barely snagging rebounds. He needs to do more stuff.
I'm still bullish on Ingram's versatility, vision, and creativity. The LeBron transition is hard for everyone. But Ingram's first seven games this season haven't been encouraging. |
http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/25219366/zach-lowe-10-things-like-including-jayson-tatum-nba |
BI has been playing very well, Lowe should focus on his Boston Celtics and there underachieving young players in Brown/Tatum. |
AirTupac wrote: | Tatum had 2 points, 7 rebounds on 11% last night vs Suns and Brown is averaging 11 points on 31% for the season. Ingram is doing just fine on a new team with new pieces. |
He critiqued Tatum in the same article. |
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TheBlackMamba Star Player
Joined: 23 Apr 2007 Posts: 9057
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Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 1:18 pm Post subject: |
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Not to turn this into a Tatum thread, but I never got carried away with the hype machine which was absolutely out of control coming out of the past summer. He's got a super advanced scorer's skillset for a player that young, I'll definitely give him that, but I don't see it translating to the superstar everybody already anointed him as without a lot more work being put into other aspects of his game to round it all out (because he doesn't have elite physical talent to fall back on). That's going to take years. And he damn well isn't even close to Kobe Bean Bryant right now, for everyone who likes to bring that comparison up. Mitchell's better, tbh. |
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LuciusAllen Star Player
Joined: 24 Sep 2005 Posts: 5786
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Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 1:30 pm Post subject: |
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venturalakersfan wrote: | Inspector Gadget wrote: | AirTupac wrote: | Tatum had 2 points, 7 rebounds on 11% last night vs Suns and Brown is averaging 11 points on 31% for the season. Ingram is doing just fine on a new team with new pieces. |
Even BI seemed to have admit that the suspension messed up flow when a reporter asked him about it after the Minny game, it’s obvious that BI is ahead of the curve in development compared to Tatum/Brown/Josh Jackson. |
It is far from obvious and Ingram should be smarter and not get suspended for a cheap shot. |
It's all part of the learning curve. In a way, I think it was a good thing. He learned a lot from that incident. First of all, he has always been so quiet and mild-mannered on the court. Now he's getting feisty. He wants his share of calls, he wants to show players he will not be pushed around so easily. Isn't that a good developmental step?
Secondly, he has hopefully learned a hard lesson in the dangers of not controlling your emotions. One moment of losing his cool cost him time, money, and rhythm. If he sees the importance of channeling his anger more productively, he can take steps towards fixing the problem. There's just no benefit to looking at this any other way than long-term.
Dr. Lucius is available for psychotherapy for just $125 per hour. $750 per hour if you are an NBA player |
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