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Joe Pesci
Star Player
Joined: 15 Oct 2017
Posts: 3885
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 Posted: Thu Nov 22, 2018 2:04 am Post subject: |
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| GoldenThroat wrote: | | Joe Pesci wrote: | | James will guard PFs. He’s done so this year. He did last year and the year before. Nonsense. |
He doesn't want to do that for most of the game. |
Until he does.
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Mike@LG
Moderator
Joined: 10 Apr 2001
Posts: 65135
Location: Orange County, CA
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| Posted: Thu Nov 22, 2018 2:35 am Post subject: |
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| Sentient Meat wrote: | Ingram was bad tonight... I agree what people said about his passive attitude, especially for the first three quarters.
The good news is he played like garbage and still scored 14 points on 50% shooting. I still have faith in him, but he can't continue to play this way.
I blame Luke for most of the team's malaise... they don't seem to have any clearly defined roles... the team has no sense of urgency.
A bunch of players just drifting around the basketball court... except for LBJ and Zo for awhile. |
Poor performance, yet, had dominant net ratings for the entire 2nd half? Even helped the Lakers get the lead back?
He may have looked passive, but he's not getting a wealth of touches when LeBron is being aggressive. Zo was aggressive too. We want Ingram to get in the way of that?
By the time Ingram came back in with both the starters or worked with the 2nd unit, the Lakers not only went on a run, but Ingram got the Lakers back into the lead.
I'd hardly call that, a "poor performance."
Poor performance. Finished +15. Wild.
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https://lakersdraft.substack.com/
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VicXLakers
Franchise Player
Joined: 08 Feb 2006
Posts: 11823
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| Posted: Thu Nov 22, 2018 3:10 am Post subject: |
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| Mike@LG wrote: | | Sentient Meat wrote: | Ingram was bad tonight... I agree what people said about his passive attitude, especially for the first three quarters.
The good news is he played like garbage and still scored 14 points on 50% shooting. I still have faith in him, but he can't continue to play this way.
I blame Luke for most of the team's malaise... they don't seem to have any clearly defined roles... the team has no sense of urgency.
A bunch of players just drifting around the basketball court... except for LBJ and Zo for awhile. |
Poor performance, yet, had dominant net ratings for the entire 2nd half? Even helped the Lakers get the lead back?
He may have looked passive, but he's not getting a wealth of touches when LeBron is being aggressive. Zo was aggressive too. We want Ingram to get in the way of that?
By the time Ingram came back in with both the starters or worked with the 2nd unit, the Lakers not only went on a run, but Ingram got the Lakers back into the lead.
I'd hardly call that, a "poor performance."
Poor performance. Finished +15. Wild. |
hey...someone that watched the same game I did
Thank You |
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Mike@LG
Moderator
Joined: 10 Apr 2001
Posts: 65135
Location: Orange County, CA
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| Posted: Thu Nov 22, 2018 3:13 am Post subject: |
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| VicXLakers wrote: | | Mike@LG wrote: | | Sentient Meat wrote: | Ingram was bad tonight... I agree what people said about his passive attitude, especially for the first three quarters.
The good news is he played like garbage and still scored 14 points on 50% shooting. I still have faith in him, but he can't continue to play this way.
I blame Luke for most of the team's malaise... they don't seem to have any clearly defined roles... the team has no sense of urgency.
A bunch of players just drifting around the basketball court... except for LBJ and Zo for awhile. |
Poor performance, yet, had dominant net ratings for the entire 2nd half? Even helped the Lakers get the lead back?
He may have looked passive, but he's not getting a wealth of touches when LeBron is being aggressive. Zo was aggressive too. We want Ingram to get in the way of that?
By the time Ingram came back in with both the starters or worked with the 2nd unit, the Lakers not only went on a run, but Ingram got the Lakers back into the lead.
I'd hardly call that, a "poor performance."
Poor performance. Finished +15. Wild. |
hey...someone that watched the same game I did
Thank You |
Rare occurrence where half the game tape matches the performance. A lot of the time he was along for the ride while Lonzo and LeBron did their thing.
But the other half of the time? Much better decision-making and playmaking out there.
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https://lakersdraft.substack.com/
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Yellow
Starting Rotation
Joined: 31 Oct 2018
Posts: 265
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| Posted: Thu Nov 22, 2018 3:50 am Post subject: |
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| Even when he does well, I can't help but think it's fool's gold. |
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h2omike
Star Player
Joined: 24 Jun 2005
Posts: 2811
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| Posted: Thu Nov 22, 2018 4:25 am Post subject: |
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| He is a decent young player, he is just not the star we hoped a second pick would be. Just be glad for his 14-15 log that we get from him. Not a bust, not a top player. |
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la4win
Star Player
Joined: 27 Mar 2010
Posts: 2247
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| Posted: Thu Nov 22, 2018 4:40 am Post subject: |
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| Mike@LG wrote: | | VicXLakers wrote: | | Mike@LG wrote: | | Sentient Meat wrote: | Ingram was bad tonight... I agree what people said about his passive attitude, especially for the first three quarters.
The good news is he played like garbage and still scored 14 points on 50% shooting. I still have faith in him, but he can't continue to play this way.
I blame Luke for most of the team's malaise... they don't seem to have any clearly defined roles... the team has no sense of urgency.
A bunch of players just drifting around the basketball court... except for LBJ and Zo for awhile. |
Poor performance, yet, had dominant net ratings for the entire 2nd half? Even helped the Lakers get the lead back?
He may have looked passive, but he's not getting a wealth of touches when LeBron is being aggressive. Zo was aggressive too. We want Ingram to get in the way of that?
By the time Ingram came back in with both the starters or worked with the 2nd unit, the Lakers not only went on a run, but Ingram got the Lakers back into the lead.
I'd hardly call that, a "poor performance."
Poor performance. Finished +15. Wild. |
hey...someone that watched the same game I did
Thank You |
Rare occurrence where half the game tape matches the performance. A lot of the time he was along for the ride while Lonzo and LeBron did their thing.
But the other half of the time? Much better decision-making and playmaking out there. |
Nice to see the support when majority in here hating on him for everything he does. |
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24Legend007
Star Player
Joined: 05 May 2018
Posts: 1789
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| Posted: Thu Nov 22, 2018 4:57 am Post subject: |
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| Yellow wrote: | | Even when he does well, I can't help but think it's fool's gold. |
I can understand Lonzo a little (just because of how bad he can be), but I just don't understand holding a player this young to that standard. Especially since he was never really hyped to be the next Kobe or anything coming out of college. You have KD comparisons, but they are tame. |
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JAN24/2/14
Starting Rotation
Joined: 26 Oct 2017
Posts: 236
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| Posted: Thu Nov 22, 2018 5:04 am Post subject: |
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| Ive given up on hoping ingram will be a star. Definitely not a bust but also not a top player. Was he worth a number 2 pick? Absolutely not. Maybe we should sell high on him. If a good trade comes up even i hope magic doesnt hesitate. Kiroe mentioned a bridges and melton trade for him. Hope a trade along those lines comes up. |
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Outspoken
Star Player
Joined: 11 Feb 2015
Posts: 8457
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| Posted: Thu Nov 22, 2018 5:27 am Post subject: |
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| Ingram is a good playmaker, but I don't like that the coach has him playing the 1 and the 2. Is he ever gonna play in his natural position? He could play positionless as a 3 and put Hart in as a 2. Ingram is gonna be great. When he could consistently hit the outside, it's gonna open his game up more. |
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BigGameHames
Star Player
Joined: 24 May 2015
Posts: 7982
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| Posted: Thu Nov 22, 2018 5:37 am Post subject: |
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| Much better job of playing within himself and making good decisions last night. And I loved the spot up 3 at the top of the key, somebody tell him that’s a good shot even if it isn’t late in the shot clock. Next step, show a willingness to get physical and grab tough rebounds. We NEED him to do that a lot more often. |
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Megaton
Retired Number
Joined: 18 Feb 2015
Posts: 25648
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al242
Star Player
Joined: 28 Sep 2012
Posts: 3121
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| Posted: Thu Nov 22, 2018 6:00 am Post subject: |
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| Megaton wrote: | He has got to stop taking terrible contested mid range shots.
How does a former Duke player have such awful shot selection? |
You repeat the same thing over at least x10 a day, we get we get it. Contrary to what you think of his shot selection, hes actually been doing a pretty good job at hitting those shots. |
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BigGameHames
Star Player
Joined: 24 May 2015
Posts: 7982
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| Posted: Thu Nov 22, 2018 6:12 am Post subject: |
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| al242 wrote: | | Megaton wrote: | He has got to stop taking terrible contested mid range shots.
How does a former Duke player have such awful shot selection? |
You repeat the same thing over at least x10 a day, we get we get it. Contrary to what you think of his shot selection, hes actually been doing a pretty good job at hitting those shots. |
No he’s not. |
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LakersPimp
Star Player
Joined: 30 Aug 2005
Posts: 2211
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| Posted: Thu Nov 22, 2018 7:03 am Post subject: |
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He has to shoot off the catch much more often. It will open up his drives. I'm sure the scouting report is to give him a soft close out because he likes to dribble and its rare for him to catch and shoot.
If he took and made 3-4 catch and shoot shots to start the game...they would close harder...he can blow past the defender. |
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ringfinger
Retired Number
Joined: 08 Oct 2013
Posts: 29418
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| Posted: Thu Nov 22, 2018 7:17 am Post subject: |
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| Mike@LG wrote: | | Sentient Meat wrote: | Ingram was bad tonight... I agree what people said about his passive attitude, especially for the first three quarters.
The good news is he played like garbage and still scored 14 points on 50% shooting. I still have faith in him, but he can't continue to play this way.
I blame Luke for most of the team's malaise... they don't seem to have any clearly defined roles... the team has no sense of urgency.
A bunch of players just drifting around the basketball court... except for LBJ and Zo for awhile. |
Poor performance, yet, had dominant net ratings for the entire 2nd half? Even helped the Lakers get the lead back?
He may have looked passive, but he's not getting a wealth of touches when LeBron is being aggressive. Zo was aggressive too. We want Ingram to get in the way of that?
By the time Ingram came back in with both the starters or worked with the 2nd unit, the Lakers not only went on a run, but Ingram got the Lakers back into the lead.
I'd hardly call that, a "poor performance."
Poor performance. Finished +15. Wild. |
Kuzma finished with a net rating almost 50% greater than Lebron. |
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epak
Retired Number
Joined: 30 Aug 2005
Posts: 34147
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| Posted: Thu Nov 22, 2018 7:23 am Post subject: |
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| Outspoken wrote: | | Ingram is a good playmaker, but I don't like that the coach has him playing the 1 and the 2. Is he ever gonna play in his natural position? He could play positionless as a 3 and put Hart in as a 2. Ingram is gonna be great. When he could consistently hit the outside, it's gonna open his game up more. |
Is he a good playmaker?
People keep saying that. I feel he takes too long on his reads and misses open teammates a lot. I guess for his size he's above average on playmaking. |
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Purp 32
Star Player
Joined: 12 Jul 2014
Posts: 2154
Location: Inglewood, CA
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| Posted: Thu Nov 22, 2018 7:30 am Post subject: |
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| ringfinger wrote: | | Mike@LG wrote: | | Sentient Meat wrote: | Ingram was bad tonight... I agree what people said about his passive attitude, especially for the first three quarters.
The good news is he played like garbage and still scored 14 points on 50% shooting. I still have faith in him, but he can't continue to play this way.
I blame Luke for most of the team's malaise... they don't seem to have any clearly defined roles... the team has no sense of urgency.
A bunch of players just drifting around the basketball court... except for LBJ and Zo for awhile. |
Poor performance, yet, had dominant net ratings for the entire 2nd half? Even helped the Lakers get the lead back?
He may have looked passive, but he's not getting a wealth of touches when LeBron is being aggressive. Zo was aggressive too. We want Ingram to get in the way of that?
By the time Ingram came back in with both the starters or worked with the 2nd unit, the Lakers not only went on a run, but Ingram got the Lakers back into the lead.
I'd hardly call that, a "poor performance."
Poor performance. Finished +15. Wild. |
Kuzma finished with a net rating almost 50% greater than Lebron. |
Net rating is so hit or miss. |
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PauPau
Starting Rotation
Joined: 12 Jul 2018
Posts: 844
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| Posted: Thu Nov 22, 2018 7:44 am Post subject: |
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| Purp 32 wrote: | | ringfinger wrote: | | Mike@LG wrote: | | Sentient Meat wrote: | Ingram was bad tonight... I agree what people said about his passive attitude, especially for the first three quarters.
The good news is he played like garbage and still scored 14 points on 50% shooting. I still have faith in him, but he can't continue to play this way.
I blame Luke for most of the team's malaise... they don't seem to have any clearly defined roles... the team has no sense of urgency.
A bunch of players just drifting around the basketball court... except for LBJ and Zo for awhile. |
Poor performance, yet, had dominant net ratings for the entire 2nd half? Even helped the Lakers get the lead back?
He may have looked passive, but he's not getting a wealth of touches when LeBron is being aggressive. Zo was aggressive too. We want Ingram to get in the way of that?
By the time Ingram came back in with both the starters or worked with the 2nd unit, the Lakers not only went on a run, but Ingram got the Lakers back into the lead.
I'd hardly call that, a "poor performance."
Poor performance. Finished +15. Wild. |
Kuzma finished with a net rating almost 50% greater than Lebron. |
Net rating is so hit or miss. |
I hope that doesn't translate to : only applicable when it need be applied |
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Jesusdelonla
Franchise Player
Joined: 24 Jan 2018
Posts: 15430
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| Posted: Thu Nov 22, 2018 8:16 am Post subject: |
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| Mike@LG wrote: | | Sentient Meat wrote: | Ingram was bad tonight... I agree what people said about his passive attitude, especially for the first three quarters.
The good news is he played like garbage and still scored 14 points on 50% shooting. I still have faith in him, but he can't continue to play this way.
I blame Luke for most of the team's malaise... they don't seem to have any clearly defined roles... the team has no sense of urgency.
A bunch of players just drifting around the basketball court... except for LBJ and Zo for awhile. |
Poor performance, yet, had dominant net ratings for the entire 2nd half? Even helped the Lakers get the lead back?
He may have looked passive, but he's not getting a wealth of touches when LeBron is being aggressive. Zo was aggressive too. We want Ingram to get in the way of that?
By the time Ingram came back in with both the starters or worked with the 2nd unit, the Lakers not only went on a run, but Ingram got the Lakers back into the lead.
I'd hardly call that, a "poor performance."
Poor performance. Finished +15. Wild. |
LEBRON is usually passive to start off the game and gives the young guys chances.
Once he gets tired of BI building brick City & we r down he becomes aggressive Wich I don't blame him off.
U r a stats guy, how many off BI's points come off of a pass by somebody else.
How aggressive is he without the ball? |
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Sentient Meat
Franchise Player
Joined: 04 Jul 2014
Posts: 12978
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| Posted: Thu Nov 22, 2018 8:18 am Post subject: |
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| Mike@LG wrote: | | Sentient Meat wrote: | Ingram was bad tonight... I agree what people said about his passive attitude, especially for the first three quarters.
The good news is he played like garbage and still scored 14 points on 50% shooting. I still have faith in him, but he can't continue to play this way.
I blame Luke for most of the team's malaise... they don't seem to have any clearly defined roles... the team has no sense of urgency.
A bunch of players just drifting around the basketball court... except for LBJ and Zo for awhile. |
Poor performance, yet, had dominant net ratings for the entire 2nd half? Even helped the Lakers get the lead back?
He may have looked passive, but he's not getting a wealth of touches when LeBron is being aggressive. Zo was aggressive too. We want Ingram to get in the way of that?
By the time Ingram came back in with both the starters or worked with the 2nd unit, the Lakers not only went on a run, but Ingram got the Lakers back into the lead.
I'd hardly call that, a "poor performance."
Poor performance. Finished +15. Wild. |
I defended BI all week on this forum, so I think I should be fair when I see either a lack of direction or effort. If we were blowing out the Cavs, then I wouldn't have minded but we were struggling all game.
The game started on the wrong foot when he bricked his two first foul shots, then got a silly offensive foul... stepped out of bounds and was pretty ineffective the entire first half. I said in other posts that he got his act together at the end of the game.
I'm guessing his plus minus was a function of being a witness to when Zo went into Hulk mode in the third. Ingram made some key contributions at the end of the third and beginning of the fourth, but I thought he should have done more... especially in the first half.
So we are officially doing plus/minus to defend players on this board?
Because I got killed for using it to defend Rondo earlier in the season. |
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Luminous8
Star Player
Joined: 26 Apr 2017
Posts: 2192
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| Posted: Thu Nov 22, 2018 8:23 am Post subject: |
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| Mike@LG wrote: | | Sentient Meat wrote: | Ingram was bad tonight... I agree what people said about his passive attitude, especially for the first three quarters.
The good news is he played like garbage and still scored 14 points on 50% shooting. I still have faith in him, but he can't continue to play this way.
I blame Luke for most of the team's malaise... they don't seem to have any clearly defined roles... the team has no sense of urgency.
A bunch of players just drifting around the basketball court... except for LBJ and Zo for awhile. |
Poor performance, yet, had dominant net ratings for the entire 2nd half? Even helped the Lakers get the lead back?
He may have looked passive, but he's not getting a wealth of touches when LeBron is being aggressive. Zo was aggressive too. We want Ingram to get in the way of that?
By the time Ingram came back in with both the starters or worked with the 2nd unit, the Lakers not only went on a run, but Ingram got the Lakers back into the lead.
I'd hardly call that, a "poor performance."
Poor performance. Finished +15. Wild. |
I was thinking the same thing. |
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Purp 32
Star Player
Joined: 12 Jul 2014
Posts: 2154
Location: Inglewood, CA
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| Posted: Thu Nov 22, 2018 8:25 am Post subject: |
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| PauPau wrote: | | Purp 32 wrote: | | ringfinger wrote: | | Mike@LG wrote: | | Sentient Meat wrote: | Ingram was bad tonight... I agree what people said about his passive attitude, especially for the first three quarters.
The good news is he played like garbage and still scored 14 points on 50% shooting. I still have faith in him, but he can't continue to play this way.
I blame Luke for most of the team's malaise... they don't seem to have any clearly defined roles... the team has no sense of urgency.
A bunch of players just drifting around the basketball court... except for LBJ and Zo for awhile. |
Poor performance, yet, had dominant net ratings for the entire 2nd half? Even helped the Lakers get the lead back?
He may have looked passive, but he's not getting a wealth of touches when LeBron is being aggressive. Zo was aggressive too. We want Ingram to get in the way of that?
By the time Ingram came back in with both the starters or worked with the 2nd unit, the Lakers not only went on a run, but Ingram got the Lakers back into the lead.
I'd hardly call that, a "poor performance."
Poor performance. Finished +15. Wild. |
Kuzma finished with a net rating almost 50% greater than Lebron. |
Net rating is so hit or miss. |
I hope that doesn't translate to : only applicable when it need be applied |
No, it just doesn't tell the whole story and can often be misleading. |
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Mike@LG
Moderator
Joined: 10 Apr 2001
Posts: 65135
Location: Orange County, CA
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| Posted: Thu Nov 22, 2018 8:45 am Post subject: |
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| ringfinger wrote: | | Mike@LG wrote: | | Sentient Meat wrote: | Ingram was bad tonight... I agree what people said about his passive attitude, especially for the first three quarters.
The good news is he played like garbage and still scored 14 points on 50% shooting. I still have faith in him, but he can't continue to play this way.
I blame Luke for most of the team's malaise... they don't seem to have any clearly defined roles... the team has no sense of urgency.
A bunch of players just drifting around the basketball court... except for LBJ and Zo for awhile. |
Poor performance, yet, had dominant net ratings for the entire 2nd half? Even helped the Lakers get the lead back?
He may have looked passive, but he's not getting a wealth of touches when LeBron is being aggressive. Zo was aggressive too. We want Ingram to get in the way of that?
By the time Ingram came back in with both the starters or worked with the 2nd unit, the Lakers not only went on a run, but Ingram got the Lakers back into the lead.
I'd hardly call that, a "poor performance."
Poor performance. Finished +15. Wild. |
Kuzma finished with a net rating almost 50% greater than Lebron. |
Kuzma didn't play with the bench.
As I noted in a later post, Brandon Ingram's net effect is skewed by playing with the starters, yes, but he played with the bench unit that got the Lakers the lead too.
Net rating of +12.6 in the 2nd half isn't exactly terrible with a bench unit now, is it?
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Resident Car Nut.
https://lakersdraft.substack.com/
I am not an economic advisor nor do I advise economic strategies or plans. |
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Mike@LG
Moderator
Joined: 10 Apr 2001
Posts: 65135
Location: Orange County, CA
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| Posted: Thu Nov 22, 2018 8:48 am Post subject: |
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I defended BI all week on this forum, so I think I should be fair when I see either a lack of direction or effort. If we were blowing out the Cavs, then I wouldn't have minded but we were struggling all game.
The game started on the wrong foot when he bricked his two first foul shots, then got a silly offensive foul... stepped out of bounds and was pretty ineffective the entire first half. I said in other posts that he got his act together at the end of the game.
I'm guessing his plus minus was a function of being a witness to when Zo went into Hulk mode in the third. Ingram made some key contributions at the end of the third and beginning of the fourth, but I thought he should have done more... especially in the first half.
So we are officially doing plus/minus to defend players on this board?
Because I got killed for using it to defend Rondo earlier in the season.
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We're seeing different games here.
Everyone is focusing on the *types* of shots he's taking.
They're not focusing on the broader picture. Seriously, did anyone else notice out of the pick and roll that the entire Lakers squad kept hitting the roll-man early? Like 5x within 6 minutes?
Ingram hit McGee twice out of pick and roll, and even waited for the play to develop instead of just pulling up mid-range.
This is the problem when people are looking for all of the negatives of the player, but can't recognize positive impact on the floor as well.
I admit, he had a troubled late 1st/2nd quarter, but more than made up for it with ++ impact with the bench, and even bigger +++ with the rest of the starting lineup. Isn't that the point? Getting away from post up shots? Getting him in better position to take wing-type shots? Better playmaking? Some actual 2-way play? For a good 3-4 minute stint in the 3rd, he took the deficit with the bench unit and got the Lakers the lead. I even tweeted out the sequences of plays and they were consecutive.
We got that in the 2nd half. Tape said everything.
The idea of "He should of done more" really frustrates me. People have been crapping on his shot selection for a week now, and when he finally does, it's like "Nope, he didn't do enough change, I'm not satisfied."
If I were him and I read this board, I'd be pissed. It's not like he's not trying.
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