OFFICIAL BRANDON INGRAM THREAD
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3 ... 1383, 1384, 1385 ... 1883, 1884, 1885  Next
 
Post new topic    LakersGround.net Forum Index -> General Basketball Discussion Reply to topic
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
CRoost
Star Player
Star Player


Joined: 21 Mar 2017
Posts: 4790

PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2018 10:08 am    Post subject:

Four Decade Bandwagon wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
If BI thought co-existing with LBJ was tough, imagine if we add KD/KL/Klay?

It's a part of every top basketball player's growth curve.

Unless you are so clearly gifted and should be a centerpiece of the team's offense, you have to adapt to the team. It will be LBJ this year, and likely LBJ + another a high usage all star.


That is assuming those players are willing to adapt their roles to fit with James. Every All-star that has played with him has struggled. So why would young developing players not?

If rumors are to be believed, James may be getting the cold shoulder from marquee FAs next year. He has historically cast a big shadow over his teammates when he was prime Lebron. Not too hard to believe that some of the potential "Robins" may not be as enthusiastic to join a declining James for the next few years. They tend to get few accolades and most of the criticisms on a James led team.

Developing the youth and slowly loosening the grips on the reins may be the best option for James and IMO the Lakers.

Roster is currently built to be competitive if not even a bit contentious as the young players struggle to establish themselves as big ego vets demand their mpg. We saw this with every off-season signing. Why lose patience with it now as they inevitably struggle.

Stay the course. Play out this year as is. And then evaluate what is needed next summer when FAs are available, money to spend and young players have (hopefully) established their roles.


This is the better path for us. BI is still adjusting to his role, Lonzo too. I rather see how this year played out then rush it just to advance pass the first round of the playoff.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
Sentient Meat
Franchise Player
Franchise Player


Joined: 04 Jul 2014
Posts: 12978

PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2018 10:12 am    Post subject:

I don't think anyone is trying to pit BI and Kuz against each other.

I'm only explaining that Kuzma taking a lot of the passes inside (deservedly) means BI gets less easy shots.

Which is why he looks less efficient.

Kuzma has gone from taking 26% shots at the rim to 38%.

Ingram meanwhile has gone from 37% to 33%.

Most of this is because LBJ has made Kuzma his go to target for finishing.

I have no problem with this as Kuzma has been the most efficient closer underneath. However, we should all lay off of BI for taking midrange shots because this was dictated by LBJ and Luke's game plan.

They took away a good portion of his looks inside by opting for Kuz and this made him migrate more to the midrange.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
oldlakerfan
Star Player
Star Player


Joined: 15 May 2001
Posts: 2146
Location: Tega Cay, South Carolina

PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2018 10:14 am    Post subject:

BI seems better on defense but he is out of sorts on offense.

He is stopping the ball. He isn't finding the open man. He is taking low percentage shots. He finding the open spot on the floor without the ball.

Kid is only 21 but the coaches and Lebron ought to have a pointed conversation with him so he can focus on making the right changes to his game.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
BigGameHames
Star Player
Star Player


Joined: 24 May 2015
Posts: 7982

PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2018 10:16 am    Post subject:

Sentient Meat wrote:
I don't think anyone is trying to pit BI and Kuz against each other.

I'm only explaining that Kuzma taking a lot of the passes inside (deservedly) means BI gets less easy shots.

Which is why he looks less efficient.

Kuzma has gone from taking 26% shots at the rim to 38%.

Ingram meanwhile has gone from 37% to 33%.

Most of this is because LBJ has made Kuzma his go to target for finishing.


I have no problem with this as Kuzma has been the most efficient closer underneath. However, we should all lay off of BI for taking midrange shots because this was dictated by LBJ and Luke's game plan.

They took away a good portion of his looks inside by opting for Kuz and this made him migrate more to the midrange.


This has more to do with Kuzmas superior cutting than anything the coaching staff is doing. Kuz has much more of a knack for when to cut than anybody else on the roster.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
Sentient Meat
Franchise Player
Franchise Player


Joined: 04 Jul 2014
Posts: 12978

PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2018 10:19 am    Post subject:

BigGameHames wrote:
Sentient Meat wrote:
I don't think anyone is trying to pit BI and Kuz against each other.

I'm only explaining that Kuzma taking a lot of the passes inside (deservedly) means BI gets less easy shots.

Which is why he looks less efficient.

Kuzma has gone from taking 26% shots at the rim to 38%.

Ingram meanwhile has gone from 37% to 33%.

Most of this is because LBJ has made Kuzma his go to target for finishing.


I have no problem with this as Kuzma has been the most efficient closer underneath. However, we should all lay off of BI for taking midrange shots because this was dictated by LBJ and Luke's game plan.

They took away a good portion of his looks inside by opting for Kuz and this made him migrate more to the midrange.


This has more to do with Kuzmas superior cutting than anything the coaching staff is doing. Kuz has much more of a knack for when to cut than anybody else on the roster.


Which is why I said deservedly.

Doesn't matter who ultimately decided this... My point is that Ingram hasn't regressed so much as LBJ has a favored target.

People keep accusing him of going for the midrange... what else is he supposed to do if Kuzma is the designated man at the rim?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
Bard207
Star Player
Star Player


Joined: 08 Jan 2013
Posts: 7713

PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2018 10:19 am    Post subject:

yinoma2001 wrote:
Bard207 wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
Sentient Meat wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
1. BI's shooting about the same number of shots this year compared to last year per game. (12.9 FGA in 2017-18; 13.0 FGA in 2018-19).

2. He's also shooting the same paltry 3PAs a game 1.8 3s a game in 2017-18; 1.9 3s a game in 2018-19.

3. His overall 2P% is down from 48.3% to 47.9%; his 3s from 39% to 35%.

4. His BPM is staggeringly changed from -1.3 in 2017-18 to -5.2 this year.

5. TS% down from 53.6% last year (meh) to 51.3% this year (really bad).

Only thing I can say he's looked good (and it's just the eye and not even captured in advanced stats as DWS/Drtg have all gotten worse) is his defensive effort. That is why I'm questioning his offensive efficacy, and whether he's better served as a utility defense/playmaker guy.


He had two horrible games in a row offensively.

If he has two or three efficient games, he should be right back to where he should be numbers wise.

I'd rather BI play the way he has been... then play like Lonzo who seems to be nursing his FG% by shutting it down after he hits a few.


But his offensive profile does not lead to the conclusion that he's improved his style and efficacy on the offensive end.

Still not shooting a lot of 3s.

Lots of mid-range contested shots.

Shooting %s lower across the board.

The point remains, if we get a max wing FA, where does he fit in if he can't shoot 3s consistently?



Did Magic expect that adding LeBron would lift all players to a higher level or was an allowance for the possibility that at least one player would have his role diminished?


How is LBJ preventing him from the things listed above?



Because as a #2 pick he might have had an expected career path in his mind. LeBron's presence along with the possibility of a 30% Max being added next summer are going to be obstacles for him being the top guy in the next few seasons.

I am not saying that he was actually worthy of getting a max salary and leading a team to a championship, but that could have been his mindset/goal. Now he is flailing because having a lesser role revolving around LeBron isn't what he saw for his NBA career.

Russell and Randle left with some whispers about them being poor fits with where the team wanted to go. Is the organization really sure that Ingram has the mindset to co-exist with LeBron and possibly another high profile player such as Leonard?

Russell, Randle and Ingram were drafted with expectations/hopes to become top NBA talent and not so much if they would be good fits with LeBron.

Kyrie Irving had the status/power to say that he was unhappy and be able to get out of Cleveland.

Ingram could be unhappy with his changed situation (LeBron added), but isn't established enough in his NBA career to do much about it like Kyrie was.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
BigGameHames
Star Player
Star Player


Joined: 24 May 2015
Posts: 7982

PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2018 10:26 am    Post subject:

Sentient Meat wrote:
BigGameHames wrote:
Sentient Meat wrote:
I don't think anyone is trying to pit BI and Kuz against each other.

I'm only explaining that Kuzma taking a lot of the passes inside (deservedly) means BI gets less easy shots.

Which is why he looks less efficient.

Kuzma has gone from taking 26% shots at the rim to 38%.

Ingram meanwhile has gone from 37% to 33%.

Most of this is because LBJ has made Kuzma his go to target for finishing.


I have no problem with this as Kuzma has been the most efficient closer underneath. However, we should all lay off of BI for taking midrange shots because this was dictated by LBJ and Luke's game plan.

They took away a good portion of his looks inside by opting for Kuz and this made him migrate more to the midrange.


This has more to do with Kuzmas superior cutting than anything the coaching staff is doing. Kuz has much more of a knack for when to cut than anybody else on the roster.


Which is why I said deservedly.

Doesn't matter who ultimately decided this... My point is that Ingram hasn't regressed so much as LBJ has a favored target.

People keep accusing him of going for the midrange... what else is he supposed to do if Kuzma is the designated man at the rim?


There is no designated man at the rim, that’s an off base excuse. If BI cuts more, he would be the recipient. Luke was heard saying something along those lines in training camp. He needs to be more active off the ball, be more willing to move the ball and take open 3s. Just those things would go a long way.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
Sentient Meat
Franchise Player
Franchise Player


Joined: 04 Jul 2014
Posts: 12978

PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2018 10:26 am    Post subject:

Bard207 wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
Bard207 wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
Sentient Meat wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
1. BI's shooting about the same number of shots this year compared to last year per game. (12.9 FGA in 2017-18; 13.0 FGA in 2018-19).

2. He's also shooting the same paltry 3PAs a game 1.8 3s a game in 2017-18; 1.9 3s a game in 2018-19.

3. His overall 2P% is down from 48.3% to 47.9%; his 3s from 39% to 35%.

4. His BPM is staggeringly changed from -1.3 in 2017-18 to -5.2 this year.

5. TS% down from 53.6% last year (meh) to 51.3% this year (really bad).

Only thing I can say he's looked good (and it's just the eye and not even captured in advanced stats as DWS/Drtg have all gotten worse) is his defensive effort. That is why I'm questioning his offensive efficacy, and whether he's better served as a utility defense/playmaker guy.


He had two horrible games in a row offensively.

If he has two or three efficient games, he should be right back to where he should be numbers wise.

I'd rather BI play the way he has been... then play like Lonzo who seems to be nursing his FG% by shutting it down after he hits a few.


But his offensive profile does not lead to the conclusion that he's improved his style and efficacy on the offensive end.

Still not shooting a lot of 3s.

Lots of mid-range contested shots.

Shooting %s lower across the board.

The point remains, if we get a max wing FA, where does he fit in if he can't shoot 3s consistently?



Did Magic expect that adding LeBron would lift all players to a higher level or was an allowance for the possibility that at least one player would have his role diminished?


How is LBJ preventing him from the things listed above?



Because as a #2 pick he might have had an expected career path in his mind. LeBron's presence along with the possibility of a 30% Max being added next summer are going to be obstacles for him being the top guy in the next few seasons.

I am not saying that he was actually worthy of getting a max salary and leading a team to a championship, but that could have been his mindset/goal. Now he is flailing because having a lesser role revolving around LeBron isn't what he saw for his NBA career.

Russell and Randle left with some whispers about them being poor fits with where the team wanted to go. Is the organization really sure that Ingram has the mindset to co-exist with LeBron and possibly another high profile player such as Leonard?

Russell, Randle and Ingram were drafted with expectations/hopes to become top NBA talent and not so much if they would be good fits with LeBron.

Kyrie Irving had the status/power to say that he was unhappy and be able to get out of Cleveland.

Ingram could be unhappy with his changed situation (LeBron added), but isn't established enough in his NBA career to do much about it like Kyrie was.


Ingram has no right to be unhappy with his role yet.

Let him put up a bunch of all star quality games, then he can complain like Kyrie.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
KeepItRealOrElse
Retired Number
Retired Number


Joined: 11 Oct 2012
Posts: 32767

PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2018 10:26 am    Post subject:

Bard207 wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
Bard207 wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
Sentient Meat wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
1. BI's shooting about the same number of shots this year compared to last year per game. (12.9 FGA in 2017-18; 13.0 FGA in 2018-19).

2. He's also shooting the same paltry 3PAs a game 1.8 3s a game in 2017-18; 1.9 3s a game in 2018-19.

3. His overall 2P% is down from 48.3% to 47.9%; his 3s from 39% to 35%.

4. His BPM is staggeringly changed from -1.3 in 2017-18 to -5.2 this year.

5. TS% down from 53.6% last year (meh) to 51.3% this year (really bad).

Only thing I can say he's looked good (and it's just the eye and not even captured in advanced stats as DWS/Drtg have all gotten worse) is his defensive effort. That is why I'm questioning his offensive efficacy, and whether he's better served as a utility defense/playmaker guy.


He had two horrible games in a row offensively.

If he has two or three efficient games, he should be right back to where he should be numbers wise.

I'd rather BI play the way he has been... then play like Lonzo who seems to be nursing his FG% by shutting it down after he hits a few.


But his offensive profile does not lead to the conclusion that he's improved his style and efficacy on the offensive end.

Still not shooting a lot of 3s.

Lots of mid-range contested shots.

Shooting %s lower across the board.

The point remains, if we get a max wing FA, where does he fit in if he can't shoot 3s consistently?



Did Magic expect that adding LeBron would lift all players to a higher level or was an allowance for the possibility that at least one player would have his role diminished?


How is LBJ preventing him from the things listed above?



Because as a #2 pick he might have had an expected career path in his mind. LeBron's presence along with the possibility of a 30% Max being added next summer are going to be obstacles for him being the top guy in the next few seasons.

I am not saying that he was actually worthy of getting a max salary and leading a team to a championship, but that could have been his mindset/goal. Now he is flailing because having a lesser role revolving around LeBron isn't what he saw for his NBA career.

Russell and Randle left with some whispers about them being poor fits with where the team wanted to go. Is the organization really sure that Ingram has the mindset to co-exist with LeBron and possibly another high profile player such as Leonard?

Russell, Randle and Ingram were drafted with expectations/hopes to become top NBA talent and not so much if they would be good fits with LeBron.

Kyrie Irving had the status/power to say that he was unhappy and be able to get out of Cleveland.

Ingram could be unhappy with his changed situation (LeBron added), but isn't established enough in his NBA career to do much about it like Kyrie was.


It always comes down to tangible on-court fit and skills. Ingram came into this league expecting what - to be a good 3pt shooter - he said exactly this, this Summer . He expected to be able to fit with any player - he wasn’t a go-to player for much of his time at Duke. At Duke he played defense as well.

I don’t buy what you’re trying to pin as an excuse, not trying to be mean. Just saying. Right now he doesn’t fit in either role, ya know....
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
Sentient Meat
Franchise Player
Franchise Player


Joined: 04 Jul 2014
Posts: 12978

PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2018 10:32 am    Post subject:

BigGameHames wrote:
Sentient Meat wrote:
BigGameHames wrote:
Sentient Meat wrote:
I don't think anyone is trying to pit BI and Kuz against each other.

I'm only explaining that Kuzma taking a lot of the passes inside (deservedly) means BI gets less easy shots.

Which is why he looks less efficient.

Kuzma has gone from taking 26% shots at the rim to 38%.

Ingram meanwhile has gone from 37% to 33%.

Most of this is because LBJ has made Kuzma his go to target for finishing.


I have no problem with this as Kuzma has been the most efficient closer underneath. However, we should all lay off of BI for taking midrange shots because this was dictated by LBJ and Luke's game plan.

They took away a good portion of his looks inside by opting for Kuz and this made him migrate more to the midrange.


This has more to do with Kuzmas superior cutting than anything the coaching staff is doing. Kuz has much more of a knack for when to cut than anybody else on the roster.


Which is why I said deservedly.

Doesn't matter who ultimately decided this... My point is that Ingram hasn't regressed so much as LBJ has a favored target.

People keep accusing him of going for the midrange... what else is he supposed to do if Kuzma is the designated man at the rim?


There is no designated man at the rim, that’s an off base excuse. If BI cuts more, he would be the recipient. Luke was heard saying something along those lines in training camp. He needs to be more active off the ball, be more willing to move the ball and take open 3s. Just those things would go a long way.


I think Kuzma has been terrific cutting to the rim... but I've seen BI run for the rim many times only to head to his corner three position disappointedly.

It's tough when one guy gets set up almost automatically and the other does not.

As I said, Kuzma has earned this... I feel most confident among all the players that Kuz will finish... more so than McGee who's regressed back towards his career average in recent games.

BI can't just sprint to the rim every time... I'm sure he's been designated to either wait in the corner or create an iso score from the top of the key.

All I'm saying is that although there is clearly room for improvement... BI's shot selection can be explained by certain fundamental changes in our offense.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
yinoma2001
Retired Number
Retired Number


Joined: 19 Jun 2010
Posts: 119487

PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2018 10:33 am    Post subject:

Bard207 wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
Bard207 wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
Sentient Meat wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
1. BI's shooting about the same number of shots this year compared to last year per game. (12.9 FGA in 2017-18; 13.0 FGA in 2018-19).

2. He's also shooting the same paltry 3PAs a game 1.8 3s a game in 2017-18; 1.9 3s a game in 2018-19.

3. His overall 2P% is down from 48.3% to 47.9%; his 3s from 39% to 35%.

4. His BPM is staggeringly changed from -1.3 in 2017-18 to -5.2 this year.

5. TS% down from 53.6% last year (meh) to 51.3% this year (really bad).

Only thing I can say he's looked good (and it's just the eye and not even captured in advanced stats as DWS/Drtg have all gotten worse) is his defensive effort. That is why I'm questioning his offensive efficacy, and whether he's better served as a utility defense/playmaker guy.


He had two horrible games in a row offensively.

If he has two or three efficient games, he should be right back to where he should be numbers wise.

I'd rather BI play the way he has been... then play like Lonzo who seems to be nursing his FG% by shutting it down after he hits a few.


But his offensive profile does not lead to the conclusion that he's improved his style and efficacy on the offensive end.

Still not shooting a lot of 3s.

Lots of mid-range contested shots.

Shooting %s lower across the board.

The point remains, if we get a max wing FA, where does he fit in if he can't shoot 3s consistently?



Did Magic expect that adding LeBron would lift all players to a higher level or was an allowance for the possibility that at least one player would have his role diminished?


How is LBJ preventing him from the things listed above?



Because as a #2 pick he might have had an expected career path in his mind. LeBron's presence along with the possibility of a 30% Max being added next summer are going to be obstacles for him being the top guy in the next few seasons.

I am not saying that he was actually worthy of getting a max salary and leading a team to a championship, but that could have been his mindset/goal. Now he is flailing because having a lesser role revolving around LeBron isn't what he saw for his NBA career.

Russell and Randle left with some whispers about them being poor fits with where the team wanted to go. Is the organization really sure that Ingram has the mindset to co-exist with LeBron and possibly another high profile player such as Leonard?

Russell, Randle and Ingram were drafted with expectations/hopes to become top NBA talent and not so much if they would be good fits with LeBron.

Kyrie Irving had the status/power to say that he was unhappy and be able to get out of Cleveland.

Ingram could be unhappy with his changed situation (LeBron added), but isn't established enough in his NBA career to do much about it like Kyrie was.


We've been trying to add max FAs for several summers now. It isn't exactly news. Even if we got KL via trade and added PG13 instead of LBJ, BI's role would be reduced.

He has to adapt to it b/c it won't be easier next year if we get a max wing FA.
_________________
From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
yinoma2001
Retired Number
Retired Number


Joined: 19 Jun 2010
Posts: 119487

PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2018 10:41 am    Post subject:

It's obviously difficult going from a situation where it was cute to be a "we tried hard but lost" team that missed the playoffs. But we're not that team anymore.

Even Kyrie, Dion Waiters and Tristan (high draft picks for the Cavs) had to adjust or ship out (Dion). Those 3 were accustomed to being the Man and having things run through them too. I think 1 ring and several Finals trips later that LBJ proved to be the difference.
_________________
From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
Bard207
Star Player
Star Player


Joined: 08 Jan 2013
Posts: 7713

PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2018 10:41 am    Post subject:

Sentient Meat wrote:

Ingram has no right to be unhappy with his role yet.

Let him put up a bunch of all star quality games, then he can complain like Kyrie.



He turned 21 in September, so it could be that he just isn't able to handle some adversity very well.

Thing such as

* Political Correctness

* Right/Wrong of how he handles the situation

* etc

could be things that he isn't even considering.


Last edited by Bard207 on Tue Nov 13, 2018 10:49 am; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
Bard207
Star Player
Star Player


Joined: 08 Jan 2013
Posts: 7713

PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2018 10:48 am    Post subject:

KeepItRealOrElse wrote:

It always comes down to tangible on-court fit and skills. Ingram came into this league expecting what - to be a good 3pt shooter - he said exactly this, this Summer . He expected to be able to fit with any player - he wasn’t a go-to player for much of his time at Duke. At Duke he played defense as well.

I don’t buy what you’re trying to pin as an excuse, not trying to be mean. Just saying. Right now he doesn’t fit in either role, ya know....



Don't take my posts as a defense of Ingram. Just an observation that he very well could be a poor fit with the direction the team is going with LeBron and possibly another max player being added to the roster.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
yinoma2001
Retired Number
Retired Number


Joined: 19 Jun 2010
Posts: 119487

PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2018 11:04 am    Post subject:

I think this is a good thing for BI. He can show his true value to the team with his effort, consistency and attitude.

IMO, he can really stick long term with this team if he becomes "elite" or great at defending perimeter players and shooting 3s (which is a work in progress b/c he takes so few of them).

I don't think this team needs his inefficient scoring but if he could hang in the 17-18ppg range, be a lockdown defender, someone who moves the ball, and hits more 3s, that's a valuable player to keep.
_________________
From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
Sentient Meat
Franchise Player
Franchise Player


Joined: 04 Jul 2014
Posts: 12978

PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2018 11:04 am    Post subject:

Bard207 wrote:
Sentient Meat wrote:

Ingram has no right to be unhappy with his role yet.

Let him put up a bunch of all star quality games, then he can complain like Kyrie.



He turned 21 in September, so it could be that he just isn't able to handle some adversity very well.

Thing such as

* Political Correctness

* Right/Wrong of how he handles the situation

* etc

could be things that he isn't even considering.


I think Ingram should be guaranteed nothing other than respect from management and his coaches.

If they want to play him on the second unit... I have no problem with that.

But I also think we should keep him and develop him... At least until they've determined he isn't progressing.

My posts recently have been mostly to play devil's advocate as to why he's taking more midrange shots.

It's because Kuzma has taken over that primary function in the offense and rightfully so.

However, I still think Ingram will become a good player maybe even an all star.

As long as he keeps getting better, I'd keep him to replace LBJ in three years.

Again his FG% has gone down because he's forced to take more contested midrange shots instead of easy layups that Kuzma is now taking.

This doesn't mean he's a worse player than he was last season.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
Bard207
Star Player
Star Player


Joined: 08 Jan 2013
Posts: 7713

PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2018 11:05 am    Post subject:

yinoma2001 wrote:

We've been trying to add max FAs for several summers now. It isn't exactly news. Even if we got KL via trade and added PG13 instead of LBJ, BI's role would be reduced.

He has to adapt to it b/c it won't be easier next year if we get a max wing FA.


Of course they have been trying to bring in top free agents, but Ingram, Ball etc didn't have to actually experience the impact/changes until this season.


Melo was well into his 30's and near the end of his career before he accepted that he needed to leave the Knicks and try to win a ring elsewhere. Even then, he has struggled to adapt to having a lesser role with OKC and now with Houston.

Players come to the realization of their place in the NBA universe at different ages. Some such as Melo never seem to get it or maybe their egos prevent them from getting it.

Just speculating on Ingram's mindset, but my gut thinks that he has quite a bit going on mentally with adjusting to a lesser role with LeBron.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
yinoma2001
Retired Number
Retired Number


Joined: 19 Jun 2010
Posts: 119487

PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2018 11:07 am    Post subject:

Quote:
Just speculating on Ingram's mindset, but my gut thinks that he has quite a bit going on mentally with adjusting to a lesser role with LeBron.


Absolutely, but that's his reality.

His role doesn't have to be lesser. It's just that the ones he's accustomed to are being reduced by LBJ (and even Rondo/Lance). So the question should be, "what roles can I fill?" Kuz came in and immediately filled the cutter role. BI? Haven't seen the adaptation yet. Hopefully will come. I like the kid a lot.
_________________
From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
yinoma2001
Retired Number
Retired Number


Joined: 19 Jun 2010
Posts: 119487

PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2018 11:08 am    Post subject:

Quote:
My posts recently have been mostly to play devil's advocate as to why he's taking more midrange shots.


He's functionally playing "SG" on the starting unit but not taking 3s. I remember folks here arguing that BI should play the "SG" spot which I thought was not the best spot for him.
_________________
From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
Villain6Activated
Star Player
Star Player


Joined: 22 Dec 2011
Posts: 6697

PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2018 11:13 am    Post subject:

BigGameHames wrote:
Sentient Meat wrote:
I don't think anyone is trying to pit BI and Kuz against each other.

I'm only explaining that Kuzma taking a lot of the passes inside (deservedly) means BI gets less easy shots.

Which is why he looks less efficient.

Kuzma has gone from taking 26% shots at the rim to 38%.

Ingram meanwhile has gone from 37% to 33%.

Most of this is because LBJ has made Kuzma his go to target for finishing.


I have no problem with this as Kuzma has been the most efficient closer underneath. However, we should all lay off of BI for taking midrange shots because this was dictated by LBJ and Luke's game plan.

They took away a good portion of his looks inside by opting for Kuz and this made him migrate more to the midrange.


This has more to do with Kuzmas superior cutting than anything the coaching staff is doing. Kuz has much more of a knack for when to cut than anybody else on the roster.


I agree but OP already clarified that same point in the post like multiple times just so people wouldn’t quote and say that
_________________
“Life is too short. You have to keep it moving.” - Kobe
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
Inspector Gadget
Retired Number
Retired Number


Joined: 18 Apr 2016
Posts: 46492

PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2018 11:30 am    Post subject:

https://www.reddit.com/r/lakers/comments/9wokbu/jacob_rude_per_nbas_matchup_stats_some_of_brandon/

Watch this before you guys try to make trade proposals involving BI, all those guys are arguably a star talent... once his offensive comes out it is over for the league.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
Inspector Gadget
Retired Number
Retired Number


Joined: 18 Apr 2016
Posts: 46492

PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2018 11:42 am    Post subject:

He is just 21 think about that..
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
PauPau
Starting Rotation
Starting Rotation


Joined: 12 Jul 2018
Posts: 844

PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2018 12:22 pm    Post subject:

Sentient Meat wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
Quote:
he's LBJ's heir apparent.


That's not apparent to me at all.


Not in skill level.. but role.

Again... if BI progresses consistently over the next year or two we should keep him.

It's on him though to demonstrate that progression.

As I said... remember that Ingram right now is being tasked the dirty work while Kuzma's getting all the easy passes.

Keep that in mind when judging his numbers.


Why do we need the Lebron role to persist after his retirement? Its not a constant requirement for championships.
Id be all for keeping Ingram if rookie extension etc were not factored into the thinking process. These decisions must be made in context and in relation to other players on the roster.
This notion of Kuzma having an easier ride is ridiculous. There is a world of difference between him making it look easy and it actually being easy.
There's no denying LeBrons presence has necessitated changes in the youngins approach but they have been given opportunities to express themselves in areas where they are most comfortable as well.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
Sentient Meat
Franchise Player
Franchise Player


Joined: 04 Jul 2014
Posts: 12978

PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2018 12:33 pm    Post subject:

PauPau wrote:
Sentient Meat wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
Quote:
he's LBJ's heir apparent.


That's not apparent to me at all.


Not in skill level.. but role.

Again... if BI progresses consistently over the next year or two we should keep him.

It's on him though to demonstrate that progression.

As I said... remember that Ingram right now is being tasked the dirty work while Kuzma's getting all the easy passes.

Keep that in mind when judging his numbers.


Why do we need the Lebron role to persist after his retirement? Its not a constant requirement for championships.
Id be all for keeping Ingram if rookie extension etc were not factored into the thinking process. These decisions must be made in context and in relation to other players on the roster.
This notion of Kuzma having an easier ride is ridiculous. There is a world of difference between him making it look easy and it actually being easy.
There's no denying LeBrons presence has necessitated changes in the youngins approach but they have been given opportunities to express themselves in areas where they are most comfortable as well.


We don't necessarily... but for many here is the argument to trade him is that his skill set is redundant.

I'm not blind... he has struggled the last two games... but before those games his numbers were right on track for an improvement.

No one wants the Ingram who shot horribly and was a turnover machine.

However, if he tightens up his handles, continues to improve on defense and his shots start falling... he becomes a nice player.

It's not for nothing that many have posted how Giannis didn't breakout until after his third year.

Ingram has far to go to be at Giannis's or any all stars level but if he grows this year I still believe in him.

If he's playing like this at the halfway point then maybe I'll join some of the skeptics, but I think he's shown enough flashes that I think he'll come good.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
Nash Vegas
Star Player
Star Player


Joined: 01 Sep 2012
Posts: 7239

PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2018 1:07 pm    Post subject:

yinoma2001 wrote:
Quote:
he's LBJ's heir apparent.


That's not apparent to me at all.


More reason to come off the bench to quarterback the 2nd unit instead of being Alfred the butler to LeBron's Batman.
_________________
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic    LakersGround.net Forum Index -> General Basketball Discussion All times are GMT - 8 Hours
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3 ... 1383, 1384, 1385 ... 1883, 1884, 1885  Next
Page 1384 of 1885
Jump to:  

 
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum






Graphics by uberzev
© 1995-2018 LakersGround.net. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy. Terms of Use.
LakersGround is an unofficial news source serving the fan community since 1995.
We are in no way associated with the Los Angeles Lakers or the National Basketball Association.


Powered by phpBB