I think LeBron is maybe top 50. He always needs other players to prop him up. He manipulates the stats to his liking. Clearly he only had the most pts/rebounds/blocks/steals/assists on either team in the finals, first player to ever do it (at almost the exact same efficiency as the 2nd leading scorer, kyrie, at like 2ppg less) because of kyrie and jr smith and everyone else on the cavs.
Boy, at the risk of trolling the boards here...I'd like to hear your analysis of pippen vs lebron. Everything you said is one point (as usual). But that's always an interesting comparison here. LG thinks I made that up to troll everyone, but I honestly don't see how lebron is that much better than pippen. lebron is stronger, pippen is taller/longer. that's a wash to me.
I think you get a bad rap for your player comparisons, SBR. I don't always agree with your points and vice versa, but there's nothin' wrong with that. It doesn't mean I don't consider you an LG amigo. Don't buy into that troll stuff, dude. You're above board, trust. Even if people call you that, at least you're a consistent contributor and LG can't have enough of those. At the end of the day, opinions are cheap. I previously made the same points about Scott Pippen that I did on Page 1 and got a lot of consternation that particular week, iirc some of it even by Mike (@) LG. I remember some posters being a lot more optimistic visavis his clutchness, which Iono about, but there you have it.
Don't get me totally twisted tho, I actually thought Pippen was an awesome player, a classic definition of a Swiss Army guy. He filled all the holes in the Bulls' gameplan without Jordan there. Even when he was being a twit, he was leading them in almost every category. That's similar to what Bron has been doing for a long time in Cleveland. I think though that there's no comparison between the two on D. I see Bron being a lazy D player many times. If Kobe got accused of that (rightfully to an extent), then Bron should too. Scott Pippen was never accused of taking breaks on that end. You mentioned his D in 2000. I thought that was zoning. He had his rear in Shaq's junk at times while sagging off of Horry or Fox. He knew how long Shaq was with those intimate zones, but still, if the zebras aren't calling it, then it becomes clever/crafty play.
To me, Bron is not a more beefed up Magic. That's the convenient, obvious, and unimaginative comparison although it is a step up from the early attempts to compare him to Jordan. Bird is the closest approx to Magic imo and if he is, then by definition, a guy as powerful and athletic as Bron can't be. If anything, I consider Bron a lite version of Karl Malone instead of a bulked up Magic. They play the same steaming locomotive running game and both overpowered weaker/smaller guys at their respective positions. Both are excellent passers, both had clutch concerns. Bron's not as bad in that regard as Malone is, tho. Karl got disrupted by fans counting 1 to 10 on his free throws in that 98 Sonics series. His misses at Chicago in 97 and the classic scene of Mike stripping him with his back turned and then hitting the series clincher are glaring. Malone was a better defender, tho. We saw him play fantastic man D in 2004 at age 72. He pushed Timmy around. In the 4 straight that SA lost, Timmy averaged 17 points and about .380 FPG. That's impressive.
Scott Williams, man... What a useless human being.
If you ask me about 2004, I'll tell you flat out that Karl Malone, hated as he was to Laker Nation, was the SOLE bright spot of that season. That season was nothing but hatred and beefs. _________________ GOAT MAGIC REEL SEDALE TRIBUTE EDDIE DONX!
How can you say LeBron has "clutch concerns" as a Laker fan? You're not fooling anyone. LeBron is one of the better "clutch" players ever. Kobe, to put it bluntly, plays hero ball too much and you can make that distinction by looking at the amount of shots he takes late i close games and the large decrease in the lakers offensive efficiency late in games throughout the entirety of his 20 year career. He also, as most people know, shoots a poor percentage in game winners and "crunchtime" shots (within 5 pts) in the final 5 mins of close games.
Straight up, don't bring up LeBron in the clutch to (bleep) prop up Kobe in the clutch. ANY analytics based basketball analyst will tell you LeBron is the better player to have in a close game. You're gonna have to try harder than that to knock LeBron. There are COUNTLESS stats that prove LeBron is better in the "crunchtime" than Kobe. I mean, same could be said about regular seasons, postseasons, and the finals, but Kobe fans will say he's better in all of those times as well. So it's par for the course.
How can you say LeBron has "clutch concerns" as a Laker fan? You're not fooling anyone. LeBron is one of the better "clutch" players ever. Kobe, to put it bluntly, plays hero ball too much and you can make that distinction by looking at the amount of shots he takes late i close games and the large decrease in the lakers offensive efficiency late in games throughout the entirety of his 20 year career. He also, as most people know, shoots a poor percentage in game winners and "crunchtime" shots (within 5 pts) in the final 5 mins of close games.
Straight up, don't bring up LeBron in the clutch to (bleep) prop up Kobe in the clutch. ANY analytics based basketball analyst will tell you LeBron is the better player to have in a close game. You're gonna have to try harder than that to knock LeBron. There are COUNTLESS stats that prove LeBron is better in the "crunchtime" than Kobe. I mean, same could be said about regular seasons, postseasons, and the finals, but Kobe fans will say he's better in all of those times as well. So it's par for the course.
How can you say LeBron has "clutch concerns" as a Laker fan? You're not fooling anyone. LeBron is one of the better "clutch" players ever. Kobe, to put it bluntly, plays hero ball too much and you can make that distinction by looking at the amount of shots he takes late i close games and the large decrease in the lakers offensive efficiency late in games throughout the entirety of his 20 year career. He also, as most people know, shoots a poor percentage in game winners and "crunchtime" shots (within 5 pts) in the final 5 mins of close games.
Straight up, don't bring up LeBron in the clutch to (bleep) prop up Kobe in the clutch. ANY analytics based basketball analyst will tell you LeBron is the better player to have in a close game. You're gonna have to try harder than that to knock LeBron. There are COUNTLESS stats that prove LeBron is better in the "crunchtime" than Kobe. I mean, same could be said about regular seasons, postseasons, and the finals, but Kobe fans will say he's better in all of those times as well. So it's par for the course.
How can you say LeBron has "clutch concerns" as a Laker fan? You're not fooling anyone. LeBron is one of the better "clutch" players ever. Kobe, to put it bluntly, plays hero ball too much and you can make that distinction by looking at the amount of shots he takes late i close games and the large decrease in the lakers offensive efficiency late in games throughout the entirety of his 20 year career. He also, as most people know, shoots a poor percentage in game winners and "crunchtime" shots (within 5 pts) in the final 5 mins of close games.
Straight up, don't bring up LeBron in the clutch to (bleep) prop up Kobe in the clutch. ANY analytics based basketball analyst will tell you LeBron is the better player to have in a close game. You're gonna have to try harder than that to knock LeBron. There are COUNTLESS stats that prove LeBron is better in the "crunchtime" than Kobe. I mean, same could be said about regular seasons, postseasons, and the finals, but Kobe fans will say he's better in all of those times as well. So it's par for the course.
Nobody cares about your lame conspiracy theories. One random regular season game? Who gives a (bleep). I don't even care enough to post the video I just posted unless some (bleep) moron posts a video like you just did- And my video is over the course of multiple games.
(bleep) sad.
The video I posted also had playoff implications.
Also, the video you posted. Really? (bleep) 5:47 of bad calls? What about the calls that DID go in the Lakers favor in that game?
You know how many times per game I think they miss a call in LeBron in the paint? All the (bleep) time. Every (bleep) game. Go look at his free throw rates declining even though he spends more time in the paint now. Then think twice about your lame ass conspiracy theories that are according to you formulated against a guy who WAY spends less time in the paint yet has a similar free throw rate with LeBron.
About 3 calls in, this guy calls for a flagrant on Kobe on what would have been THE softest flagrant, EVER. What a (bleep) (bleep).
This guy called for a hand-check? Are you kidding?
LeBron gets hand-checked on every. single. offensive possession in the playoffs. Of course they're going to miss a hand-check every once in a
while. Oh look, this clown youtube video maker posted an instance where Kobe didn't get a foul call on a follow through. As if Kobe doesn't get that call enough.
As if Steph doesn't ALWAYS have that go as a no call (gotta curtail his efficiency somehow must be the refs logic... seriously, he NEVER gets the call this clown video maker wants Eric Snow to have called on him)
I can't believe this moron also doesn't know (or refuses to acknowledge the difference in getting to their spots on the final plays between Lamar's offensive possession and Murrays offensive possession... the defender was late on the Murray possession. Defender wasn't late in the Odom possession.
Cut
and
Dry
Yet this moron decided to include the Cavs getting that call, as if it's favorable. LOL.
Not to mention the wild inconsistency refs have shown in late game situations before and after this one ultimately close to meaningless regular season game...
All I'm getting from this garbage is that sometimes the calls don't go your way. In bunches.
I can't believe someone posted that conspiracy theory trash. Yeah, the NBA doesn't want the Lakers to win. What a (bleep) joke.
final edit after finishing this abomination: Finally it's over. This horribad conspiracy theory went out in truly (bleep) fashion: With an inspirational quote asking the viewer to question things. I think I'm dead after watching that trash.
Last edited by Chadley on Sun Jul 17, 2016 3:06 pm; edited 7 times in total
How can you say LeBron has "clutch concerns" as a Laker fan? You're not fooling anyone.
wat
Why should a Laker fan show unquestioning reverence for an opposing player? I think you had two tabs open, one LakersGround and one CavsGround and you must've accidentally thought this was CavsGround and got pissed that someone would question Brawn in any way, shape, or form.
Do Cavs fans get mad when someone criticizes Kobe on their forums? Link me, if so. I wanna see that. _________________ GOAT MAGIC REEL SEDALE TRIBUTE EDDIE DONX!
Joined: 02 May 2005 Posts: 90299 Location: Formerly Known As 24
Posted: Sun Jul 17, 2016 9:10 pm Post subject:
Chadley wrote:
The (bleep)...
Nobody cares about your lame conspiracy theories. One random regular season game? Who gives a (bleep). I don't even care enough to post the video I just posted unless some (bleep) moron posts a video like you just did- And my video is over the course of multiple games.
You get one warning from me. Keep trolling and name calling and the next thing you see from me will be the boot. We clear? _________________ “We must always take sides. Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim. Silence encourages the tormentor, never the tormented.” ― Elie Wiesel
Nobody cares about your lame conspiracy theories. One random regular season game? Who gives a (bleep). I don't even care enough to post the video I just posted unless some (bleep) moron posts a video like you just did- And my video is over the course of multiple games.
You get one warning from me. Keep trolling and name calling and the next thing you see from me will be the boot. We clear?
Nobody cares about your lame conspiracy theories. One random regular season game? Who gives a (bleep). I don't even care enough to post the video I just posted unless some (bleep) moron posts a video like you just did- And my video is over the course of multiple games.
You get one warning from me. Keep trolling and name calling and the next thing you see from me will be the boot. We clear?
I'm not the one who is trolling. He posted the first conspiracy theory video. But okay.
Nobody cares about your lame conspiracy theories. One random regular season game? Who gives a (bleep). I don't even care enough to post the video I just posted unless some (bleep) moron posts a video like you just did- And my video is over the course of multiple games.
the one you called moron could have given you more examples. You must be new here n you had no clues who Just Ming was.
Here is a clue. Check out 2008 finals against coston beltics.
Nobody cares about your lame conspiracy theories. One random regular season game? Who gives a (bleep). I don't even care enough to post the video I just posted unless some (bleep) moron posts a video like you just did- And my video is over the course of multiple games.
the one you called moron could have given you more examples. You must be new here n you had no clues who Just Ming was.
Here is a clue. Check out 2008 finals against coston beltics.
~~~~~
Back to the topic, pippen will get the nod for the top 5.
Imagine prime pippen and prime kobe together.
Weren't the Lakers the winners of that rigged Sacramento series?
Nobody cares about your lame conspiracy theories. One random regular season game? Who gives a (bleep). I don't even care enough to post the video I just posted unless some (bleep) moron posts a video like you just did- And my video is over the course of multiple games.
the one you called moron could have given you more examples. You must be new here n you had no clues who Just Ming was.
Here is a clue. Check out 2008 finals against coston beltics.
~~~~~
Back to the topic, pippen will get the nod for the top 5.
Imagine prime pippen and prime kobe together.
Weren't the Lakers the winners of that rigged Sacramento series?
Nobody cares about your lame conspiracy theories. One random regular season game? Who gives a (bleep). I don't even care enough to post the video I just posted unless some (bleep) moron posts a video like you just did- And my video is over the course of multiple games.
the one you called moron could have given you more examples. You must be new here n you had no clues who Just Ming was.
Here is a clue. Check out 2008 finals against coston beltics.
~~~~~
Back to the topic, pippen will get the nod for the top 5.
Imagine prime pippen and prime kobe together.
Weren't the Lakers the winners of that rigged Sacramento series?
Yes and no. Lakers also suffered from the rigged series. If you want to argue about riggedness, there were no players on earth getting more non calls besides Shaq n Kobe. Not because I am a fan of Kobe or Shaq but from watching the games.
The no handcheck rules were basically implicitly being allowed to stop the dominance that was Kobe or Shaq. Lebron like MJ, benefitted more than those two. If you wanna argue, let me warn you upfront: I was a Bulls fan. _________________ Kobe's Top 5 Dunks, 81 points, MJ last gm @Staples
Nobody cares about your lame conspiracy theories. One random regular season game? Who gives a (bleep). I don't even care enough to post the video I just posted unless some (bleep) moron posts a video like you just did- And my video is over the course of multiple games.
the one you called moron could have given you more examples. You must be new here n you had no clues who Just Ming was.
Here is a clue. Check out 2008 finals against coston beltics.
~~~~~
Back to the topic, pippen will get the nod for the top 5.
Imagine prime pippen and prime kobe together.
Weren't the Lakers the winners of that rigged Sacramento series?
Yes and no. Lakers also suffered from the rigged series. If you want to argue about riggedness, there were no players on earth getting more non calls besides Shaq n Kobe. Not because I am a fan of Kobe or Shaq but from watching the games.
The no handcheck rules were basically implicitly being allowed to stop the dominance that was Kobe or Shaq. Lebron like MJ, benefitted more than those two. If you wanna argue, let me warn you upfront: I was a Bulls fan.
That explains LeBrons way lower free throw rate than Kobe despite spending way more time in the paint than him. Oh wait.
LeBron never gets the handcheck call, EVER. You can look atll over but you'll never find a telling stat that implies LeBron gets the benefit of lots of calls, contrary to Kobe. Therefore; trying to say Kobe gets less treatment than LeBron is just.... Beyond baseless. There's more evidence to support the complete opposite.
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