GT - every time I watch your videos I pick up at least 3 bbIQ points, sometimes more. Only about 50 more videos and I'll be a freakin' BB Isaac Newton!!
I have watched every vid. at least twice and ingram one 4 times already.
Do I get a extra bbIQ points??
That's a great question. PnR coverages are mostly predetermined. A few random thoughts...
-It's gonna depend on who you're going up against. If Ben Simmons is the screener, you're going to want to run PnR coverages that protect the paint, and surrender a jumper (Ice, Soft Hedge, for example). If it's Channing Frye, you don't.
I was at the LAL/CLE game at Staples last year. Byron definitely didn't understand this.
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-It also depends on what your guys can do. Cleveland KILLED us when we soft hedged every time, but a guy like Zubac can only run a couple of PnR coverages because he's not going to be able to defend the perimeter. Conversely, you can switch some stuff with Randle because he has good feet and can defend the perimeter.
Do you think there's a chance Zubac becomes serviceable at the hard hedge, at least enough to keep offenses guessing? He seemed to do a good job on the soft hedge, at least against S/L level competition.
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-There is some read & react component to it as well though. Say you're in a Soft Hedge coverage, but if the guard just got cracked on the screen he might yell out for the Switch because he knows he won't recover in time.
-Switching up PnR coverages throughout the game is one of the bigger adjustments that a coach can make defensively. NBA level coaches will figure out what you're doing and then start running stuff/putting in personnel that counters it. PnR play is one of the cat & mouse games in the NBA.
Do you think this is one of the things they're going to look bad at for a while until they get more experience and accustomed to each other? It just seems like a prime area where a young team who is still learning to communicate is going to struggle.
I think they have pretty decent defensive versatility and am excited to see how Luke and his staff utilize it over the course of the year. _________________ Austin Reaves keeps his game tight, like Kobe Bryant on game night.
Do you think there's a chance Zubac becomes serviceable at the hard hedge, at least enough to keep offenses guessing? He seemed to do a good job on the soft hedge, at least against S/L level competition.
Ehhh...I'd be surprised. It'll depend on his development from a Strength & Conditioning perspective. He had a couple of plays where he double jumped, or quick jumped guys to get blocked shots that impressed me, so maybe there's some quickness in there somewhere. I think it's more likely that it's an issue and not something that he'll be able to do effectively, but it's too early to rule that out.
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Do you think this is one of the things they're going to look bad at for a while until they get more experience and accustomed to each other? It just seems like a prime area where a young team who is still learning to communicate is going to struggle.
I think they have pretty decent defensive versatility and am excited to see how Luke and his staff utilize it over the course of the year.
Yeah, I think there will be some confusion on this for just that reason. There are also ways that veterans will set our young guys up as defenders and make them think they're doing one thing, when they end up doing another. PnR coverages are one of those things that will slow down and become easier for the young guys simply off of seeing the same things over and over again.
Fantastic vid, GT! The criticism of Russell's defense must've been annoying for you to read, as I remember you preaching this. I'll admit I didn't get the ice misreads at all. It looks like I blamed Russell too much and gave Nance too much credit.
Appreciate it as always
Awesome, glad you made it that far into the video.
This vid makes Nance look worse than he was. He was fantastic on the defensive end for the most part, but when there were miscommunications w/Russell, it was usually him and occasionally Auguste. Being that it's a Russell vid, that's all that really made it in to that end.
I can't say with certainty what our pick & roll coverage was supposed to be, and it could have been Russell who was messing up. But I hope the video at least demonstrates how often it was a communication error rather than a lack of capability.
Nice video, congrats!
I believe that is something the coaching staff should be able to fix. Building chemestry and comumnication is a process and I trust this coaching staff ability to work as a catalyst developing some synergy among this guys, something Scott was clearly inept to do. The lack of defensive awareness ball watching is also correctible and not unusual among young players. He has a strength and a reason of concern defending both the pick and roll and his man defense. He has great length that really bothers other players when he is able to stay in front of them, but when he is not able to correctly position hinself when he makes a mistake giving the wrong angle he is beated by speed and can't recover. He must learn how to deny that first step to opponents since he is really not slow, but he is not quick enough to let someone put a half step over him and recover.
Defense is a work in progress with a lot of room to improve. His offensive game scoring is developing fast, I'd like to see him looking for the big guys creating offense for them more often, but his scoring ability is advanced for a 20 years old player and he is as effective without the ball as he is running the show, I believe it's a mistake put a PG or a SG label on him.
Joined: 25 Jul 2013 Posts: 9577 Location: Salem, OR
Posted: Sat Jul 23, 2016 8:54 pm Post subject:
Nice work as always. Btw, did you get the stats on Russell's PnR through double drags and ICE by going through all of the footage and calculating it yourself? Also, is there an advantage of soft hedging PnR's, rather than ICE'ing them, since both are designed for the big to contain and give up pull up jumpers/PnP jumpers? It's somewhat concerning that Russell and Nance weren't in sync in terms of ICE'ing the PnR's, hopefully the coaching staff addresses this.
Last edited by The Logo on Sat Jul 23, 2016 9:04 pm; edited 1 time in total
Nice work as always. Btw, did you get the stats on Russell's PnR through double drags and ICE by going through all of the footage and calculating it yourself?
Yes, I did. I wish there was somewhere that did that that was publicly available, but unfortunately there isn't. I would imagine that teams chart that sort of thing, but I can't say for sure.
Joined: 25 Jul 2013 Posts: 9577 Location: Salem, OR
Posted: Sat Jul 23, 2016 9:15 pm Post subject:
GoldenThroat wrote:
The Logo wrote:
Nice work as always. Btw, did you get the stats on Russell's PnR through double drags and ICE by going through all of the footage and calculating it yourself?
Yes, I did. I wish there was somewhere that did that that was publicly available, but unfortunately there isn't. I would imagine that teams chart that sort of thing, but I can't say for sure.
Damn that's a lot of work, also is there an advantage of soft hedging PnR's, rather than ICE'ing them, since both are designed for the big to contain and give up pull up jumpers/PnP jumpers?
Does it make me look bad to say I want to watch it again 10 minutes after watching it the first time? In my defense SPCM is one of the best songs ever.
That whole album, man...
100%.....hootie hoo! _________________ Music is my medicine
Nice work as always. Btw, did you get the stats on Russell's PnR through double drags and ICE by going through all of the footage and calculating it yourself?
Yes, I did. I wish there was somewhere that did that that was publicly available, but unfortunately there isn't. I would imagine that teams chart that sort of thing, but I can't say for sure.
Damn that's a lot of work, also is there an advantage of soft hedging PnR's, rather than ICE'ing them, since both are designed for the big to contain and give up pull up jumpers/PnP jumpers?
Another great question. You're correct that they're similar coverages, and while I don't have any data to prove it, I would guess that they're the two most common PnR coverages in the NBA today.
Ice is more vulnerable to ball reversal than soft hedges are. This is an excellent video that demonstrates that. But there is a time & place for both and both are widely used in the NBA.
I didn't see a situation that called for it in Summer League, but Russell is really at what this coach calls "Snaking the Twist" at 1:47. I just call it "snaking", but the Twist terminology makes sense because that's a Twist PnR, where the big "twists" behind the guard after he goes into his roll lane.
Does it make me look bad to say I want to watch it again 10 minutes after watching it the first time? In my defense SPCM is one of the best songs ever.
That whole album, man...
Git up, Git out you know. _________________ Austin Reaves keeps his game tight, like Kobe Bryant on game night.
My favorite plays in the SL were the pistol action, open looks off of handoffs. Never knew the terminology before the video. Much appreciated for that.
Can't wait to see more post play from him as well.
As others have said, I learned a lot from the ICE defense segment. Makes a lot of sense when you see Russell and Nance communicating like that after the play.
Seeing some patterns already being instilled (double screen/Russell sprinting like Curry to their side of the court) from your Warriors video. Absolutely excited for the season!
Joined: 23 Jun 2005 Posts: 8488 Location: The (real) short corner
Posted: Sun Jul 24, 2016 1:46 am Post subject:
tox wrote:
GoldenThroat wrote:
tox wrote:
Fantastic vid, GT! The criticism of Russell's defense must've been annoying for you to read, as I remember you preaching this. I'll admit I didn't get the ice misreads at all. It looks like I blamed Russell too much and gave Nance too much credit.
Appreciate it as always
Awesome, glad you made it that far into the video.
This vid makes Nance look worse than he was. He was fantastic on the defensive end for the most part, but when there were miscommunications w/Russell, it was usually him and occasionally Auguste. Being that it's a Russell vid, that's all that really made it in to that end.
I can't say with certainty what our pick & roll coverage was supposed to be, and it could have been Russell who was messing up. But I hope the video at least demonstrates how often it was a communication error rather than a lack of capability.
Ha yeah, I watch your vids straight through when they come. They're that interesting
But yeah, regardless of whose fault it is, miscommunication is the best possible cause of a breakdown, given our good coaching staff. Definitely encouraging to hear.
Quick question: is P&R coverage read-and-react, i.e. depending on who is the screener and where it's taking place, you run different coverage options? Or is it more that teams tend to run one kind of coverage option all game (or half) for the most part?
Like when DLO is barking out "ice ice" is he telling Nance what to do, or is he reaffirming that their coverage option is ice?
The way you worded the last paragraph suggests the latter, which makes it weird there would be any miscommunication since there isn't that much room for error.
Usually it's the big's job to call ice, even if the game plan is to ice every side PnR, as the guard can't see behind him. Perhaps the rules weren't made clear yet in the few practices they have and DLO saw the screens coming himself and assumed the bigs were on the same page. Some teams are even more conservative will only have the guard ice when both the screener's defender and the weak side big are in help position (calling 'low') to prevent these kind of situations.
GS tended to ice every side PnR (if they weren't switching), but I'm not clear on what their specific rules on the call were.
Joined: 23 Jun 2005 Posts: 12825 Location: Somewhere watching a Laker game
Posted: Sun Jul 24, 2016 5:08 am Post subject:
Great stuff as always GT. Very insightful. I saw this vid earlier (I am following you on Twitter). Are you doing one on BI? If so, I'm looking forward to it!
Great work, GT! My dad is finally getting back into the Lakers this summer after the Howard fiasco, looking forward to seeing the young guys develop, and he's becoming a big DLo fan. I told him to check out your DLo vid on YouTube, and he's been binging it and your "Luke to the Lakers" series all afternoon and texting me lol.
But apparently you pulled your Deng vid? He and I couldn't find it. Any chance it'll make a come back?
After watching your breakdown, I tried to go back and look at some of the summer league footage from last year and watch DLO just to compare how far he's come in a year. Hard to find defensive stuff, but offensively you could see how much missing from long range was messing with him and making him not take what the D was giving at times.
But I got sidetracked in looking at DLO to notice that most of our highlights last year were off the high PNR, ISO and transition. All the other crap, the floppies and whatnot, rarely amounted to scores. It was very much a predictor of how we ran things like crap in the regular season. Guys had to impose their individual skills on an opponent basically.
This summer league I'm very happy seeing all the stuff we've run... So much more team oriented. The double drag screens, motion weak, motion weak seals to post up, the pistol three-man stuff, the 45 high screens and most pleased about the amount of screen the screener stuff we've had in play. I can't wait for the weakside movement to kick in like in Golden State. Once DLO gets comfortable in all this, I think his read and react skills will start to shine. It may take a year of repetition but getting him in read and react situations where he KNOWS all the nuances and options...look out.
Nice work as always. Btw, did you get the stats on Russell's PnR through double drags and ICE by going through all of the footage and calculating it yourself?
Yes, I did. I wish there was somewhere that did that that was publicly available, but unfortunately there isn't. I would imagine that teams chart that sort of thing, but I can't say for sure.
Damn, great job. I was thinking to myself....nah, he must have found a stat source. Well done, sir.
One thing I noticed watching the video was how high the picks were being set. It seemed like on most of the center picks (meaning not sideline) the big had one foot on the center court logo. That's like 36'-38' from the hoop.
That appears to give the guard a nice long runway. _________________ Austin Reaves keeps his game tight, like Kobe Bryant on game night.
Great stuff as always GT. Very insightful. I saw this vid earlier (I am following you on Twitter). Are you doing one on BI? If so, I'm looking forward to it!
Fantastic vid, GT! The criticism of Russell's defense must've been annoying for you to read, as I remember you preaching this. I'll admit I didn't get the ice misreads at all. It looks like I blamed Russell too much and gave Nance too much credit.
Appreciate it as always
Awesome, glad you made it that far into the video.
This vid makes Nance look worse than he was. He was fantastic on the defensive end for the most part, but when there were miscommunications w/Russell, it was usually him and occasionally Auguste. Being that it's a Russell vid, that's all that really made it in to that end.
I can't say with certainty what our pick & roll coverage was supposed to be, and it could have been Russell who was messing up. But I hope the video at least demonstrates how often it was a communication error rather than a lack of capability.
Ha yeah, I watch your vids straight through when they come. They're that interesting
But yeah, regardless of whose fault it is, miscommunication is the best possible cause of a breakdown, given our good coaching staff. Definitely encouraging to hear.
Quick question: is P&R coverage read-and-react, i.e. depending on who is the screener and where it's taking place, you run different coverage options? Or is it more that teams tend to run one kind of coverage option all game (or half) for the most part?
Like when DLO is barking out "ice ice" is he telling Nance what to do, or is he reaffirming that their coverage option is ice?
The way you worded the last paragraph suggests the latter, which makes it weird there would be any miscommunication since there isn't that much room for error.
Usually it's the big's job to call ice, even if the game plan is to ice every side PnR, as the guard can't see behind him. Perhaps the rules weren't made clear yet in the few practices they have and DLO saw the screens coming himself and assumed the bigs were on the same page. Some teams are even more conservative will only have the guard ice when both the screener's defender and the weak side big are in help position (calling 'low') to prevent these kind of situations.
GS tended to ice every side PnR (if they weren't switching), but I'm not clear on what their specific rules on the call were.
As always, appreciate the insight, fiendish! Gonna be looking out for this stuff during preseason
Great work, GT! My dad is finally getting back into the Lakers this summer after the Howard fiasco, looking forward to seeing the young guys develop, and he's becoming a big DLo fan. I told him to check out your DLo vid on YouTube, and he's been binging it and your "Luke to the Lakers" series all afternoon and texting me lol.
But apparently you pulled your Deng vid? He and I couldn't find it. Any chance it'll make a come back?
Haha, awesome. I'm glad you guys are enjoying them. Good to see you around, BVH. Been wondering where you've been.
After watching your breakdown, I tried to go back and look at some of the summer league footage from last year and watch DLO just to compare how far he's come in a year. Hard to find defensive stuff, but offensively you could see how much missing from long range was messing with him and making him not take what the D was giving at times.
But I got sidetracked in looking at DLO to notice that most of our highlights last year were off the high PNR, ISO and transition. All the other crap, the floppies and whatnot, rarely amounted to scores. It was very much a predictor of how we ran things like crap in the regular season. Guys had to impose their individual skills on an opponent basically.
This summer league I'm very happy seeing all the stuff we've run... So much more team oriented. The double drag screens, motion weak, motion weak seals to post up, the pistol three-man stuff, the 45 high screens and most pleased about the amount of screen the screener stuff we've had in play. I can't wait for the weakside movement to kick in like in Golden State. Once DLO gets comfortable in all this, I think his read and react skills will start to shine. It may take a year of repetition but getting him in read and react situations where he KNOWS all the nuances and options...look out.
Yeah man, all of this. I'm going to do a video on the coaching staff in SL as well, and I'd love your input. (fiendish as well, of course)
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Gonna be looking out for this stuff during preseason 
