View previous topic :: View next topic |
What grade do you give the Lakers offseason (coach, free agency, draft)? |
5 ("A" grade) |
|
21% |
[ 20 ] |
4 ("B" grade) |
|
58% |
[ 56 ] |
3 ("C" grade) |
|
14% |
[ 14 ] |
2 ("D" grade) |
|
5% |
[ 5 ] |
|
Total Votes : 95 |
|
Author |
Message |
yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
|
Posted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 5:26 am Post subject: GRADING the Lakers Offseason |
|
|
It’s Summer Grading time! Now that it appears for the most part, the Lakers (and most of free agency) has to come to an end, let’s grade our offseason. I’m going to assign grades using a 1-5 scale (5 = A, 4 = B, 3 = C, 2 = D, 1 = F). I’m then dividing “free agency” into 3 parts: coach, free agency, and draft. I think all 3 for a rebuilding team like ours is equal, so I’ve assigned 33% of the grade to each accordingly. Here are the reported transactions and personnel moves:
1. Coaching (Luke, Shaw, et. al): I give this a 4.5
2. Free Agency
a. Mozgov (17% of 94m cap in 2016-17): 3
b. Deng (19% of cap): 4 (nice solid veteran)
c. Clarkson (13% of cap): 4.5 (great value signing)
d. Calderon (8% of cap): 4.5 (great trade)
e. Black (6% of cap): 4 (good 1 year cap filler)
f. Huertas (1.7% of cap): 4 (good 1 year cap filler)
AVERAGE: 4
3. Draft
a. Ingram: 5
b. Zubac: 4.5
AVERAGE: 4.75
YINOMA’s FREE AGENCY OVERALL GRADE: 4.4 (translated to around an overall “B”).
As much as I wish we could have done better in the free agency component, we absolutely nailed the draft/coaching, which IMO, is equally (or even more) important with FA. What is your grade using my criteria (3 parts: coaching/FA/draft on a 1-5 scale).
We reportedly have 13.4m in cap space left, and likely 31.7m next year (enough for a max offer to WB). So it's not like the team has killed future flexibility. Most pundits have crucified the Lakers "offseason," but IMO have narrowly defined that as simply the "free agency" component without looking at the equally important coaching/drafting decisions.
Imagine if we kept Byron, and didn't have a 2nd pick and say blew the 32nd pick. Things would be dramatically worse. But IMO we absolutely killed 2 of the 3 components of the "Offseason" and therefore have an overall "B" score. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
|
Back to top |
|
|
panamaniac Franchise Player
Joined: 28 May 2011 Posts: 11238 Location: PTY
|
Posted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 5:30 am Post subject: |
|
|
I'm with you. I'd say A for draft, B for FA. Coaching is TBD altho we are obviously hoping for the best. Overall about a B-ish.
But the more I think of it, there wasn't any plausible scenario where we could've had an A+ offseason. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
|
Posted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 6:07 am Post subject: |
|
|
The Grind wrote: | I'm with you. I'd say A for draft, B for FA. Coaching is TBD altho we are obviously hoping for the best. Overall about a B-ish.
But the more I think of it, there wasn't any plausible scenario where we could've had an A+ offseason. |
Yeah, aside from KD or something like a Hassan/DRoz we were bound for a B to B- level overall summer b/c we nailed the coaching/drafting. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
|
Back to top |
|
|
KeepItRealOrElse Retired Number
Joined: 11 Oct 2012 Posts: 32767
|
Posted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 6:10 am Post subject: |
|
|
Coach A+
Draft A+
FA B-
A- overall |
|
Back to top |
|
|
ringfinger Retired Number
Joined: 08 Oct 2013 Posts: 29418
|
Posted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 6:12 am Post subject: |
|
|
Totally agree with Yinoma's write up. Only thing I'd change is the Zubac rating from a 4.5 to a 5. Based on what we've seen so far, you can't ask for a better talent and kid. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
|
Posted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 6:13 am Post subject: |
|
|
KeepItRealOrElse wrote: | Coach A+
Draft A+
FA B-
A- overall |
I guess in terms of methodology, folks can quibble about the weight of the 3 components. But for simplicity sake, I weighed them equally. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
|
Back to top |
|
|
KeepItRealOrElse Retired Number
Joined: 11 Oct 2012 Posts: 32767
|
Posted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 6:17 am Post subject: |
|
|
yinoma2001 wrote: | KeepItRealOrElse wrote: | Coach A+
Draft A+
FA B-
A- overall |
I guess in terms of methodology, folks can quibble about the weight of the 3 components. But for simplicity sake, I weighed them equally. |
Ya that's a big factor. Although I think with where we stand as a down franchise - coach and draft would be most important - couldn't of expected us to do great in free agency
I still think there's a chance that Clarkson ends up with one of the very best contracts that will be handed out in the new CBA. There's a chance he develops into a 20ppg starter. I personally see very tangible tweaks he could make, moves. But that's just my optimistic irrational trainer type eye |
|
Back to top |
|
|
yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
|
Posted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 6:19 am Post subject: |
|
|
KeepItRealOrElse wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | KeepItRealOrElse wrote: | Coach A+
Draft A+
FA B-
A- overall |
I guess in terms of methodology, folks can quibble about the weight of the 3 components. But for simplicity sake, I weighed them equally. |
Ya that's a big factor. Although I think with where we stand as a down franchise - coach and draft would be most important - couldn't of expected us to do great in free agency
I still think there's a chance that Clarkson ends up with one of the very best contracts that will be handed out in the new CBA. There's a chance he develops into a 20ppg starter. I personally see very tangible tweaks he could make, moves. But that's just my optimistic irrational trainer type eye |
No doubt. He was a bargain signing. Ironically though, that also makes him a highly tradeable asset if we end up with WB next year for example. JC is making the equivalent of 8.75m during 2015-16 season. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Dave20 Franchise Player
Joined: 15 Jun 2013 Posts: 11333
|
Posted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 7:13 am Post subject: |
|
|
Overall a B. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Vancouver Fan Franchise Player
Joined: 17 Apr 2006 Posts: 17740
|
Posted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 7:22 am Post subject: |
|
|
Dave20 wrote: | Overall a B. |
_________________ Music is my medicine |
|
Back to top |
|
|
pmacla Star Player
Joined: 31 Aug 2012 Posts: 7849 Location: Los Angeles, CA
|
Posted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 7:24 am Post subject: |
|
|
Firing Byron makes it an A ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
in my book
Last edited by pmacla on Fri Jul 29, 2016 7:52 am; edited 2 times in total |
|
Back to top |
|
|
2019 Franchise Player
Joined: 03 Dec 2014 Posts: 10786
|
Posted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 7:31 am Post subject: |
|
|
1. Coaching-- 4.5
2. Free Agency
a. Mozgov: 1
b. Deng: 2
c. Clarkson: 5
d. Calderon: 3
e. Black: 4
f. Huertas: 2
3. Draft
a. Ingram: 5
b. Zubac: 4.5
AVERAGE: 3.44
Extra Credit--- here are the moves I would have made knowing what we know now (all greatly within real of possibility)
Biyombo- 4/$72MM (holds more upside and far more future trade value)
Afflalo- 2/$25MM (great 3&D guard/forward)
Barnes- 2/$12MM (brings intensity/toughness, cheap, easily movable)
Jeff Green- 1/$15MM (tweener 3/4, still gives 15ppg, expires, solid vet)
Clarkson- same deal
Black- same deal
Huertes- same
Biyombo | Black | Zubac
Randle | Nance | Green
Ingram | Barnes
Clarkson | Afflalo | Brown
Russell | Lou | Huertes
By '18, all the contracts are back off the books (except Lou and Biyombo who are both easily moved) and in the short term we would have quality players who are also professional and the right culture guys to help us win games.
Biyombo (24) | Black (16) | Randle (8)
Randle (22) | Nance (22) | Green (4)
Ingram (26) | Barnes (14) | Green (8)
Clarkson (32) | Afflalo (16) | Brown
Russell (32)| Lou (16)
DNP- Zubac, Huertes (try and get Zu a ton of time in D-League and then PT for injuries unless he starts outplaying Black or BB)
Anyway, always fun to look back at what you would have done compared to what your team actually did, so there would have been my summer.
My big thing was to gain wins now, add elements we're lacking, and maintain massive cap in 2018 for Cousins and George.
Last edited by 2019 on Fri Jul 29, 2016 9:43 am; edited 1 time in total |
|
Back to top |
|
|
yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
|
Posted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 7:50 am Post subject: |
|
|
PMACLA can you edit your post so that the page isn't screwed up with all the A++ you gave. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Inspector Gadget Retired Number
Joined: 18 Apr 2016 Posts: 46492
|
Posted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 7:55 am Post subject: |
|
|
Finally have a coach who can lead players is gonna be huge. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
pmacla Star Player
Joined: 31 Aug 2012 Posts: 7849 Location: Los Angeles, CA
|
Posted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 7:57 am Post subject: |
|
|
yinoma2001 wrote: | PMACLA can you edit your post so that the page isn't screwed up with all the A++ you gave. |
fixed sorry bout that, but to me was biggest and best move they could have made, Luke is face of the franchise now lets see how does but is such a breathe of fresh air after two years held under captivity of Byron |
|
Back to top |
|
|
yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
|
Posted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 7:58 am Post subject: |
|
|
I'm with you brother! You know my beloved thoughts about the Parking Brake. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Lakers2015 Star Player
Joined: 16 Feb 2015 Posts: 2315
|
Posted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 7:58 am Post subject: |
|
|
B+. The Lakers got two of the top 15 prospects in the draft including possibly the best overall player in Ingram and possibly best big in Zubac. Luke was my number one choice and a lot of people's number one choice. He's a great and modern basketball mind, such a high IQ, so intelligent, great communicator, has all the leadership qualities, wants to teach these kids, this is his dream job, and he has hired an excellent staff.
The free agency signings weren't great because of the money spent, but Mozgov and Deng are definite upgrades over Hibbert and Kobe. They instantly improve both our perimeter and interior defense. Makes us more versatile with Deng playing a lot of small ball 4. Mozgov gives D'Angelo a pick and roll partner. Calderon is an upgrade as a backup over Huertas. As good a play maker and much more of a threat offensively. Give us another ball handler. Re-signed Clarkson and Black to cheap deals considering what everyone else got.
At the end of the day about fourth months ago this team had so many holes. They needed a coach who would stop wasting the young guys and would work to develop them and teach them how to play NBA basketball. They got that guy in Luke. They needed better defensive personel along with floor spacing and a finisher so D'Angelo could start racking up more assists. Needed better depth. We've accomplished all of those things. This roster is unquestionably better than it was last year. Good job Lakers. _________________ #CowboysNation
#LakeShow |
|
Back to top |
|
|
laker50 Star Player
Joined: 07 Mar 2014 Posts: 2140
|
Posted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 8:03 am Post subject: |
|
|
I have to agree with some of the posters.
Ingram and Zubac makes it an A+
Walton an A
Deng an B+ Mosgov TBD
So average out to A-
I long time since Lakers received this high of a grade.
Maybe even Kobe or Shaq times. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
|
Posted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 8:06 am Post subject: |
|
|
I was listening to Nate Duncan/Danny Leroux and their grades for the offseasons in the West, and they gave D- and D+ respectively.
Now, I think that they're weighing 1/3rd of the offseason, i.e. free agency, more than the other 2 components. And it didn't seem clear to me that they understood that the Lakers increased their talent pool AND saved enough for a max in 2017, when we should have a better chance at top FAs.
So I created this thread so we could have a holistic view of the offseason, not just free agency. Again, I don't see too many pundits disagreeing about the draft/coach selection. I'd say anecdotally, I've heard a bunch of pundits generally give the Lakers around a C to C+ for just the free agency component. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
|
Back to top |
|
|
pmacla Star Player
Joined: 31 Aug 2012 Posts: 7849 Location: Los Angeles, CA
|
Posted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 8:12 am Post subject: |
|
|
those who realize where we really are and how we have to build under the rules of the NBA grade this season an A or B, those that unrealistically expected a KD, or DeRozan etc to come to LA grade it low |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Dr. Funkbot Star Player
Joined: 24 Sep 2001 Posts: 8188 Location: Eagle Rock
|
Posted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 8:21 am Post subject: |
|
|
Yeah, the FA portion of our offseason I would give a C at best. Deng's contract is OK but too long, Mozzer's contract is too generous and too long. But we do salvage a C because JC and TB's contracts are very very good.
Gotta hope we get the amnesty provision back baby!
Luke is an A++
The Draft was a home run A+
The trade for Calderon was a good move and we get 2 picks= A _________________ R.I.P. Doc Buss |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Jbar805 Starting Rotation
Joined: 08 Jun 2015 Posts: 247
|
Posted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 8:53 am Post subject: |
|
|
Nick Young is still on the Roster so I get it a C. If he is cut or traded I go to a C+.
Made solid Vet moves at Positions that wont stagger the young guys development. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Dr. Funkbot Star Player
Joined: 24 Sep 2001 Posts: 8188 Location: Eagle Rock
|
Posted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 9:07 am Post subject: |
|
|
Jbar805 wrote: | Nick Young is still on the Roster so I get it a C. If he is cut or traded I go to a C+.
Made solid Vet moves at Positions that wont stagger the young guys development. |
How do you rate the entire offseason, not just the FA signings? _________________ R.I.P. Doc Buss |
|
Back to top |
|
|
activeverb Retired Number
Joined: 17 Jun 2006 Posts: 37470
|
Posted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 9:09 am Post subject: Re: GRADING the Lakers Offseason |
|
|
yinoma2001 wrote: | It’s Summer Grading time! Now that it appears for the most part, the Lakers (and most of free agency) has to come to an end, let’s grade our offseason. I’m going to assign grades using a 1-5 scale (5 = A, 4 = B, 3 = C, 2 = D, 1 = F). I’m then dividing “free agency” into 3 parts: coach, free agency, and draft. I think all 3 for a rebuilding team like ours is equal, so I’ve assigned 33% of the grade to each accordingly. Here are the reported transactions and personnel moves:
1. Coaching (Luke, Shaw, et. al): I give this a 4.5
2. Free Agency
a. Mozgov (17% of 94m cap in 2016-17): 3
b. Deng (19% of cap): 4 (nice solid veteran)
c. Clarkson (13% of cap): 4.5 (great value signing)
d. Calderon (8% of cap): 4.5 (great trade)
e. Black (6% of cap): 4 (good 1 year cap filler)
f. Huertas (1.7% of cap): 4 (good 1 year cap filler)
AVERAGE: 4
3. Draft
a. Ingram: 5
b. Zubac: 4.5
AVERAGE: 4.75
YINOMA’s FREE AGENCY OVERALL GRADE: 4.4 (translated to around an overall “B”).
As much as I wish we could have done better in the free agency component, we absolutely nailed the draft/coaching, which IMO, is equally (or even more) important with FA. What is your grade using my criteria (3 parts: coaching/FA/draft on a 1-5 scale).
We reportedly have 13.4m in cap space left, and likely 31.7m next year (enough for a max offer to WB). So it's not like the team has killed future flexibility. Most pundits have crucified the Lakers "offseason," but IMO have narrowly defined that as simply the "free agency" component without looking at the equally important coaching/drafting decisions.
Imagine if we kept Byron, and didn't have a 2nd pick and say blew the 32nd pick. Things would be dramatically worse. But IMO we absolutely killed 2 of the 3 components of the "Offseason" and therefore have an overall "B" score. |
Luke seems like a reasonable hire. Nothing to second guess about the draft at this point. Free agency was a mixed bag -- I am not sold on Clarkson as anything more than an average guard, but his contract is decent; we might be regretting Deng and Mosgoz's contracts in a few years, but they are good transitional players who can help with team culture.
I'd give the Lakers a solid B. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
oldschool32 Franchise Player
Joined: 24 Jun 2005 Posts: 20032
|
Posted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 9:10 am Post subject: |
|
|
Draft:A+
Coaching:B
Free agency:D-
I couldn't have asked for more out of the draft, they hit a homerun in terms of potential. Hiring Luke was great in terms of Develpment the young guys, but I think they could have added a guru on defense and I really expected them to surround Luke with more veteran coaches. Free agency was a let down. I wasn't expecting them to sign any big names because they aren't in that position yet, but I don't think signing 30+ year old players to 4 year deals is a good idea. I like the fit for the most part, just not the years. _________________ "It's just a job. Grass grows, birds fly, waves pound the sand. I beat people up."-The Greatest |
|
Back to top |
|
|
|