GRADING the Lakers Offseason
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What grade do you give the Lakers offseason (coach, free agency, draft)?
5 ("A" grade)
21%
 21%  [ 20 ]
4 ("B" grade)
58%
 58%  [ 56 ]
3 ("C" grade)
14%
 14%  [ 14 ]
2 ("D" grade)
5%
 5%  [ 5 ]
Total Votes : 95

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epak
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 7:24 pm    Post subject:

A if we get anything in return for Nick
A- if we stretch Nick
B+ if we keep Nick
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 7:26 pm    Post subject:

kikanga wrote:
venturalakersfan wrote:
kikanga wrote:
How is Calderon a good signing now? When last season when NY signed him, people said Calderon isn't a good player/signing?

Mozgod, Deng, and Clarkson are quality signings. Not A level. But I can accept B.
But Huertas, Calderon, and Black aren't coveted players in the slightest. 2 of those players weren't good enough to get consistent minutes on the 2nd worst team in the league last year (us). Don't understand how that equates to a B free agency. C seems more appropriate.


We didn't sign him, we took his contract in exchange for two draft picks. That is what makes adding Calderon good, cap space next offseason and two draft picks.


Fair enough. I don't think we need those picks on the basketball court (since we have a ton of young prospects already). But they could be used as trade assets down the line.


Yes, as could potentially Calderon.
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mirak
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 10:27 pm    Post subject:

Coach - solid B+/A- Luke is still young and relatively inexperienced, so can't say A+. But he's the guy we wanted.

FA signings - B-/C+ - still puzzled by giving Mozgov 4 years, seems like we were competing against ourselves. Doesn't matter that Luke says he wanted him. This move is somewhat alleviated, however, by what seems like an excellent bargain for JC. I liked the Deng signing, too.

Even if striking out on the top tier FAs was to be expected, can't get an A unless you grab one of them. This is not a championship squad who just needed to sign a few role players, this was a 17 win squad that needed established stars, but we got role players. That means we won't be competitive off the bat, and this is LA, expectations are always high.

Draft - A/A+ - We got Ingram, who most teams would have picked at #2. Still, his body is not yet NBA ready, and he's so young. Zubac looks like a steal - a first round talent with a 2nd round pick.
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fansincemagic
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 10:48 pm    Post subject:

I try to look at working with what they had, Ingram is a great building block but he was a given at #2. Landing Walton, getting Zubac in the 2nd and signing JC cheap for 4 years trump paying what they did for Deng and Mozgov. Us fans had high hopes for a big named FA but made some solid moves and have a max slot for next year. I'll give them a B overall, which will look like an A if the vets and staff help groom these young prospects into a team Westbrook will want to play for.
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 30, 2016 10:29 am    Post subject:

venturalakersfan wrote:
kikanga wrote:
How is Calderon a good signing now? When last season when NY signed him, people said Calderon isn't a good player/signing?

Mozgod, Deng, and Clarkson are quality signings. Not A level. But I can accept B.
But Huertas, Calderon, and Black aren't coveted players in the slightest. 2 of those players weren't good enough to get consistent minutes on the 2nd worst team in the league last year (us). Don't understand how that equates to a B free agency. C seems more appropriate.


We didn't sign him, we took his contract in exchange for two draft picks. That is what makes adding Calderon good, cap space next offseason and two draft picks.


This is what the Lakers should be doing anytime they have an opportunity. By opportunity I mean late in free agency when it's not affecting your ability to sign anyone worthwhile, you flex your financial advantage you have over other teams. You pick up two future assets to help replenish the assetless cupboard over the next few years ... That's a great move. You don't need to use them for players but can (maybe we spot another Clarkson or Zubac or Nance who we picked up as a pick in exactly the same kind of deal). But you have these picks in your pocket if you need to for a trade or dumping another longer contract. Frankly, at the premium price teams are now putting on picks these days with the cap having gone up, it's a bonus in my mind if Calderon even gives us something worthwhile. You could release him right now and it would still be an "A" type of move.
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 30, 2016 3:24 pm    Post subject:

Probably should separate free-agency to free-agency and trades.

Coaching: A (replaced BS with LW, a hot commodity)
Draft: A (got 2 of the top 5 projected players at their positions)
Trades: A (got additional assets while taking on a one-year rental in Calderon that they can still trade at the deadline for more assets). Still pending the Nick Young move though.
Free-agency: C (Mozgov is too many years guaranteed at too much money, but they had little negotiation advantage. Same with Deng. On the flip side, these are good "culture" signings. Clarkson deal with decent and that raises the grade.).

Basically I look at the Laker moves mirroring what the LA Kings had done years ago when they hired Dean Lombardi. They had a complete overhaul of everything and developed a certain team identity from the ground up. Lakers have finally settled on what their organizational identity will be with the hiring of Luke. They've gotten some talent in the draft and now have to develop them. They've also signed some bridge players, i.e. veterans to teach the young players the culture that the team is trying to create. Now we'll see if the Lakers take the next step.
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 30, 2016 5:15 pm    Post subject:

venturalakersfan wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
It's truly ironic that some would think firing Byron/hiring Luke was "obvious."

Why do you think we were in a position where Byron had to be fired in the first place? B/c the Lakers didn't make the "obvious" right coaching choice in the first place.


If theories of why they hired Byron (to promote Kobe's last two seasons) are correct, they did hire the obvious and right choice. I think the out in the year that Kobe retired supports that as well.


After D'Antoni decided to leave prior to the 14-15 season (LA refusing to pick up his 15-16 option and MD refusing to be a lame duck coach), LA tried to get a good coach before hiring Byron. They interviewed him at least three times while they looked for a better option. No coach of quality wanted to step into the deficit the Lakers were in, the foremost issue likely having been placating Bryant who was on a nearly $50 million extension coming off major injury.

Scott was a way to get return on investment from the Bryant deal while the team was in full tank mode. The plan was to keep their 1st round picks for two years while Bryant kept the ratings high. When Kobe wrapped it up LA would look for a legit coach. They even put a win count clause so they could cut Byron lose without loss of face with the other Buss kids.

The picks ended up being Russell and Ingram. The coach, Walton after having trained under Kerr for the last two years and a surprise opportunity to get a temp head coaching gig for 30+ games.

I know it's been really hard the last few years but I don't know if you could have scripted a revival any better given where they started. The only better outcome would have been pulling one or more superstars in free agency which they facilitated with good financial planning but as we've seen requires you be further along than where we started from. We need a solid year to convince next July's marquee free agents to give us a legit look, but we're right there.


BTW, the only criteria our free agent moves should be evaluated by is how well it helps us make a case next July. Deng and Mozgov are going to be stabilizing forces for our roster this year and the young guys are going to be better for it. That's way more valuable than saving the space.
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gng930
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 31, 2016 5:39 am    Post subject:

Draft: A
Coaching: B+

Mozgov: D (possibly good fit but awful contract)
Deng: C (great fit but bad contract, encouraging that they pursued Bazemore first though)
Clarkson: A (bargain...enough said)
Calderon: A (just for the fact that they got a pair of 2nd-rounders which is where Mitch seems to really shine)
Black: A (low risk...moderately-high reward)

FA/trade averages out to a C+ but I feel the longer deals should weigh in more heavily. I also understand we just didn't have good bargaining power. In hindsight, there were better deals that were signed but the team has been burned in the past for waiting and who's to say those players would have signed those same deals with a 17-win team? All things considered, I still give them a C- in FA/trade which may continue to be the case as long as they lack a pitchman in FA meetings. Once Luke establishes credibility as a coach, that will be him.

In the grand scheme of things, the team has established a positive, progressive culture, maintained flexibility to grab a MAX free agent (and maybe more) next summer and added premier prospects to an already strong young talent pool that really shined in SPL.

Overall B+ IMO. All eyes are on Luke and I'm genuinely excited. I'll be moving to the Bay Area soon but I'll still be more psyched to watch Laker games.
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 31, 2016 9:45 am    Post subject:

I selected 'A' finally having a coach who can actually coach is a bigger acqusition then any marquee FA we could have signed with the exception of LeBron and Durant,

For example would you rather have Luke and a talented young team

Or a bad coach like Scott and a FA signing like Whiteside?

Having a coach is a lot bigger to me then had we had gotten a marquee FA.
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dcarter4kobe
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 31, 2016 12:42 pm    Post subject:

gng930 wrote:
Draft: A
Coaching: B+

Mozgov: D (possibly good fit but awful contract)
Deng: C (great fit but bad contract, encouraging that they pursued Bazemore first though)
Clarkson: A (bargain...enough said)
Calderon: A (just for the fact that they got a pair of 2nd-rounders which is where Mitch seems to really shine)
Black: A (low risk...moderately-high reward)

FA/trade averages out to a C+ but I feel the longer deals should weigh in more heavily. I also understand we just didn't have good bargaining power. In hindsight, there were better deals that were signed but the team has been burned in the past for waiting and who's to say those players would have signed those same deals with a 17-win team? All things considered, I still give them a C- in FA/trade which may continue to be the case as long as they lack a pitchman in FA meetings. Once Luke establishes credibility as a coach, that will be him.

In the grand scheme of things, the team has established a positive, progressive culture, maintained flexibility to grab a MAX free agent (and maybe more) next summer and added premier prospects to an already strong young talent pool that really shined in SPL.

Overall B+ IMO. All eyes are on Luke and I'm genuinely excited. I'll be moving to the Bay Area soon but I'll still be more psyched to watch Laker games.


Agreed completely about the longer deals leaving a bad taste
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 31, 2016 1:01 pm    Post subject:

Laker's Fan wrote:
venturalakersfan wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
It's truly ironic that some would think firing Byron/hiring Luke was "obvious."

Why do you think we were in a position where Byron had to be fired in the first place? B/c the Lakers didn't make the "obvious" right coaching choice in the first place.


If theories of why they hired Byron (to promote Kobe's last two seasons) are correct, they did hire the obvious and right choice. I think the out in the year that Kobe retired supports that as well.


After D'Antoni decided to leave prior to the 14-15 season (LA refusing to pick up his 15-16 option and MD refusing to be a lame duck coach), LA tried to get a good coach before hiring Byron. They interviewed him at least three times while they looked for a better option. No coach of quality wanted to step into the deficit the Lakers were in, the foremost issue likely having been placating Bryant who was on a nearly $50 million extension coming off major injury.

Scott was a way to get return on investment from the Bryant deal while the team was in full tank mode. The plan was to keep their 1st round picks for two years while Bryant kept the ratings high. When Kobe wrapped it up LA would look for a legit coach. They even put a win count clause so they could cut Byron lose without loss of face with the other Buss kids.

The picks ended up being Russell and Ingram. The coach, Walton after having trained under Kerr for the last two years and a surprise opportunity to get a temp head coaching gig for 30+ games.

I know it's been really hard the last few years but I don't know if you could have scripted a revival any better given where they started. The only better outcome would have been pulling one or more superstars in free agency which they facilitated with good financial planning but as we've seen requires you be further along than where we started from. We need a solid year to convince next July's marquee free agents to give us a legit look, but we're right there.


BTW, the only criteria our free agent moves should be evaluated by is how well it helps us make a case next July. Deng and Mozgov are going to be stabilizing forces for our roster this year and the young guys are going to be better for it. That's way more valuable than saving the space.




Quote:
The plan was to keep their 1st round picks for two years


Quote:

The only better outcome would have been pulling one or more superstars in free agency which they facilitated with good financial planning but as we've seen requires you be further along than where we started from.



If they had landed a Star - Superstar in Summer 2014 or Summer 2015, it would have been nearly impossible to retain both the 2015 #2 pick (Russell) or the 2016 #2 (Ingram) unless the Star - Superstar missed most of the season because of health - injury issues.
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2016 7:42 am    Post subject:

Breaking Down Mitch's Summer

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Laker Land will be without the services of Kobe Bryant for the first time in 20 years, as the five time NBA Champion finally announced his retirement from the game that consumed much of his life. Unable to defeat father time, the Lakers looked to move forward from #8/24 and had much reason to be optimistic coming into the offseason.


http://mikesmind.sportsblog.com/posts/23170072/breaking-down-mitch-s-summer.html
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2016 9:29 am    Post subject:

Grading A-F is always a comparative rating. Based upon what the average of the league did ("C" grade, passing) I'd say the Lakers pulled off B-, just above average.

The move to dump B-Scott was the winning move, a no-brainer but still something they get credit for. The hire of Walton looks promising but he's an unknown in terms of impact, really. B for the two moves together.

The acquisition of Ingram was a product of the prior season's horrific finish, so as the winner's of the cellar prize, the Lakers get no special mark from me for that. C.

Adding a good defensive wing, B.

Mozgov seems mistake to me, the signing of a below average starting big bodied center, worse - with a foot injury history two years back The drafting of a second big lug (Zubac) is a passing grade for the end of the first round. C.
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2016 4:39 pm    Post subject:

KeepItRealOrElse wrote:
Coach A+
Draft A+
FA B-

A- overall


Yup. This is like the Lakers drafting in the mid 90s, getting steals in the 2nd round.
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2016 6:24 pm    Post subject:

1. Coaching: 4

2. Free Agency
a. Mozgov: 3.5
b. Deng : 4
c. Clarkson : 5
d. Calderon : 4
e. Black : 3
f. Huertas : 3

3. Draft
a. Ingram: 5
b. Zubac: 4

C+
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2016 6:41 pm    Post subject:

thegreatest wrote:
1. Coaching: 4

2. Free Agency
a. Mozgov: 3.5
b. Deng : 4
c. Clarkson : 5
d. Calderon : 4
e. Black : 3
f. Huertas : 3

3. Draft
a. Ingram: 5
b. Zubac: 4

C+


You graded them slightly over 4 on a five point scale.
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kikanga
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2016 7:26 pm    Post subject:

Mike@LG wrote:
KeepItRealOrElse wrote:
Coach A+
Draft A+
FA B-

A- overall


Yup. This is like the Lakers drafting in the mid 90s, getting steals in the 2nd round.


Am i being a negative nancy for thinking it's too soon to give Luke an A+?
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2016 7:41 pm    Post subject:

I gave them a "B". It is a rigged test though. I think they did the best they could possibly do considering the circumstances.
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 09, 2016 1:31 pm    Post subject:

Omar Little wrote:
thegreatest wrote:
1. Coaching: 4

2. Free Agency
a. Mozgov: 3.5
b. Deng : 4
c. Clarkson : 5
d. Calderon : 4
e. Black : 3
f. Huertas : 3

3. Draft
a. Ingram: 5
b. Zubac: 4

C+



You graded them slightly over 4 on a five point scale.


I wouldn't assume a simple average applies. It's foolish to weight each player's grade equally towards an overall team mark. Mozgov and Deng as likely new starters would combine for C+, even if weighted equally. Zubac graded a 4 for his draft position, but probably not for his value to the club overall.
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audioaxes
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 09, 2016 1:58 pm    Post subject:

coaching A:
I think some people have some unrealistic expectations of Luke but I still like the hire of a younger coach more open to innovation.
free agency C:
I'm not dinging the Lakers for not being able to nab a super star agent... I never thought that was even possible to begin with given that so many better teams could offer the same contract we could. But I hate that we overpaid for Mozgov and Deng as old stop gap players. If we couldnt get anyone who is on their upside I rather we not get anyone at all. On the positive I loved that we were able to resign Clarkson to a budget contract and I liked the Calderon trade.
draft: A
I dont think any player drafted behind our picks will become better than who we drafted.
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 09, 2016 6:14 pm    Post subject:

Coach: A+
Draft: A+
Free Agency: C+

Coaching is the obvious one: got rid of the worst coach in NBA history and hired a coach we wanted.

Draft: Ingram being a stud and Zubac being yet another steal. As well as both of them being the positions we absolutely needed.

Some solid ones like Deng signing, great value signings in with Clarkson and Black, getting Calderon and 2 2nd rounders is nice. The Mosgov signing brings the grade much lower though and didn't really see the point in resigning Huertus. Would have much rather had a upcoming d-leaguer take his spot since we pretty much know what we get (and don't get) from Marcelo.

Overall, very good offseason.
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