|
| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
Laker's Fan
Franchise Player
Joined: 27 Jun 2002
Posts: 12850
|
 Posted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 10:07 am Post subject: |
|
|
I predict Luol Deng will get a 3-year, $54 million deal.
_________________
Austin Reaves keeps his game tight, like Kobe Bryant on game night. |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
Wildchild027
Star Player
Joined: 17 Jul 2002
Posts: 3846
Location: A-T-L-A-N-T-A
|
| Posted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 10:35 am Post subject: |
|
|
| MJST wrote: | | dao wrote: | | MJST wrote: | | dao wrote: | | MJST wrote: | | There's absolutely no reason to get Paul George prior to free agency, nor give up our assets for him, our team is nowhere near "one Paul George away" from enough of a one year run that he wouldn't leave in free agency. |
of course there is. Acquiring his rights now would allow us to offer George the largest contract when he becomes a free agent. If we can trade for him without giving up Russell/Ingram, it makes plenty of sense to trade for him now. Of course an ideal scenario would be keeping the pick and signing him in 2018, but that would be a long shot. The Pacers are basically forced to trade him now, and the team that acquires him will be able to offer him the biggest contract. I want that team to be us, as long as the trade doesn't involve Russell/Ingram.
A package of #3 + Randle + Clarkson is pretty perfect for both sides. Pacers get Jackson to replace George at SF, and Randle fits with Turner in the starting frontcourt.
On our end, getting rid of Clarkson's 12 million per year and avoiding having to extend Randle allows us to pursue another max FA in addition to George. |
Everyone expects Paul George to leave Indiana in free agency despite the fact they can give him the biggest contract.
We aren't special snowflakes.
Jf we're in the same situation as Indiana, which we will be if we give up our youth for him, he'll leave us just like he'll leave them. |
If we can attain George without giving up Russell/Ingram, we will be in much better shape than Indy is in now. In the Randle/Clarkson/#3 pick trade scenario, we'd be left with
Russell/Ennis
George/Nwaba
Ingram/Brewer
Nance/Deng
Zubac/Black
Plus cap space to sign another max free agent. In Indy, he's got only 1 up and coming teammate in Turner. Under this scenario, he'd have three (Russell, Ingram, Zubac), and we'd still have cap for another max FA. That's a much better situation than what he has in Indy.
Now of course, if the FO knows that George absolutely wants to come HERE, then you keep the assets and hope to sign George in FA. Short of this high level of certainty, I think it makes sense to trade for his rights now so that you can offer him the largest contract in 2018, as long as you can get George without giving up your top assets (Ingram, Russell, and don't sleep on Zubac, who was around 16/10/2 per 36 after he entered the regular rotation. That is crazy good for a player with such an underdeveloped physique and with so little playing experience. He is a potential future All Star as well).
Now, note that I include #3 in this scenario, because I would NOT trade Ball/Fultz for him. I also would not trade either Ingram or Russell. However, if the pick is #3, I wouldn't mind giving up Josh Jackson, Randle, and Clarkson for George. Clarkson has minimal value, and Randle at PF is easily replaced by Nance/Deng. Losing these two players would have very little negative impact on the team imo. So it comes down to whether trading Josh Jackson is worth being able to offer the largest contract to George in 2018. I think the answer is yes, particularly because dropping Clarkson's contract and not having to extend Randle would give us enough space to sign another max FA in addition to George. |
Expiring contract Paul George isn't worth Randle, Clarkson and the pick. |
Expiring contractGeorge Hill got a LOTTERY PICKfrom the Utah Jazz.
EXPIRING CONTRACTDemarcus Cousins (expire the same year as George) got two lottery picks.
EXPIRING CONTRACT Serge Ibaka got Terrence Ross and 2017 first round draft pick.
Maybe, you are the one not understanding the value of good players. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
richmorgan12
Starting Rotation
Joined: 13 Feb 2017
Posts: 595
|
| Posted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 10:38 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Wildchild027 wrote: | | MJST wrote: | | dao wrote: | | MJST wrote: | | dao wrote: | | MJST wrote: | | There's absolutely no reason to get Paul George prior to free agency, nor give up our assets for him, our team is nowhere near "one Paul George away" from enough of a one year run that he wouldn't leave in free agency. |
of course there is. Acquiring his rights now would allow us to offer George the largest contract when he becomes a free agent. If we can trade for him without giving up Russell/Ingram, it makes plenty of sense to trade for him now. Of course an ideal scenario would be keeping the pick and signing him in 2018, but that would be a long shot. The Pacers are basically forced to trade him now, and the team that acquires him will be able to offer him the biggest contract. I want that team to be us, as long as the trade doesn't involve Russell/Ingram.
A package of #3 + Randle + Clarkson is pretty perfect for both sides. Pacers get Jackson to replace George at SF, and Randle fits with Turner in the starting frontcourt.
On our end, getting rid of Clarkson's 12 million per year and avoiding having to extend Randle allows us to pursue another max FA in addition to George. |
Everyone expects Paul George to leave Indiana in free agency despite the fact they can give him the biggest contract.
We aren't special snowflakes.
Jf we're in the same situation as Indiana, which we will be if we give up our youth for him, he'll leave us just like he'll leave them. |
If we can attain George without giving up Russell/Ingram, we will be in much better shape than Indy is in now. In the Randle/Clarkson/#3 pick trade scenario, we'd be left with
Russell/Ennis
George/Nwaba
Ingram/Brewer
Nance/Deng
Zubac/Black
Plus cap space to sign another max free agent. In Indy, he's got only 1 up and coming teammate in Turner. Under this scenario, he'd have three (Russell, Ingram, Zubac), and we'd still have cap for another max FA. That's a much better situation than what he has in Indy.
Now of course, if the FO knows that George absolutely wants to come HERE, then you keep the assets and hope to sign George in FA. Short of this high level of certainty, I think it makes sense to trade for his rights now so that you can offer him the largest contract in 2018, as long as you can get George without giving up your top assets (Ingram, Russell, and don't sleep on Zubac, who was around 16/10/2 per 36 after he entered the regular rotation. That is crazy good for a player with such an underdeveloped physique and with so little playing experience. He is a potential future All Star as well).
Now, note that I include #3 in this scenario, because I would NOT trade Ball/Fultz for him. I also would not trade either Ingram or Russell. However, if the pick is #3, I wouldn't mind giving up Josh Jackson, Randle, and Clarkson for George. Clarkson has minimal value, and Randle at PF is easily replaced by Nance/Deng. Losing these two players would have very little negative impact on the team imo. So it comes down to whether trading Josh Jackson is worth being able to offer the largest contract to George in 2018. I think the answer is yes, particularly because dropping Clarkson's contract and not having to extend Randle would give us enough space to sign another max FA in addition to George. |
Expiring contract Paul George isn't worth Randle, Clarkson and the pick. |
Expiring contractGeorge Hill got a LOTTERY PICKfrom the Utah Jazz.
EXPIRING CONTRACTDemarcus Cousins (expire the same year as George) got two lottery picks.
EXPIRING CONTRACT Serge Ibaka got Terrence Ross and 2017 first round draft pick.
Maybe, you are the one not understanding the value of good players. |
Or maybe those GMs are just idiots. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Chase.button07
Star Player
Joined: 19 Feb 2017
Posts: 4996
|
| Posted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 10:50 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Wildchild027 wrote: |
Expiring contractGeorge Hill got a LOTTERY PICKfrom the Utah Jazz.
EXPIRING CONTRACTDemarcus Cousins (expire the same year as George) got two lottery picks.
EXPIRING CONTRACT Serge Ibaka got Terrence Ross and 2017 first round draft pick.
Maybe, you are the one not understanding the value of good players. |
Expiring Ibaka got #2pick in 3rd/4th yr and a 11th lotto pick
George hill got #12 pick which in turn was traded for J Teague. So both George Hill/Teague's expires got #12th pick |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
CRoost
Star Player
Joined: 21 Mar 2017
Posts: 4794
|
| Posted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 10:57 am Post subject: |
|
|
| BobbyB wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | Is ennis > mudiay? |
I would say Mudiay has more talent overall but ennis has more skill. Including better shot, passing abilities.
Mudiay projects more as a combo scoring guard IMO. Great ability to attack the rim, get to the ft line. His shot will improve but hard to say if it could ever get as good as DLo or Ennis. |
Ennis is a 3rd stringer. He only played one game of meaningful minutes with us. Nuggets became better when they run their offense through Jokic and made Mudliay who can't shoot a lick expendable. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Wildchild027
Star Player
Joined: 17 Jul 2002
Posts: 3846
Location: A-T-L-A-N-T-A
|
| Posted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 11:10 am Post subject: |
|
|
| richmorgan12 wrote: | | Wildchild027 wrote: | | MJST wrote: | | dao wrote: | | MJST wrote: | | dao wrote: | | MJST wrote: | | There's absolutely no reason to get Paul George prior to free agency, nor give up our assets for him, our team is nowhere near "one Paul George away" from enough of a one year run that he wouldn't leave in free agency. |
of course there is. Acquiring his rights now would allow us to offer George the largest contract when he becomes a free agent. If we can trade for him without giving up Russell/Ingram, it makes plenty of sense to trade for him now. Of course an ideal scenario would be keeping the pick and signing him in 2018, but that would be a long shot. The Pacers are basically forced to trade him now, and the team that acquires him will be able to offer him the biggest contract. I want that team to be us, as long as the trade doesn't involve Russell/Ingram.
A package of #3 + Randle + Clarkson is pretty perfect for both sides. Pacers get Jackson to replace George at SF, and Randle fits with Turner in the starting frontcourt.
On our end, getting rid of Clarkson's 12 million per year and avoiding having to extend Randle allows us to pursue another max FA in addition to George. |
Everyone expects Paul George to leave Indiana in free agency despite the fact they can give him the biggest contract.
We aren't special snowflakes.
Jf we're in the same situation as Indiana, which we will be if we give up our youth for him, he'll leave us just like he'll leave them. |
If we can attain George without giving up Russell/Ingram, we will be in much better shape than Indy is in now. In the Randle/Clarkson/#3 pick trade scenario, we'd be left with
Russell/Ennis
George/Nwaba
Ingram/Brewer
Nance/Deng
Zubac/Black
Plus cap space to sign another max free agent. In Indy, he's got only 1 up and coming teammate in Turner. Under this scenario, he'd have three (Russell, Ingram, Zubac), and we'd still have cap for another max FA. That's a much better situation than what he has in Indy.
Now of course, if the FO knows that George absolutely wants to come HERE, then you keep the assets and hope to sign George in FA. Short of this high level of certainty, I think it makes sense to trade for his rights now so that you can offer him the largest contract in 2018, as long as you can get George without giving up your top assets (Ingram, Russell, and don't sleep on Zubac, who was around 16/10/2 per 36 after he entered the regular rotation. That is crazy good for a player with such an underdeveloped physique and with so little playing experience. He is a potential future All Star as well).
Now, note that I include #3 in this scenario, because I would NOT trade Ball/Fultz for him. I also would not trade either Ingram or Russell. However, if the pick is #3, I wouldn't mind giving up Josh Jackson, Randle, and Clarkson for George. Clarkson has minimal value, and Randle at PF is easily replaced by Nance/Deng. Losing these two players would have very little negative impact on the team imo. So it comes down to whether trading Josh Jackson is worth being able to offer the largest contract to George in 2018. I think the answer is yes, particularly because dropping Clarkson's contract and not having to extend Randle would give us enough space to sign another max FA in addition to George. |
Expiring contract Paul George isn't worth Randle, Clarkson and the pick. |
Expiring contractGeorge Hill got a LOTTERY PICKfrom the Utah Jazz.
EXPIRING CONTRACTDemarcus Cousins (expire the same year as George) got two lottery picks.
EXPIRING CONTRACT Serge Ibaka got Terrence Ross and 2017 first round draft pick.
Maybe, you are the one not understanding the value of good players. |
Or maybe those GMs are just idiots. |
That Utah idiot got his team in the playoffs for the first time in 5 years.
When there are 10 different trades of 1st round picks for guys who contract either end this summer or next summer, than maybe the silly fans who won't trade a first round pick for an expirer are the real idiots.
I mean, one of those idiots (Morey) will be executive of the year. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Fortysixn2
Star Player
Joined: 22 Jun 2016
Posts: 2849
|
| Posted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 11:50 am Post subject: |
|
|
Well, all the people wanting to trade for PG got their wish...swept out of the playoffs with a miserable last performance which should theoretically drive his value down a smidge.
After seeing that, no way we should part with a top 3 pick, DLO, BI or ZU in any trade deal for the last year of his contract.
With Magic's friendship with Bird, that performance and Indy's position it should be doable. Honestly, if Magic CAN'T pull this off he's not much of a FO guy. Ball is in your court Earvin. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Chase.button07
Star Player
Joined: 19 Feb 2017
Posts: 4996
|
| Posted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 11:52 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Fortysixn2 wrote: | Well, all the people wanting to trade for PG got their wish...swept out of the playoffs with a miserable last performance which should theoretically drive his value down a smidge.
After seeing that, no way we should part with a top 3 pick, DLO, BI or ZU in any trade deal for the last year of his contract.
With Magic's friendship with Bird, that performance and Indy's position it should be doable. Honestly, if Magic CAN'T pull this off he's not much of a FO guy. Ball is in your court Earvin. |
 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Fortysixn2
Star Player
Joined: 22 Jun 2016
Posts: 2849
|
| Posted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 11:53 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Double post |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Wildchild027
Star Player
Joined: 17 Jul 2002
Posts: 3846
Location: A-T-L-A-N-T-A
|
| Posted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 11:54 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Fortysixn2 wrote: | Well, all the people wanting to trade for PG got their wish...swept out of the playoffs with a miserable last performance which should theoretically drive his value down a smidge.
After seeing that, no way we should part with a top 3 pick, DLO, BI or ZU in any trade deal for the last year of his contract.
With Magic's friendship with Bird, that performance and Indy's position it should be doable. Honestly, if Magic CAN'T pull this off he's not much of a FO guy. Ball is in your court Earvin. |
So you wouldn't part with a top 3 pick, when other teams (Utah and New Orleans and Orlando) gave away lottery picks to get Cousins, Hill and Ibaka? Magic isn't getting George giving up nothing. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
yinoma2001
Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010
Posts: 119487
|
| Posted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 12:00 pm Post subject: |
|
|
And so it begins.
_________________
From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
iimarshon
Star Player
Joined: 12 Oct 2007
Posts: 2673
|
| Posted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 12:01 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Wildchild027 wrote: | | Fortysixn2 wrote: | Well, all the people wanting to trade for PG got their wish...swept out of the playoffs with a miserable last performance which should theoretically drive his value down a smidge.
After seeing that, no way we should part with a top 3 pick, DLO, BI or ZU in any trade deal for the last year of his contract.
With Magic's friendship with Bird, that performance and Indy's position it should be doable. Honestly, if Magic CAN'T pull this off he's not much of a FO guy. Ball is in your court Earvin. |
So you wouldn't part with a top 3 pick, when other teams (Utah and New Orleans and Orlando) gave away lottery picks to get Cousins, Hill and Ibaka? Magic isn't getting George giving up nothing. |
Id trade a Top 3 Pick + Houston Pick + Tarik.
Id rather have DLO then a top 3 pick, personally.
But essentially:
Top 3 Pick OR Russell + Houston Pick + Black
If they want more, id prob pass. Although theres no one i want more than Paul George. And I think he's getting traded this summer and I think whoever trades for him will resign him the year after too.
I think it'll come down to Lakers, Celtics, maybe Miami (but probably not), maybe Rockets (but probably not), maybe Trailblazers (McCollum).
I hope PG pushes for Lakers.
_________________
24 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
iimarshon
Star Player
Joined: 12 Oct 2007
Posts: 2673
|
| Posted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 12:07 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Would you trade Clarkson or Randle for Carmelo if it meant we could get rid of Deng (and Knicks took his contract on)?
_________________
24 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
venturalakersfan
Retired Number
Joined: 14 Apr 2001
Posts: 144462
Location: The Gold Coast
|
| Posted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 12:21 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Wildchild027 wrote: | | Fortysixn2 wrote: | Well, all the people wanting to trade for PG got their wish...swept out of the playoffs with a miserable last performance which should theoretically drive his value down a smidge.
After seeing that, no way we should part with a top 3 pick, DLO, BI or ZU in any trade deal for the last year of his contract.
With Magic's friendship with Bird, that performance and Indy's position it should be doable. Honestly, if Magic CAN'T pull this off he's not much of a FO guy. Ball is in your court Earvin. |
So you wouldn't part with a top 3 pick, when other teams (Utah and New Orleans and Orlando) gave away lottery picks to get Cousins, Hill and Ibaka? Magic isn't getting George giving up nothing. |
Well with our recent success in the playoffs we should never add a player who can't lead his low seeded team to a series win against the world champions.
{sarcasm}
_________________
RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
venturalakersfan
Retired Number
Joined: 14 Apr 2001
Posts: 144462
Location: The Gold Coast
|
| Posted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 12:23 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| iimarshon wrote: | | Would you trade Clarkson or Randle for Carmelo if it meant we could get rid of Deng (and Knicks took his contract on)? |
No. We can stretch Deng and not lose assets or have to take a ball stopper like Melo.
_________________
RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Showtime__79
Sixth Man
Joined: 16 Apr 2017
Posts: 34
|
| Posted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 12:36 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| iimarshon wrote: | | Would you trade Clarkson or Randle for Carmelo if it meant we could get rid of Deng (and Knicks took his contract on)? |
I'll drive them to the airport. Just get it done. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
venturalakersfan
Retired Number
Joined: 14 Apr 2001
Posts: 144462
Location: The Gold Coast
|
| Posted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 12:38 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Showtime__79 wrote: | | iimarshon wrote: | | Would you trade Clarkson or Randle for Carmelo if it meant we could get rid of Deng (and Knicks took his contract on)? |
I'll drive them to the airport. Just get it done. |
What a waste of assets.
_________________
RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
fontana3d
Star Player
Joined: 22 Mar 2013
Posts: 3794
|
| Posted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 12:44 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| venturalakersfan wrote: | | iimarshon wrote: | | Would you trade Clarkson or Randle for Carmelo if it meant we could get rid of Deng (and Knicks took his contract on)? |
No. We can stretch Deng and not lose assets or have to take a ball stopper like Melo. |
Plus Melo needs to worry about his family issues before basketball anyways. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
iimarshon
Star Player
Joined: 12 Oct 2007
Posts: 2673
|
| Posted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 12:44 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| venturalakersfan wrote: | | iimarshon wrote: | | Would you trade Clarkson or Randle for Carmelo if it meant we could get rid of Deng (and Knicks took his contract on)? |
No. We can stretch Deng and not lose assets or have to take a ball stopper like Melo. |
Except stretching Deng saves 10m for 3 seasons, not 17m for 3 seasons..
It also means we'd be paying him like 7-8m for 4 addt seasons then the 3 left on his deal.
_________________
24 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
USCandLakers
Franchise Player
Joined: 13 Mar 2008
Posts: 19955
|
| Posted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 12:44 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| iimarshon wrote: | | venturalakersfan wrote: | | iimarshon wrote: | | Would you trade Clarkson or Randle for Carmelo if it meant we could get rid of Deng (and Knicks took his contract on)? |
No. We can stretch Deng and not lose assets or have to take a ball stopper like Melo. |
Except stretching Deng saves 10m for 3 seasons, not 17m for 3 seasons..
It also means we'd be paying him like 7-8m for 4 addt seasons then the 3 left on his deal. |
Why would the Knicks do that deal?
_________________
A banana is killed every time a terrible thread or post is made.  Save the bananas. Stop creating terrible posts! |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
fontana3d
Star Player
Joined: 22 Mar 2013
Posts: 3794
|
| Posted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 12:49 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| iimarshon wrote: | | Wildchild027 wrote: | | Fortysixn2 wrote: | Well, all the people wanting to trade for PG got their wish...swept out of the playoffs with a miserable last performance which should theoretically drive his value down a smidge.
After seeing that, no way we should part with a top 3 pick, DLO, BI or ZU in any trade deal for the last year of his contract.
With Magic's friendship with Bird, that performance and Indy's position it should be doable. Honestly, if Magic CAN'T pull this off he's not much of a FO guy. Ball is in your court Earvin. |
So you wouldn't part with a top 3 pick, when other teams (Utah and New Orleans and Orlando) gave away lottery picks to get Cousins, Hill and Ibaka? Magic isn't getting George giving up nothing. |
Id trade a Top 3 Pick + Houston Pick + Tarik.
Id rather have DLO then a top 3 pick, personally.
But essentially:
Top 3 Pick OR Russell + Houston Pick + Black
If they want more, id prob pass. Although theres no one i want more than Paul George. And I think he's getting traded this summer and I think whoever trades for him will resign him the year after too.
I think it'll come down to Lakers, Celtics, maybe Miami (but probably not), maybe Rockets (but probably not), maybe Trailblazers (McCollum).
I hope PG pushes for Lakers. |
I think the Lakers might do a straight swap to have George absorb our cap space. So it's the top 3 pick, Houston Pick, and a salary filler (Brewer, Black, and even Young if he opts it). Or just PG for the top 3 pick+houston pick. Nick opting out clears the remaining cap space need to take on George. Also since the Lakers are awful with free agents anyways this should be the only move this offseason. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Vottomatic
Starting Rotation
Joined: 20 Feb 2015
Posts: 385
|
| Posted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 12:57 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| fontana3d wrote: | | iimarshon wrote: | | Wildchild027 wrote: | | Fortysixn2 wrote: | Well, all the people wanting to trade for PG got their wish...swept out of the playoffs with a miserable last performance which should theoretically drive his value down a smidge.
After seeing that, no way we should part with a top 3 pick, DLO, BI or ZU in any trade deal for the last year of his contract.
With Magic's friendship with Bird, that performance and Indy's position it should be doable. Honestly, if Magic CAN'T pull this off he's not much of a FO guy. Ball is in your court Earvin. |
So you wouldn't part with a top 3 pick, when other teams (Utah and New Orleans and Orlando) gave away lottery picks to get Cousins, Hill and Ibaka? Magic isn't getting George giving up nothing. |
Id trade a Top 3 Pick + Houston Pick + Tarik.
Id rather have DLO then a top 3 pick, personally.
But essentially:
Top 3 Pick OR Russell + Houston Pick + Black
If they want more, id prob pass. Although theres no one i want more than Paul George. And I think he's getting traded this summer and I think whoever trades for him will resign him the year after too.
I think it'll come down to Lakers, Celtics, maybe Miami (but probably not), maybe Rockets (but probably not), maybe Trailblazers (McCollum).
I hope PG pushes for Lakers. |
I think the Lakers might do a straight swap to have George absorb our cap space. So it's the top 3 pick, Houston Pick, and a salary filler (Brewer, Black, and even Young if he opts it). Also since the Lakers are awful with free agents anyways this should be the only move this offseason. |
Yup that's what I would offer too, unless we get the #1 pick then I'll keep the pick .... |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
EZ-Ryder
Starting Rotation
Joined: 11 Jul 2013
Posts: 843
|
| Posted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 1:02 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| pjiddy wrote: | | Dilla_ wrote: | I don't know if anyone has seen this yet Dan Favale from Bleacher Report predicts how much some FAs will make this summer.
JaMychal Green - Four years, $76 million
Tim Hardaway Jr - Four years, $58 million
Serge Ibaka - Four years, $108 million
Patty Mills - Four years, $70 million
Nerlens Noel - Four years, $90 million
Mason Plumlee - Four years, $60 million
JJ Redick - Four years, $74 million
Andre Roberson - Four years, $88 million
Derrick Rose - Three years, $42 million
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2704610-he-made-how-much-predicting-the-worst-contracts-of-2017-nba-offseason |
88 million for Roberson?? So he's gonna get more than Oladipo??
Truth be told, I really like Roberson. I think his defense is so good, he's worth signing and praying his jump shot falls. But I don't think anyone gives him that. Lot of guys on that list I like, but short of Ibaka, I don't see us going after any of them. |
I think Roberson gets that money. He's the second best perimeter defender in the league behind Leonard and impacts the game more significantly than anyone outside of NBA front offices probably realizes. Here is a look at some of the top NBA players effective shooting percentage normally and then against Roberson.
Kawhi leonard. 55%. 44% with Roberson guarding.
James harden. 69%. 28% Roberson guarding.
LeBron James. 63%. 43% with Roberson guarding.
Demar derozan. 70%. 50% with Roberson guarding.
Gordon hayward.70%. 40% with Roberson guarding.
His numbers aren't sexy, but dude impacts the game defensively in ways only shared by leonard, draymond, and gobert. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
USCandLakers
Franchise Player
Joined: 13 Mar 2008
Posts: 19955
|
| Posted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 1:07 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| EZ-Ryder wrote: | | pjiddy wrote: | | Dilla_ wrote: | I don't know if anyone has seen this yet Dan Favale from Bleacher Report predicts how much some FAs will make this summer.
JaMychal Green - Four years, $76 million
Tim Hardaway Jr - Four years, $58 million
Serge Ibaka - Four years, $108 million
Patty Mills - Four years, $70 million
Nerlens Noel - Four years, $90 million
Mason Plumlee - Four years, $60 million
JJ Redick - Four years, $74 million
Andre Roberson - Four years, $88 million
Derrick Rose - Three years, $42 million
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2704610-he-made-how-much-predicting-the-worst-contracts-of-2017-nba-offseason |
88 million for Roberson?? So he's gonna get more than Oladipo??
Truth be told, I really like Roberson. I think his defense is so good, he's worth signing and praying his jump shot falls. But I don't think anyone gives him that. Lot of guys on that list I like, but short of Ibaka, I don't see us going after any of them. |
I think Roberson gets that money. He's the second best perimeter defender in the league behind Leonard and impacts the game more significantly than anyone outside of NBA front offices probably realizes. Here is a look at some of the top NBA players effective shooting percentage normally and then against Roberson.
Kawhi leonard. 55%. 44% with Roberson guarding.
James harden. 69%. 28% Roberson guarding.
LeBron James. 63%. 43% with Roberson guarding.
Demar derozan. 70%. 50% with Roberson guarding.
Gordon hayward.70%. 40% with Roberson guarding.
His numbers aren't sexy, but dude impacts the game defensively in ways only shared by leonard, draymond, and gobert. |
I love Roberson's defense, but you just can't run a proper offense with him on the perimeter. He's a disruptive force on the defensive end, but also one on the offensive end for the wrong reason.
_________________
A banana is killed every time a terrible thread or post is made. Save the bananas. Stop creating terrible posts! |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
JUST-MING
Retired Number
Joined: 23 Jun 2005
Posts: 43986
|
| Posted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 1:12 pm Post subject: |
|
|
5-on-5: Will Pacers trade Paul George? Should they?
| Quote: |
1. The Pacers _________ trade Paul George this offseason.
A. Should and will
B. Should but won't
C. Shouldn't but will
D. Shouldn't and won't
Amin Elhassan, ESPN Insider: A. If (and only if) George does not make the All-NBA team this season. Should he be named to such an honor, the Pacers would be eligible to offer him a deal that would be about $70 million more lucrative than any other open-market offer, a sum that would certainly keep him in a Pacers uniform. However, without that safety net, the Pacers would face too large a flight risk, and so they'd be better off moving aggressively rather than waiting.
Chris Herring, FiveThirtyEight/ESPN.com: A. Dropping this series in frustrating fashion doesn't help the case to keep him. But at this point, without the potential lure of extra money through the Designated Player Exception (DPE), I don't think you can risk losing someone that talented -- for nothing -- in his prime, especially not when there are reports saying he's interested in going elsewhere. Go acquire a pick or two to get players closer in age to Myles Turner.
Bradford Doolittle, ESPN Insider: D. Trading George signals a total rebuild. It's easy to say that's what needs to happen. However, with Indiana, you're talking about an 82-year-old owner (Herb Simon) and a 60-year-old hoops executive (Larry Bird). The Pacers have the flexibility to make themselves over this summer, and they need to make a run at doing so before dealing away an irreplaceable talent.
Jeremias Engelmann, ESPN Insider: Probably B. There's certainly a case to be made for dealing him and "blowing it up." The Pacers have finished seventh in the East and been ousted in the first round two straight years. Before that, they finished ninth. They're the mayors of "no man's land."
Kevin Pelton, ESPN Insider: D. I'm not convinced the Pacers can get enough value from teams that aren't certain they can re-sign George -- or from the Los Angeles Lakers if they believe they can sign him without having to give up picks or young players in return -- to justify giving up the chance he makes the All-NBA Team next year. While George probably can't maintain his level of play over the last month for a full season, if he comes close, there will probably be an All-NBA spot for him.
|
| Quote: |
2. What else do you foresee and advise for the Pacers this offseason?
Herring: Depending on what happens with George, it may make sense to tear the process all the way down and start over. If you end up keeping him, which is risky for any number of reasons, you need to substantially improve the team to make sure he doesn't go into free agency next summer disappointed with the direction of the franchise.
That means finding guys who would be upgrades over Jeff Teague and C.J. Miles. Since I don't have faith they can convince those sorts of talents to play for a stagnant Pacers team, I'd probably advise dealing George and starting over.
Elhassan: Obviously, the George domino will dictate much of the direction Indiana should take. If George is to be moved, the most prudent course of action is to divest themselves of the other large salaries on the books (Thaddeus Young and Monta Ellis to start) and begin to craft the next vision of Pacers basketball around Myles Turner.
Doolittle: We'll see just how much the Pacers are hamstrung by the contracts Bird has given out that last couple of years for middling players like Ellis, Thaddeus Young and Al Jefferson. The Pacers should re-sign Teague, who not only fits well with George, but gives Indiana the chance to play faster if the right roster is put into place.
Then they need to make a run at Hoosier State native Gordon Hayward, clearing cap space as needed. A core four of George, Teague, Hayward and Turner would need only to be augmented with a 3-and-D wing to be a dynamite unit.
Engelmann: Teague has played well for the Pacers (real plus-minus: 1.5). If they can retain him for less than 80 percent of the max, they should.
Miles, if he's smart, will opt out. On the free agent market, he'll command more than double the $4.7 million he is making now. He also should be re-signed if the price is right, say, $13 million per season.
Pelton: A relatively quiet offseason, presuming Indiana is able to re-sign Jeff Teague at a reasonable price. If so, Teague's cap hold will swallow up most of the Pacers' cap space, particularly if C.J. Miles opts out (a virtual certainty) and re-signs. The Pacers could tweak their backup frontcourt rotation, but I think that's about it.
|
| Quote: |
3. Larry Bird wants the Pacers to play fast. How do they get there?
Pelton: Not with Nate McMillan as coach, given that this was the second-fastest team relative to league average he's coached for a full season (and the fastest since the 2003-04 Seattle SuperSonics).
But I'm not sure that playing faster would make Indiana a better team. The relationship between pace and performance remains a tenuous one at best. The bottom 10 teams in pace this season actually posted a better offensive rating (106.2) than the top 10 (105.6). And the middle third, in which the Pacers resided, were better yet (106.9).
Engelmann: By replacing coach Nate McMillan? His Trail Blazer teams were continuously among the slowest teams in the NBA. Playing fast simply doesn't appear to be his style. That said, pace isn't strongly correlated with team success, so it seems kind of pointless to shoehorn a roster that might rather play slow into a different style.
Elhassan: First of all, having a coach with a track record of coaching fast would be a nice start. Next, not stocking the roster with notorious plodders and ball stoppers. Third, adding some more pass-first, quick-decision-making talents.
Herring: This was one of those things that made the Nate McMillan hire so strange to me in the first place, given that his teams had a reputation for playing so slowly.
But if I were Bird watching this series, I'd be far more concerned with finding a way to regain the defensive edge the Pacers had three or four years ago. You can win big without playing fast, but it's much harder to accomplish that without playing defense. Cleveland may be able to do it, but the Pacers probably can't.
Doolittle: Follow my plan in No. 2 and the Pacers can play fast. This year's roster just had too many plodders -- Jefferson, Kevin Seraphin, Lavoy Allen and, arguably, Young. Of course, this is all contingent on getting George to play the 4 and like it.
|
| Quote: |
4. Fact or fiction: Myles Turner is the future superstar cornerstone for Indiana.
Elhassan: Faction. He's a tremendous shot blocker and defensive presence with a more than respectable perimeter stroke that extends to 3-point range. He might not be a superstar, but he's a pretty good asset to have in the cupboard, with a skill set that will fit in nearly any incarnation of a winning team.
Pelton: Fiction. I think it's unlikely that Turner develops into a top-10 player given his current trajectory. A more realistic outcome is him emerging as a top-25 player who's an All-Star most years. That could be a cornerstone piece, but I wouldn't call that a superstar.
Herring: Both. He becomes the player you build around if George walks. But based on what we've seen so far -- a ton of ability and athleticism, but likely still a rung beneath someone like Karl-Anthony Towns or Nikola Jokic -- you still need to find more young running mates for him to experience sustainable teamwide success. I'm not sure Turner's talent alone gets you there in the future.
Doolittle: Assuming his game continues to grow, Turner should be a foundation-quality player for a team in contention. I'm not sure I see him as a cornerstone because he's not a a great offensive creator, either for himself or others. But maybe he can get there.
As for his combo skills of deep shooting and shot-blocking, it's funny how much less rare that package now seems after basically half of the centers in the NBA took to shooting 3-pointers.
Engelmann: Fact, or at least, I think so. Turner just turned 21 and is one of the top 40 players in the NBA, according to Real Plus-Minus. He's a "modern" center that can shoot 3s, and he also gets steals and blocks while not turning the ball over often. His rebounding needs some work, though; currently, he grabs only 6.3 defensive boards per 36 minutes.
|
| Quote: |
5. If Pacers were a stock and you were looking three years ahead, would you buy, sell or hold?
Herring: Sell. If George departs, things would get ugly. But that'd still be best for the long-term growth of the franchise, which has made the playoffs 22 of the past 28 seasons.
George, a former No. 10 pick, is the only top-10 selection the Pacers have had in 20 years. It's so hard to find franchise-altering talent without being a high-end lottery team. The next few years would be painful, which is why I'd sell. But the long-term outlook would improve.
Elhassan: Hold. While I'm not completely sold on Larry Bird's idea of how to rebuild this team, history tells us that Indiana is very rarely awful. Any George trade is sure to net a luxurious haul, and as I mentioned above, Turner is a nice piece to build around in the meanwhile.
Doolittle: Sell. The path to immediate contention -- landing a premier free agent in addition to keeping Teague -- is a long shot. If George wants out at some point, then you're starting at ground level. You don't get from there to relevancy in three years, especially when the process has yet to start as of the close of the 2016-17 season.
Engelmann: Hold. Pacers management has been pretty average when it comes to putting together a competitive team. Their roster decisions are never home runs. Rather, they include some head-scratchers, like the recent George Hill trade.
Pelton: Hold. While I think Turner's a good enough centerpiece that Indiana would probably be undervalued by the market because of concern about George leaving, I don't feel confident enough about the Pacers' ability to put a winning team around Turner to actually buy up shares. Turner might be the only player on the current roster more likely than not to still be around in three years.
|
Last edited by JUST-MING on Sun Apr 23, 2017 1:21 pm; edited 2 times in total |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
|
|
