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King Randle
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 Posted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 6:51 am Post subject: |
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| DoubleClutch wrote: | | King Randle wrote: | | I don't think they'll move anyone before the start of the season unless they get a valid offer involving Deng. I think they'll roll with this squad and see how they're doing come the trade deadline. If they're fighting for the 8th seed I see them holding on to the main contributors of the squad and make their moves in the off season ( not including Deng who should be moved any chance they get). If they're too far out from and 8th seed then I see them moving JC and hopefully Deng at the deadline. |
I think they need to get Deng on the court at PF with Lonzo. Zo might actually make Deng look like he can still play. |
Good luck with that....Randle, Nance and Kuzma are ahead of him at PF. And Ingram and Brewer are ahead of him at SF...and to top it off he's too slow to play SF. Deng is absolutely done...I just hope his agent finds a taker form him and we can deal Deng and his disastrous contract. |
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yinoma2001
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| Posted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 7:06 am Post subject: |
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Rehabbing Deng's value may prove illusory.
More so than rehabbing Deng's value, we need development time for Jules/Nance/Kuz, especially b/c Jules is a RFA (and if we want to keep him, we would need to trade JC + Deng (with $0 coming back).
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King Randle
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| Posted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 7:14 am Post subject: |
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| yinoma2001 wrote: | Rehabbing Deng's value may prove illusory.
More so than rehabbing Deng's value, we need development time for Jules/Nance/Kuz, especially b/c Jules is a RFA (and if we want to keep him, we would need to trade JC + Deng (with $0 coming back). |
Bingo! |
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jodeke
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| Posted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 7:35 am Post subject: |
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I love what Earvin and Rob are doing. Signing KPC to a 1 year deal doesn't get in the way of signing two max players in 2018 and gives us a chance to be competitive in 2017. They didn't do a Deng, Mozgov albatross deal.
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PRLakeShow
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| Posted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 7:47 am Post subject: |
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| yinoma2001 wrote: | | Wildchild027 wrote: | | adkindo wrote: | | Wildchild027 wrote: | One team I see hasn't been mention for Deng is Utah. They have their guards with Rubio, Donovan and Exum, but they are a little lite on stretch 4's. The only one on the roster is Jebreko.
The reason I think the Jazz could look at Deng is Derrick Favors being a UFA. Do the Jazz really want to invest 20M a year into Favors? If we can give them Deng, plus two picks, does that make them bite?
Interesting to hear people thoughts. |
pretty sure they would rather put $20 Million into Favors over $18 Million into Deng |
You think they rather pay Favors 80 million + over 4 years, or pay Deng 36 million over 2, with two or three picks for their troubles? |
Obviously depends on the picks, and the protections on it.
2 2nd rounders won't do much.
But 2 1st rounders would be a good deal for Utah, not sure why the Lakers do that. |
We've gone through this before. LeBron/PG and keep Randle and no dead cap hit. |
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venturalakersfan
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| Posted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 7:50 am Post subject: |
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| ChickenStu wrote: | | Omar Little wrote: | | Laker's Fan wrote: | | PHILosophize wrote: | | Pelinka didn't mention Clarkson in his interview - trade for Belinelli IMMINENT |
I realize you're just kidding, but actually the way Pelinka talks about our having 2Max already is essentially saying I either have a deal to get Deng off the books or I'm trading Jordan. |
Both. |
God knows I've put forth enough Deng trade ideas for Rob to have stolen one of them and pulled something off. But in case he hasn't yet, here's another one, what with the Blazers trying to toss their hat into the Melo sweepstakes. 
http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=y99kezaf
Lakers in: Faried, Barton
Lakers out: Deng, Zubac, 2020 1st (top-10 protected), 2019 CHI 2nd
Knicks in: Deng, Ed Davis, Zubac, 2018 POR 1st, 2019 CHI 2nd, 2020 LA 1st
Knicks out: Melo
Blazers in: Melo
Blazers out: Crabbe, Davis, 2018 1st, 2020 1st
Nuggets in: Crabbe, 2020 POR 1st
Nuggets out: Faried, Barton
Why the Lakers do it: We give up a similar package to what I've suggested in a possible Deng-to-CHI deal. But this time, Faried contract is not expiring, and Barton is pretty helpful. That said, Faried shouldn't be that difficult to move, as he's a useful player. Maybe we could even look to flip him immediately, given that we, too, have a logjam at the 4.
Why the Knicks do it: With the Blazers apparently desperate to get Melo, the Knicks get a second 1st round pick out of this, and this one's a 2018 pick. I think that it would be worth it for them to absorb Deng if they got back two 1st rounders and Zubac, and the CHI 2019 2nd is about as valuable a 2nd round pick as there can be.
Why the Blazers do it: As discussed, they want to surround their backcourt duo with another star. They give up 2 first round picks here, in 2018 and 2020, but they also get Crabbe's money off the books, which is why the 2020 1st goes to the Nuggets. They also shed Ed Davis here as necessary salary filler.
Why the Nuggets do it: Although Crabbe is due a lot of money, they do shed Faried's remaining $26MM or so, and he is the odd man out there. Barton is someone they are very unlikely to retain past this season anyway, and Crabbe gives them another shooter for the next 3 years (to add to Gary Harris, a guy they will have around for a while). Not only is Crabbe a better fit for their squad than Faried is, but they pick up a future 2020 1st in this scenario, which isn't too shabby considering how badly they want to dump Faried. |
You forgot the deal breaker, why Melo does it?
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Zubolo
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| Posted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 8:06 am Post subject: |
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| adkindo wrote: | | Wildchild027 wrote: | One team I see hasn't been mention for Deng is Utah. They have their guards with Rubio, Donovan and Exum, but they are a little lite on stretch 4's. The only one on the roster is Jebreko.
The reason I think the Jazz could look at Deng is Derrick Favors being a UFA. Do the Jazz really want to invest 20M a year into Favors? If we can give them Deng, plus two picks, does that make them bite?
Interesting to hear people thoughts. |
pretty sure they would rather put $20 Million into Favors over $18 Million into Deng |
How about Deng, Randle, Clarkson for Favors, Joe Johnson, Alec Burkes (Sp).
Joe Johnson and Favors are expiring. Stretch out Burkes 3.5 over 3 years.
Utah gets likely upgrades in Randle and Clarkson going forward. Deng if he is a little bit motivated is just about as good as Joe Johnson at this stage of their careers.
Lakers have over 80 mill in cap space in 2018 but have to be very sure they can get their max FA targets! Thoughts? |
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Chase.button07
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| Posted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 8:15 am Post subject: |
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| yinoma2001 wrote: | Rehabbing Deng's value may prove illusory.
More so than rehabbing Deng's value, we need development time for Jules/Nance/Kuz, especially b/c Jules is a RFA (and if we want to keep him, we would need to trade JC + Deng (with $0 coming back). |
rehabbing or not, Deng has no value and shouldn't be getting any minutes over all young guys. heck not over T bryant as well.
he is lost cause. Wait for next summer and trade him with picks to get out of his contract.
in the mean time send him more or keep him on inactive list
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yinoma2001
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| Posted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 8:22 am Post subject: |
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| Chase.button07 wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | Rehabbing Deng's value may prove illusory.
More so than rehabbing Deng's value, we need development time for Jules/Nance/Kuz, especially b/c Jules is a RFA (and if we want to keep him, we would need to trade JC + Deng (with $0 coming back). |
rehabbing or not, Deng has no value and shouldn't be getting any minutes over all young guys. heck not over T bryant as well.
he is lost cause. Wait for next summer and trade him with picks to get out of his contract.
in the mean time send him more or keep him on inactive list |
Yeah. And even if we "showcase" him, that will barely move the needle. Teams will rightfully ask for a king's ransom (i.e. at least 1 future 1st, possibly more).
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Chase.button07
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| Posted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 8:39 am Post subject: |
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| yinoma2001 wrote: | | Chase.button07 wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | Rehabbing Deng's value may prove illusory.
More so than rehabbing Deng's value, we need development time for Jules/Nance/Kuz, especially b/c Jules is a RFA (and if we want to keep him, we would need to trade JC + Deng (with $0 coming back). |
rehabbing or not, Deng has no value and shouldn't be getting any minutes over all young guys. heck not over T bryant as well.
he is lost cause. Wait for next summer and trade him with picks to get out of his contract.
in the mean time send him more or keep him on inactive list |
Yeah. And even if we "showcase" him, that will barely move the needle. Teams will rightfully ask for a king's ransom (i.e. at least 1 future 1st, possibly more). |
ya. trading him next year makes sense instead of now. its going to cost us minimum 1 1st and 2nd
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Laker's Fan
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| Posted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 8:44 am Post subject: |
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| yinoma2001 wrote: | | Chase.button07 wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | Rehabbing Deng's value may prove illusory.
More so than rehabbing Deng's value, we need development time for Jules/Nance/Kuz, especially b/c Jules is a RFA (and if we want to keep him, we would need to trade JC + Deng (with $0 coming back). |
rehabbing or not, Deng has no value and shouldn't be getting any minutes over all young guys. heck not over T bryant as well.
he is lost cause. Wait for next summer and trade him with picks to get out of his contract.
in the mean time send him more or keep him on inactive list |
Yeah. And even if we "showcase" him, that will barely move the needle. Teams will rightfully ask for a king's ransom (i.e. at least 1 future 1st, possibly more). |
I think the answer for Deng is to try to 'Chris Webber' his deal. Trade him for two to three smaller contract, one of which is hopefully expiring, and whittle the salary obligation down from there. One example would be Delly/Hawes for Deng. Delly has a 3-year deal like Deng but has $31 million left to Deng's $54 million. Delly would also provide some value this season if kept. Then going into free agency next year finding a taker for 2-years, $21 million is less costly than moving Deng @ $36 million. Would probably take some sweetner(s) but not as high because you're taking a fair amount of salary back. As an ancillary point, I'm not totally convinced we would need LeBron's max to bring him here. If he makes the move to LA it's about 100's of millions, not the difference between $29 and $35 million. He could easily do a 1+1 where the first year is within 20% of his max and then re-sign a 3+1 as a non-bird free agent the following year.
Another example would be Temple/Koufos for Deng. Again, would take sweeteners but it sets you up to move or stretch one/both of the deals more easily.
in these cases you don't necessarily need to do a full rehab of Deng's reputation, just prove he can be a productive player in a position of need around the league.
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Wildchild027
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| Posted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 9:03 am Post subject: |
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| yinoma2001 wrote: | | Wildchild027 wrote: | | adkindo wrote: | | Wildchild027 wrote: | One team I see hasn't been mention for Deng is Utah. They have their guards with Rubio, Donovan and Exum, but they are a little lite on stretch 4's. The only one on the roster is Jebreko.
The reason I think the Jazz could look at Deng is Derrick Favors being a UFA. Do the Jazz really want to invest 20M a year into Favors? If we can give them Deng, plus two picks, does that make them bite?
Interesting to hear people thoughts. |
pretty sure they would rather put $20 Million into Favors over $18 Million into Deng |
You think they rather pay Favors 80 million + over 4 years, or pay Deng 36 million over 2, with two or three picks for their troubles? |
Obviously depends on the picks, and the protections on it.
2 2nd rounders won't do much.
But 2 1st rounders would be a good deal for Utah, not sure why the Lakers do that. |
I think the Lakers will do what they can to get out of Deng's contract. The Jazz have some tough decision they have to make next summer. They have Hood and Exum, who are RFA, and they have Favors, who is UFA. They are likely not to sign all three.
Deng and Josh Hart, plus a couple of drafts picks (one first) would be a decent haul for the Jazz. Hart could replace Exum, so they don't have to overpay him in FA, and Deng gives the Jazz a floor spacer next to Gobert. |
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Wildchild027
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| Posted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 9:07 am Post subject: |
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| yinoma2001 wrote: | Rehabbing Deng's value may prove illusory.
More so than rehabbing Deng's value, we need development time for Jules/Nance/Kuz, especially b/c Jules is a RFA (and if we want to keep him, we would need to trade JC + Deng (with $0 coming back). |
I don't see how Kuz get any minutes. The Lakers are unlikely to tell Deng to go away. You have to assume that the big man rotation will be (Deng, Randle, Nance and Lopez). Lopez is going to play 29 minutes. Randle maybe 30, Nance low 20's, and Deng in the teens. I just don't see any playing time for Kuz without and injury or a trade. |
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ahaider
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| Posted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 9:08 am Post subject: |
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I'm not as quick to trade Randle or Zubac.
Zubac in particular to me has showcased enough offensive versatility to me that his issues with defense remain worth working with. I want to continue to develop him defensively. If we move him, we're selling early.
With Randle, Zach Lowe and Luke Walton mentioned his game against Charlotte where he had 5 blocks in a game. They both think he can get to that level more consistently and Randle watches a lot of Draymond tape.
I truly beleive Randle is part of the attraction for 2 Max FA's. If we lose him, I think we're much less appealing. He's an elite rebounder and he's quite possibly the quickest 4 in the league. I want to see what he can do with Lonzo.
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Sentient Meat
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| Posted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 9:10 am Post subject: |
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When I see names like Jarrett Jack and Brandon Jennings being thrown out here, I hope people are finally starting to realize how much we needed to get Rondo. Watching the team blow a 26 point lead without Lonzo made this fact even more evident.
Maybe we should sign Derrick Rose... at least he'd have some sort of "Weekend at Bernie's" effect as his presence might at least psych out some teams for one season into believing we had a decent second unit leader. |
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Wildchild027
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| Posted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 9:10 am Post subject: |
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| King Randle wrote: | | DoubleClutch wrote: | | King Randle wrote: | | I don't think they'll move anyone before the start of the season unless they get a valid offer involving Deng. I think they'll roll with this squad and see how they're doing come the trade deadline. If they're fighting for the 8th seed I see them holding on to the main contributors of the squad and make their moves in the off season ( not including Deng who should be moved any chance they get). If they're too far out from and 8th seed then I see them moving JC and hopefully Deng at the deadline. |
I think they need to get Deng on the court at PF with Lonzo. Zo might actually make Deng look like he can still play. |
Good luck with that....Randle, Nance and Kuzma are ahead of him at PF. And Ingram and Brewer are ahead of him at SF...and to top it off he's too slow to play SF. Deng is absolutely done...I just hope his agent finds a taker form him and we can deal Deng and his disastrous contract. |
There is no way that Deng is not in the rotation. We may not like it, but Deng is playing as long as he's here. |
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jodeke
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| Posted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 9:11 am Post subject: |
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I've read a bunch of posts suggesting trades. Some look good but they are speculative.
Stick with the plan. Aim at 2 max players in 2018 without gutting the young nucleus. If Earvin and Rob can dump Deng's contract and stay with the plan I'm gonna pass the Mitch magic wand.
The trades the FO has made so far will make us competitive next season. Haven't been this stoked for a season in some time.
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America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves. |
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JustaObserver
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| Posted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 9:19 am Post subject: |
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| Why do people want to get rid of draft picks smh. Will some be then whining when the draft comes saying "aaaaah we don't got no draft picks!!! We can't get the next shinny toy!" ? Some just haven't learned much about giving away assets just to do it smh" you don't like deng? Then play him so he can raise his value...smh wow. He might surprise but just giving up is the same knees jerk reaction in buying a stock and if you see it go down just a little?...dump dump sale sale |
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RG73
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| Posted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 9:33 am Post subject: |
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| Wildchild027 wrote: | | King Randle wrote: | | DoubleClutch wrote: | | King Randle wrote: | | I don't think they'll move anyone before the start of the season unless they get a valid offer involving Deng. I think they'll roll with this squad and see how they're doing come the trade deadline. If they're fighting for the 8th seed I see them holding on to the main contributors of the squad and make their moves in the off season ( not including Deng who should be moved any chance they get). If they're too far out from and 8th seed then I see them moving JC and hopefully Deng at the deadline. |
I think they need to get Deng on the court at PF with Lonzo. Zo might actually make Deng look like he can still play. |
Good luck with that....Randle, Nance and Kuzma are ahead of him at PF. And Ingram and Brewer are ahead of him at SF...and to top it off he's too slow to play SF. Deng is absolutely done...I just hope his agent finds a taker form him and we can deal Deng and his disastrous contract. |
There is no way that Deng is not in the rotation. We may not like it, but Deng is playing as long as he's here. |
Why would we play the worst player in that front court any minutes? They shut him down the last two months of last season, why would you expect them to do something different this season? He's a practice guy, veteran locker room guy now. |
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yinoma2001
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| Posted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 9:34 am Post subject: |
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| jodeke wrote: | I've read a bunch of posts suggesting trades. Some look good but they are speculative.
Stick with the plan. Aim at 2 max players in 2018 without gutting the young nucleus. If Earvin and Rob can dump Deng's contract and stay with the plan I'm gonna pass the Mitch magic wand.
The trades the FO has made so far will make us competitive next season. Haven't been this stoked for a season in some time. |
2 (likely 3) out of JC/Deng/Jules will be gone to make cap space room for 2 maxes in 2018.
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Rek
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| Posted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 9:45 am Post subject: |
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| Sentient Meat wrote: | When I see names like Jarrett Jack and Brandon Jennings being thrown out here, I hope people are finally starting to realize how much we needed to get Rondo. Watching the team blow a 26 point lead without Lonzo made this fact even more evident.
Maybe we should sign Derrick Rose... at least he'd have some sort of "Weekend at Bernie's" effect as his presence might at least psych out some teams for one season into believing we had a decent second unit leader. |
I think there's quite a few that agree Rondo is better than the other PGs still available. But, NOP was able to offer a starting role and familiarity with Boogie.
I don't really want Jennings on our team. I'm neutral on Rose. The reality is that pretty much either of those guys along with players like Ennis and Sessions are upgrades for the bench and insurance policies for a Lonzo injury. It's not like the FO is unaware of the need. We know they talked to George Hill and Rondo. I prefer consistent ball distribution over another Lou/Clarkson scorer type. I'll be seriously disappointed if we end up with Farmar. |
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TDRock
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| Posted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 9:47 am Post subject: |
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THANK HEAVENS
Sorry. I just did not want Rondo on the serious ganxta tip...even moreso now that I've seen Zo play.
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JustaObserver
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| Posted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 9:52 am Post subject: |
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| RG73 wrote: | | Wildchild027 wrote: | | King Randle wrote: | | DoubleClutch wrote: | | King Randle wrote: | | I don't think they'll move anyone before the start of the season unless they get a valid offer involving Deng. I think they'll roll with this squad and see how they're doing come the trade deadline. If they're fighting for the 8th seed I see them holding on to the main contributors of the squad and make their moves in the off season ( not including Deng who should be moved any chance they get). If they're too far out from and 8th seed then I see them moving JC and hopefully Deng at the deadline. |
I think they need to get Deng on the court at PF with Lonzo. Zo might actually make Deng look like he can still play. |
Good luck with that....Randle, Nance and Kuzma are ahead of him at PF. And Ingram and Brewer are ahead of him at SF...and to top it off he's too slow to play SF. Deng is absolutely done...I just hope his agent finds a taker form him and we can deal Deng and his disastrous contract. |
There is no way that Deng is not in the rotation. We may not like it, but Deng is playing as long as he's here. |
Why would we play the worst player in that front court any minutes? They shut him down the last two months of last season, why would you expect them to do something different this season? He's a practice guy, veteran locker room guy now. |
Ummm it could be we were tank tanking. The whole nba knew it...ESPN knew it....there was nobody that thought we were sitting our vets because we were trying our best to ....make the playoffs. |
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King Randle
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| Posted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 9:54 am Post subject: |
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| Wildchild027 wrote: | | King Randle wrote: | | DoubleClutch wrote: | | King Randle wrote: | | I don't think they'll move anyone before the start of the season unless they get a valid offer involving Deng. I think they'll roll with this squad and see how they're doing come the trade deadline. If they're fighting for the 8th seed I see them holding on to the main contributors of the squad and make their moves in the off season ( not including Deng who should be moved any chance they get). If they're too far out from and 8th seed then I see them moving JC and hopefully Deng at the deadline. |
I think they need to get Deng on the court at PF with Lonzo. Zo might actually make Deng look like he can still play. |
Good luck with that....Randle, Nance and Kuzma are ahead of him at PF. And Ingram and Brewer are ahead of him at SF...and to top it off he's too slow to play SF. Deng is absolutely done...I just hope his agent finds a taker form him and we can deal Deng and his disastrous contract. |
There is no way that Deng is not in the rotation. We may not like it, but Deng is playing as long as he's here. |
Are you out of your mind? He got benched last year because he's pathetic. He aged 10 years in 1 year. Randle, Nance and Kuzma (who btw Pelinka and Magic love) are the future and energy of the bigs. When is the last time you heard either Magic Pelinka or Luke say "We expect big things from Deng this year." You haven't because he's a dang footnote with a ridiculous contract who cant play worth a lick. |
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yinoma2001
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| Posted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 9:56 am Post subject: |
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I doubt we are going to deep six Kuzma and have him sit on the bench and get 0 minutes.
How much can Deng realistically rehab his value? I'd argue not much. Maybe he plays "decently" in 12mpg but is the opportunity cost of sitting out younger players worth it (and the trade value of Deng is still the same essentially).
He's a sunk cost and should be treated as such, especially if his playing time comes at the expense of our young guys.
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