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Mike@LG
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Posted: Sat Oct 22, 2016 12:23 pm Post subject:

Dave20 wrote:

Mike@LG wrote:

Dave20 wrote:

We're starting slow because of Randle and Lou.

And it's supposed to be Randle supplying the motor with Lou supplying instant scoring punch.

Luke has to make the best decision for the team. He can't start Randle and Lou minutes should be limited.

I think Luke basically sees the 6th and 7th man (Clarkson and Nance) as an "even" unit with the starting unit, even when they start off slow.

When I watch the Warriors, Klay Thompson isn't wasting his time drawing fouls. He is in default scoring mode with his quick release shot or direct line to the hoop. That just screams Jordan Clarkson's role, although Clarkson is more comfortable as a slasher than spot up shooter.

The Lakers simply don't have a J.J. Redick or Klay Thompson or Kyle Korver type.
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Dave20
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Posted: Sat Oct 22, 2016 12:23 pm Post subject:

Russell, Clarkson, Ingram, Deng, and Mozgov is a lineup I think would thrive. Nance, Black, Calderon, and Young off the bench. Luke needs to shorten the rotation.

Mike@LG
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Posted: Sat Oct 22, 2016 12:25 pm Post subject:

P.K. wrote:

Mike@LG wrote:

Dave20 wrote:

We're starting slow because of Randle and Lou.

And it's supposed to be Randle supplying the motor with Lou supplying instant scoring punch.

I'd guess you already see this, but Randle really only supplies the motor when he's able to lead the fast break, which is only about 3-5 times a game. In the half court offense, he's stagnant and is more a hindrance than help

Right. A large part of it has to do with engagement with PnR and other things.

But I see a lot of Laker fans already willing to trade him or write him off, and dude isn't anywhere near close to developing.

It really didn't help that he was sidelined an entire rookie year. Injuries wreck development and skill level improvement.

There's a part of me that thinks Randle is better off the bench, because he can be more of a focal point of scoring attention with the second unit. Nance on the other hand, keeps the ball moving with the 1st unit and has range.
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P.K.
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Posted: Sat Oct 22, 2016 12:33 pm Post subject:

Mike@LG wrote:

P.K. wrote:

Mike@LG wrote:

Dave20 wrote:

We're starting slow because of Randle and Lou.

And it's supposed to be Randle supplying the motor with Lou supplying instant scoring punch.

Yep.
I might be critical of starting Randle when there seem to be better choices - however, I don't think they should trade him since his physical skills may turn into something.
And, I agree with the idea of Randle being a beast on the 2nd unit

Put Nance in the 1st unit, the ball moves, he plays tough D 100% of the time, and he can stretch the floor a little - not to mention, he probably gets assists going into Moz the way he does with Black (and Moz is severely under-utilized currently)
Put JR with the 2nd team, he destroys most other teams 2nd string PF's, he becomes a focal point on that team (which he can't do on the 1st team), and his defensive deficiencies aren't so glaring going against the other teams 2nd unit. This gives him a chance to grow into something down the road while not killing our 1st unit short term
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Last edited by P.K. on Sat Oct 22, 2016 12:37 pm; edited 1 time in total

PICKnPOP
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Posted: Sat Oct 22, 2016 12:37 pm Post subject:

Russell Ingram Deng Nance Mosgov I'd bring in Clarkson and Randle off the bench first for Ingram and nance to give us another boost of energy around that 6 minute mark he's talking about. Energy is energy and Clarkson/Randle will bring it in scoring and pushing the tempo.

Mike@LG
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Posted: Sat Oct 22, 2016 12:41 pm Post subject:

Quote:

Agreed. Basically whatever match up was best during the game, finishes the game.

I think if the Lakers were solely focused on winning games, then Loul Deng would start. He may not be a shot-blocking presence or tremendous rebounder, but he gives the guards all the floor space they need and gives good defensive effort.

Sidenote: I would never play Ingram at SG. That experiment didn't even work with Durant when he played in Seattle.
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defense
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Posted: Sat Oct 22, 2016 12:41 pm Post subject:

Lol Anthony Brown lead the team in three point percentage followed by Nick young

P.K.
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Posted: Sat Oct 22, 2016 12:52 pm Post subject:

Mike@LG wrote:

Quote:

I'm actually good with the concept of starting Deng at PF - except for the fact that I kind of agree with Luke that Ingram isn't ready for a full time starting role yet.
If we started Deng at PF, we'd have to start Young at SF - but that would leave us with Lou or JC at SG, both of which aren't a very good option.
That puts me into evaluating it as a "short term" vs "mid/long-term" lineups for this year:
Short: Dlo, Young, Deng, Nance, Moz
Mid/Long: Dlo, Young, Ingram, Deng, Moz
IF Ingram can handle the workload in 2 or 3 months (or whenever)...

I don't really see Dlo, JC, Young, Deng, Moz as being viable because Dlo/JC just does not work well, and JC works much better as a natural combo guard on the 2nd unit.
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lewis
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Posted: Sat Oct 22, 2016 12:53 pm Post subject:

manlisten wrote:

I'd like to see D'lo's numbers without Lou for comparison.

Also don't think JC got a fair shake as a starter going up against GSW. He at least should have gotten the nod against PHX and one of the Sac games.

Treble Clef
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Posted: Sat Oct 22, 2016 1:02 pm Post subject:

venturalakersfan wrote:

Our starters aren't as good as most other team's starters.

I think that is the most appropriate explanation. In every game, it seemed like the Lakers struggled against the opposing starters and did much better against the other teams second and third units.

anpherknee
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Posted: Sat Oct 22, 2016 1:02 pm Post subject:

defense wrote:

Lol Anthony Brown lead the team in three point percentage followed by Nick young

Mike@LG
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Posted: Sat Oct 22, 2016 1:09 pm Post subject:

Quote:

If we started Deng at PF, we'd have to start Young at SF

This is where we need AB.
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greenfrog
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Posted: Sat Oct 22, 2016 1:11 pm Post subject:

defense wrote:

Lol Anthony Brown lead the team in three point percentage followed by Nick young

3 for 5!

defense
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Posted: Sat Oct 22, 2016 1:14 pm Post subject:

I know I'll probably get hazed but I still think this line up should be tried for the sake of roster balance. Russell Brown Deng Nance Mosgov Tell the guards to crash the defensive boards. Tell this unit to work on half court execution and let the second unit run out the building. Go easy on me fellas lol.

dcarter4kobe
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Posted: Sat Oct 22, 2016 1:24 pm Post subject:

AB really didn't get consistent enough minutes with rotation players in the preseason to really judge him _________________ "He's a Zen master, so he can speak to you, and he doesn't need a microphone; you can hear him in your head, 'Ron, don't shoot, don't shoot.' Whatever, pow, three. I love the Zen, though."

adkindo
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Posted: Sat Oct 22, 2016 2:19 pm Post subject:

dcarter4kobe wrote:

On the Nance/Randle debate

1. Nance hasn't had a strong preseason
2. We would get out rebounded like crazy with Mozgov/Nance starting

Another problem is Randle and Black in the 2nd unit. The problem has not changed....Randle is going to have to develop a jump shot and finish better to be a plus starter, and Nance has to give more effort on the boards. Neither can protect the rim unless it is weak side help.

The Logo
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Posted: Sat Oct 22, 2016 2:22 pm Post subject:

Dave20 wrote:

Russell, Clarkson, Ingram, Deng, and Mozgov is a lineup I think would thrive. Nance, Black, Calderon, and Young off the bench. Luke needs to shorten the rotation.

So you're in favor of cutting Randle completely out of the rotation?

The Logo
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Posted: Sat Oct 22, 2016 2:23 pm Post subject:

defense wrote:

I know I'll probably get hazed but I still think this line up should be tried for the sake of roster balance.

Russell
Brown
Deng
Nance
Mosgov

Tell the guards to crash the defensive boards. Tell this unit to work on half court execution and let the second unit run out the building. Go easy on me fellas lol.

It'd be by far our best defensive lineup, but even then I'd still think you have the same problems with spacing given Nance's inconsistent, albeit better shot than Randle.

adkindo
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Posted: Sat Oct 22, 2016 2:26 pm Post subject:

dcarter4kobe wrote:

AB really didn't get consistent enough minutes with rotation players in the preseason to really judge him

but judged he is....for example, here is the summary from LG last night.

1. Brown checks into game.... "Oh no, AB is coming in!"
2. Brown hits a contested 3, and grabs aboard...a few comments, mostly sarcastic
3. AB misses a shot...."jesus, get him out of there, this guy is terrible and taking shots away from Ingram"
4. Ingram misses badly...."wow, did you see that form? That rim must have moved."

defense
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Posted: Sat Oct 22, 2016 2:31 pm Post subject:

The Logo wrote:

defense wrote:

It'd be by far our best defensive lineup, but even then I'd still think you have the same problems with spacing given Nance's inconsistent, albeit better shot than Randle.

Its our best mesh of defense and play styles given the players we have currently imo. Nance has shown a lot of improvement knocking down open shots. One can only guess he will continue to get better. Plus... the advantage of playing Nance with Russell isn't just and outside shot, more importantly its the ability to set good screens and cut. Also his defensive energy along with Brown's size and perimeter d would help keep the score close until the bench comes in to do their thing. I actually favor Ingram in there too instead of Deng but Ingram needs more experience before that move comes.

The Logo
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Posted: Sat Oct 22, 2016 2:35 pm Post subject:

defense wrote:

The Logo wrote:

defense wrote:

It'd be by far our best defensive lineup, but even then I'd still think you have the same problems with spacing given Nance's inconsistent, albeit better shot than Randle.

Yeah, I didn't really see a lot of Deng to evaluate how he works at the 3, but I agree Ingram needs more experience on the offensive end. Defensively he's a plus on that side of the ball, but offensively he needs to know when to attack, when to shoot, etc.

Jim99187
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Posted: Sat Oct 22, 2016 3:20 pm Post subject:

PICKnPOP wrote:

Russell
Ingram
Deng
Nance
Mosgov

I'd bring in Clarkson and Randle off the bench first for Ingram and nance to give us another boost of energy around that 6 minute mark he's talking about. Energy is energy and Clarkson/Randle will bring it in scoring and pushing the tempo.

This is the lineup I want aswell

KBH
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Posted: Sat Oct 22, 2016 4:48 pm Post subject:

venturalakersfan wrote:

Our starters aren't as good as most other team's starters.

And our starters aren't as good as other teams partly because two of them (Deng, Mozgov) haven't played most of the preseason and because of the aforementioned issues in the OP (poor spacing, ball movement, defensive awareness/activity).

Dave20
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Posted: Sat Oct 22, 2016 5:16 pm Post subject:

The Logo wrote:

Dave20 wrote:

Russell, Clarkson, Ingram, Deng, and Mozgov is a lineup I think would thrive. Nance, Black, Calderon, and Young off the bench. Luke needs to shorten the rotation.

So you're in favor of cutting Randle completely out of the rotation?

For the better of the team I would. He's not better than Deng or Nance at PF and he can't play C. The sooner Luke realizes this the better this team will be. Nance is a perfect fit starting at PF.

The Logo
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Posted: Sat Oct 22, 2016 5:20 pm Post subject:

Dave20 wrote:

The Logo wrote:

Dave20 wrote:

Russell, Clarkson, Ingram, Deng, and Mozgov is a lineup I think would thrive. Nance, Black, Calderon, and Young off the bench. Luke needs to shorten the rotation.

So you're in favor of cutting Randle completely out of the rotation?

For the better of the team I would. He's not better than Deng or Nance at PF and he can't play C. The sooner Luke realizes this the better this team will be. Nance is a perfect fit starting at PF.

I'm glad you're not the coach

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