2017 Lakers Draft Discussion Thread ** DRAFT DAY** (2: Ball, 27: Kuzma, 30: Hart and 42: Bryant )
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Who you got after Fultz?
Lonzo Ball
75%
 75%  [ 315 ]
Josh Jackson
15%
 15%  [ 64 ]
Jayson Tatum
1%
 1%  [ 8 ]
De'Aaron Fox
4%
 4%  [ 20 ]
Malik Monk
1%
 1%  [ 5 ]
Jonathan Isaac
0%
 0%  [ 4 ]
Total Votes : 416

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Ziggy
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 25, 2017 9:08 am    Post subject:

I said before the game last night that Ball was being overhyped on LG based on what I had seen up to that point. Last night was just confirmation. We'd be stuck with 2 guards with just above average court vision who can't break down a defense and rely almost entirely on the deep ball for their offense.
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lakid
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 25, 2017 9:08 am    Post subject:

And to add insult to injury, UCLA is now stuck with Alford for the foreseeable future.

Baron Von Humongous wrote:
GoldenThroat wrote:
UCLA's PnR defense was God-awful last night. Fox feasted on it.

https://twitter.com/colezwicker/status/845664020317126656

It was terrible the entire season, and it was compounded last night by Fox being able to penetrate even against their 3-2 zone, which had staunched UCLA's bleeding a bit back in February. They had no way of clamping down on Fox's penetration or of getting out to shooters, and Kentucky's roleplayers hit their open looks last night.

Ball was the only defensively engaged above-average athlete in their starting lineup all season, and Steve Alford hasn't been very adept at coaching fundamentals on that end in his time in Westwood, anyway. I would've liked to have seen what a better coach could've done with the Bruins this season, but c'est la vie.
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Baron Von Humongous
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 25, 2017 9:25 am    Post subject:

lakid wrote:
And to add insult to injury, UCLA is now stuck with Alford for the foreseeable future.

Baron Von Humongous wrote:
GoldenThroat wrote:
UCLA's PnR defense was God-awful last night. Fox feasted on it.

https://twitter.com/colezwicker/status/845664020317126656

It was terrible the entire season, and it was compounded last night by Fox being able to penetrate even against their 3-2 zone, which had staunched UCLA's bleeding a bit back in February. They had no way of clamping down on Fox's penetration or of getting out to shooters, and Kentucky's roleplayers hit their open looks last night.

Ball was the only defensively engaged above-average athlete in their starting lineup all season, and Steve Alford hasn't been very adept at coaching fundamentals on that end in his time in Westwood, anyway. I would've liked to have seen what a better coach could've done with the Bruins this season, but c'est la vie.

Him not going to Indiana was more disappointing than the loss. I assume UCLA will let Guerrero waddle off with his pension into the sunset in 2019/2020, and Alford will have a free ride until the next AD takes over.
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GoldenThroat
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 25, 2017 9:26 am    Post subject:

Baron Von Humongous wrote:
lakid wrote:
And to add insult to injury, UCLA is now stuck with Alford for the foreseeable future.

Baron Von Humongous wrote:
GoldenThroat wrote:
UCLA's PnR defense was God-awful last night. Fox feasted on it.

https://twitter.com/colezwicker/status/845664020317126656

It was terrible the entire season, and it was compounded last night by Fox being able to penetrate even against their 3-2 zone, which had staunched UCLA's bleeding a bit back in February. They had no way of clamping down on Fox's penetration or of getting out to shooters, and Kentucky's roleplayers hit their open looks last night.

Ball was the only defensively engaged above-average athlete in their starting lineup all season, and Steve Alford hasn't been very adept at coaching fundamentals on that end in his time in Westwood, anyway. I would've liked to have seen what a better coach could've done with the Bruins this season, but c'est la vie.

Him not going to Indiana was more disappointing than the loss. I assume UCLA will let Guerrero waddle off with his pension into the sunset in 2019/2020, and Alford will have a free ride until the next AD takes over.


And I'm sure LaVar Ball is gonna be a lot less charming to have around when his less talented kids are there.
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 25, 2017 9:27 am    Post subject:

Fox showed why quickness and athleticism are vital in basketball
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 25, 2017 9:29 am    Post subject:

Mike@LG wrote:
Fan0Bynum17 wrote:
How would you guys rate Jackson's scoring upside if he somehow developed into a decent shooter?


I can't really imagine him as a 20ppg scoring type, only because it doesn't seem inherent to his personality. His game is widely diversified and while he did show quite a few moves during his last game, it was just a brief glimpse. Personally, I think he'd rather stick to his slashing against PFs, spot up jumpshooting, and playmaking, and call it a day.


I ask because back when Jackson was a HS So/Jr, I thought he was going to be a no.1 star level player (shows how much I know,) so I was just wondering if he actually had that potential but was just being held back by his jump shot, or if it's more about his lack of moves.
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 25, 2017 9:31 am    Post subject:

Ughh, sadly what you just posted is reality. Guerrero is definitely going to ride out Alford into his retirement, and Alford is now recruiting at a level where seasons like this season will be the norm but we will always come up short and flameout within the first 3 rounds because that's Alford's ceiling as a head coach.

Baron Von Humongous wrote:
lakid wrote:
And to add insult to injury, UCLA is now stuck with Alford for the foreseeable future.

Baron Von Humongous wrote:
GoldenThroat wrote:
UCLA's PnR defense was God-awful last night. Fox feasted on it.

https://twitter.com/colezwicker/status/845664020317126656

It was terrible the entire season, and it was compounded last night by Fox being able to penetrate even against their 3-2 zone, which had staunched UCLA's bleeding a bit back in February. They had no way of clamping down on Fox's penetration or of getting out to shooters, and Kentucky's roleplayers hit their open looks last night.

Ball was the only defensively engaged above-average athlete in their starting lineup all season, and Steve Alford hasn't been very adept at coaching fundamentals on that end in his time in Westwood, anyway. I would've liked to have seen what a better coach could've done with the Bruins this season, but c'est la vie.

Him not going to Indiana was more disappointing than the loss. I assume UCLA will let Guerrero waddle off with his pension into the sunset in 2019/2020, and Alford will have a free ride until the next AD takes over.
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Baron Von Humongous
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 25, 2017 9:31 am    Post subject:

GoldenThroat wrote:
Baron Von Humongous wrote:
lakid wrote:
And to add insult to injury, UCLA is now stuck with Alford for the foreseeable future.

Baron Von Humongous wrote:
GoldenThroat wrote:
UCLA's PnR defense was God-awful last night. Fox feasted on it.

https://twitter.com/colezwicker/status/845664020317126656

It was terrible the entire season, and it was compounded last night by Fox being able to penetrate even against their 3-2 zone, which had staunched UCLA's bleeding a bit back in February. They had no way of clamping down on Fox's penetration or of getting out to shooters, and Kentucky's roleplayers hit their open looks last night.

Ball was the only defensively engaged above-average athlete in their starting lineup all season, and Steve Alford hasn't been very adept at coaching fundamentals on that end in his time in Westwood, anyway. I would've liked to have seen what a better coach could've done with the Bruins this season, but c'est la vie.

Him not going to Indiana was more disappointing than the loss. I assume UCLA will let Guerrero waddle off with his pension into the sunset in 2019/2020, and Alford will have a free ride until the next AD takes over.


And I'm sure LaVar Ball is gonna be a lot less charming to have around when his less talented kids are there.

Ugh. Alford definitely made a deal with the devil there. The middle son is going to transfer at some point, the youngest will decommit, and Lavar is going to go on the warpath.
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 25, 2017 9:32 am    Post subject: Lorenzo Ball - Right PG?

Could Lorenzo Ball be the Floor General that will allow DLO, JC, Randle, Zubac, Nance, Ingram and Nwaba flourish?

http://fansided.com/2017/03/11/next-generation-lonzo-ball/
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 25, 2017 9:32 am    Post subject:

Drifts wrote:
Fox showed why quickness and athleticism are vital in basketball


Do you want a glance at Mudiay's stats?

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/m/mudiaem01.html
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Baron Von Humongous
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 25, 2017 9:32 am    Post subject:

Drifts wrote:
Fox showed why quickness and athleticism are vital in basketball

I'd rather have Monk.
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 25, 2017 9:34 am    Post subject:

greenfrog wrote:
Drifts wrote:
Fox showed why quickness and athleticism are vital in basketball


Do you want a glance at Mudiay's stats?

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/m/mudiaem01.html

Can we end the narrative that Mudiay was ever a special athlete at the NBA level?
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 25, 2017 9:34 am    Post subject:

Quote:
Ball is not Steve Nash or Stephen Curry. He just lacks the insane tough shot-making ability shooting off the dribble of either (his pull-up shooting numbers are insanely misleading, as its on extremely low volume and almost all on step-backs going left, an off-ball NBA shot). He’s also not Jason Kidd, probably in terms of feel and definitely not defensively. Similarly, he’s nowhere near the explosive athlete of a Derrick Rose athletically. And you know what? That’s ok.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 25, 2017 9:36 am    Post subject:

Fan0Bynum17 wrote:
Mike@LG wrote:
Fan0Bynum17 wrote:
How would you guys rate Jackson's scoring upside if he somehow developed into a decent shooter?


I can't really imagine him as a 20ppg scoring type, only because it doesn't seem inherent to his personality. His game is widely diversified and while he did show quite a few moves during his last game, it was just a brief glimpse. Personally, I think he'd rather stick to his slashing against PFs, spot up jumpshooting, and playmaking, and call it a day.


I ask because back when Jackson was a HS So/Jr, I thought he was going to be a no.1 star level player (shows how much I know,) so I was just wondering if he actually had that potential but was just being held back by his jump shot, or if it's more about his lack of moves.


I think it's a lack of moves, even more so than his J. But, at least he seeks out to score.
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 25, 2017 9:37 am    Post subject:

anpherknee wrote:
how yall fell about fox's jump shot

it dont look that broke to me guise

but i've only seen him shoot like 12 of em



It's been improving for the past 2-3 weeks.
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 25, 2017 9:39 am    Post subject:

I wouldn't draft him with a top 3 pick. He's a poor 2pt and free throw shooter and he's not good defensively. Beware of the Ball hype.
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 25, 2017 9:40 am    Post subject:

Edit: I hate analyses that use comparisons to players that the author was in no way around to see as college freshmen. I've done it a few times, but mainly to spark conversation, and I'm a semi-anonymous yutz on a messageboard.

So when someone writes that Ball doesn't do x or y like player a and b, were they actually analyzing PnR data for Santa Clara back in 1993? Breaking down mid-80s Gonzaga film?

Second pet peeve, most everyone assumes a guy will improve his shot - which is admittedly the most "fixable" skill - but a gifted passer and team orchestrator like Ball working from an already strong foundation isn't going to refine his ability to play PnR in the next decade? He won't continue to polish his ballhandling once he gets that sweet rookie contract moola? An imperfect ability is not automatically a weakness, especially when we're talking about teenagers.


Last edited by Baron Von Humongous on Sat Mar 25, 2017 10:11 am; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 25, 2017 9:52 am    Post subject:

cthroatgtr wrote:
Magic has proven himself as a business executive


Magic has proven that he knows how to invest money. He might have also proven that he knows how to get/retain the right people to run his various businesses. But, Magic has definitely not proven that he's a good front office basketball decision maker.
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 25, 2017 9:57 am    Post subject:

Baron Von Humongous wrote:
Drifts wrote:
Fox showed why quickness and athleticism are vital in basketball

I'd rather have Monk.


Monk is good too though
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 25, 2017 10:04 am    Post subject:

Fultz and Josh are less risky picks in terms of the floor, but I like Ball's intangibles too. I am fine as long as we keep the Top 3 pick in this draft.
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 25, 2017 10:08 am    Post subject:

Baron Von Humongous wrote:
greenfrog wrote:
Drifts wrote:
Fox showed why quickness and athleticism are vital in basketball


Do you want a glance at Mudiay's stats?

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/m/mudiaem01.html

Can we end the narrative that Mudiay was ever a special athlete at the NBA level?


Good point, he is pretty average.
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Drifts
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 25, 2017 10:18 am    Post subject:

greenfrog wrote:
Drifts wrote:
Fox showed why quickness and athleticism are vital in basketball


Do you want a glance at Mudiay's stats?

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/m/mudiaem01.html


lol Mudiay... that's so out of nowhere.

I am hoping we get #2 pick again this year. it's going to be Jackson or Fultz
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 25, 2017 10:22 am    Post subject:

What's crazy is, if you order the draft by scoring + assists.. it's more along the lines of:

Fultz
Dennis Smith Jr.
Malik Monk
Jayson Tatum
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 25, 2017 10:33 am    Post subject:

Mike@LG wrote:
What's crazy is, if you order the draft by scoring + assists.. it's more along the lines of:

Fultz
Dennis Smith Jr.
Malik Monk
Jayson Tatum


If fultz monk and Tatum end up being the 3 best players from this draft it wouldn't be at all surprising to me. I sincerely doubt dsj being anything more than an average starter as his ceiling. And have developed more questions about Tatum scoring vs NBA athlete defenders
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 25, 2017 10:36 am    Post subject:

44TheLogo wrote:
Mike@LG wrote:
What's crazy is, if you order the draft by scoring + assists.. it's more along the lines of:

Fultz
Dennis Smith Jr.
Malik Monk
Jayson Tatum


If fultz monk and Tatum end up being the 3 best players from this draft it wouldn't be at all surprising to me. I sincerely doubt dsj being anything more than an average starter as his ceiling. And have developed more questions about Tatum scoring vs NBA athlete defenders


I think DSJ could become more than a capable starter. I just don't think it'll translate directly to wins.

Tatum has exhibited similar patterns to DSJs play with ball stopping and what not, but at least he had shown great improvement in catch and shoot and lightweight playmaking/ball movement too.
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