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LakerLanny
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 20, 2018 9:49 am    Post subject:

DaMuleRules wrote:
Wilt wrote:
Government shutdown!


Trump's killin' it!

#MAGA


How is the shutdown on Trump?

Despite his gaffes, one could argue that Trump's policies have been very successful so far.

For instance, the economy looks strong, unemployment low and consumer confidence and wages rising.

The S&P 500 is already up 5.11% Year to Date and it is only January 20th. And that is coming off a 2017 (Trump's first year in office) when the S&P 500 was up 21.83% for the year.

My retirement accounts and investments are doing very well under Trump so I have no complaints on that side.

Talking about opening up the California Coast for new oil drilling? Now THAT, I have a major problem with.
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Wilt
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 20, 2018 10:00 am    Post subject:

LakerLanny wrote:
DaMuleRules wrote:
Wilt wrote:
Government shutdown!


Trump's killin' it!

#MAGA


How is the shutdown on Trump?

Despite his gaffes, one could argue that Trump's policies have been very successful so far.

For instance, the economy looks strong, unemployment low and consumer confidence and wages rising.

The S&P 500 is already up 5.11% Year to Date and it is only January 20th. And that is coming off a 2017 (Trump's first year in office) when the S&P 500 was up 21.83% for the year.

My retirement accounts and investments are doing very well under Trump so I have no complaints on that side.

Talking about opening up the California Coast for new oil drilling? Now THAT, I have a major problem with.


This is what people mean when they say that we've defined deviancy down. Joe Biden had gaffes, Dan Quayle had gaffes, Trump is an authoritarian that has no regard for our political institutions, the public, the press, and everything else that makes this country what it is.

With all due respect Lanny, for you to say that you've benefited monetarily from Trump's presidency and thus he's doing just fine is how authoritarianism is legitimized. Every authoritarian regime has benefited someone, as there's usually one class they fight for and classes they fight against. I don't care that the stock market has gone up and that my retirement accounts are doing great because that monster is sitting in the White House, supported by an army of enablers who all lie for him. And he and his allies will surely emphasize the strength of the economy - and his "policies" have little do with how the economy is doing - in order to numb us to the fact that they're dismantling all the institutions that have made this country great.

You're better than that, Lanny. I hope.
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LakerLanny
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 20, 2018 10:05 am    Post subject:

^I am just saying his economic policies seem to be working far better than his predecessor.

I am certainly not on board with his gaffes and would like him or any US President to act "Presidential" rather than tweeting about petty stuff or making insulting comments.

For instance, I greatly dislike his environmental policies (oil drilling, coal, etc) but as I mentioned in the last post...his economic policies seem to be working very well.

To me, life is all in shades of gray more than black and white including politics. I am far enough along in life where things political figures say or do don't get me that worked up, I am a bit more pragmatic about things.
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DaMuleRules
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 20, 2018 10:18 am    Post subject:

LakerLanny wrote:
^I am just saying his economic policies seem to be working far better than his predecessor.

I am certainly not on board with his gaffes and would like him or any US President to act "Presidential" rather than tweeting about petty stuff or making insulting comments.

For instance, I greatly dislike his environmental policies (oil drilling, coal, etc) but as I mentioned in the last post...his economic policies seem to be working very well.

To me, life is all in shades of gray more than black and white including politics. I am far enough along in life where things political figures say or do don't get me that worked up, I am a bit more pragmatic about things.


It's easy to be "pragmatic" when you are an upper class, straight, white male.
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Wilt
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 20, 2018 10:19 am    Post subject:

LakerLanny wrote:
^I am just saying his economic policies seem to be working far better than his predecessor.


That's not true. The economy has been improving for many years, ever since it reached bottom in 2008. More than anything, he's lucky. For years, he and his supporters ignored the stock market, the job numbers, and many other economic indicators. But now they suddenly care because their guy is in charge. And again, he hasn't enacted any economic policies, he relies on the support he gets from corporate America because he just gave them a giant tax cut that won't benefit me or you.

Quote:
I am certainly not on board with his gaffes and would like him or any US President to act "Presidential" rather than tweeting about petty stuff or making insulting comments.


As I said above, whenever you frame the issue that way, you give him credit. Acting unpresidential is having an affair with an intern and lying about it, for instance. Calling the press the enemy of the people is how an authoritarian acts. You keep normalizing him.

Quote:
For instance, I greatly dislike his environmental policies (oil drilling, coal, etc) but as I mentioned in the last post...his economic policies seem to be working very well.


I'm glad you care about the environment but it seems to me you care about it primarly because it might affect California. Which goes back to my original point: the fact that his "policies" might be benefiting you personally shouldn't be the reason for you to normalize him. He is hurting this country's image around the world, he's hurting minorities, he's hurting LGBT people, he incites hatred and violence against the press, etc. Taking all of that into account, the fact that I might have a few hundred extra dollars in my bank account is irrelevant to me.

Quote:
To me, life is all in shades of gray more than black and white including politics. I am far enough along in life where things political figures say or do don't get me that worked up, I am a bit more pragmatic about things.


Well, that's unfortunate.
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LakerLanny
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 20, 2018 10:45 am    Post subject:

Wilt wrote:

Well, that's unfortunate.


Is it?

I like as much as possible to maintain peace and calm in my life.

Getting all worked up every time Trump or any other politician says or does something stupid? Not for me, but I understand how others feel differently and respect your passion for the issues you mentioned and your activism.
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 20, 2018 10:47 am    Post subject:

He caused the shutdown due to blatant overt racist policies

What sentient being thinks a wall is a good idea?


The dollars anyone earns from the tax theft will be offset by the destruction of our society by silver spoon trash

He is a (bleep) nightmare citizen who before office
Complained about everything
Sowing seeds of hate and revenge
Caused massive problems with four iirc bankruptcies

Our DEFENSE DEPARTMENT said Russia hacked our election and imposed sanctions on them. Trump had a YEAR now to enact them or even one of them. He never has. He never has.

What does that tell you

If there is an afterlife Money over Civility in this life will be an ugly debt in the afterlife

Trump should receive no praise for anything until he apologizes for being a liar and racist and traitor and mass manipulator

Hitler's economic policies helped rebuild Germany?


Last edited by ContagiousInspiration on Sat Jan 20, 2018 11:19 am; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 20, 2018 10:55 am    Post subject:

Peeps are really gonna stan for Trump after he (bleep) up this entire year with the shutdown as the culmination? Lawd have mercy, I never realized standards were so low.
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kikanga
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 20, 2018 11:25 am    Post subject:

Proud of the Dems for growing some balls (and ovaries).
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kikanga
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 20, 2018 11:35 am    Post subject:

Messaging is really important.

GOP will say the troops are now in danger.
Dems have to respond, "what are the troops fighting for if we can't get DACA legislation?"
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DaMuleRules
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 20, 2018 11:42 am    Post subject:

LakerLanny wrote:
Wilt wrote:

Well, that's unfortunate.


Is it?

I like as much as possible to maintain peace and calm in my life.

Getting all worked up every time Trump or any other politician says or does something stupid? Not for me, but I understand how others feel differently and respect your passion for the issues you mentioned and your activism.


We get it. Your bank account is good. No worries for you. Some of us have kids to whom we would like to leave a decent country and planet to.
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kikanga
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 20, 2018 12:33 pm    Post subject:

http://thehill.com/homenews/senate/369929-schumer-working-with-trump-like-negotiating-with-jello

Quote:
Schumer: Negotiating with Trump 'like negotiating with Jell-O'


This is the result when you negotiate with a person without conviction. There is no issue Trump truly cares about that doesn't make himself personally richer.

That's why he can meet with a Dem and agree. Then talk to his far right "consultants" and pitch something completely different after the negotiation. He isn't smart enough and he doesn't care enough to debate the issues on either side of the aisle.

Even if he wasn't a vile person. With his lack of prerequisites for office, this is what happens. Qualifications matter when it comes to any job. INCLUDING President.
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 20, 2018 12:45 pm    Post subject:

governator wrote:
PLATNUM wrote:
Just went through about 50 pages on this thread... and it is some damn entertaining stuff. It's too bad it's actually REAL LIFE we're talking about here though. Thanks to the thread regulars on here for all the links and news updates (fake or otherwise)

So I recently got a text from my same Trump loving friend I've mentioned on here before. I made a joke about some ignorant tweet Trump wrote and my buddy responded by saying that Trump "knows exactly what he's doing" and maybe I should stop going to football games (told him I was at the Rams game) and listen to REAL news so I didn't sound so uninformed. He said that everything I read/see is fake and Trumps tax bill is bringing back jobs to the US and he's got more "great things" coming.

He then went so far as to hurl a few insults at me for having the nerve to TRY and argue with him about things I know nothing about... and that I was foolish to pay for a college education so that I could just be fed lies ( I don't even know where that came from)

I just can't believe a guy I have known for over 25 years and grew up with has seemingly lost his freakin mind. I wish I could copy and paste our back and forth texts. It's maddening. Reason and common sense are non-existent.


It's a cult


It honestly feels like that. When the guy gets backed into a corner and cant logically justify a defense for his guy, I finally think I can get him to concede and show some actual common sense.... But, no.... he'll come up with some off the wall conspiracy theory. I keep waiting for him to tell me he's just been messing with me this whole time.
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 20, 2018 12:51 pm    Post subject:

LakerLanny wrote:
^I am just saying his economic policies seem to be working far better than his predecessor.

Name a single policy that Trump and the Republican congress have passed that could be linked to the current status of the GDP, jobs, or the unemployment rate, or even remotely linked?

Heck, he has not even passed a budget yet.
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 20, 2018 12:53 pm    Post subject:

The huge emotional investment in him has led them to conclude that continue to lie is a better option than admitting that they made the wrong choice. So yeah, it's somewhat like a cult.
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 20, 2018 1:04 pm    Post subject:

kikanga wrote:
Messaging is really important.

GOP will say the troops are now in danger.
Dems have to respond, "what are the troops fighting for if we can't get DACA legislation?"


Yep, Trump in particular. That might be good for the uniformed, or the alternative fact based, but we still have these-here modern devices that record what really went on:

Link: You Go Girl

Clair McCaskill (D) (paraphrased): I ask to pass an amendment to fund the troops

Parliamentarian (?) Is there objection?

McConnell (R): I object
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 20, 2018 1:21 pm    Post subject:

Wilt wrote:
LakerLanny wrote:
^I am just saying his economic policies seem to be working far better than his predecessor.


That's not true. The economy has been improving for many years, ever since it reached bottom in 2008. More than anything, he's lucky. For years, he and his supporters ignored the stock market, the job numbers, and many other economic indicators. But now they suddenly care because their guy is in charge. And again, he hasn't enacted any economic policies, he relies on the support he gets from corporate America because he just gave them a giant tax cut that won't benefit me or you.


Unless you don't have a 401k, IRA or any investments whatsoever, it is benefiting me and you. This administration's tax policy and stance on deregulation are directly responsible for the incredible growth in the stock market since the election. It's been rising after the bottom in 2007, but not to this extent.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/economists-credit-trump-as-tailwind-for-u-s-growth-hiring-and-stocks-1515682893

It won't end well, but that's besides the point.
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Wilt
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 20, 2018 1:26 pm    Post subject:

I was talking about tax cuts, not the stock market.

Until we see real changes in economic and wealth inequality, this means very little in the long run.
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 20, 2018 1:27 pm    Post subject:

Wilt wrote:
I was talking about tax cuts, not the stock market.


They're one and the same.

Your wealth is not just your paycheck, it's your investments and their growth, but I'm sure you realize that.
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 20, 2018 1:29 pm    Post subject:

DuncanIdaho wrote:
Wilt wrote:
I was talking about tax cuts, not the stock market.


They're one and the same.


They're not one and the same. The tax cut I will get will mean little to me if I have to pay more in healthcare and if all this deregulation poisons and endangers me and millions of other people. You sound like a Republican, dude.
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 20, 2018 1:31 pm    Post subject:

Wilt wrote:
Until we see real changes in economic and wealth inequality, this means very little in the long run.


This is a big one. Time will tell if wages rise as well, but I have a feeling they'll continue to lag behind as they have since the 80's.
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 20, 2018 1:35 pm    Post subject:

Wilt wrote:
DuncanIdaho wrote:
Wilt wrote:
I was talking about tax cuts, not the stock market.


They're one and the same.


They're not one and the same. The tax cut I will get will mean little to me if I have to pay more in healthcare and if all this deregulation poisons and endangers me and millions of other people. You sound like a Republican, dude.


I sound like I've seen my 401k soar this year. Retirement is non-partisan goal last time I checked. It's OK to be happy about one thing and still be pissed at others. Yes, healthcare is a major problem. I've railed about it in this thread consistently, especially how we can't seem to pass any sort of prescription drug reform even though there seems to be consensus across the aisle up until the time votes are cast.
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 20, 2018 1:36 pm    Post subject:

And a recession is not out of the question. In fact, I was listening to NPR the other day and they were saying that there were some signs of an upcoming recession in the not so distant future. We'll see.
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 20, 2018 1:40 pm    Post subject:

Wilt wrote:
And a recession is not out of the question. In fact, I was listening to NPR the other day and they were saying that there were some signs of an upcoming recession in the not so distant future. We'll see.


Yep. If we take a look at the rise and fall of the markets, it's cyclical. This high won't last forever. Just have to hope it isn't as bad as the last one.
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 20, 2018 1:41 pm    Post subject:

DuncanIdaho wrote:
Wilt wrote:
I was talking about tax cuts, not the stock market.


They're one and the same.

Your wealth is not just your paycheck, it's your investments and their growth, but I'm sure you realize that.


I'd wager there are maybe 30% of Americans who have extra money to invest.
Did most home owners just get (bleep) by the tax bull
Students..loans.
Teachers...stripped of a simple tax cut for paying for extra supplies
Sick Elderly all just got raped by those tax cuts

He is the greatest criminal we have ever had in office. His level of (bleep) has emboldened the worst of the worst in this once great collection of idiots we call America

How many jobs did Gestapo ICE blitzkrieg create
Federal government paying private prison corporations again
Neo Nazis are good people too


Here is a question

Is there anything that could have been done to kill the momentum in the economy Obama had in place?
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