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J.C. Smith
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Joined: 23 Jun 2005
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 Posted: Mon Jun 18, 2018 9:15 pm Post subject: |
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| Fallout wrote: | | Well his plan is to ask to pay for the wall in exchange to removing the separation policy. If Dems don't play ball, then he will say Dems are at fault. |
That's part of it. They also want to get democrats to cave in on some other legal immigration policies. They don't want the visa lottery, and want to get rid of people being able to help their family get visas... Even spouses. I personally am offended by that considering I've been living with a foreign born woman for 15 years, and married for 7. It was already a year long process to get her into the country under the current regulations. If Trump has his way it would mean it would be difficult to get at all. And that would be similar to many of the serviceman living abroad, or people like myself who work abroad but still pay American taxes and own American companies.
Trump is using these children as political hostages to get democrats to cave in on everything else. And it's doing irreparable trauma to these kids. And as bad as that is the democrats can not cave in to these demands. This is the equivalent of paying for hostages. If they cave here it sets a dangerous precedent. |
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Omar Little
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| Posted: Mon Jun 18, 2018 9:19 pm Post subject: |
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It’s important to the GOP to extort Democratic complicity in immigration roll backs because if the democrats gain the house and/or senate, Trump can veto any undoing of the new measures. That’s the GOP playbook right now, gut or change anything they can and prepare to obstruct the undoing of it.
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slavavov
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Joined: 03 Oct 2003
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Location: Santa Monica
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| Posted: Mon Jun 18, 2018 11:32 pm Post subject: |
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| J.C. Smith wrote: | | Fallout wrote: | | Well his plan is to ask to pay for the wall in exchange to removing the separation policy. If Dems don't play ball, then he will say Dems are at fault. |
That's part of it. They also want to get democrats to cave in on some other legal immigration policies. They don't want the visa lottery, and want to get rid of people being able to help their family get visas... Even spouses. I personally am offended by that considering I've been living with a foreign born woman for 15 years, and married for 7. It was already a year long process to get her into the country under the current regulations. If Trump has his way it would mean it would be difficult to get at all. And that would be similar to many of the serviceman living abroad, or people like myself who work abroad but still pay American taxes and own American companies.
Trump is using these children as political hostages to get democrats to cave in on everything else. And it's doing irreparable trauma to these kids. And as bad as that is the democrats can not cave in to these demands. This is the equivalent of paying for hostages. If they cave here it sets a dangerous precedent. |
I've read reports that despite what Jeff Sessions and others have said, rounding up the kids of illegals like this isn't even the law. Is there something the Dems can do to expose this?
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nickuku
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| Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 12:19 am Post subject: |
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| That audio of the children in the detention centers is brutal. When the (bleep) did we become so cruel? |
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J.C. Smith
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Wilt
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Joined: 29 Dec 2002
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| Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 5:29 am Post subject: |
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According to new polling, among Republicans:
- 19% have a favorable opinion of Kim Jong-un
- 17% have a favorable opinion of Nancy Pelosi
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nickuku
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| Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 8:43 am Post subject: |
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| Wilt wrote: | According to new polling, among Republicans:
- 19% have a favorable opinion of Kim Jong-un
- 17% have a favorable opinion of Nancy Pelosi |
20% of republicans can't recognize the difference between someone they disagree with on a political level and a murderous dictator. I'm sorry but that's a clear sign of mental illness. |
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Omar Little
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| Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 9:03 am Post subject: |
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| nickuku wrote: | | Wilt wrote: | According to new polling, among Republicans:
- 19% have a favorable opinion of Kim Jong-un
- 17% have a favorable opinion of Nancy Pelosi |
20% of republicans can't recognize the difference between someone they disagree with on a political level and a murderous dictator. I'm sorry but that's a clear sign of mental illness. |
Sadly, it's actually only an indication of the less than optimal wiring of the human brain.
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Gatekeeper
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jodeke
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| Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 10:48 am Post subject: |
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Slowly but surely Trump is putting the country on an island.  Our only allies are going to be Russia and N Korea.
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America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves.
Last edited by jodeke on Tue Jun 19, 2018 11:16 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Fallout
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| Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 10:53 am Post subject: |
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| slavavov wrote: | | J.C. Smith wrote: | | Fallout wrote: | | Well his plan is to ask to pay for the wall in exchange to removing the separation policy. If Dems don't play ball, then he will say Dems are at fault. |
That's part of it. They also want to get democrats to cave in on some other legal immigration policies. They don't want the visa lottery, and want to get rid of people being able to help their family get visas... Even spouses. I personally am offended by that considering I've been living with a foreign born woman for 15 years, and married for 7. It was already a year long process to get her into the country under the current regulations. If Trump has his way it would mean it would be difficult to get at all. And that would be similar to many of the serviceman living abroad, or people like myself who work abroad but still pay American taxes and own American companies.
Trump is using these children as political hostages to get democrats to cave in on everything else. And it's doing irreparable trauma to these kids. And as bad as that is the democrats can not cave in to these demands. This is the equivalent of paying for hostages. If they cave here it sets a dangerous precedent. |
I've read reports that despite what Jeff Sessions and others have said, rounding up the kids of illegals like this isn't even the law. Is there something the Dems can do to expose this? |
The voters have to put Dems back in power. Otherwise GOP controls the gov.
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kikanga
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| Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 11:26 am Post subject: |
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If you told me a couple years ago, the President of the United States would lock children in cages so he could gain leverage for a border wall. I wouldn't believe you.
This might be the worst thing President Donald Trump has done. And that's saying something.
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ChefLinda
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| Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 11:50 am Post subject: |
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| kikanga wrote: | If you told me a couple years ago, the President of the United States would lock children in cages so he could gain leverage for a border wall. I wouldn't believe you.
This might be the worst thing President Donald Trump has done. And that's saying something. |
It's actually worse than that. He's doing it to gin up his base for the mid-terms. Whatever solution congress comes up with, he'll nix it. Because he doesn't want a solution, he wants the issue to remain unresolved so he can use it to further race-bait and inflame his core. He's holding a Nuremberg rally for them tomorrow. He will use the terms "animals" and "infesting" and do his best to dehumanize all brown people -- to the delight of his cult.
In that regard, here' some new polling data:
| Quote: | John Harwood Verified account @JohnJHarwood
in new Quinnipiac Poll, majorities of every demographic sub-group - men/women, young/old, college/non-college, white/black/Hispanic - oppose Trump’s family separation policy
only sub-group providing majority support: Republicans |
And that's all he cares about. |
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VicXLakers
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Joined: 08 Feb 2006
Posts: 11823
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| Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 11:56 am Post subject: |
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| kikanga wrote: | If you told me a couple years ago, the President of the United States would lock children in cages so he could gain leverage for a border wall. I wouldn't believe you.
This might be the worst thing President Donald Trump has done. And that's saying something. |
it's just the beginning. 
I never thought in my lifetime the United States would be isolationist backing out of our alliances/treaties while China opens up and is investing in Central America,Africa and other developing countries in South East Asia |
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Omar Little
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| Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 12:04 pm Post subject: |
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| slavavov wrote: | | J.C. Smith wrote: | | Fallout wrote: | | Well his plan is to ask to pay for the wall in exchange to removing the separation policy. If Dems don't play ball, then he will say Dems are at fault. |
That's part of it. They also want to get democrats to cave in on some other legal immigration policies. They don't want the visa lottery, and want to get rid of people being able to help their family get visas... Even spouses. I personally am offended by that considering I've been living with a foreign born woman for 15 years, and married for 7. It was already a year long process to get her into the country under the current regulations. If Trump has his way it would mean it would be difficult to get at all. And that would be similar to many of the serviceman living abroad, or people like myself who work abroad but still pay American taxes and own American companies.
Trump is using these children as political hostages to get democrats to cave in on everything else. And it's doing irreparable trauma to these kids. And as bad as that is the democrats can not cave in to these demands. This is the equivalent of paying for hostages. If they cave here it sets a dangerous precedent. |
I've read reports that despite what Jeff Sessions and others have said, rounding up the kids of illegals like this isn't even the law. Is there something the Dems can do to expose this? |
Expose it to whom? The people you'd be trying to convince will either call it fake news or revel in it, or both.
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“We must always take sides. Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim. Silence encourages the tormentor, never the tormented.” ― Elie Wiesel |
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VicXLakers
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Joined: 08 Feb 2006
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| Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 12:04 pm Post subject: |
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| ChefLinda wrote: | | kikanga wrote: | If you told me a couple years ago, the President of the United States would lock children in cages so he could gain leverage for a border wall. I wouldn't believe you.
This might be the worst thing President Donald Trump has done. And that's saying something. |
It's actually worse than that. He's doing it to gin up his base for the mid-terms. Whatever solution congress comes up with, he'll nix it. Because he doesn't want a solution, he wants the issue to remain unresolved so he can use it to further race-bait and inflame his core. He's holding a Nuremberg rally for them tomorrow. He will use the terms "animals" and "infesting" and do his best to dehumanize all brown people -- to the delight of his cult.
In that regard, here' some new polling data:
| Quote: | John Harwood Verified account @JohnJHarwood
in new Quinnipiac Poll, majorities of every demographic sub-group - men/women, young/old, college/non-college, white/black/Hispanic - oppose Trump’s family separation policy
only sub-group providing majority support: Republicans |
And that's all he cares about. |
well said.
this is all red meat for his base...I say look a little closer at you neighbor.
I saw Kasich was confronted with 78% of republicans support the forced separations and he said it was a step in the right direction...they were a 90%  |
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kikanga
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The Lebrons
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| Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 2:53 pm Post subject: |
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Unless it makes 40% of Republicans in Congress willing to impeach Trump, which it won't because nothing matters anymore, it doesn't matter. |
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slavavov
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Location: Santa Monica
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| Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 3:01 pm Post subject: |
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| Omar Little wrote: | | slavavov wrote: | | J.C. Smith wrote: | | Fallout wrote: | | Well his plan is to ask to pay for the wall in exchange to removing the separation policy. If Dems don't play ball, then he will say Dems are at fault. |
That's part of it. They also want to get democrats to cave in on some other legal immigration policies. They don't want the visa lottery, and want to get rid of people being able to help their family get visas... Even spouses. I personally am offended by that considering I've been living with a foreign born woman for 15 years, and married for 7. It was already a year long process to get her into the country under the current regulations. If Trump has his way it would mean it would be difficult to get at all. And that would be similar to many of the serviceman living abroad, or people like myself who work abroad but still pay American taxes and own American companies.
Trump is using these children as political hostages to get democrats to cave in on everything else. And it's doing irreparable trauma to these kids. And as bad as that is the democrats can not cave in to these demands. This is the equivalent of paying for hostages. If they cave here it sets a dangerous precedent. |
I've read reports that despite what Jeff Sessions and others have said, rounding up the kids of illegals like this isn't even the law. Is there something the Dems can do to expose this? |
Expose it to whom? The people you'd be trying to convince will either call it fake news or revel in it, or both. |
Until the Dems win back a majority of both houses of Congress (if it happens, which I don't expect), all they can do is convince a few of the more "reasonable" Republicans to side with them on this issue. The SCOTUS blocked Trump's ban on Muslims (more than once), could they possibly overturn this "policy"? I feel like too many Dems in Congress are just sitting on their hands and being too nice instead of taking some kind of action.
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kikanga
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| Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 3:03 pm Post subject: |
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| The Lebrons wrote: |
Unless it makes 40% of Republicans in Congress willing to impeach Trump, which it won't because nothing matters anymore, it doesn't matter. |
It'll matter in the sense that, at least we'll have the GOP party on record saying they don't care about serious criminal activity. Like threatening physical harm/death on witnesses and their families.
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SweetP
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Joined: 23 Jun 2005
Posts: 6054
Location: My own little piece of reality
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| Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 3:21 pm Post subject: |
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| ChefLinda wrote: | | kikanga wrote: | If you told me a couple years ago, the President of the United States would lock children in cages so he could gain leverage for a border wall. I wouldn't believe you.
This might be the worst thing President Donald Trump has done. And that's saying something. |
It's actually worse than that. He's doing it to gin up his base for the mid-terms. Whatever solution congress comes up with, he'll nix it. Because he doesn't want a solution, he wants the issue to remain unresolved so he can use it to further race-bait and inflame his core. He's holding a Nuremberg rally for them tomorrow. He will use the terms "animals" and "infesting" and do his best to dehumanize all brown people -- to the delight of his cult.
In that regard, here' some new polling data:
| Quote: | John Harwood Verified account @JohnJHarwood
in new Quinnipiac Poll, majorities of every demographic sub-group - men/women, young/old, college/non-college, white/black/Hispanic - oppose Trump’s family separation policy
only sub-group providing majority support: Republicans |
And that's all he cares about. |
The referring to people as "infesting" just gives me the shudders. Crying toddlers and terrified parents are not insects or vermin.
De-humanizing other people often leads to horrific consequences. People that think it can't happen here need to wake up and remember it HAS happened here before and it CAN happen again.
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ChefLinda
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Joined: 20 Sep 2006
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Location: Boston
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| Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 6:11 pm Post subject: |
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Time: Toddlers Separated From Parents at the Border Are Being Detained in 'Tender Age' Shelters
| Quote: | Trump administration officials have been sending babies and other young children forcibly separated from their parents at the U.S.-Mexico border to at least three “tender age” shelters in South Texas, The Associated Press has learned.
Lawyers and medical providers who have visited the Rio Grande Valley shelters described play rooms of crying preschool-age children in crisis. The government also plans to open a fourth shelter to house hundreds of young migrant children in Houston, where city leaders denounced the move Tuesday.
Since the White House announced its zero tolerance policy in early May, more than 2,300 children have been taken from their parents at the U.S.-Mexico border, resulting in a new influx of young children requiring government care. The government has faced withering critiques over images of some of the children in cages inside U.S. Border Patrol processing stations. |
There is no system in place to EVER return any of these kids to their parents. They are deporting the parents and keeping the kids. There is no system to track the kids or for parents who been deported to figure out where their kids are or how to get them back.
THE UNITED STATES GOVERNMENT IS KIDNAPPING CHILDREN AND HOLDING THEM IN DETENTION CENTERS.
And 60% of Republicans are just fine with it. The party of "family values."
Last edited by ChefLinda on Tue Jun 19, 2018 6:19 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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LakerSanity
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| Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 6:17 pm Post subject: |
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This really represents a terrible moment in U.S. history. The entire rationale is that the means justify the ends. Its like we've learned nothing from history. There are just some lines you never cross regardless of the goal. This is/was one of them. It's really, really sad.
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DaMuleRules
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| Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 6:22 pm Post subject: |
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| LakerSanity wrote: | | This really represents a terrible moment in U.S. history. The entire rationale is that the means justify the ends. Its like we've learned nothing from history. There are just some lines you never cross regardless of the goal. This is/was one of them. It's really, really sad. |
It's not that we haven't learned from history.
It's just that some don't give a (bleep) about the lesson.
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You thought God was an architect, now you know
He’s something like a pipe bomb ready to blow
And everything you built that’s all for show
goes up in flames
In 24 frames
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Man, do those lyrics resonate right now |
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ChefLinda
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Location: Boston
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| Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 6:23 pm Post subject: |
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I'm afraid it's going to get worse until we get a Congress to check this evil, immoral, soulless administration.
In the mean time we are permanently traumatizing thousands of children who most likely will be scarred for life.
That said, call your Representative, call your Senator. There will be a nationwide march on June 30th. |
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