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ContagiousInspiration
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 Posted: Tue Sep 18, 2018 10:26 am Post subject: |
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I know I bring this up often but I blame the media for not taking Trump down earlier..
Just like Obama said so simply
| Quote: | | ‘How hard can that be, saying that Nazis are bad?’ |
Trumps own Personal Butler of 18 years (iirc) was a mean spirited violent racist asss..
https://www.google.com/search?q=trump+butler+anthony+senecal+racist
| Quote: |
I feel it is time for the SECOND AMERICAN REVOLUTION !!!!! The only way we will change this crooked government is to douche it !!!!! This might be the time with this kenyan fraud in power !!!!! ...[W]ith the last breath I draw I will help rid this America of the scum infested in its government--and if that means dragging that ball less dick head from the white mosque and hanging his scrawny ass from the portico--count me in !!!!!
Trump’s butler has also called for Michelle Obama, whom he referred to as “Sasquatch,” to be hanged, in addition to the rest of the Obama administration and Hillary Clinton (whom Senecal refers to as “Killery”). His Facebook friends would egg him on, too, Mother Jones reports: |
https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2016/05/donald-trump-butler-obama-lynching |
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Omar Little
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| Posted: Tue Sep 18, 2018 10:27 am Post subject: |
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| ocho wrote: | | The Juggernaut wrote: | | ocho wrote: | | Supporting Trump while pretending you’re doing so reluctantly is very in fashion at the moment. |
I've noticed this too. No one believes it's really reluctant support. That's just a cop out for when things come crashing down on Trump. |
Yep. It’s a tapdance, and it isn’t a convincing one. Polls of GOP support for him tell the real story. With rare exception, he is them, and they are him. |
That's why I didn't care for the anonymous NYT op ed. It was more of that, "don't blame us, we are going along with him and getting everything we want, but we're not him, and later on don't blame us for him" bull. Not only is he pretty much what the GOP has been in a thinly coded way for decades (see the mainstream conservative response to Black Lives Matter/ kneeling NFL players), but if you allow him to do and say stuff unchallenged that is morally repugnant, criminal, anti American, racist, misogynist, corrupt, and just downright nuts, because you'd rather do that than let your policy opponents win, you're saying at the very least you're OK with those things.
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jodeke
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| Posted: Tue Sep 18, 2018 10:28 am Post subject: |
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Mitch McConnell is a disgrace.
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yinoma2001
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| Posted: Tue Sep 18, 2018 10:38 am Post subject: |
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| ribeye wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | ChefLinda wrote: | | PSA: For anyone who cares, Hillary Clinton is going to be interviewed on Rachel Maddow tonight. |
I just can't stand Hillary. Not sure she is helping things out to be honest. Was the wrong choice to put up against Trump. |
I had many conversations with many of Hillary's detractors about her during the election who made similar statements. Why, specifically, can't you stand her? |
Just Hillary fatigue.
Never connected with me (and yes, I'm not part of her "base" and I voted for her over Trump). Just feel this may also drive Trump's base too for every Dem base voter she energizes.
Some of the newer voices are more interesting rather than rehashing the 1990s/2000s. Her time has passed.
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ribeye
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| Posted: Tue Sep 18, 2018 10:49 am Post subject: |
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| yinoma2001 wrote: | | ribeye wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | ChefLinda wrote: | | PSA: For anyone who cares, Hillary Clinton is going to be interviewed on Rachel Maddow tonight. |
I just can't stand Hillary. Not sure she is helping things out to be honest. Was the wrong choice to put up against Trump. |
I had many conversations with many of Hillary's detractors about her during the election who made similar statements. Why, specifically, can't you stand her? |
Just Hillary fatigue.
Never connected with me (and yes, I'm not part of her "base" and I voted for her over Trump). Just feel this may also drive Trump's base too for every Dem base voter she energizes.
Some of the newer voices are more interesting rather than rehashing the 1990s/2000s. Her time has passed. |
That is a fair explanation, but it doesn't quite mesh with, I can't stand her. I suppose that was hyperbole, which were are all guilty of on occasion.
And I tend to agree, that when she speaks, she probably energizes the right more than the left.
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ChefLinda
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| Posted: Tue Sep 18, 2018 10:49 am Post subject: |
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| yinoma2001 wrote: | | ribeye wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | ChefLinda wrote: | | PSA: For anyone who cares, Hillary Clinton is going to be interviewed on Rachel Maddow tonight. |
I just can't stand Hillary. Not sure she is helping things out to be honest. Was the wrong choice to put up against Trump. |
I had many conversations with many of Hillary's detractors about her during the election who made similar statements. Why, specifically, can't you stand her? |
Just Hillary fatigue.
Never connected with me (and yes, I'm not part of her "base" and I voted for her over Trump). Just feel this may also drive Trump's base too for every Dem base voter she energizes.
Some of the newer voices are more interesting rather than rehashing the 1990s/2000s. Her time has passed. |
I get why you personally don't want to read/watch Clinton, that's fine. That's why I prefaced my PSA for those who care, not those who don't care.
But "her time has passed?" Mitt Romney can run for Senate, Biden can go on shows and talk about whatever, ditto Al Gore, McCain stayed in Senate, John Kerry still walking and talking.
But only Hillary is supposed to go away and not be heard from. (Even though she got second most popular votes in history, behind only Obama.)
You're a friend of mine and this isn't meant to be an attack on you personally. But I hope you will take a look at some underlying attitudes and assumptions that may lead people to make these pronouncements about some and not others.
And how is Hillary doing what she's doing preventing others from rising to the top? Is Hillary being on Rachel taking away from Kamala Harris? Bernie is on 100 times as many talk shows. Is he accused of stepping on younger politicians or keeping them from shining?
/not personal, just fed up with sexism in the world |
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jodeke
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| Posted: Tue Sep 18, 2018 10:51 am Post subject: |
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Hillary Clinton hitting the campaign trail. I don't think it's a good idea. I don't know if she has any appeal.
LINK
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America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves. |
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yinoma2001
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| Posted: Tue Sep 18, 2018 10:52 am Post subject: |
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| ChefLinda wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | ribeye wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | ChefLinda wrote: | | PSA: For anyone who cares, Hillary Clinton is going to be interviewed on Rachel Maddow tonight. |
I just can't stand Hillary. Not sure she is helping things out to be honest. Was the wrong choice to put up against Trump. |
I had many conversations with many of Hillary's detractors about her during the election who made similar statements. Why, specifically, can't you stand her? |
Just Hillary fatigue.
Never connected with me (and yes, I'm not part of her "base" and I voted for her over Trump). Just feel this may also drive Trump's base too for every Dem base voter she energizes.
Some of the newer voices are more interesting rather than rehashing the 1990s/2000s. Her time has passed. |
I get why you personally don't want to read/watch Clinton, that's fine. That's why I prefaced my PSA for those who care, not those who don't care.
But "her time has passed?" Mitt Romney can run for Senate, Biden can go on shows and talk about whatever, ditto Al Gore, McCain stayed in Senate, John Kerry still walking and talking.
But only Hillary is supposed to go away and not be heard from. (Even though she got second most popular votes in history, behind only Obama.)
You're a friend of mine and this isn't meant to be an attack on you personally. But I hope you will take a look at some underlying attitudes and assumptions that may lead people to make these pronouncements about some and not others.
And how is Hillary doing what she's doing preventing others from rising to the top? Is Hillary being on Rachel taking away from Kamala Harris? Bernie is on 100 times as many talk shows. Is he accused of stepping on younger politicians or keeping them from shining?
/not personal, just fed up with sexism in the world |
Understood. But I find that she equally energizes the GOP base. There is some risk putting her out there front and center again. The more you use her to advance your message, you'll find that the other side simply parrots her for their ends.
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yinoma2001
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| Posted: Tue Sep 18, 2018 10:54 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | But only Hillary is supposed to go away and not be heard from. |
Honestly. Could care less what Kerry has to say. You had your chance and lost. It's truly not a sexism thing for me (can't speak for others).
FWIW, my sister in law worked for Hillary for many years, and there are a lot of non-flattering things that she said about that experience. That's all I will say about that.
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ChefLinda
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| Posted: Tue Sep 18, 2018 11:12 am Post subject: |
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| yinoma2001 wrote: | | Quote: | | But only Hillary is supposed to go away and not be heard from. |
Honestly. Could care less what Kerry has to say. You had your chance and lost. It's truly not a sexism thing for me (can't speak for others).
FWIW, my sister in law worked for Hillary for many years, and there are a lot of non-flattering things that she said about that experience. That's all I will say about that. |
I know you personally don't mean it like this, but implying a woman should go away and be quiet is something like implying Obama is lazy. Women hear sexist dog whistles. Women have been told to sublimate themselves, go away and be quiet since the beginning of time. It seems to be a recurring theme that's been building over the last 18 months (see Rebecca Traister's article on women being angry on the previous page). Coincidentally, it began building right after Clinton's loss followed by the Women's March. I'm saying all these things are connected, and when remarks like this are made in the context of the last 18 months, then I'm sorry but it strikes a nerve.
I am not calling you sexist or calling anyone here sexist. I'm trying to add context and depth to the conversation. |
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yinoma2001
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| Posted: Tue Sep 18, 2018 11:17 am Post subject: |
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I can understand how that may sound to you, but just saying as someone who voted for Hillary (and that was b/c I was anti-Trump), a former GOP supporter, and now an independent, I'm just not a fan of Hillary.
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ChefLinda
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| Posted: Tue Sep 18, 2018 11:25 am Post subject: |
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I'm perfectly fine with that opinion.  |
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kikanga
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| Posted: Tue Sep 18, 2018 11:38 am Post subject: |
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https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-09-05/u-s-trade-gap-widens-most-since-2015-china-deficit-hits-record
| Quote: | | U.S. Trade Gap Widens Most Since 2015; Record China Deficit |
GDP is a lagging indicator. This will really hurt our economy. Probably sometime in 2019.
And yes, the newly voted in Democratic House will somehow get blamed for this next year.
The Dems will have to take back the WH and Congress before this problem will be addressed.
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kikanga
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| Posted: Tue Sep 18, 2018 11:40 am Post subject: |
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For the record. TPP addressed China's growing economic power and unsavory business practices better than anything Trump has done in office.
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splashmtn
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| Posted: Tue Sep 18, 2018 11:48 am Post subject: |
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| ChefLinda wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | ribeye wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | ChefLinda wrote: | | PSA: For anyone who cares, Hillary Clinton is going to be interviewed on Rachel Maddow tonight. |
I just can't stand Hillary. Not sure she is helping things out to be honest. Was the wrong choice to put up against Trump. |
I had many conversations with many of Hillary's detractors about her during the election who made similar statements. Why, specifically, can't you stand her? |
Just Hillary fatigue.
Never connected with me (and yes, I'm not part of her "base" and I voted for her over Trump). Just feel this may also drive Trump's base too for every Dem base voter she energizes.
Some of the newer voices are more interesting rather than rehashing the 1990s/2000s. Her time has passed. |
I get why you personally don't want to read/watch Clinton, that's fine. That's why I prefaced my PSA for those who care, not those who don't care.
But "her time has passed?" Mitt Romney can run for Senate, Biden can go on shows and talk about whatever, ditto Al Gore, McCain stayed in Senate, John Kerry still walking and talking.
But only Hillary is supposed to go away and not be heard from. (Even though she got second most popular votes in history, behind only Obama.)
You're a friend of mine and this isn't meant to be an attack on you personally. But I hope you will take a look at some underlying attitudes and assumptions that may lead people to make these pronouncements about some and not others.
And how is Hillary doing what she's doing preventing others from rising to the top? Is Hillary being on Rachel taking away from Kamala Harris? Bernie is on 100 times as many talk shows. Is he accused of stepping on younger politicians or keeping them from shining?
/not personal, just fed up with sexism in the world |
a lot of that so called hillary fatigue is sexism and some of it is hidden in men's minds as well as women being socialized to be this way all of their lives. BUT, there are people who truly have clinton fatigue period. no just hilary. they are sick of the name itself. It's like the group Boyz 2 Men. They never had a bad song. They never missed a note. Every single time they would sing a song it sounded like You were in heaven. yet, I got sick of them. Why? because they were every where all of the time non stop. during times when they were supposed to be gone working on a new album. They would be coming thru the radio on a christmas playlist, they would perform on new years eve. They would perform at every award show. "okay can we get someone else? Is there any other talented people out there?" Is how we all felt about them. well not all but a lot of us.
Quiet as kept everytime I hear mit romney's name I think why the hell is he in office at all? get outta here already. so i feel the same about him but in an even worse way. he is a republican. lol. now John kerry can hang around but he aint running for president and no one is asking him to. Everytime Hil shows up or speaks, you have her supporters(which are a huge group.) getting excited about her possibly running. Which then some what steps ont he toes of the new guard(even if that is not her desire. It's true. There's a reason Kobe wasnt showing up a laker games even though he was watching those games. he wasnt THAT busy. the guy is hoops nerd. he has a show breaking down film. Lakers are and have always been his favorite team. He's watching. But he knew he couldnt be all up in the stands on the front row. that would do two things. have people thinking he was coming back and also have people thinking he was going to take luke's spot or knew more than luke, etc. cant have that out there like that even if that were not his intentions. If you're going to let the new guard push the team forward. you as the old guard celeb have to step aside and step back. Bill Clinton had to do the same. They used him as a specialist after awhile. and thats the way its supposed to be. I know its different with Hil because she never had the luxury of actually being the prez twice so she could never run again and everyone know it. which makes everything easier on all parties. But I feel what you're saying CL. You do make a valid point. How about this. Is there any other woman out there that you could get behind for the white house aside from hil from the new guard? |
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ChefLinda
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| Posted: Tue Sep 18, 2018 11:52 am Post subject: |
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| I love Kamala Harris. |
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splashmtn
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| Posted: Tue Sep 18, 2018 11:53 am Post subject: |
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| jodeke wrote: | Hillary Clinton hitting the campaign trail. I don't think it's a good idea. I don't know if she has any appeal.
LINK |
now dont be disrespectful to her. she has a ton of appeal. she destroyed trump in that Pop vote for a reason. and truth be told. even with the russians help trump only BARELY won those swing states by a few grand here and there.
I mean. the man had to cheat, then had to pray for a 2nd investigation to pop up to make a few would be hil supporters to stay home. then pray for a bernie situation and stay home and then pray for Hil's Camp to blow it and not properly campaign in those swing states.
if any one of those things would've not been there Hilary R Clinton would be your president right now. you guys do know this right? As much as I go at it with CL and DMR about Establishment dems, bernie etc. i aint no fool. i can count. She was by far the most popular candidate and trump was only known for being a reality start billionaire who filed BR multiple times and some how came back and still had his billion dollars(supposedly.)
She did have it in the bag if it wasnt for one of those things above i mentioned. So yes, she still has a ton of appeal. now with that being said. Should she fall back and let the new guard push forward(another woman, women in general, or some new guy or a combo of both)? Probably. |
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ChefLinda
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| Posted: Tue Sep 18, 2018 11:56 am Post subject: |
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She's out there raising money for OTHER WOMEN CANDIDATES precisely so they can be elected and take over. It's called mentoring. Men have been doing it since the beginning of time. But a woman does it and...
Last edited by ChefLinda on Tue Sep 18, 2018 11:57 am; edited 1 time in total |
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splashmtn
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| Posted: Tue Sep 18, 2018 11:56 am Post subject: |
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| ChefLinda wrote: | | I love Kamala Harris. |
I dont. I like her. i dont love her.
The idea of her is great (women of color). But in reality, I'm not so sure. and No i refuse to compare her to trump. I would vote for yinoma over trump right now. that goes without saying. I know she's super intelligent. But I"m not so sure if she is willing to do the hard pushing that needs to be done in order to get us on track or will she be a part of the NEW Establishment dem party. A new face with the same ole stuff aint going to cut it. at least not right now. maybe after this thing is stabilized. we could afford to do that. |
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kikanga
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| Posted: Tue Sep 18, 2018 12:01 pm Post subject: |
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| splashmtn wrote: | | ChefLinda wrote: | | I love Kamala Harris. |
I dont. I like her. i dont love her.
The idea of her is great (women of color). But in reality, I'm not so sure. and No i refuse to compare her to trump. I would vote for yinoma over trump right now. that goes without saying. I know she's super intelligent. But I"m not so sure if she is willing to do the hard pushing that needs to be done in order to get us on track or will she be a part of the NEW Establishment dem party. A new face with the same ole stuff aint going to cut it. at least not right now. maybe after this thing is stabilized. we could afford to do that. |
The problem is. The far left isn't the stronger voting block in the Democratic party. Bernie lost the African American vote by 50% in the primary. And the majority of Dems believe in the system in place for nominating candidates.
We can't let the message taken away from 2016 be: women can't win.
We need to make sure there are women running in our primary in 2020. And let the best person win.
Also, no candidate can be viewed as someone getting special treatment. Let the voters decide. That way there is minimal conflict when a 2020 primary winner is finally decided.
I don't know the details of the "debate topic" controversy Hillary suffered in 2016. But I do know it hurt voter confidence. Bernie voters felt cheated. And that can't be allowed moving forward. Every voter needs to feel heard. And the process has to be unimpeachable.
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Last edited by kikanga on Tue Sep 18, 2018 12:04 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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governator
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| Posted: Tue Sep 18, 2018 12:03 pm Post subject: |
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| splashmtn wrote: | | ChefLinda wrote: | | I love Kamala Harris. |
I dont. I like her. i dont love her.
The idea of her is great (women of color). But in reality, I'm not so sure. and No i refuse to compare her to trump. I would vote for yinoma over trump right now. that goes without saying. I know she's super intelligent. But I"m not so sure if she is willing to do the hard pushing that needs to be done in order to get us on track or will she be a part of the NEW Establishment dem party. A new face with the same ole stuff aint going to cut it. at least not right now. maybe after this thing is stabilized. we could afford to do that. |
Sounds like you might like Cortez, young, educated woman, new left, unapologetic and not afraid... already taking shots from the right (translate: they're worried) |
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kikanga
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| Posted: Tue Sep 18, 2018 12:09 pm Post subject: |
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One reason why I personally prefer far left candidates over moderate Dems is because there is less temptation to go after "Moderates" or "cross-over voters".
I put those descriptions in quotes. Because I don't believe many exist. And strictly from a political perspective, the voting block doesn't matter.
Dems are better off shoring up the base. And increasing voter turnout that way.
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ChefLinda
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| Posted: Tue Sep 18, 2018 12:09 pm Post subject: |
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| governator wrote: | | splashmtn wrote: | | ChefLinda wrote: | | I love Kamala Harris. |
I dont. I like her. i dont love her.
The idea of her is great (women of color). But in reality, I'm not so sure. and No i refuse to compare her to trump. I would vote for yinoma over trump right now. that goes without saying. I know she's super intelligent. But I"m not so sure if she is willing to do the hard pushing that needs to be done in order to get us on track or will she be a part of the NEW Establishment dem party. A new face with the same ole stuff aint going to cut it. at least not right now. maybe after this thing is stabilized. we could afford to do that. |
Sounds like you might like Cortez, young, educated woman, new left, unapologetic and not afraid... already taking shots from the right (translate: they're worried) |
Cortez is very young, raw, inexperienced and doesn't have the breadth of knowledge to run for presidency. Let her win a House seat first, then she's got a lot of learning to do. |
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governator
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| Posted: Tue Sep 18, 2018 12:14 pm Post subject: |
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| ChefLinda wrote: | | governator wrote: | | splashmtn wrote: | | ChefLinda wrote: | | I love Kamala Harris. |
I dont. I like her. i dont love her.
The idea of her is great (women of color). But in reality, I'm not so sure. and No i refuse to compare her to trump. I would vote for yinoma over trump right now. that goes without saying. I know she's super intelligent. But I"m not so sure if she is willing to do the hard pushing that needs to be done in order to get us on track or will she be a part of the NEW Establishment dem party. A new face with the same ole stuff aint going to cut it. at least not right now. maybe after this thing is stabilized. we could afford to do that. |
Sounds like you might like Cortez, young, educated woman, new left, unapologetic and not afraid... already taking shots from the right (translate: they're worried) |
Cortez is very young, raw, inexperienced and doesn't have the breadth of knowledge to run for presidency. Let her win a House seat first, then she's got a lot of learning to do. |
Yeah, not for presidency, you're right, shoulda specify that |
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kikanga
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| Posted: Tue Sep 18, 2018 12:15 pm Post subject: |
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| ChefLinda wrote: |
Cortez is very young, raw, inexperienced and doesn't have the breadth of knowledge to run for presidency. Let her win a House seat first, then she's got a lot of learning to do. |
I think you've addressed a key intra-party conflict the Dems are dealing with.
What we ultimately want vs. what we can accomplish step-by-step.
Obama realized the gap in those 2 things in office.
The first plays better on the campaign trail. The latter is the reality when in office.
For all of Bernie's grand ideas. His list of tangible accomplishments are underwhelming when compared to his tenure in office. How much more could he have gotten done if he were willing to compromise a little more? We'll never know.
Cortez and Harris should both run if they want to. We'll see what the voters want. And if that means 1 less male candidate in the field. GOOD.
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