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ContagiousInspiration
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 Posted: Sat Apr 20, 2019 6:10 pm Post subject: |
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| ChefLinda wrote: | | Omar Little wrote: | | ChefLinda wrote: | | DaMuleRules wrote: | | ChefLinda wrote: | | DaMuleRules wrote: | | ribeye wrote: | I keep hearing that impeachment tears apart the country.
No, the crimes warranting impeachment tear apart the county. |
The second sentence is certainly true. As for the first, impeachment won't tear the country apart. But an unsuccessful impeachment will dramatically increase the likelihood of a Trump selection and that will tear the nation apart.
Republicans will not impeach Trump and there are other ways to bring justice to Trump. I don't believe this country as we know it will survive a second term under Trump. There is far too much at stake to risk extending Trump's presidency by engaging in what will amount to nothing more than political theater. |
I certainly respect that opinion. And I honestly don't know which course will increase the odds of ridding us of Trump. To impeach or not to impeach. There are good arguments on both sides. I don't think either path is 100%.
But just out of curiosity, and I'm not sure you're quite old enough, but did you watch the Watergate Hearings or were you old enough to be aware of the politics at the time? |
Oh yeah. I was still just a kid, but I remember that period well. My parents were very political (they had "Don't blame me, I voted for McGovern bumper stickers") and my Dad was a history teacher and a Headmaster at the school H.R. Haldeman's son attended. So the hearings were must see TV in our house. |
We watched them at school and discussed them in real time. I just think that the average Joe Blow doesn't read every newspaper article or watch cable news every night. You have to paint them a picture. Live testimony that the entire country is watching is very dramatic, very compelling and even the most jaded can be shocked by watching the president's lawyer recount in detail how the president ordered him to break the law. It's the difference between reading a script and watching a movie. I personally think the hearings would shift the country more toward wanting to get rid of Trump. I'm assuming that all Trump voters will keep being Trump voters. That will be true with or without hearings. These people are already motivated to vote for him again. I don't see how Impeachment creates more Trump voters. They can certainly be more intense, but they still only get to vote once. I'm assuming that no person who watches this type of hearing and who had been anti-Trump will all of the sudden become pro-Trump. But I do think there are Independents, undecideds, young voters, previous non-voters who would watch the hearings and be shocked and motivated to vote him out.
Maybe I'm wrong. But I remember how shocking, dramatic and compelling the Watergate hearings were even though Woodward and Bernstein had already written about it in the Washington Post. |
It's important to remember the GOP stood by Nixon right up until the tapes came out. This version of the GOP would stand with him still. |
Yes, that's what I assumed in bold above. |
Isn't this much bigger than Watergate though?
This was a crime against every citizen of the USA.. not just Democrats
Criminal Conspiracy with a Foreign Nation who was once our Sworn ENEMY!
played right the public would run out of pitchforks |
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DaMuleRules
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| Posted: Sat Apr 20, 2019 6:16 pm Post subject: |
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| ContagiousInspiration wrote: |
Isn't this much bigger than Watergate though? |
Yep. Which is why this has to be navigated with the utmost care.
_________________
You thought God was an architect, now you know
He’s something like a pipe bomb ready to blow
And everything you built that’s all for show
goes up in flames
In 24 frames
Jason Isbell
Man, do those lyrics resonate right now |
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ContagiousInspiration
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Location: Boulder ;)
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| Posted: Sat Apr 20, 2019 7:06 pm Post subject: |
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| DaMuleRules wrote: | | ContagiousInspiration wrote: |
Isn't this much bigger than Watergate though? |
Yep. Which is why this has to be navigated with the utmost care. |
Is there any way to remove McConnell? 
Somehow chess pieces need removed to get to Trump
BTW.. just found this on AT.. Hilarious
https://imgur.com/YoMCtM6
*Worth a Mod pic |
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ContagiousInspiration
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| Posted: Sat Apr 20, 2019 8:06 pm Post subject: |
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I want to commend our DC Police and FBI for doing what they can to keep AOC/Talib/Omar safe
Two more years of Trump..
Will all three of them survive? |
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kikanga
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| Posted: Sat Apr 20, 2019 8:48 pm Post subject: |
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How do we know the House impeaching Trump would make the 2020 election harder? I'm not sure that's true.
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"Every hurt is a lesson, and every lesson makes you better” |
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ContagiousInspiration
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| Posted: Sat Apr 20, 2019 9:52 pm Post subject: |
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| kikanga wrote: | | How do we know the House impeaching Trump would make the 2020 election harder? I'm not sure that's true. |
Could we investigate McConnell for removing sanctions and receiving $200,000,000 invested in his
Home state immediately thereafter? I'm sure there's more
Start a Oligarch Republican investigation in the interests of National Security
The United Nations and NATO should order their own investigation into
Trump and Putin
There is possibly no greater threat to Humanity than those two men aligned
Put the screws to Trump's henchmen ALL of them assp
Erik Prince
Get SDNY to investigate Rudy Giuliani
Takedown the NRA for inciting violence
I'm sure some civil rights Trump what Trump did to ilhan Omar and he should
Be taken to court for using imagery to call a
Female **Trump is too scared to pull that (bleep) on say Kieth Ellison
Muslim
Freshman
Citizen
A terrorist using the power of United States of America*for which it stands
That is something the whole world should have been up in arms about
The people of the US and World "Anonymous if you can get dirt on Trump, now is the time. TIA"
Should remove Trump before his influence grows too malignant
#Will Trump intervene in the Vigilante Kidnappers case? Would fire up the base for sure
This is a War that MUST be fought |
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Conker
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| Posted: Sat Apr 20, 2019 10:22 pm Post subject: |
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Trump is not going to get impeach. I've said this before, he's going to get indicted once he leaves office.
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(❍ᴥ❍ʋ) ʕʘᴥʘʔ (⌐ ͡■ ͜ʖ ͡■) (┛◉Д◉)┛( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°) ༼;´༎ຶ ༎ຶ༽ |
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governator
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| Posted: Sun Apr 21, 2019 5:09 am Post subject: |
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| Conker wrote: | | Trump is not going to get impeach. I've said this before, he's going to get indicted once he leaves office. |
He better realize that once he leaves office, he's no longer the messiah to his cult, the next right wing Pres candidate would be... if he don't get impeach (which I think it's the right thing to pursue), he'll be in a ruuude awakening when his base moved on from him.
His option might literally be to move to Russia |
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Surfitall
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| Posted: Sun Apr 21, 2019 5:55 am Post subject: |
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| kikanga wrote: | | How do we know the House impeaching Trump would make the 2020 election harder? I'm not sure that's true. |
We don’t know for sure, but we do know that when the Republicans went after Bill Clinton for lying about Monica Lewinsky the American Public felt they went to far and rewarded Dems with a blue wave. |
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governator
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| Posted: Sun Apr 21, 2019 6:29 am Post subject: |
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| Surfitall wrote: | | kikanga wrote: | | How do we know the House impeaching Trump would make the 2020 election harder? I'm not sure that's true. |
We don’t know for sure, but we do know that when the Republicans went after Bill Clinton for lying about Monica Lewinsky the American Public felt they went to far and rewarded Dems with a blue wave. |
lying about a BJ and lying about Russia... different weight |
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DaMuleRules
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| Posted: Sun Apr 21, 2019 6:36 am Post subject: |
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| governator wrote: | | Surfitall wrote: | | kikanga wrote: | | How do we know the House impeaching Trump would make the 2020 election harder? I'm not sure that's true. |
We don’t know for sure, but we do know that when the Republicans went after Bill Clinton for lying about Monica Lewinsky the American Public felt they went to far and rewarded Dems with a blue wave. |
lying about a BJ and lying about Russia... different weight |
But Republicans don't believe he did (or those that do make excuses for it). Impeachment proceedings would be viewed as an unwarranted attack on their beloved President.
_________________
You thought God was an architect, now you know
He’s something like a pipe bomb ready to blow
And everything you built that’s all for show
goes up in flames
In 24 frames
Jason Isbell
Man, do those lyrics resonate right now |
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governator
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| Posted: Sun Apr 21, 2019 6:49 am Post subject: |
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| DaMuleRules wrote: | | governator wrote: | | Surfitall wrote: | | kikanga wrote: | | How do we know the House impeaching Trump would make the 2020 election harder? I'm not sure that's true. |
We don’t know for sure, but we do know that when the Republicans went after Bill Clinton for lying about Monica Lewinsky the American Public felt they went to far and rewarded Dems with a blue wave. |
lying about a BJ and lying about Russia... different weight |
But Republicans don't believe he did (or those that do make excuses for it). Impeachment proceedings would be viewed as an unwarranted attack on their beloved President. |
Dems have to make their case to the public in general and impeachment shouldn't be based on republicans sentiment in general, should be because Trump committed impeachment offenses |
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paymonM
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Posts: 4399
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| Posted: Sun Apr 21, 2019 7:22 am Post subject: |
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| ContagiousInspiration wrote: | I want to commend our DC Police and FBI for doing what they can to keep AOC/Talib/Omar safe
Two more years of Trump..
Will all three of them survive? |
Glenn Greenwald
Verified account
@ggreenwald
Follow Follow @ggreenwald
More Glenn Greenwald Retweeted Edward-Isaac Dovere
That Trump is the symptom, not the cause, is one of the most important - & repressed - truths in US politics. It's great to hear Obama say it. People want to depict Trump as the cause because a) the solution is simpler (get rid of Trump) & b) it's exculpatory of pre-Trump elites. |
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ChefLinda
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| Posted: Sun Apr 21, 2019 7:31 am Post subject: |
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Additional arguments for impeachment:
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Jared Yates Sexton @JYSexton
Trump and Republicans have opened the door to it being perfectly acceptable for a campaign to accept and rely on foreign interference. There are massive, massive ramifications to this, and shutting that precedent down is reason enough to impeach. 1/
Russia has been given no reason to quit interfering. In fact, they've been rewarded time and time again. They'll continue, and so will other nations. We're going to get to a point where you'll never know where anyone's loyalties lay. That's not a country works... 2/
At least it's not how a functioning country works. We're allowing Trump and Republicans to bring into question the legitimacy of the United States of America. In this case, we're saying what matters is winning, by any cost, and our laws and sovereignty are irrelevant. 3/
What Trump did was blatantly show that his loyalties lay with getting himself elected and empowered. He put his own greed and ambition over the good of the country, over the safety of the country. He won't be the last to do this, especially if it goes completely unpunished 4/
We've seen this time and again. If somebody gets away with an illegal act, if they benefit from it, people will replicate it. There's no reason for Russia not to continually interfere and no reason for Republicans not to welcome and seek that out. 5/
And we've seen Republicans quickly change their expectations and their positions on this. They're already shifting toward Russian interests and growing more loyal to Russian ideology. This will have unbelievable ramifications if we just turn away from our responsibilities. 6/
If this isn't addressed, if Democrats abdicate their duty, if we as a society just allow foreign adversaries to taint our elections, 2020 and every election after is going to not only be suspect but completely undermined. It's a long and slippery slope after that. 7/
If you doubt any of this, look at Giuliani this morning openly supporting foreign interference. Trump has absolutely no shame. This either gets addressed, or it's going to be exponentially worse, and the results going forward are going to be nothing short of a nightmare. 8/8 |
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Baron Von Humongous
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| Posted: Sun Apr 21, 2019 7:55 am Post subject: |
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| paymonM wrote: | | ContagiousInspiration wrote: | I want to commend our DC Police and FBI for doing what they can to keep AOC/Talib/Omar safe
Two more years of Trump..
Will all three of them survive? |
Glenn Greenwald
Verified account
@ggreenwald
Follow Follow @ggreenwald
More Glenn Greenwald Retweeted Edward-Isaac Dovere
That Trump is the symptom, not the cause, is one of the most important - & repressed - truths in US politics. It's great to hear Obama say it. People want to depict Trump as the cause because a) the solution is simpler (get rid of Trump) & b) it's exculpatory of pre-Trump elites. |
Greenwald finally has good tweet. Maybe he should say that to Tucker Carlson.
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Under New Management |
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ChefLinda
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| Posted: Sun Apr 21, 2019 7:59 am Post subject: |
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Washington Post: Democrats will meet in the next few weeks to discuss impeachment, Schiff says
| Quote: | House Democrats will hold a meeting to discuss whether to pursue impeachment proceedings against President Trump, a key lawmaker said Sunday.
House Intelligence Committee Chairman Adam B. Schiff (D-Calif.) said on “Fox News Sunday” that the House Democratic caucus will meet in the coming weeks to discuss the matter.
“That’s going to be a very consequential decision and one that I’m going to reserve judgment on until we’ve had a chance to fully deliberate on it,” Schiff said.
In an appearance on ABC News’s “This Week,” Schiff also said that while the findings of the Mueller report are “serious and damning,” he does not believe the Senate would convict Trump if the House were to impeach him.
“Now, it may be that we undertake an impeachment nonetheless. I think what we are going to have to decide as a caucus is: What is the best thing for the country?” he said. |
| Quote: | House Judiciary Committee Chairman Jerrold Nadler (D-N.Y.) also declined to rule out impeachment, saying Sunday that “if proven,” Trump’s alleged obstruction of justice “would be impeachable.”
“We may get to that. We may not. As I’ve said before, it is our job to go through all the evidence, all the information we can get,” he said. |
| Quote: | On Friday, two 2020 Democratic presidential contenders — Sen. Elizabeth Warren (Mass.) and Julián Castro, who was housing and urban development secretary in the Obama administration — seized on the report’s findings to make the case for impeachment.
But others, including House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) and Majority Leader Steny H. Hoyer (D-Md.), have urged members of their party to hold off on any impeachment proceedings and instead continue their investigations of Trump. |
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DaMuleRules
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| Posted: Sun Apr 21, 2019 8:09 am Post subject: |
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| governator wrote: | | DaMuleRules wrote: | | governator wrote: | | Surfitall wrote: | | kikanga wrote: | | How do we know the House impeaching Trump would make the 2020 election harder? I'm not sure that's true. |
We don’t know for sure, but we do know that when the Republicans went after Bill Clinton for lying about Monica Lewinsky the American Public felt they went to far and rewarded Dems with a blue wave. |
lying about a BJ and lying about Russia... different weight |
But Republicans don't believe he did (or those that do make excuses for it). Impeachment proceedings would be viewed as an unwarranted attack on their beloved President. |
Dems have to make their case to the public in general and impeachment shouldn't be based on republicans sentiment in general, should be because Trump committed impeachment offenses |
Definitely. That will certainly be crucial come 11/2020. The problem is, the public in general doesn't impeach and the those in power in the GOP are not going to. So rather than embark on a political theater that will not result in the desired action and will help the GOP argument as Trump as victim, hammer away on the acts he committed and demonstrate the corruption involved. That will (hopefully) encourage more people to vote against Trump rather than dig in and support him defensively.
_________________
You thought God was an architect, now you know
He’s something like a pipe bomb ready to blow
And everything you built that’s all for show
goes up in flames
In 24 frames
Jason Isbell
Man, do those lyrics resonate right now |
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Aussiesuede
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Joined: 27 Jul 2005
Posts: 10964
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| Posted: Sun Apr 21, 2019 8:12 am Post subject: |
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| paymonM wrote: | | ContagiousInspiration wrote: | I want to commend our DC Police and FBI for doing what they can to keep AOC/Talib/Omar safe
Two more years of Trump..
Will all three of them survive? |
Glenn Greenwald
Verified account
@ggreenwald
Follow Follow @ggreenwald
More Glenn Greenwald Retweeted Edward-Isaac Dovere
That Trump is the symptom, not the cause, is one of the most important - & repressed - truths in US politics. It's great to hear Obama say it. People want to depict Trump as the cause because a) the solution is simpler (get rid of Trump) & b) it's exculpatory of pre-Trump elites. |
There is the very real possibility that the time is nearer than farther that Americans are going to finally come to the realization that their government doesn't have the commitment to righting wrongs that they've been led to believe is inherent to the structure of their nation. Bloodthirst is intregally woven into the American psyche. Trump provided "Trumpians" a path to free a part of who they are. Who they've always been. A major part of being American. The innate ability to ignore the grievous misdeeds of the nation due to a heartfelt belief in it's moral superiority. "Trumpians" won't simply die with Trump. They will survive for the very same reasons those Americans who accepted the stain of Slavery survived. For the very same reason that those who accepted dropping a nuke survived. For the same reason those who've accepted war atrocities have survived. For the very same reason that those who still tolerate systemic racism continue to survive. Because in the final analysis, they are part and parcel of what America is, and aren't an aberration as many would hope to believe.
The power structure that is America will see to it that Trump get's the same pass that the other miscreants that have preceded him have. Many Americans are going to be left thirsty, but as has been proven time and again, they'll move past it and continue on their way accepting the status quo, however repugnant. An uncomfortable truth, but a truth nonetheless. Trump won't be held to pay for his sins. Americans will see to it... 
_________________
I'm On point, On task, On message, and Off drugs. A Streetwise Smart Bomb, Out of rehab and In denial. Over the Top, On the edge, Under the Radar, and In Control. Behind the 8 ball, Ahead of the Curve and I've got a Love Child who sends me Hate mail. |
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ChefLinda
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Location: Boston
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| Posted: Sun Apr 21, 2019 8:13 am Post subject: |
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And if Republicans think there is nothing wrong with accepting foreign money through cut-outs, using stolen and hacked info on their opponents, and accepting campaign help from foreign governments, and they see that no one will punish them for it, THEN THEY WILL DO IT AGAIN ONLY THIS TIME IT WILL BE A THOUSAND FOLD. Ditto for Russia, China and the Saudis. U.S. government policy will go to the highest foreign bidder. It's bad enough when it's the U.S. oil companies and Wall Street. If there are no punitive consequences for Trump's corrupt 2016 campaign, then the future will make Citizens's United look like puppies and rainbows.
As it is, Trump has dismantled cyber protection agency and GOP has blocked all bills and funding to protect the voting system.
You think they are just going to what, go by the honor system? |
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DaMuleRules
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| Posted: Sun Apr 21, 2019 8:15 am Post subject: |
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| ChefLinda wrote: | Additional arguments for impeachment:
| Quote: |
Jared Yates Sexton @JYSexton
[b]Trump and Republicans have opened the door to it being perfectly acceptable for a campaign to accept and rely on foreign interference. There are massive, massive ramifications to this, and shutting that precedent down is reason enough to impeach. 1/ |
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Here's the problem with that argument (as has been pointed out). An unsuccessful impeachment process actually would do far more to set a precedent by virtue of systematically through lawful procedure that there was no wrong committed.
Look, if impeachment is the way the Dems go, so be it. I just hope people are prepared for all the ramifications involved if it fails. Ramifications that will resonate in far more serious fashion than patiently working to vote Trump and Republicans out and prosecute the crimes later.
_________________
You thought God was an architect, now you know
He’s something like a pipe bomb ready to blow
And everything you built that’s all for show
goes up in flames
In 24 frames
Jason Isbell
Man, do those lyrics resonate right now |
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DaMuleRules
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Joined: 10 Dec 2006
Posts: 52656
Location: Making a safety stop at 15 feet.
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| Posted: Sun Apr 21, 2019 8:25 am Post subject: |
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| ChefLinda wrote: | And if Republicans think there is nothing wrong with accepting foreign money through cut-outs, using stolen and hacked info on their opponents, and accepting campaign help from foreign governments, and they see that no one will punish them for it, THEN THEY WILL DO IT AGAIN ONLY THIS TIME IT WILL BE A THOUSAND FOLD. Ditto for Russia, China and the Saudis. U.S. government policy will go to the highest foreign bidder. It's bad enough when it's the U.S. oil companies and Wall Street. If there are no punitive consequences for Trump's corrupt 2016 campaign, then the future will make Citizens's United look like puppies and rainbows.
As it is, Trump has dismantled cyber protection agency and GOP has blocked all bills and funding to protect the voting system.
You think they are just going to what, go by the honor system? |
Of course not. But tell me, do you honestly think that if the Dems bring impeachment proceedings that the GOP ultimately shuts down that the GOP are going to see the error of their ways and strive to be more ethical in the future?
I sure as hell don't.
_________________
You thought God was an architect, now you know
He’s something like a pipe bomb ready to blow
And everything you built that’s all for show
goes up in flames
In 24 frames
Jason Isbell
Man, do those lyrics resonate right now |
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jodeke
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Location: In a world where admitting to not knowing something is considered a great way to learn.
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| Posted: Sun Apr 21, 2019 8:34 am Post subject: |
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I've stopped losing sleep over the Trump administrations dismantling of democracy. It only causes loss of sleep and rising blood pressure readings. I don't have a organization to spread the word. I only have "Pass it on>" I talk to friends and strangers about Trump and urge them to "Pass it on>" I beat the register to vote and go to the polls drum.
_________________
Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves. |
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ContagiousInspiration
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Joined: 07 May 2014
Posts: 13823
Location: Boulder ;)
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| Posted: Sun Apr 21, 2019 8:37 am Post subject: |
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| ChefLinda wrote: | And if Republicans think there is nothing wrong with accepting foreign money through cut-outs, using stolen and hacked info on their opponents, and accepting campaign help from foreign governments, and they see that no one will punish them for it, THEN THEY WILL DO IT AGAIN ONLY THIS TIME IT WILL BE A THOUSAND FOLD. Ditto for Russia, China and the Saudis. U.S. government policy will go to the highest foreign bidder. It's bad enough when it's the U.S. oil companies and Wall Street. If there are no punitive consequences for Trump's corrupt 2016 campaign, then the future will make Citizens's United look like puppies and rainbows.
As it is, Trump has dismantled cyber protection agency and GOP has blocked all bills and funding to protect the voting system.
You think they are just going to what, go by the honor system? |
Kushner and Khashoggi
Kushner with an illegal security clearance helping Saudi Arabia coverup the murder of a US Citizen
I remember seeing some article early on saying Kushner may have even helped them keep tabs on Khashoggi
**If reading this.. ^
Click this
https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-1-d&q=mcconnell+200+million
must be some dirt in there |
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governator
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Posts: 25092
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| Posted: Sun Apr 21, 2019 8:38 am Post subject: |
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| DaMuleRules wrote: | | ChefLinda wrote: | And if Republicans think there is nothing wrong with accepting foreign money through cut-outs, using stolen and hacked info on their opponents, and accepting campaign help from foreign governments, and they see that no one will punish them for it, THEN THEY WILL DO IT AGAIN ONLY THIS TIME IT WILL BE A THOUSAND FOLD. Ditto for Russia, China and the Saudis. U.S. government policy will go to the highest foreign bidder. It's bad enough when it's the U.S. oil companies and Wall Street. If there are no punitive consequences for Trump's corrupt 2016 campaign, then the future will make Citizens's United look like puppies and rainbows.
As it is, Trump has dismantled cyber protection agency and GOP has blocked all bills and funding to protect the voting system.
You think they are just going to what, go by the honor system? |
Of course not. But tell me, do you honestly think that if the Dems bring impeachment proceedings that the GOP ultimately shuts down that the GOP are going to see the error of their ways and strive to be more ethical in the future?
I sure as hell don't. |
If you can make the case to the general public, they can decide to replace these GOP who protect corrupt president, even if GOP successfully prevent impeachment. There is no way for any of us can see how this plays out in the end but we should start the impeachment process because Trump committed impeachable offenses, GOP on the way or not |
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ContagiousInspiration
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Joined: 07 May 2014
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Location: Boulder ;)
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| Posted: Sun Apr 21, 2019 8:40 am Post subject: |
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| DaMuleRules wrote: | | ChefLinda wrote: | Additional arguments for impeachment:
| Quote: |
Jared Yates Sexton @JYSexton
[b]Trump and Republicans have opened the door to it being perfectly acceptable for a campaign to accept and rely on foreign interference. There are massive, massive ramifications to this, and shutting that precedent down is reason enough to impeach. 1/ |
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Here's the problem with that argument (as has been pointed out). An unsuccessful impeachment process actually would do far more to set a precedent by virtue of systematically through lawful procedure that there was no wrong committed.
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This is the strangest of times..
Sexual Intercourse with an Intern
or
A Russian in the White House
Pray for a mass awakening in the Hearts and Minds of Republicans?
*I still think there is a way to dethrone his biggest supporters and convince the less tainted to see he is a danger to America |
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