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eddiejonze
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 Posted: Thu Feb 20, 2020 4:04 pm Post subject: |
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| Wilt wrote: | Quinnipiac has polls from Wisconsin, Pennsylvania, and Michigan.
Basically, all Democrats lead Trump in Pennsylvania and Michigan, but Trump leads all Democrats in Wisconsin.
Assuming we can't win any other Trump states, we need all three above. It might come down to Wisconsin. No wonder the Democratic convention is there. |
Speaking of Quinnipiac polls, they had one with Biden being the only candidate to beat Drumpf in Texas...
At some point I wish the Bernie "revolutionaries" would get that a "revolution" within the democratic party won't mean squat in the EC...
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DaMuleRules
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| Posted: Thu Feb 20, 2020 4:06 pm Post subject: |
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| ChickenStu wrote: | | greenfrog wrote: | | Ted wrote: | | governator wrote: | | Klobuchar looked like she was about to cry over this Mexico question, this is just like Pete’s AA question... but she held on, strong work, it would’ve been over for her if she cried |
I noticed that too. She was getting upset and angry and her voice was cracking. If Pete went after her further it would've made him look terrible. But I'm sorry, she doesn't have it. She fumbles her words and just seems so unprepared. Everyone else on the stage asides from Klobuchar and Bloomberg are able to hold their own in a debate. Warren came out aggressive which I thought was great, I think she did well tonight. Bernie was good. Biden had his moments someone must have slipped him some Adderall tonight. Pete is all one liners and generic platitudes. I think Warren came out on top tonight, and Bernie held steady. Interesting to see how the rest of the week plays out. |
If a stapler was within her reaching distance that Telemundo moderator would have been beaned in the head. But Pete's constant and petty attacks were desperate and cringe worthy. |
LOL, no, and that's not how most are seeing that. Amy came off looking far worse last night. And I say this as someone who likes both she and Pete. What he did was not angry--in fact, nothing he does is angry--he was debating. She made a gaffe, and he brought it up in a fair way. This is a debate in Nevada, a state with a lot of latino voters, and, yes, the Telemundo reporter brought it up because it's an issue that latino voters fairly would like to have an answer on. So how is it unfair game when Pete brings up the mistake and also relates it to her votes on border issues and her assignment on certain committees? It's a fair question to ask why she didn't know the president's name. Now, look, could a person in a momentary fog simply forget? Of course! However, that's not what I think happened during her interview. She just simply said "no", she didn't know the name. She didn't offer up anything to suggest that it was on the tip of her tongue, that she was just having a momentary lapse, anything like that. So she doesn't get that benefit of the doubt from me, and, again, I say this as someone who likes her, generally. In my judgment, she simply didn't know the dude's name. Even during the debate last night, she had to look at her notes when saying his name.
So no, that was not a petty attack by Pete. It was relevant. And when she defensively said "are you saying I'm dumb?", that wasn't his argument or what he implied, and then when she said "I guess no one is as perfect as you, Pete", that was petty. She also flatly interrupted him while he was giving an answer to a question when he was called on. I'm not telling anyone to like Pete, but as someone who considers himself a moderate and who probably has those two as his first two choices, she's the one that came off looking far worse last night. I thought she handily won the New Hampshire debate. But she was awful last night and looked rattled. |
I think you are being a little too kind to Pete. Sure, there was nothing wrong with bringing up the gaffe in a debate. But it was simply a gaffe. Not the big deal he tried to make it by hammering at it.
Not a good moment for Pete (or Amy) And I say that as someone who likes them both too.
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DaMuleRules
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| Posted: Thu Feb 20, 2020 4:08 pm Post subject: |
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| ChickenStu wrote: | ^
Well, it's not exactly news that she has an angry streak; it's just that it's supposedly behind closed doors. I brought this up last night, but I'll just ask it again: do we think that if a woman had been so rudely interrupted flatly like Pete was last night, it wouldn't have been a major talking point? And yet he remained composed throughout. I miss Cory Booker on that stage, by the way. Always conducts himself with composure, grace, and vitality. Never saw any hubris from him. I thought he had a positive, inclusive message, and that resonates with me. |
There was a lot of interrupting and bombarding by both genders last night, so I don't think that's really an issue.
_________________
You thought God was an architect, now you know
He’s something like a pipe bomb ready to blow
And everything you built that’s all for show
goes up in flames
In 24 frames
Jason Isbell
Man, do those lyrics resonate right now |
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ChickenStu
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| Posted: Thu Feb 20, 2020 4:10 pm Post subject: |
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| DaMuleRules wrote: | | ChickenStu wrote: | ^
Well, it's not exactly news that she has an angry streak; it's just that it's supposedly behind closed doors. I brought this up last night, but I'll just ask it again: do we think that if a woman had been so rudely interrupted flatly like Pete was last night, it wouldn't have been a major talking point? And yet he remained composed throughout. I miss Cory Booker on that stage, by the way. Always conducts himself with composure, grace, and vitality. Never saw any hubris from him. I thought he had a positive, inclusive message, and that resonates with me. |
There was a lot of interrupting and bombarding by both genders last night, so I don't think that's really an issue. |
Not when one person was 20-30 seconds into their speaking time. She just flat stopped him and then talked over him. The moderators didn't even give him time to continue his response after that; a couple of other people spoke after that and then they went to a commercial. It would've been one thing if he had at least been given an opportunity to continue his answer. He wasn't. |
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Wilt
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| Posted: Thu Feb 20, 2020 4:18 pm Post subject: |
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| focus wrote: | | Wilt wrote: | | I don't think the Denmark card is effective in the long term. Americans don't aspire to move to Denmark. He has to explain why democratic socialism is humane and why unbridled capitalism is inhumane. |
He talked for a couple of minutes about democratic socialism and "billionaire socialism" in reply to Bloomberg and did well there. I missed it myself but saw it today online. |
Oh, I remember that part. While it's a good way to counter someone like Bloomberg, that's not really a good way to explain what socialism is.
Here's what I've suspected for a long time: Bernie doesn't know much about socialism, how it came about, and what its purpose is. He has certain talking points about Denmark and about billionaire socialism that he took from MLK, but he doesn't know much beyond it. And it doesn't require a huge speech, you can shrink it to a couple sentences, like I did a few posts ago.
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Heartburn
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| Posted: Thu Feb 20, 2020 4:19 pm Post subject: |
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| focus wrote: | | Wilt wrote: | | I don't think the Denmark card is effective in the long term. Americans don't aspire to move to Denmark. He has to explain why democratic socialism is humane and why unbridled capitalism is inhumane. |
He talked for a couple of minutes about democratic socialism and "billionaire socialism" in reply to Bloomberg and did well there. I missed it myself but saw it today online. |
I did like that response and I think it's a strong counter to their socialist claims. There is a welfare state but it's not for the poor, it's for billionaires...and at the moment, farmers. |
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ChefLinda
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| Posted: Thu Feb 20, 2020 4:42 pm Post subject: |
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First Trump colluded with Russia to steal the election. Then he gutted the State Department, then he purged the FBI, then he appointed Barr to make the Dept. of Justice his private law firm, and now he's purging the Intelligence agencies. So he's back where he started trying to collude with Russia again and firing anyone who objects and taking revenge on those who tried to impeach him. And McConnell helped him stack the courts. If re-elected there will be no stopping him from going full Putin and America as most of us have known it all our lives will be gone. Maybe we can get it back, and maybe we can't.
| Quote: | Sam Stein @samstein
·
So the sequence here appears to be.
1. DNI gets intel that Russia is interfering again in the election
2. Acting DNI briefs lawmakers about the threat.
3. Trump finds out
4. Trump berates acting DNI
5. Trump replaces acting DNI with political stooge/ally |
And the entire Republican Party has 100% ownership of every bit of it.
#VoteBlueNoMatterWho at every level of government. |
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focus
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| Posted: Thu Feb 20, 2020 4:47 pm Post subject: |
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| DaMuleRules wrote: | | ChickenStu wrote: | | greenfrog wrote: | | Ted wrote: | | governator wrote: | | Klobuchar looked like she was about to cry over this Mexico question, this is just like Pete’s AA question... but she held on, strong work, it would’ve been over for her if she cried |
I noticed that too. She was getting upset and angry and her voice was cracking. If Pete went after her further it would've made him look terrible. But I'm sorry, she doesn't have it. She fumbles her words and just seems so unprepared. Everyone else on the stage asides from Klobuchar and Bloomberg are able to hold their own in a debate. Warren came out aggressive which I thought was great, I think she did well tonight. Bernie was good. Biden had his moments someone must have slipped him some Adderall tonight. Pete is all one liners and generic platitudes. I think Warren came out on top tonight, and Bernie held steady. Interesting to see how the rest of the week plays out. |
If a stapler was within her reaching distance that Telemundo moderator would have been beaned in the head. But Pete's constant and petty attacks were desperate and cringe worthy. |
LOL, no, and that's not how most are seeing that. Amy came off looking far worse last night. And I say this as someone who likes both she and Pete. What he did was not angry--in fact, nothing he does is angry--he was debating. She made a gaffe, and he brought it up in a fair way. This is a debate in Nevada, a state with a lot of latino voters, and, yes, the Telemundo reporter brought it up because it's an issue that latino voters fairly would like to have an answer on. So how is it unfair game when Pete brings up the mistake and also relates it to her votes on border issues and her assignment on certain committees? It's a fair question to ask why she didn't know the president's name. Now, look, could a person in a momentary fog simply forget? Of course! However, that's not what I think happened during her interview. She just simply said "no", she didn't know the name. She didn't offer up anything to suggest that it was on the tip of her tongue, that she was just having a momentary lapse, anything like that. So she doesn't get that benefit of the doubt from me, and, again, I say this as someone who likes her, generally. In my judgment, she simply didn't know the dude's name. Even during the debate last night, she had to look at her notes when saying his name.
So no, that was not a petty attack by Pete. It was relevant. And when she defensively said "are you saying I'm dumb?", that wasn't his argument or what he implied, and then when she said "I guess no one is as perfect as you, Pete", that was petty. She also flatly interrupted him while he was giving an answer to a question when he was called on. I'm not telling anyone to like Pete, but as someone who considers himself a moderate and who probably has those two as his first two choices, she's the one that came off looking far worse last night. I thought she handily won the New Hampshire debate. But she was awful last night and looked rattled. |
I think you are being a little too kind to Pete. Sure, there was nothing wrong with bringing up the gaffe in a debate. But it was simply a gaffe. Not the big deal he tried to make it by hammering at it.
Not a good moment for Pete (or Amy) And I say that as someone who likes them both too. |
I disagree that it was merely a gaffe and not a big deal. It's a big deal not to know the name in the context of that interview. He was surprisingly effective in making the case. It was a good moment for him i guess in that he got what he wanted i.e. to make her look bad. Her lack of composure under relatively minor fire came out there given the critique he was making. I say this as someone who likes neither much, though I used to be intrigued by him. She seems far more authentic to me though. |
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focus
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| Posted: Thu Feb 20, 2020 4:48 pm Post subject: |
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| Heartburn wrote: | | focus wrote: | | Wilt wrote: | | I don't think the Denmark card is effective in the long term. Americans don't aspire to move to Denmark. He has to explain why democratic socialism is humane and why unbridled capitalism is inhumane. |
He talked for a couple of minutes about democratic socialism and "billionaire socialism" in reply to Bloomberg and did well there. I missed it myself but saw it today online. |
I did like that response and I think it's a strong counter to their socialist claims. There is a welfare state but it's not for the poor, it's for billionaires...and at the moment, farmers. |
There's a welfare state for farmers? |
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Baron Von Humongous
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| Posted: Thu Feb 20, 2020 4:52 pm Post subject: |
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If Sanders does get the nomination, one fun side effect will be seeing alternative media leftists who mocked #RussiaGate for four years suddenly finding religion when David Serota's emails get leaked.
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Baron Von Humongous
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| Posted: Thu Feb 20, 2020 5:19 pm Post subject: |
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| Omar Little wrote: | | Baron Von Humongous wrote: | | Baron Von Humongous wrote: | | Baron Von Humongous wrote: | | greenfrog wrote: | | kikanga wrote: | Seeing Bernie and Bloomberg polling top 2 nationally makes me really long for the days when Warren and Biden were the top 2. On both sides.
Bernie makes Warren seems like a realist. And Bloomberg makes Biden look like a progressive. |
The fact that she like likes to virtue signal with plan-itis I don't think makes her more realistic. Just like Sanders is playing to his populist base with simple plans and generalities to show what he stands for, she's doing the same to her audience of West Wing watchers dreaming of a presidency where the Ivy League educated rub elbows in the White House and hatch brilliant policies on the fly. |
So...close...to the mask falling. |
Just vile moronic remark after another. |
Misogynistic kayfabe from greenfrog. |
I found it fascinating that having a plan is virtue signaling snobbery, but generalities are the sweet spot of genuineness and effectiveness. |
"Real salt of the earth Americans value vague promises.* None of this Ivy League detailed information and well-considered plans for the common yokel whose plight I obviously identify with."
* and Marxism
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Heartburn
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| Posted: Thu Feb 20, 2020 6:07 pm Post subject: |
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| focus wrote: | | Heartburn wrote: | | focus wrote: | | Wilt wrote: | | I don't think the Denmark card is effective in the long term. Americans don't aspire to move to Denmark. He has to explain why democratic socialism is humane and why unbridled capitalism is inhumane. |
He talked for a couple of minutes about democratic socialism and "billionaire socialism" in reply to Bloomberg and did well there. I missed it myself but saw it today online. |
I did like that response and I think it's a strong counter to their socialist claims. There is a welfare state but it's not for the poor, it's for billionaires...and at the moment, farmers. |
There's a welfare state for farmers? |
They're getting floated billions of dollars (more than the auto industry in 2008-9) while Trump plays Trade War Battleship with China. |
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governator
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| Posted: Thu Feb 20, 2020 6:09 pm Post subject: |
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How did Biden do? I missed it. Warren is kicking ass again on her townhall, bringing back Bloomberg to start, great move
Warren flexing her professor/lawyer muscle, educated answers, she’s back |
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DaMuleRules
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| Posted: Thu Feb 20, 2020 6:17 pm Post subject: |
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I was talking to a buddy today and we went down an interesting path. That being that Bloomberg, despite what he is saying, isn't running to defeat Trump.
He's running to beat the Dems, especially Bernie and Warren because of their designs to get to the Billionaire's bank accounts.
If he gets the nomination and beats Trumps, he gets power in a Trumpian world where the POTUS can do no wrong and his GOP cronies (we all know he is not really a Dem) back him the way they did Trump.
If he gets the nomination and loses the General, he still wins because there's no one coming for his money - just the opposite.
_________________
You thought God was an architect, now you know
He’s something like a pipe bomb ready to blow
And everything you built that’s all for show
goes up in flames
In 24 frames
Jason Isbell
Man, do those lyrics resonate right now |
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governator
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| Posted: Thu Feb 20, 2020 6:21 pm Post subject: |
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| DaMuleRules wrote: | I was talking to a buddy today and we went down an interesting path. That being that Bloomberg, despite what he is saying, isn't running to defeat Trump.
He's running to beat the Dems, especially Bernie and Warren because of their designs to get to the Billionaire's bank accounts.
If he gets the nomination and beats Trumps, he gets power in a Trumpian world where the POTUS can do no wrong and his GOP cronies (we all know he is not really a Dem) back him the way they did Trump.
If he gets the nomination and loses the General, he still wins because there's no one coming for his money - just the opposite. |
Can’t see anybody voting for this guy. He sounds like he hasn’t live with regular people for a while, Extremely out of touch |
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DaMuleRules
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| Posted: Thu Feb 20, 2020 6:23 pm Post subject: |
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| governator wrote: | | DaMuleRules wrote: | I was talking to a buddy today and we went down an interesting path. That being that Bloomberg, despite what he is saying, isn't running to defeat Trump.
He's running to beat the Dems, especially Bernie and Warren because of their designs to get to the Billionaire's bank accounts.
If he gets the nomination and beats Trumps, he gets power in a Trumpian world where the POTUS can do no wrong and his GOP cronies (we all know he is not really a Dem) back him the way they did Trump.
If he gets the nomination and loses the General, he still wins because there's no one coming for his money - just the opposite. |
Can’t see anybody voting for this guy. He sounds like he hasn’t live with regular people for a while, Extremely out of touch |
I don't either. It was a conversation about what his motivation and end game must be. Not his odds of winning.
_________________
You thought God was an architect, now you know
He’s something like a pipe bomb ready to blow
And everything you built that’s all for show
goes up in flames
In 24 frames
Jason Isbell
Man, do those lyrics resonate right now |
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AD23
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| Posted: Thu Feb 20, 2020 6:23 pm Post subject: |
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| governator wrote: | How did Biden do? I missed it. Warren is kicking ass again on her townhall, bringing back Bloomberg to start, great move
Warren flexing her professor/lawyer muscle, educated answers, she’s back |
Not sure what you’re watching. She just being her folksy self. Don’t think that will result in winning Vegas or even finishing top 3 |
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governator
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| Posted: Thu Feb 20, 2020 6:32 pm Post subject: |
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| AD23 wrote: | | governator wrote: | How did Biden do? I missed it. Warren is kicking ass again on her townhall, bringing back Bloomberg to start, great move
Warren flexing her professor/lawyer muscle, educated answers, she’s back |
Not sure what you’re watching. She just being her folksy self. Don’t think that will result in winning Vegas or even finishing top 3 |
Warren scared of denouncing super-PACs was bad but overall still a good townhall |
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ChickenStu
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| Posted: Thu Feb 20, 2020 7:41 pm Post subject: |
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| governator wrote: | | AD23 wrote: | | governator wrote: | How did Biden do? I missed it. Warren is kicking ass again on her townhall, bringing back Bloomberg to start, great move
Warren flexing her professor/lawyer muscle, educated answers, she’s back |
Not sure what you’re watching. She just being her folksy self. Don’t think that will result in winning Vegas or even finishing top 3 |
Warren scared of denouncing super-PACs was bad but overall still a good townhall |
Agreed, I thought it was good performance by her. I thought her answer about what she learned from being a special ed teacher was genuinely heartfelt and not overly emotional, but emotional in a way that resonated with people. It was her at her best. |
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Baron Von Humongous
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| Posted: Thu Feb 20, 2020 8:33 pm Post subject: |
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| ChickenStu wrote: | | governator wrote: | | AD23 wrote: | | governator wrote: | How did Biden do? I missed it. Warren is kicking ass again on her townhall, bringing back Bloomberg to start, great move
Warren flexing her professor/lawyer muscle, educated answers, she’s back |
Not sure what you’re watching. She just being her folksy self. Don’t think that will result in winning Vegas or even finishing top 3 |
Warren scared of denouncing super-PACs was bad but overall still a good townhall |
Agreed, I thought it was good performance by her. I thought her answer about what she learned from being a special ed teacher was genuinely heartfelt and not overly emotional, but emotional in a way that resonated with people. It was her at her best. |
She really should've run in 2016 instead of Bernie.
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ContagiousInspiration
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| Posted: Thu Feb 20, 2020 9:07 pm Post subject: |
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| ChefLinda wrote: | First Trump colluded with Russia to steal the election. Then he gutted the State Department, then he purged the FBI, then he appointed Barr to make the Dept. of Justice his private law firm, and now he's purging the Intelligence agencies. So he's back where he started trying to collude with Russia again and firing anyone who objects and taking revenge on those who tried to impeach him. And McConnell helped him stack the courts. If re-elected there will be no stopping him from going full Putin and America as most of us have known it all our lives will be gone. Maybe we can get it back, and maybe we can't.
| Quote: | Sam Stein @samstein
·
So the sequence here appears to be.
1. DNI gets intel that Russia is interfering again in the election
2. Acting DNI briefs lawmakers about the threat.
3. Trump finds out
4. Trump berates acting DNI
5. Trump replaces acting DNI with political stooge/ally |
And the entire Republican Party has 100% ownership of every bit of it.
#VoteBlueNoMatterWho at every level of government. |
I blame Robert Mueller for hating America. Comes a time when just doing your job is PURE COWARDICE
Stand up for America Mueller..
I have known it was going to be this way since day one. The Russians have won.
What is left for him to do?
Barr is a horrible human being and his right hand man
Mitch and Lindsay and and Ryan and Rand and tons of other horrible human beings
ICE is horrible
his children are horrible
I can understand why England would behead traitors and put their body parts on london bridge.
Not long before Trump starts lining up journalists and judges in the middle of 5th Avenue
Nov 3rd 2020 thru January 20th 2021 will not bring change. It will bring Martial Law. |
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Wilt
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| Posted: Thu Feb 20, 2020 9:23 pm Post subject: |
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| Wilt wrote: | Quinnipiac has polls from Wisconsin, Pennsylvania, and Michigan.
Basically, all Democrats lead Trump in Pennsylvania and Michigan, but Trump leads all Democrats in Wisconsin.
Assuming we can't win any other Trump states, we need all three above. It might come down to Wisconsin. No wonder the Democratic convention is there. |
I want to add something to this...
Someone looked at the internals of all three polls. So even though Quinnipiac did all three of them, they did a better job representing the partisan breakdown in Michigan and Pennsylvania than they did in Wisconsin, in which they oversampled Republicans. Which is why Trump not only leads there, but leads by big margins against all Democratic candidates. It made little sense for Trump to lead all Democrats by upper single digits there. He may very well win the state again, but it'll be very close.
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Wilt
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| Posted: Thu Feb 20, 2020 9:39 pm Post subject: |
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| ChefLinda wrote: | First Trump colluded with Russia to steal the election. Then he gutted the State Department, then he purged the FBI, then he appointed Barr to make the Dept. of Justice his private law firm, and now he's purging the Intelligence agencies. So he's back where he started trying to collude with Russia again and firing anyone who objects and taking revenge on those who tried to impeach him. And McConnell helped him stack the courts. If re-elected there will be no stopping him from going full Putin and America as most of us have known it all our lives will be gone. Maybe we can get it back, and maybe we can't.
| Quote: | Sam Stein @samstein
·
So the sequence here appears to be.
1. DNI gets intel that Russia is interfering again in the election
2. Acting DNI briefs lawmakers about the threat.
3. Trump finds out
4. Trump berates acting DNI
5. Trump replaces acting DNI with political stooge/ally |
And the entire Republican Party has 100% ownership of every bit of it.
#VoteBlueNoMatterWho at every level of government. |
This should be the first issue discussed at the next debate. It was inexplicable that they completely ignored Trump's latest abuses of power regarding Barr and Stone in the last debate. And if Chuck Todd didn't care to ask a question about stuff like that, they should have brought it up anyway and kept talking about it.
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Ted
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| Posted: Thu Feb 20, 2020 11:36 pm Post subject: |
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| DaMuleRules wrote: | I was talking to a buddy today and we went down an interesting path. That being that Bloomberg, despite what he is saying, isn't running to defeat Trump.
He's running to beat the Dems, especially Bernie and Warren because of their designs to get to the Billionaire's bank accounts.
If he gets the nomination and beats Trumps, he gets power in a Trumpian world where the POTUS can do no wrong and his GOP cronies (we all know he is not really a Dem) back him the way they did Trump.
If he gets the nomination and loses the General, he still wins because there's no one coming for his money - just the opposite. |
This is spot on. That's exactly the reason why he entered the race. |
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kikanga
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| Posted: Fri Feb 21, 2020 12:31 am Post subject: |
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| Wilt wrote: | | Wilt wrote: | Quinnipiac has polls from Wisconsin, Pennsylvania, and Michigan.
Basically, all Democrats lead Trump in Pennsylvania and Michigan, but Trump leads all Democrats in Wisconsin.
Assuming we can't win any other Trump states, we need all three above. It might come down to Wisconsin. No wonder the Democratic convention is there. |
I want to add something to this...
Someone looked at the internals of all three polls. So even though Quinnipiac did all three of them, they did a better job representing the partisan breakdown in Michigan and Pennsylvania than they did in Wisconsin, in which they oversampled Republicans. Which is why Trump not only leads there, but leads by big margins against all Democratic candidates. It made little sense for Trump to lead all Democrats by upper single digits there. He may very well win the state again, but it'll be very close. |
I wonder if there is someone in the Dem party we could put on a VP ticket to carry Florida. Does anybody know?
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