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Rumor: Phil Jackson could end up with Lakers this summer
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Omar Little
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Posted: Mon Nov 28, 2016 10:46 pm Post subject:

slavavov wrote:

Omar Little wrote:

dont_be_a_wuss wrote:

slavavov wrote:

I like Phil more than most people on this board, but I'd only be OK with it if, as vlf said, he was a consultant or the man setting the general vision, and Mitch was still the main man as far as making acquisitions and executing the game plan. I know Phil has his flaws and that many here despise him as a human being, but I've read about him behind the scenes and realized that he has a good heart beneath all that ego and office politicking. He has some gravitas that could help with FAs, and besides, as he himself once said, Luke Walton is his son.

Give him Jim's job when Jim stays true to his word and resigns.

Why? Other than drafting the best available guy by default in Porzingis (who was being considered higher), what has Phil done in NY that would make him the pick?

The Knicks are doing OK right now, especially in the last couple weeks. You gotta give an executive a couple years when he takes over a bad team before you can expect results. Much like how Mitch needed a few years to prove that he's a solid GM.

The Knicks are worse in the roster than when he started (possibly because of trading an elite anchor for a washed up tri pg and then holding onto assets like shumlert and Smith until he had to dump them for nothing to tank), and even at OK, that's their upside. Ok
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dont_be_a_wuss
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Posted: Mon Nov 28, 2016 10:48 pm Post subject:

Omar Little wrote:

slavavov wrote:

Omar Little wrote:

dont_be_a_wuss wrote:

slavavov wrote:

Give him Jim's job when Jim stays true to his word and resigns.

Why? Other than drafting the best available guy by default in Porzingis (who was being considered higher), what has Phil done in NY that would make him the pick?

Players have free will. You can't just force them to sign there. We signed freaking mozgov to $64 million. Is that Jim's fault? Or is that just the reality of how things worked out?

Runway8
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Posted: Mon Nov 28, 2016 10:52 pm Post subject:

dont_be_a_wuss wrote:

Omar Little wrote:

dont_be_a_wuss wrote:

slavavov wrote:

Give him Jim's job when Jim stays true to his word and resigns.

Why? Other than drafting the best available guy by default in Porzingis (who was being considered higher), what has Phil done in NY that would make him the pick?

Well if Jim doesn't backtrack on his word and show himself to be a dishonest liar, and we do end up having a vacancy, who else would you rather give his title to?

I'd like the "dishonest liar" to stay put. And if he leaves, definitely not for Phil. We've all said things in the moment. He loves his Lakers, that's clear. PJ loves himself, that's very clear.

dont_be_a_wuss
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Posted: Mon Nov 28, 2016 10:55 pm Post subject:

Runway8 wrote:

dont_be_a_wuss wrote:

Omar Little wrote:

dont_be_a_wuss wrote:

slavavov wrote:

Give him Jim's job when Jim stays true to his word and resigns.

Why? Other than drafting the best available guy by default in Porzingis (who was being considered higher), what has Phil done in NY that would make him the pick?

Well if Jim doesn't backtrack on his word and show himself to be a dishonest liar, and we do end up having a vacancy, who else would you rather give his title to?

I'd like the "dishonest liar" to stay put. And if he leaves, definitely not for Phil. We've all said things in the moment. He loves his Lakers, that's clear. PJ loves himself, that's very clear.

Personally, I though it was he full of crap from the beginning and did not think he was genuine when he said it. So the dishonest liar may grant your wish.

augus7
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Posted: Mon Nov 28, 2016 10:57 pm Post subject:

Gatekeeper wrote:

I always wondered if we'll ever have a blacklist for articles on the Lakers posted by certain journos. Isola, Simers, and Simmons should be on that list asap.

Haven't read much Simers and Simmons but I agree that that is a good idea.

Really hard to filter which authors should be blacklisted, though.
Isola definitely should be one of them IMO. Also, yahoo finance

epak
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Posted: Mon Nov 28, 2016 10:58 pm Post subject:

This is the reason we should be hoping the Lakers make the 2nd round. To finally put an end to Phil rumors. So sickening.

J.C. Smith
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Posted: Mon Nov 28, 2016 11:07 pm Post subject:

dont_be_a_wuss wrote:

Personally, I though it was he full of crap from the beginning and did not think he was genuine when he said it. So the dishonest liar may grant your wish.?

It's such a silly argument. He made a statement behind closed doors that was supposed to remain private basically saying that if the team isn't on the right track in a few years he'll resign. Then his sister leaked that out into public for whatever reason. I don't think it was ever meant as a real deadline. And I can't see any way he steps down given the direction the Lakers are heading in.

Runway8
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Posted: Mon Nov 28, 2016 11:09 pm Post subject:

epak wrote:

This is the reason we should be hoping the Lakers make the 2nd round. To finally put an end to Phil rumors. So sickening.

We're on our way. And so what if it takes 4 or 5 years? It's still reasonable. Building a team is not exact science and you can't be on the money with your predictions and time-tables. Only children would say, "But you said 3 years! Get out!" And sometimes they do act like children, so who knows.

CervantesRises
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Posted: Mon Nov 28, 2016 11:12 pm Post subject:

J.C. Smith wrote:

dont_be_a_wuss wrote:

Personally, I though it was he full of crap from the beginning and did not think he was genuine when he said it. So the dishonest liar may grant your wish.?

Uhhh...Jim Made the statement in an interview...Jeannie didn't have to leak anything because he effectively and inexplicably put the rope around his own neck.

http://www.lakersnation.com/the-clock-is-ticking-for-jim-buss-and-lakers/2016/01/05/
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Omar Little
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Posted: Mon Nov 28, 2016 11:13 pm Post subject:

dont_be_a_wuss wrote:

Omar Little wrote:

slavavov wrote:

Omar Little wrote:

dont_be_a_wuss wrote:

slavavov wrote:

Give him Jim's job when Jim stays true to his word and resigns.

Why? Other than drafting the best available guy by default in Porzingis (who was being considered higher), what has Phil done in NY that would make him the pick?

Players have free will. You can't just force them to sign there. We signed freaking mozgov to $64 million. Is that Jim's fault? Or is that just the reality of how things worked out?

You're all over the board, again. I've made a case that the assets he has now are worse than when he started, that he made horrible transactions, coaching decisions, can't close prime free agents, and meddlesome to the point of undermining his coach.

And your response to being asked to make the case for him is to say that you can't make free agents sign and Jim signed Mozgov (which, btw, most of the naysayers are realizing was a decent move, not a disaster). Quality stuff there. Me hate Jim. Me love Phil.
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Omar Little
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Posted: Mon Nov 28, 2016 11:15 pm Post subject:

dont_be_a_wuss wrote:

Runway8 wrote:

dont_be_a_wuss wrote:

Omar Little wrote:

dont_be_a_wuss wrote:

slavavov wrote:

Give him Jim's job when Jim stays true to his word and resigns.

Why? Other than drafting the best available guy by default in Porzingis (who was being considered higher), what has Phil done in NY that would make him the pick?

Well if Jim doesn't backtrack on his word and show himself to be a dishonest liar, and we do end up having a vacancy, who else would you rather give his title to?

I'd like the "dishonest liar" to stay put. And if he leaves, definitely not for Phil. We've all said things in the moment. He loves his Lakers, that's clear. PJ loves himself, that's very clear.

Personally, I though it was he full of crap from the beginning and did not think he was genuine when he said it. So the dishonest liar may grant your wish.

Of course. Because your analysis has always just been back filling your prior emotional position. Me hate Jim.
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Lakerfan 4 Life
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Posted: Mon Nov 28, 2016 11:18 pm Post subject:

I predict that Phil will be back with the Lakers this summer being apart of the front office, Luke will still be head coach, no changes to the coaching staff and no more Triangle Offense.

Omar Little
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Posted: Mon Nov 28, 2016 11:22 pm Post subject:

Fwiw, my ongoing point has always been that even if you don't like Jim, if he steps down, he has to be replaced with either another owner or someone totally empowered by the owners (because ultimately owners can trump any employee, and someone as to be the final boss). Who the hell is that going to be? Who is going to be that owner, or who is going to be the proxy? Like it or not there really isn't a solution that works within the ownership construct. _________________ “We must always take sides. Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim. Silence encourages the tormentor, never the tormented.” ― Elie Wiesel

LawyerShawn
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Posted: Mon Nov 28, 2016 11:22 pm Post subject:

Only way Phil is coming here, is if Cousins is somehow traded here. Phil and Walton, working together, could gain his trust. _________________ Station where the act becomes the art of growing up.

Omar Little
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Posted: Mon Nov 28, 2016 11:22 pm Post subject:

Lakerfan 4 Life wrote:

I predict that Phil will be back with the Lakers this summer being apart of the front office, Luke will still be head coach, no changes to the coaching staff and no more Triangle Offense.

What role do you see Phil in?
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CervantesRises
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Posted: Mon Nov 28, 2016 11:26 pm Post subject:

Omar Little wrote:

Judah wrote:

venturalakersfan wrote:

Goldenwest wrote:

As long as its a ceremonial or consultant type gig, why not? Seems inevitable anyway, since he's part of the family.

He could be a consultant, similar to Jerry West in Golden State. He has a lot of basketball knowledge and it would be good to tap into that. He supposedly turned down a consulting position before, but maybe after the Knicks he will be ready for that. He could actually help us out.

This is my view as well. Phil was such a brilliant coach with a unique basketball mind and feel for the game. Luke isn't running the triangle and I don't think Phil returning in any capacity would change that, but it's intriguing to at least wonder how much more Luke could grow as a coach if he had Phil around to bounce ideas/suggestions off of in some sort of advisory role. I've never agreed with the whole 'Phil only enjoyed success because he had some of the best players of all time' thing, especially when you have someone like Kobe saying that Phil helped him see the game in a way that he never even knew existed until he learned from him. I think he'd be a valuable voice for Luke that would go beyond constant screams of 'Run the triangle!'

One thing I did always like about the triangle was the way it incorporated all five guys in a consistent way and made everyone a threat. Modern offenses like GS and SA borrow elements and principles from the triangle, so, who knows? Given his willingness to learn as a coach and his basketball IQ, maybe bouncing ideas off of Phil at times could result in Luke drawing even more from the "water well" of the triangle, so to speak, in some innovative ways and add even more depth to the modern offense. The two of them together could be a lethal combo. Iron sharpens iron (Proverbs 27:17).

I don't think there's any wisdom in granting him the power to make personnel moves, though. I just don't see him flourishing in that role, especially if he'd be replacing Jim Buss. Phil is in his 70's. He wouldn't be a long-term solution there. Besides, it's obvious that coaching is where his heart is. I think his decision to take the basketball ops gig in NY had more to do with him missing being around the game in an up close way. That's why he always ended up returning after only a year off every time he retired. He may have wanted time to mull a return in 2012, but we all know he was gonna take it. There was even a report that he had already started contacting his old assistants and even reached out to Scottie Pippen to see if he wanted in. Had the Lakers not sandbagged him, he would've been back.

I think he only took the FO position with NY because he had to give that competitive itch of his a scratch, somehow. But making personnel moves isn't really what he wants. He was probably up for the challenge initially and figured he'd give it a shot, but a couple of years into it, I'm sure he realizes more than ever that a FO position can't and won't replace his desire to teach the game. The two roles are just too different.

Phil's basketball genius was his ability to get stupendous star talent to play together, and for the role players to happily or at least satisfactorily sublimate their touches to the stars. That's no small feat, but it also isn't really all that relevant outside of coaching.

And he's shown that he absolutely will meddle and insist on an offense that is obsolete, and has neither the knowledge nor the curiosity to attain the knowledge of why that offense is obsolete, or that it wasn't the reason for his coaching success. Not to mention his dividing of organizations, which worked well as a coach during his runs, doesn't help a seat higher.

Then there's the fact that he actually isn't a recruitment draw with players these days.

I'm not for Phil coming back or for us doing anything that Jeopardizes Ryan West or Jesse Buss as those 2 seem to have the best eye's for talent in the organization.

I'm also not a fan of the OPs seemingly incessant need for attention or attempts to suck up towards the Mods.

But I think your statement here about an 11 time Championship Head Coach...a person who can easily be placed on a Mt. Rushmore of coaches across all professions...is intellectually dishonest.

You talk about the dude as if what he did was so easy anyone could do it...and that he only really had one skill.

Come on bruh...we was all there...Phil the HC was great at making half-time adjustments. Great at letting his teams develop a confidence for figuring things out on their own. Great at in bounds plays. Great at creating defensive funnels. Great at luring opposing teams into his traps. Great at the psychology of war. Great at having his teams prepared for the moments of truth. And absolutely the luckiest sob I've ever seen too.

You don't win a Championship coaching scrubs in Puerto Rico...get a NBA assistant gig...quickly ascend to take over the most forceful player of all-time and mold the team into a 6 time champion...and then go surfing in Australia only to come back to LA and take over 2 tremendous talents that were getting walked in 4-0 air-ball embarrassments to instance champions because you got role players to sublimate their games.

Hate on the FO Phil all you want...it's justified...

But don't diss the greatest coach in the history of professional sports by reducing his over arching imprint down to such trite and superficial historical revisions.

Give the man his due...know what I'm saying?

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Omar Little
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Posted: Mon Nov 28, 2016 11:32 pm Post subject:

Uh, I give the man his due. He was a great coach, and his greatest gift was not x and o, but his management of ego and personnel. Masterful. Easily in the goat conversation for coaches. But what works as a coach is not necessarily what works as an executive. In fact, it is often quite the opposite. And nothing in his coaching resume, nor in his actual foray into being an exec, gives credence to him being a master at that job. Quote the opposite. Btw, it is quite feasible to be a great coach in an era and then have that era pass. _________________ “We must always take sides. Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim. Silence encourages the tormentor, never the tormented.” ― Elie Wiesel

LawyerShawn
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Posted: Mon Nov 28, 2016 11:37 pm Post subject:

Omar Little wrote:

Uh, I give the man his due. He was a great coach, and his greatest gift was not x and o, but his management of ego and personnel. Masterful. Easily in the goat conversation for coaches.

But what works as a coach is not necessarily what works as an executive. In fact, it is often quite the opposite. And nothing in his coaching resume, nor in his actual foray into being an exec, gives credence to him being a master at that job. Quote the opposite.

Btw, it is quite feasible to be a great coach in an era and then have that era pass.

Some good points here. There is a place for Phil as far as bringing legitimacy to the Lakers front office. That applies to potential free agent stars (I am convinced Lakers are planning a run at Cousins this offseason).

If I were Phil, I would have gone for the Cavaliers HC job. Perhaps Phil thought this might cement the naysayers who condemn him as 'only winning because he coached the best players'.
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Omar Little
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Posted: Tue Nov 29, 2016 12:00 am Post subject:

LawyerShawn wrote:

Omar Little wrote:

As we have seen, how a team is set up to win is key in free agency, not so much big name execs. And Phil is proving both that and his lack of connection to current players. He brings nothing but nostalgia for fans and dissension in the front office hierarchy.
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non-player zealot
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Posted: Tue Nov 29, 2016 12:40 am Post subject:

Inspector Gadget wrote:

ocho wrote:

C'mon Dooce.

Do you want Phil back in a FO role?

Yeah, he needs to advise Mitch on which draftees are most tri-fit.

Do I want him a part of the FO? No. Do I want him apart of the FO? Yes.
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Ziggy
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Posted: Tue Nov 29, 2016 12:45 am Post subject:

He's coming for the legal marijuana guys, relax.

J.C. Smith
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Posted: Tue Nov 29, 2016 1:16 am Post subject:

CervantesRises wrote:

Uhhh...Jim Made the statement in an interview...Jeannie didn't have to leak anything because he effectively and inexplicably put the rope around his own neck.

He spoke about it after it had already been leaked in public.

Omar Little
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Posted: Tue Nov 29, 2016 1:16 am Post subject:

Ziggy wrote:

He's coming for the legal marijuana guys, relax.

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Bard207
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Posted: Tue Nov 29, 2016 1:48 am Post subject:

Omar Little wrote:

LawyerShawn wrote:

Omar Little wrote:

Phil also vaulted into the top executive position with no prior experience and lacking positive relationships with other FO executives around the league.

He took on a difficult task that he hadn't prepared for.

Chronicle
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Posted: Tue Nov 29, 2016 2:19 am Post subject:

Can't we have jeanie end up with the knicks instead please? _________________ Kobe

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