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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Wed Jan 18, 2017 10:41 am Post subject: |
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adkindo wrote: | Zach Lowe reported that the Pelicans were in talks with Atlanta about Dwight when they were considering blowing up roster. Claims Pelicans do not trust Davis durability if he has to play the 5. Mozgov is not Dwight, but he could be sold as a quality 5 to allow Davis to play the 4. |
I get the sense the Knicks feel the same about Porky and the 5. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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Vesper Starting Rotation
Joined: 10 Dec 2016 Posts: 387
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Posted: Wed Jan 18, 2017 10:44 am Post subject: |
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Only trade I make is whether we keep nick young or louwill and trade the one left out.
Nick Young can probably get us a 2nd round pick, which we wont have if we retain our 2017 lottery pick. |
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dcarter4kobe Franchise Player
Joined: 30 Jul 2005 Posts: 17656
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Posted: Wed Jan 18, 2017 10:47 am Post subject: |
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adkindo wrote: | Zach Lowe reported that the Pelicans were in talks with Atlanta about Dwight when they were considering blowing up roster. Claims Pelicans do not trust Davis durability if he has to play the 5. Mozgov is not Dwight, but he could be sold as a quality 5 to allow Davis to play the 4. |
They already have Asik off the bench on a large contract. They wouldn't add Mozgov (or any other team, I'm 99% sure) _________________ "He's a Zen master, so he can speak to you, and he doesn't need a microphone; you can hear him in your head, 'Ron, don't shoot, don't shoot.' Whatever, pow, three. I love the Zen, though." |
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adkindo Retired Number
Joined: 16 Jun 2005 Posts: 40345 Location: Dirty South
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Posted: Wed Jan 18, 2017 10:50 am Post subject: |
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dcarter4kobe wrote: | adkindo wrote: | Zach Lowe reported that the Pelicans were in talks with Atlanta about Dwight when they were considering blowing up roster. Claims Pelicans do not trust Davis durability if he has to play the 5. Mozgov is not Dwight, but he could be sold as a quality 5 to allow Davis to play the 4. |
They already have Asik off the bench on a large contract. They wouldn't add Mozgov (or any other team, I'm 99% sure) |
your likely right, but they were going to take on Dwights which was much larger....and Asik sucks, which is the root of the problem. |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Wed Jan 18, 2017 10:51 am Post subject: |
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adkindo wrote: | dcarter4kobe wrote: | adkindo wrote: | Zach Lowe reported that the Pelicans were in talks with Atlanta about Dwight when they were considering blowing up roster. Claims Pelicans do not trust Davis durability if he has to play the 5. Mozgov is not Dwight, but he could be sold as a quality 5 to allow Davis to play the 4. |
They already have Asik off the bench on a large contract. They wouldn't add Mozgov (or any other team, I'm 99% sure) |
your likely right, but they were going to take on Dwights which was much larger....and Asik sucks, which is the root of the problem. |
What would the Pels even offer ATL for Dwight (since ATL is not tanking)? _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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adkindo Retired Number
Joined: 16 Jun 2005 Posts: 40345 Location: Dirty South
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Posted: Wed Jan 18, 2017 10:59 am Post subject: |
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yinoma2001 wrote: | adkindo wrote: | dcarter4kobe wrote: | adkindo wrote: | Zach Lowe reported that the Pelicans were in talks with Atlanta about Dwight when they were considering blowing up roster. Claims Pelicans do not trust Davis durability if he has to play the 5. Mozgov is not Dwight, but he could be sold as a quality 5 to allow Davis to play the 4. |
They already have Asik off the bench on a large contract. They wouldn't add Mozgov (or any other team, I'm 99% sure) |
your likely right, but they were going to take on Dwights which was much larger....and Asik sucks, which is the root of the problem. |
What would the Pels even offer ATL for Dwight (since ATL is not tanking)? |
at that time, I think they were gutting the roster...probably seeking young assets, picks and expiring contracts for filler? |
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Mini Mamba Star Player
Joined: 06 May 2013 Posts: 6006
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Posted: Wed Jan 18, 2017 12:55 pm Post subject: |
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adkindo wrote: | dcarter4kobe wrote: | adkindo wrote: | Zach Lowe reported that the Pelicans were in talks with Atlanta about Dwight when they were considering blowing up roster. Claims Pelicans do not trust Davis durability if he has to play the 5. Mozgov is not Dwight, but he could be sold as a quality 5 to allow Davis to play the 4. |
They already have Asik off the bench on a large contract. They wouldn't add Mozgov (or any other team, I'm 99% sure) |
your likely right, but they were going to take on Dwights which was much larger....and Asik sucks, which is the root of the problem. |
Would anyone here do Asik and fillers for Mozgov?
Asik is cheaper than Mozgov which would give us more cap space this summer.
Asik could be our 3rd string center and allow Zubac and Black more playing time to develop. |
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kikanga Retired Number
Joined: 15 Sep 2012 Posts: 29150 Location: La La Land
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Posted: Wed Jan 18, 2017 1:03 pm Post subject: |
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We should all bring up salary and years whenever we propose Mozgov trade ideas.
The biggest problem with Mozgov isn't his production on the court. It's the length of his contract and the money spent. _________________ "Every hurt is a lesson, and every lesson makes you better” |
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justsomelakerfan Franchise Player
Joined: 16 Jul 2016 Posts: 10939
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Posted: Wed Jan 18, 2017 4:19 pm Post subject: |
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kikanga wrote: | We should all bring up salary and years whenever we propose Mozgov trade ideas.
The biggest problem with Mozgov isn't his production on the court. It's the length of his contract and the money spent. |
For sure. I totally respect that they went out and got Luke's guy. But get him within reason. _________________ Austin Reaves
Tweeter: @sarah_dotbiz |
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i'm not worthy Rookie
Joined: 19 May 2015 Posts: 12
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Posted: Wed Jan 18, 2017 4:47 pm Post subject: |
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I'm really not a fan of tanking, but how can the Lakers afford NOT to tank this year. If they don't make the bottom 3 (top 3 in draft terms), they will lose TWO first round draft picks over the next three years. Not to mention the PG talent coming out this year.
Trade Lou and Young. Also available: Deng, Mozgov, Randle, and Russell.
I wouldn't trade: Zubac, Ingram, Nance, Clarkson, Black |
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Laker's Fan Franchise Player
Joined: 27 Jun 2002 Posts: 12813
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Posted: Wed Jan 18, 2017 11:11 pm Post subject: |
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I wonder if LA could get traction with Portland on a Mozgov for Crabbe swap. He a 24 year old shooting guard from LA who was retained on a match of Brooklyn's offer. Next year Portland is in Tax hell before signing Plumlee. Ezili isn't looking like the insurance policy they were hoping.
Converting Crabbe's contract for a center allows Portland to cash in Plumlee in a deal for an asset while better managing their cap.
Crabbe has the same agent as Randle (and Russell).
Would potentially kill the max cap slot next year though as BRK inflicted a peak in his salary next year while LA scripted a dip in Mozgov's deal (making him that more interesting to Portland). _________________ Austin Reaves keeps his game tight, like Kobe Bryant on game night. |
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kikanga Retired Number
Joined: 15 Sep 2012 Posts: 29150 Location: La La Land
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Posted: Wed Jan 18, 2017 11:31 pm Post subject: |
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i'm not worthy wrote: | I'm really not a fan of tanking, but how can the Lakers afford NOT to tank this year. If they don't make the bottom 3 (top 3 in draft terms), they will lose TWO first round draft picks over the next three years. Not to mention the PG talent coming out this year.
Trade Lou and Young. Also available: Deng, Mozgov, Randle, and Russell.
I wouldn't trade: Zubac, Ingram, Nance, Clarkson, Black |
I've been thinking about that bolded point alot lately. And given our record the last 1/4 of the season, I'm getting pushed closer and closer to team tank each day.
But Nance isn't back, we could easily go on a winning streak when he returns.
The compromise is, give the young guys a ton of minutes. That way I can live with whatever happens.
I see 4 possible scenario's that I've organized from best to worst.
1) Play young guys a ton. Young guys figure out how to win games. Win 30+ games. Don't keep pick.
2) Play young guys a ton. They struggle to win games. Keep pick
3) Keep current rotation and roles. We struggle to win games. Keep pick
4) Keep current rotation and roles. Win 30+ games because of Lou and Young's hot shooting. Lose pick. _________________ "Every hurt is a lesson, and every lesson makes you better” |
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LaxT Star Player
Joined: 23 Sep 2002 Posts: 2536
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Posted: Wed Jan 18, 2017 11:50 pm Post subject: |
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i'm not worthy wrote: | I'm really not a fan of tanking, but how can the Lakers afford NOT to tank this year. If they don't make the bottom 3 (top 3 in draft terms), they will lose TWO first round draft picks over the next three years. Not to mention the PG talent coming out this year.
Trade Lou and Young. Also available: Deng, Mozgov, Randle, and Russell.
I wouldn't trade: Zubac, Ingram, Nance, Clarkson, Black |
Even if they do, nothing is guaranteed in lottery.
As to Mozgov, maybe for a bad but shorter contract. Or an equally bad contract but possibly better fit such as Evan Turner. |
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dcarter4kobe Franchise Player
Joined: 30 Jul 2005 Posts: 17656
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Posted: Wed Jan 18, 2017 11:57 pm Post subject: |
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I would possibly do an Asik for Mozgov deal. Saves 5m a year over the next 3. _________________ "He's a Zen master, so he can speak to you, and he doesn't need a microphone; you can hear him in your head, 'Ron, don't shoot, don't shoot.' Whatever, pow, three. I love the Zen, though." |
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activeverb Retired Number
Joined: 17 Jun 2006 Posts: 37470
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Posted: Thu Jan 19, 2017 12:07 am Post subject: |
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kikanga wrote: | i'm not worthy wrote: | I'm really not a fan of tanking, but how can the Lakers afford NOT to tank this year. If they don't make the bottom 3 (top 3 in draft terms), they will lose TWO first round draft picks over the next three years. Not to mention the PG talent coming out this year.
Trade Lou and Young. Also available: Deng, Mozgov, Randle, and Russell.
I wouldn't trade: Zubac, Ingram, Nance, Clarkson, Black |
I've been thinking about that bolded point alot lately. And given our record the last 1/4 of the season, I'm getting pushed closer and closer to team tank each day.
But Nance isn't back, we could easily go on a winning streak when he returns.
The compromise is, give the young guys a ton of minutes. That way I can live with whatever happens.
I see 4 possible scenario's that I've organized from best to worst.
1) Play young guys a ton. Young guys figure out how to win games. Win 30+ games. Don't keep pick.
2) Play young guys a ton. They struggle to win games. Keep pick
3) Keep current rotation and roles. We struggle to win games. Keep pick
4) Keep current rotation and roles. Win 30+ games because of Lou and Young's hot shooting. Lose pick. |
There are more scenarios. Even if we lost every single game from this point forward, we'd still have a one in three chance of not getting the pick. So you could tank, tear the team apart, and still have nothing to show from it.
On the bright side, winning 30 games doesn't automatically lose the pick, though the odds of keeping it decline with each win. |
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kikanga Retired Number
Joined: 15 Sep 2012 Posts: 29150 Location: La La Land
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Posted: Thu Jan 19, 2017 12:14 am Post subject: |
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activeverb wrote: | kikanga wrote: | i'm not worthy wrote: | I'm really not a fan of tanking, but how can the Lakers afford NOT to tank this year. If they don't make the bottom 3 (top 3 in draft terms), they will lose TWO first round draft picks over the next three years. Not to mention the PG talent coming out this year.
Trade Lou and Young. Also available: Deng, Mozgov, Randle, and Russell.
I wouldn't trade: Zubac, Ingram, Nance, Clarkson, Black |
I've been thinking about that bolded point alot lately. And given our record the last 1/4 of the season, I'm getting pushed closer and closer to team tank each day.
But Nance isn't back, we could easily go on a winning streak when he returns.
The compromise is, give the young guys a ton of minutes. That way I can live with whatever happens.
I see 4 possible scenario's that I've organized from best to worst.
1) Play young guys a ton. Young guys figure out how to win games. Win 30+ games. Don't keep pick.
2) Play young guys a ton. They struggle to win games. Keep pick
3) Keep current rotation and roles. We struggle to win games. Keep pick
4) Keep current rotation and roles. Win 30+ games because of Lou and Young's hot shooting. Lose pick. |
There are more scenarios. Even if we lost every single game from this point forward, we'd still have a one in three chance of not getting the pick. So you could tank, tear the team apart, and still have nothing to show from it.
On the bright side, winning 30 games doesn't automatically lose the pick, though the odds of keeping it decline with each win. |
I agree. My scenarios aren't the only 1. But as long as we are prioritizing the future, I can live with whatever happens with the pick. Riding Lou and Swaggy might win ya a couple games in this meaningless season. But I don't see it benefiting us much down the road when we have a more realistic chance to have playoff success. _________________ "Every hurt is a lesson, and every lesson makes you better” |
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Vesper Starting Rotation
Joined: 10 Dec 2016 Posts: 387
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Posted: Thu Jan 19, 2017 7:18 am Post subject: |
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Problem with trading Young and/or williams are they both have had exceptional seasons.
No guard on our team actually plays decent defense like Young and LouWill is the only guard that knows how to score when his shot isn't falling...
Trade them and it's a tank. |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Thu Jan 19, 2017 7:19 am Post subject: |
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Vesper wrote: | Problem with trading Young and/or williams are they both have had exceptional seasons.
No guard on our team actually plays decent defense like Young and LouWill is the only guard that knows how to score when his shot isn't falling...
Trade them and it's a tank. |
WITH them we're still massively losing 5-21 last 26. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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Vesper Starting Rotation
Joined: 10 Dec 2016 Posts: 387
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Posted: Thu Jan 19, 2017 7:22 am Post subject: |
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yinoma2001 wrote: | Vesper wrote: | Problem with trading Young and/or williams are they both have had exceptional seasons.
No guard on our team actually plays decent defense like Young and LouWill is the only guard that knows how to score when his shot isn't falling...
Trade them and it's a tank. |
WITH them we're still massively losing 5-21 last 26. |
Depends on the return but honestly, I dont think we can fetch much with either players....
Also, if Young leaves this summer and louwill gets traded and we lose our pick. WE ARE F |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Thu Jan 19, 2017 7:25 am Post subject: |
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Vesper wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | Vesper wrote: | Problem with trading Young and/or williams are they both have had exceptional seasons.
No guard on our team actually plays decent defense like Young and LouWill is the only guard that knows how to score when his shot isn't falling...
Trade them and it's a tank. |
WITH them we're still massively losing 5-21 last 26. |
Depends on the return but honestly, I dont think we can fetch much with either players....
Also, if Young leaves this summer and louwill gets traded and we lose our pick. WE ARE F |
No we are not.
If both leave, that's adding a lot more to our cap space, (my estimation would give us nearly 37m in cap space this summer). We'd get a 2nd rounder in 2017, and a 2018 1st rounder (and finally owe Orlando our pick in 2019). _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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Vesper Starting Rotation
Joined: 10 Dec 2016 Posts: 387
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Posted: Thu Jan 19, 2017 7:28 am Post subject: |
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yinoma2001 wrote: | Vesper wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | Vesper wrote: | Problem with trading Young and/or williams are they both have had exceptional seasons.
No guard on our team actually plays decent defense like Young and LouWill is the only guard that knows how to score when his shot isn't falling...
Trade them and it's a tank. |
WITH them we're still massively losing 5-21 last 26. |
Depends on the return but honestly, I dont think we can fetch much with either players....
Also, if Young leaves this summer and louwill gets traded and we lose our pick. WE ARE F |
No we are not.
If both leave, that's adding a lot more to our cap space, (my estimation would give us nearly 37m in cap space this summer). We'd get a 2nd rounder in 2017, and a 2018 1st rounder (and finally owe Orlando our pick in 2019). |
How are we not F.
We are winning games because of the second unit's intensity and our potent guard play. Take Young out, than JC will have to focus more on defending and the whole balance between offense and defense would get F up (including spacing). In addition, we would have no legit scorers on the bench than.
Unless, your plan is to tank again next year. |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Thu Jan 19, 2017 7:38 am Post subject: |
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Vesper wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | Vesper wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | Vesper wrote: | Problem with trading Young and/or williams are they both have had exceptional seasons.
No guard on our team actually plays decent defense like Young and LouWill is the only guard that knows how to score when his shot isn't falling...
Trade them and it's a tank. |
WITH them we're still massively losing 5-21 last 26. |
Depends on the return but honestly, I dont think we can fetch much with either players....
Also, if Young leaves this summer and louwill gets traded and we lose our pick. WE ARE F |
No we are not.
If both leave, that's adding a lot more to our cap space, (my estimation would give us nearly 37m in cap space this summer). We'd get a 2nd rounder in 2017, and a 2018 1st rounder (and finally owe Orlando our pick in 2019). |
How are we not F.
We are winning games because of the second unit's intensity and our potent guard play. Take Young out, than JC will have to focus more on defending and the whole balance between offense and defense would get F up (including spacing). In addition, we would have no legit scorers on the bench than.
Unless, your plan is to tank again next year. |
Again, 5-21 last 26, how exactly is the 2nd unit "winning" games right now?
You also act as if DLo/Jules/Ingram/Nance/Zub/JC, etc. would take another step forward next year. Armed with 37m in cap space, and Luke as the coach, I expect better FA signings in 2017. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Thu Jan 19, 2017 7:48 am Post subject: |
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For example, could come back next year with:
Jrue/Livingston
DLO/JC
Ingram/Deng
Randle/Nance
Moz/Zub
+ 2nd rounder
I think that's a much more improved team than what we have now. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Thu Jan 19, 2017 7:51 am Post subject: |
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Or:
DLO/Livingston
JC/Justin Holiday
Ingram/Deng
Randle/Nance
Ibaka/Zub/Moz
+ 2nd rounder
Having 37m in cap space gives us a chance to get a 7-9 year vet (i.e. Holiday or Ibaka) + useful veteran like Livingston (familiarity with Luke). _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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Vesper Starting Rotation
Joined: 10 Dec 2016 Posts: 387
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Posted: Thu Jan 19, 2017 7:59 am Post subject: |
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OR WE CAN SIGN MOZGOV AND DENG AGAIN |
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