Lakers Have the 5th Best Young Core (25 or Under)
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Jakanzi
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2017 11:49 am    Post subject:

ESPN Insider released their 25 under 25. Not sure what the rules are here with respect to that stuff, but someone posted the list to reddit: https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/5romu7/insider_top_25_under_25_which_young_nba_stars/

D'Lo is 15th, Ingram is 21st, Randle is 25th.

For individual writer rankings there's this comment: https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/5romu7/insider_top_25_under_25_which_young_nba_stars/dd8vpvr/

Thorpe is the only one high on the Lakers kids, though honestly his opinion is probably the one I respect the least here.

Pelton didn't have any of the Lakers ranked in his top 25
Elhassan had Russell 17th, others unranked
Thorpe had Russell 9th, Ingram 11th, Randle 14th
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yinoma2001
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2017 11:52 am    Post subject:

Jakanzi wrote:
ESPN Insider released their 25 under 25. Not sure what the rules are here with respect to that stuff, but someone posted the list to reddit: https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/5romu7/insider_top_25_under_25_which_young_nba_stars/

D'Lo is 15th, Ingram is 21st, Randle is 25th.

For individual writer rankings there's this comment: https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/5romu7/insider_top_25_under_25_which_young_nba_stars/dd8vpvr/

Thorpe is the only one high on the Lakers kids, though honestly his opinion is probably the one I respect the least here.

Pelton didn't have any of the Lakers ranked in his top 25
Elhassan had Russell 17th, others unranked
Thorpe had Russell 9th, Ingram 11th, Randle 14th


Thanks for posting. Wow, surprised Pelton didn't have any in the top 25 (at least DLO?).
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2017 11:52 am    Post subject:

Jakanzi wrote:
ESPN Insider released their 25 under 25. Not sure what the rules are here with respect to that stuff, but someone posted the list to reddit: https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/5romu7/insider_top_25_under_25_which_young_nba_stars/

D'Lo is 15th, Ingram is 21st, Randle is 25th.

For individual writer rankings there's this comment: https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/5romu7/insider_top_25_under_25_which_young_nba_stars/dd8vpvr/

Thorpe is the only one high on the Lakers kids, though honestly his opinion is probably the one I respect the least here.

Pelton didn't have any of the Lakers ranked in his top 25
Elhassan had Russell 17th, others unranked
Thorpe had Russell 9th, Ingram 11th, Randle 14th


I like this Thorpe fellow
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yinoma2001
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2017 11:55 am    Post subject:

Pelton's list is screwy. A bit too dependent on advanced stats?

Thorpe seems to have a scout's approach (though Elhassan was formerly a scout?).
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2017 11:57 am    Post subject:

yinoma2001 wrote:
Pelton's list is screwy. A bit too dependent on advanced stats?

Thorpe seems to have a scout's approach (though Elhassan was formerly a scout?).


WAS is the operative word here

Dude couldn't hack it and now acts god-status on tv.
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2017 11:58 am    Post subject:

Comments:

Quote:
15. D'Angelo Russell

Los Angeles Lakers
Guard
Age: 20

The league is trending to more athleticism, but Russell proves that feel, craft and skill will always have a place on the court. His versatility as a scorer and playmaker are greatly helped by his "never in a rush" mentality, making him ready more often to make the right play. Having great size for his position helps, too.

As with many players on this list, more experienced teammates will help his game grow immensely if his work ethic matches his talent. -- Thorpe


Quote:
21. Brandon Ingram

Los Angeles Lakers
Forward
Age: 19

Some players are 19 years old with the body of a fully grown man. Ingram is 19 but still carries a high school kid's physique. It's a mistake to think he will always be what he is now; as his body fills out, it won't be as great a hindrance to the impact of his length and skills.

Ingram can be expected to make perhaps the biggest jump in production going forward as he and his young teammates earn experience. -- Thorpe


Quote:
25. Julius Randle

Los Angeles Lakers
Forward
Age: 22

Randle is a good example of how a player can find success before he really masters skills by just competing very hard. His physique and skill set let him impact games with playmaking, scoring and rebounding. Few players have that potential.

He looks to be a little less skilled than famed Laker Lamar Odom, though he has a hotter motor and a similar game overall. The Lakers would be thrilled if Randle grew to that level, which is a distinct possibility. -- Thorpe

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yinoma2001
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2017 11:59 am    Post subject:

Overall, to have what is the 15, 21, and 25th best under 25 talents isn't a bad start. I think DLO/Ingram may take a few years to start hitting their stride so I think they climb up this ladder.

Obviously too early to tell about Zubac.

Yeah, didn't think JC (sorry Dave20) and Nance were top 25 under 25 material.
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tox
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2017 12:55 pm    Post subject:

yinoma2001 wrote:
Pelton's list is screwy. A bit too dependent on advanced stats?

Thorpe seems to have a scout's approach (though Elhassan was formerly a scout?).
Russell's advanced stats aren't bad though. I honestly don't know how you have 25 guys ahead of him.
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2017 1:20 pm    Post subject:

NO Zubac

not legit!
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yinoma2001
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2017 1:29 pm    Post subject:

tox wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
Pelton's list is screwy. A bit too dependent on advanced stats?

Thorpe seems to have a scout's approach (though Elhassan was formerly a scout?).
Russell's advanced stats aren't bad though. I honestly don't know how you have 25 guys ahead of him.


Fine. Pelton has a side chick and is enforcing the bro-code.
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TheBlackMamba
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2017 1:55 pm    Post subject:

yinoma2001 wrote:
tox wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
Pelton's list is screwy. A bit too dependent on advanced stats?

Thorpe seems to have a scout's approach (though Elhassan was formerly a scout?).
Russell's advanced stats aren't bad though. I honestly don't know how you have 25 guys ahead of him.


Fine. Pelton has a side chick and is enforcing the bro-code.


As discussed in the DLo thread yesterday, Pelton is one of those respectable, advanced stats-driven analysts who inexplicably is choosing to ignore what the stats are saying about DLo and instead going with the easy "Lakers suck and are doomed for eternity" angle. Even the ESPN stat geeks need hits, and what sells better than clowning the Lakers?
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2017 2:00 pm    Post subject:

I like the Randle to LO comparison, though. Eerily similar games (both the pros and the cons) and detached looks on their faces from time to time, just different body types. LO was definitely a better athlete and had the all-important length factor going for him, but it's still a great comparison.
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yinoma2001
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2017 2:05 pm    Post subject:

TheBlackMamba wrote:
I like the Randle to LO comparison, though. Eerily similar games (both the pros and the cons) and detached looks on their faces from time to time, just different body types. LO was definitely a better athlete and had the all-important length factor going for him, but it's still a great comparison.


I think both are products of the AAU system where certain fundamentals went wholly untaught/ignored b/c they were so talented.
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2017 2:08 pm    Post subject:

tox wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
Pelton's list is screwy. A bit too dependent on advanced stats?

Thorpe seems to have a scout's approach (though Elhassan was formerly a scout?).
Russell's advanced stats aren't bad though. I honestly don't know how you have 25 guys ahead of him.


Pelton's list is ridiculous.

11. Aaron Gordon
13. Otto Porter
16. Victor Oladipo
18. Kentavious Caldwell-Pope
20. Cody Zeller
22. Evan Fournier
25. Tobias Harris

I mean, some of these guys are solid players, sure. But top 25 under 25?
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2017 2:20 pm    Post subject:

yinoma2001 wrote:
TheBlackMamba wrote:
I like the Randle to LO comparison, though. Eerily similar games (both the pros and the cons) and detached looks on their faces from time to time, just different body types. LO was definitely a better athlete and had the all-important length factor going for him, but it's still a great comparison.


I think both are products of the AAU system where certain fundamentals went wholly untaught/ignored b/c they were so talented.


Yeah. I would be ecstatic if Jules lived up to that LO comparison, though. They do have different mentalities - LO was always content to be a super role player, and when we finally were able to let him play that role behind Kobe and Pau, he flourished and everyone loved him. The problem with Jules is that he came into the league with an alpha's mentality (not a bad thing), which is the opposite of LO, but the hope is that he recognizes he can be a much bigger contributor on a GOOD team if he embraces those super role player duties. And I use that term very loosely, since guys like that can actually be the MVPs of their teams, as we're arguably seeing with Dray and the Dubs.
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2017 10:45 pm    Post subject:

yinoma2001 wrote:
Overall, to have what is the 15, 21, and 25th best under 25 talents isn't a bad start.


It is if you place it within the context of where they were drafted. 2 players at the number 2 pick. One at number 7. They need to hit some home runs with their draft picks just to get on the right path to a potential title contender level. They're very far behind.
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2017 10:51 pm    Post subject:

Pelton's very smart but he lost me here. It was maybe 2 weeks ago or so that he had DLO listed at 5 in his rankings for best prospects from the 2015 draft. However, I also think Thorpe's rankings were funky across the board.
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2017 11:16 pm    Post subject:

TheBlackMamba wrote:
tox wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
Pelton's list is screwy. A bit too dependent on advanced stats?

Thorpe seems to have a scout's approach (though Elhassan was formerly a scout?).
Russell's advanced stats aren't bad though. I honestly don't know how you have 25 guys ahead of him.


Pelton's list is ridiculous.

11. Aaron Gordon
13. Otto Porter
16. Victor Oladipo
18. Kentavious Caldwell-Pope
20. Cody Zeller
22. Evan Fournier
25. Tobias Harris

I mean, some of these guys are solid players, sure. But top 25 under 25?


Yeah this is ridiculous. Like if you're an advanced stats guy, half these dudes don't have arguments over Russell. That's not including age / growth potential.
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2017 11:16 pm    Post subject:

TheBlackMamba wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
TheBlackMamba wrote:
I like the Randle to LO comparison, though. Eerily similar games (both the pros and the cons) and detached looks on their faces from time to time, just different body types. LO was definitely a better athlete and had the all-important length factor going for him, but it's still a great comparison.


I think both are products of the AAU system where certain fundamentals went wholly untaught/ignored b/c they were so talented.


Yeah. I would be ecstatic if Jules lived up to that LO comparison, though. They do have different mentalities - LO was always content to be a super role player, and when we finally were able to let him play that role behind Kobe and Pau, he flourished and everyone loved him. The problem with Jules is that he came into the league with an alpha's mentality (not a bad thing), which is the opposite of LO, but the hope is that he recognizes he can be a much bigger contributor on a GOOD team if he embraces those super role player duties. And I use that term very loosely, since guys like that can actually be the MVPs of their teams, as we're arguably seeing with Dray and the Dubs.



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PostPosted: Fri Feb 03, 2017 6:07 am    Post subject:

LAkers 4 Life wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
Overall, to have what is the 15, 21, and 25th best under 25 talents isn't a bad start.


It is if you place it within the context of where they were drafted. 2 players at the number 2 pick. One at number 7. They need to hit some home runs with their draft picks just to get on the right path to a potential title contender level. They're very far behind.


We picked 2 players who aren't physically there yet (DLO/Ingram) and will likely blossom in a year or two (DLO is closer right now).
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 03, 2017 9:32 pm    Post subject:

Randle and Russell have improved a lot this year. And Ingram is also getting better and better as the season progress. They were all projects while they were drafted.
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 01, 2017 1:10 am    Post subject: Re: Lakers Have the 5th Best Young Core (25 or Under)

yinoma2001 wrote:
I made a post about a year ago concerning young emerging cores (I couldnít find it in the archives). So, now that we have a bit of more information, letís compare some young cores (age 25 or under). Hereís how Iíve rated them:

1. Minny: KAT, Dunn, Wiggins, Jones, Lavine, Muhammad
2. 76ers: Embiid, Simmons, Saric, Noel, Okafor, TLC, Stauskas
3. Bucks: Giannis, Brogdon, Thon, Middleton, Parker, Snell
4. Jazz: Exum, Favors, Gobert, Hood, Lyles
5. Lakers: DLO, Ingram, Jules, JC, Nance, Zubac
6. Nuggets: Harris, Jokic, Nurkic, Mudiay, Murray
7. Suns: Bender, Booker, Chriss, Knight, Len, Warren
8. OKC: Adams, Abrines, Grant, Oladipo, Payne, Sabonis
9. Knicks: Hernangomez, Porky
10. Magic: Biyombo, Fournier, Gordon, Hezonja, Payton

Top 3 IMO are certainly any combination of Minny, 76ers, and Bucks. Bucks have the all-star, Minny has 2 ROY winners, and the 76ers have the likely current ROY (plus several lottery picks this year). The Jazz have some excellent player too. Lakers/Nuggets are probably close together, with Jokic currently being the best player out of the two teams.

Lakers have the 5th best young core under 25. Is that good enough to build on?


Do you still think Minny/76ers/Bucks have superior young players than us, as a team?

Russell
Clarkson
Ingram
Randle, Nance
Zubac, Black

What's a balance team full of potential! Russell, Ingram, Randle and maybe Zubac maybe all star someday
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Yong
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 01, 2017 2:08 am    Post subject: Re: Lakers Have the 5th Best Young Core (25 or Under)

Sina wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
I made a post about a year ago concerning young emerging cores (I couldnít find it in the archives). So, now that we have a bit of more information, letís compare some young cores (age 25 or under). Hereís how Iíve rated them:

1. Minny: KAT, Dunn, Wiggins, Jones, Lavine, Muhammad
2. 76ers: Embiid, Simmons, Saric, Noel, Okafor, TLC, Stauskas
3. Bucks: Giannis, Brogdon, Thon, Middleton, Parker, Snell
4. Jazz: Exum, Favors, Gobert, Hood, Lyles
5. Lakers: DLO, Ingram, Jules, JC, Nance, Zubac
6. Nuggets: Harris, Jokic, Nurkic, Mudiay, Murray
7. Suns: Bender, Booker, Chriss, Knight, Len, Warren
8. OKC: Adams, Abrines, Grant, Oladipo, Payne, Sabonis
9. Knicks: Hernangomez, Porky
10. Magic: Biyombo, Fournier, Gordon, Hezonja, Payton

Top 3 IMO are certainly any combination of Minny, 76ers, and Bucks. Bucks have the all-star, Minny has 2 ROY winners, and the 76ers have the likely current ROY (plus several lottery picks this year). The Jazz have some excellent player too. Lakers/Nuggets are probably close together, with Jokic currently being the best player out of the two teams.

Lakers have the 5th best young core under 25. Is that good enough to build on?


Do you still think Minny/76ers/Bucks have superior young players than us, as a team?

Russell
Clarkson
Ingram
Randle, Nance
Zubac, Black

What's a balance team full of potential! Russell, Ingram, Randle and maybe Zubac maybe all star someday


A way to look at Bucks' situation, is that their talent level has plateaued (although they have the surest thing to a superstar on hand), whereas Lakers and 76ers are poised to add even more talent
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 01, 2017 5:06 am    Post subject:

By the end of this season the overall opinion of our young squad is going to be trending upwards by alot. This final stretch is where DLO,BI,Randle really show their worth. Clarkson/Zu/Nance will also shine
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 01, 2017 11:49 pm    Post subject:

Embiid is out for the season again. That guy just cannot stay healthy. Great player when he's on the court playing, but injuries are going to hamper him throughout his career. Not sure how great of an asset he is if you cannot depend on him to stay on the court.

Also sucks that we won't get to see Ben Simmons this season. Was really looking forward to watching him play.
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