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Lakerpark Star Player
Joined: 09 Nov 2002 Posts: 2117
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Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2017 7:27 am Post subject: Moz and Deng to the pine... |
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I'm glad it finally happened. Neither of them deserved starting let alone significant playing time.
I don't care that they got the big contracts, that's done, but why compound it by letting their mediocre play drag the team down.
So they gave the Young'uns some time to ease into the bigger minutes, now it's time for them to ride the bench unless they can contribute more.
I am especially disappointed with Deng as I was expecting someone who could at least hit open shots. Moz hasn't done much either with has clumsy hands, inability to dunk and make easy close in shots.
If the Lakers wanted them to give veteran guidance, they can do it from the bench like MWP does.
MWP, Moz, Deng, Calderon, it's too bad the Lakers wasted so many spots on ineffective over the hill veterans. I could see keeping one but four?
Time for the Young'uns to show what they got. |
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Laker7 Star Player
Joined: 24 Feb 2003 Posts: 6401 Location: Past left field
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Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2017 7:39 am Post subject: |
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Lakers definitely showed more energy especially on the defensive end with Moz and Deng on the bench. I hope that continues in games going forward.
We have need to give Zubac minutes for a while and he is definitely contributing off the bench. Good place for him to start rather that throwing him to wolves in the starting line up. _________________ Darvin Ham is an idiot! |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2017 7:43 am Post subject: |
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This will be Luke's first big test. How to manage Moz (more so than Deng IMO) and his possible DNP-CDs.
Will the Lakers move Black so that Zub/Moz takes the minutes (and Nance/Randle take small ball minute)? That way Moz could get 10 mpg. But yeah, pretty disappointing that we dropped this much on Moz. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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oldschool32 Franchise Player
Joined: 24 Jun 2005 Posts: 20032
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Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2017 7:45 am Post subject: |
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I know is beating a dead horse, but there was no need to give out 4 year deals to 30+ mediocre role players.
They could have signed one if those guys to the same contract that they got and it would have kept some flexibility for the team going forward. Hopefully, for one reason or another, one of the contracts becomes tradeable. Either way, it's all about the young guys now. _________________ "It's just a job. Grass grows, birds fly, waves pound the sand. I beat people up."-The Greatest |
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governator Retired Number
Joined: 28 Jan 2006 Posts: 25092
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Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2017 7:49 am Post subject: |
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yinoma2001 wrote: | This will be Luke's first big test. How to manage Moz (more so than Deng IMO) and his possible DNP-CDs.
Will the Lakers move Black so that Zub/Moz takes the minutes (and Nance/Randle take small ball minute)? That way Moz could get 10 mpg. But yeah, pretty disappointing that we dropped this much on Moz. |
Big contract smooths the DNP-CDs, who knows, maybe it was discussed during contract negotiation that this might happen and that's why the price was high |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2017 7:50 am Post subject: |
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governator wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | This will be Luke's first big test. How to manage Moz (more so than Deng IMO) and his possible DNP-CDs.
Will the Lakers move Black so that Zub/Moz takes the minutes (and Nance/Randle take small ball minute)? That way Moz could get 10 mpg. But yeah, pretty disappointing that we dropped this much on Moz. |
Big contract smooths the DNP-CDs, who knows, maybe it was discussed during contract negotiation that this might happen and that's why the price was high |
With Deng I'm pretty sure he knew that Ingram would take over one day. Moz? Pretty sure he thought he'd be manning the starting spot for a few years. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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governator Retired Number
Joined: 28 Jan 2006 Posts: 25092
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Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2017 7:52 am Post subject: |
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yinoma2001 wrote: | governator wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | This will be Luke's first big test. How to manage Moz (more so than Deng IMO) and his possible DNP-CDs.
Will the Lakers move Black so that Zub/Moz takes the minutes (and Nance/Randle take small ball minute)? That way Moz could get 10 mpg. But yeah, pretty disappointing that we dropped this much on Moz. |
Big contract smooths the DNP-CDs, who knows, maybe it was discussed during contract negotiation that this might happen and that's why the price was high |
With Deng I'm pretty sure he knew that Ingram would take over one day. Moz? Pretty sure he thought he'd be manning the starting spot for a few years. |
Well, he's already reminiscing about Cleveland |
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adkindo Retired Number
Joined: 16 Jun 2005 Posts: 40345 Location: Dirty South
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Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2017 7:55 am Post subject: |
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governator wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | This will be Luke's first big test. How to manage Moz (more so than Deng IMO) and his possible DNP-CDs.
Will the Lakers move Black so that Zub/Moz takes the minutes (and Nance/Randle take small ball minute)? That way Moz could get 10 mpg. But yeah, pretty disappointing that we dropped this much on Moz. |
Big contract smooths the DNP-CDs, who knows, maybe it was discussed during contract negotiation that this might happen and that's why the price was high |
I would hope if the FO thought this may happen, they would not have offered them those stupid contracts. |
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dcarter4kobe Franchise Player
Joined: 30 Jul 2005 Posts: 17679
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Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2017 7:55 am Post subject: |
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yinoma2001 wrote: | governator wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | This will be Luke's first big test. How to manage Moz (more so than Deng IMO) and his possible DNP-CDs.
Will the Lakers move Black so that Zub/Moz takes the minutes (and Nance/Randle take small ball minute)? That way Moz could get 10 mpg. But yeah, pretty disappointing that we dropped this much on Moz. |
Big contract smooths the DNP-CDs, who knows, maybe it was discussed during contract negotiation that this might happen and that's why the price was high |
With Deng I'm pretty sure he knew that Ingram would take over one day. Moz? Pretty sure he thought he'd be manning the starting spot for a few years. |
Probably what went into that brief convo he had with Luke before signing. Moz didn't want a repeat of what happened last year with the Cavs again.
But reality is the NBA is passing the Mozgov types by and his production has fallen off. At least he was able to get paid from his POV. He would be lucky to get the MLE if he was a FA after this season. _________________ "He's a Zen master, so he can speak to you, and he doesn't need a microphone; you can hear him in your head, 'Ron, don't shoot, don't shoot.' Whatever, pow, three. I love the Zen, though." |
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blackmamba08 Star Player
Joined: 09 Jun 2015 Posts: 2608 Location: Croatia
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Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2017 8:02 am Post subject: |
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I am not that much disappointed with Mozgov. I was expecting exactly this and I don't have a clue why people are so surprised. Just look at his numbers before. He is doing the same like before. The other thing is that we overpaid that.
Deng on the other hand is just finished athlete and awful player at the moment. I am truly disappointed with him. Deng is disaster for us compering his contract and contribution on the both sides of the floor. |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2017 8:02 am Post subject: |
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dcarter4kobe wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | governator wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | This will be Luke's first big test. How to manage Moz (more so than Deng IMO) and his possible DNP-CDs.
Will the Lakers move Black so that Zub/Moz takes the minutes (and Nance/Randle take small ball minute)? That way Moz could get 10 mpg. But yeah, pretty disappointing that we dropped this much on Moz. |
Big contract smooths the DNP-CDs, who knows, maybe it was discussed during contract negotiation that this might happen and that's why the price was high |
With Deng I'm pretty sure he knew that Ingram would take over one day. Moz? Pretty sure he thought he'd be manning the starting spot for a few years. |
Probably what went into that brief convo he had with Luke before signing. Moz didn't want a repeat of what happened last year with the Cavs again.
But reality is the NBA is passing the Mozgov types by and his production has fallen off. At least he was able to get paid from his POV. He would be lucky to get the MLE if he was a FA after this season. |
You know I wasn't happy about it, but it's beating a dead horse. I'm more interested looking forward, what Luke will do with this situation. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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dcarter4kobe Franchise Player
Joined: 30 Jul 2005 Posts: 17679
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Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2017 8:04 am Post subject: |
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^ point was Luke probably promised Mozgov he would have a prominent role on this team when they briefly talked before Moz agreed. _________________ "He's a Zen master, so he can speak to you, and he doesn't need a microphone; you can hear him in your head, 'Ron, don't shoot, don't shoot.' Whatever, pow, three. I love the Zen, though." |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2017 8:05 am Post subject: |
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dcarter4kobe wrote: | ^ point was Luke probably promised Mozgov he would have a prominent role on this team when they briefly talked before Moz agreed. |
And if so, he has his hands full with this situation. FO will need to work with Luke/Moz too to not make this all fall in Luke's hands. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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dcarter4kobe Franchise Player
Joined: 30 Jul 2005 Posts: 17679
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Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2017 8:07 am Post subject: |
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yinoma2001 wrote: | dcarter4kobe wrote: | ^ point was Luke probably promised Mozgov he would have a prominent role on this team when they briefly talked before Moz agreed. |
And if so, he has his hands full with this situation. FO will need to work with Luke/Moz too to not make this all fall in Luke's hands. |
Found it,
http://www.lakersnation.com/timofey-mozgov-conversation-with-luke-walton-was-key-to-signing-with-lakers/2016/07/01/ _________________ "He's a Zen master, so he can speak to you, and he doesn't need a microphone; you can hear him in your head, 'Ron, don't shoot, don't shoot.' Whatever, pow, three. I love the Zen, though." |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2017 8:09 am Post subject: |
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Yikes. That's going to get awkward. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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dcarter4kobe Franchise Player
Joined: 30 Jul 2005 Posts: 17679
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Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2017 8:11 am Post subject: |
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"“He said I’m going to play a lot,” Mozgov repeated. “He said I’m going to be a big part of the team on the offensive and defensive end.”"
http://www.ocregister.com/articles/mozgov-721473-lakers-going.html _________________ "He's a Zen master, so he can speak to you, and he doesn't need a microphone; you can hear him in your head, 'Ron, don't shoot, don't shoot.' Whatever, pow, three. I love the Zen, though." |
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lakerjoshua Franchise Player
Joined: 28 Nov 2007 Posts: 11277 Location: Bay Area
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Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2017 8:12 am Post subject: |
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I think Moz and Deng are not a good fit for our system. However, I don't think they are completely useless if they were playing in a slower more methodical half court offense, hence have some trade value. |
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governator Retired Number
Joined: 28 Jan 2006 Posts: 25092
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Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2017 8:14 am Post subject: |
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He has been but we youth tanking now |
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adkindo Retired Number
Joined: 16 Jun 2005 Posts: 40345 Location: Dirty South
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Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2017 8:14 am Post subject: |
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lakerjoshua wrote: | I think Moz and Deng are not a good fit for our system. However, I don't think they are completely useless if they were playing in a slower more methodical half court offense, hence have some trade value. |
wink wink.....I could explain to the other 29 teams in the league how they would be the perfect fit for them... |
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lewis Star Player
Joined: 23 Oct 2013 Posts: 1165
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Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2017 8:18 am Post subject: |
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Love the change |
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Goldenwest Star Player
Joined: 28 Nov 2009 Posts: 2802
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Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2017 8:36 am Post subject: |
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Mozgov and Deng are victims of circumstance. I think they're still good players. They just don't fit with the system Luke has in place, which is guard heavy and fast paced. Somebody blew it giving these guys huge contracts, hence, Magic's hiring. We would've been better off bringing Pau back, at least he could really help mentor the guys and would finish his career with the lakers and mend fences - which would help repair the lakers Image. |
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HumanVictoryCigar Star Player
Joined: 28 Apr 2014 Posts: 7601
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Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2017 8:47 am Post subject: |
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my impression was we went after Mozgov mostly because of Brian Shaw's recommendation - which Luke, as a brand new coach, may have overvalued Shaw's opinion - at the time, believing Mozgov could become more than he had been before.
I've been surprised how crappy Mozgov's hands are, he's cost a lot of guys a lot of assists with his fumbling and point blank misses. I would have to assume... this has been a surprise for Luke as well, as a major part of Mozgov's offense - as well as Luke selling him on coming here and getting a lot of playing time, would have involved him being a threat to roll towards the basket. |
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av3773 Star Player
Joined: 11 Dec 2011 Posts: 3751
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Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2017 9:00 am Post subject: |
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I'm still fine with the signings....we didn't know how fast the younger guys were going to develop and adding 2 solid vets to the locker room was a good idea.
Sure in hindsight we can now see the younger guys are likely going to move into the starting spots sooner than later, but it was hard to know going in, especially for a player like Zubac.
I also don't see their benching being a big issue. Why not rest these older guys, bring them in against the opposing bench, might as well keep their mileage down this year. In the summer they'll still push BI and Zubac for taking the leading roles. Year 3 and 4 sure we're eating that a bit, but it is what it is.
With that said if you could trade either before those deals expire you do it, but I still don't see it as the worst thing |
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lakerjoshua Franchise Player
Joined: 28 Nov 2007 Posts: 11277 Location: Bay Area
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Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2017 9:03 am Post subject: |
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adkindo wrote: | lakerjoshua wrote: | I think Moz and Deng are not a good fit for our system. However, I don't think they are completely useless if they were playing in a slower more methodical half court offense, hence have some trade value. |
wink wink.....I could explain to the other 29 teams in the league how they would be the perfect fit for them... |
Haha idk about 29 other teams but I'm sure there's 2 or 3 |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2017 9:03 am Post subject: |
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The saving grace...i.e. the way I'm coping with this, is their replacements (Ingram and Zub) are going to be on rookie (and cheap) deals for basically the same time period as their large contracts. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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