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Inspector Gadget
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 Posted: Fri Feb 10, 2017 12:58 pm Post subject: |
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| I think Lakers will find a way to see if Mozgov has a place with this team, they found a way to get rid of Luke when he had a big contract im sure the FO can find a way ..if they are willing to part ways with Moz. |
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999
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| Posted: Fri Feb 10, 2017 12:59 pm Post subject: |
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| Dr. Funkbot wrote: | Mitch- Great at drafting, TERRIBLE with free agency.
Keep the scouting in place and send Mitch packing. Too many miscues, I agree they should be a fire-able offense. Bazemore, Thomas, Lowry, Ed Davis- these players or at leas some of them should be Lakers now.
I can't believe you would wait around for Carmelo or LMA and let good cheap players with upside walk. Deng and Moz contracts are icing on the cake. He needs to go. |
We got Malone Payton and gasol under Mitch. 3 future hall of famers |
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Gimme_the_rock
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| Posted: Fri Feb 10, 2017 1:00 pm Post subject: |
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Mozgov is only just beginning.
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Krispy Kreme
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| Posted: Fri Feb 10, 2017 1:06 pm Post subject: |
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he was a piss poor signing considering the money and especially the years.
but jim's apologists will go down the "well, who else were we going to get if not mozgov?" route. great logic. sign players to bad deals as opposed to doing nothing.
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Dr. Funkbot
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| Posted: Fri Feb 10, 2017 1:12 pm Post subject: |
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| Krispy Kreme wrote: | he was a piss poor signing considering the money and especially the years.
but jim's apologists will go down the "well, who else were we going to get if not mozgov?" route. great logic. sign players to bad deals as opposed to doing nothing. |
I went through the stages of dealing with grief over this contract. On the face I was instantly pissed off. I mean the guy was benched and his team did better. Small ball, ect. I hoped there would be a team option for one of the years.
But then I tried to convince myself that he was a good screen setter, pick and roll finisher and had a high BBall IQ. And that Luke wanted him, so I tried to justify it. I mean he is a Laker, so I want to root for the guy.
But heck, the wheels are off the cart now. I am back to my original position. This was a terrible signing. No way to justify it.
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Krispy Kreme
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| Posted: Fri Feb 10, 2017 1:16 pm Post subject: |
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some will try (and fail) to justify it. just watch. glad you aren't a homer and realized it wasn't a good signing. i wish i could be proven wrong, but it was a bad signing.
he's one of those players who is a missing link to an already good team. for example, i think he'd be solid/serviceable in SA, GSW, etc.
on those great teams, he would just be asked to set a few screens for star players and block a shot for 5-10 mpg. that's all he's worth. he's worthless on a rebuilding team.
but i could be wrong.. maybe he's not even capable of that
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ahaider
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| Posted: Fri Feb 10, 2017 1:20 pm Post subject: |
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Most moves made of impulsitivity or fear are the wrong ones. We freaked out and overpaid out of desperation, pressure, fear one of the following.
I agree that Mitch maybe nearing the end of his gm role. I agree Mozgov is a bad signing. But the guy can evaluate talent. He's shown prudence in trades and drafting.
Signing FA's has been where they've failed. Mozgov is an example.
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Dr. Funkbot
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| Posted: Fri Feb 10, 2017 1:25 pm Post subject: |
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| 999 wrote: | | Dr. Funkbot wrote: | Mitch- Great at drafting, TERRIBLE with free agency.
Keep the scouting in place and send Mitch packing. Too many miscues, I agree they should be a fire-able offense. Bazemore, Thomas, Lowry, Ed Davis- these players or at leas some of them should be Lakers now.
I can't believe you would wait around for Carmelo or LMA and let good cheap players with upside walk. Deng and Moz contracts are icing on the cake. He needs to go. |
We got Malone Payton and gasol under Mitch. 3 future hall of famers |
Oh yeah, no doubt. The Ariza trade too and drafting Bynum, trading Bynum, getting Pau, drafting Marc.
Mitch has done wonders and I have been a loyal supporter of his since 2000. I have recently had to reconsider my support though. The game has changed and Mitch has not. We need a GM who is a better communicator and can make decisions more quickly.
It is about due diligence. If the rest of the league is sending out feelers however they do it to agents prior to the free agency period and Mitch is not it explains so much. It explains why he thought he had a chance at Carmelo ect. and why we missed out on some good signings while waiting for big stars who had no intention of coming here.
We can not continue to operate at a disadvantage when it comes to FA signings. Maybe if Mitch had reached out Mozgov's people earlier he would not have offered him such a ridiculous contract.
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fansincemagic
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| Posted: Fri Feb 10, 2017 2:29 pm Post subject: Re: Is this the end for Mozgov as a Laker? |
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| Inspector Gadget wrote: | | I'm not aware of Luke sitting him temporary.. and he looks healthy. I'm in support of giving Zu a chance, but not playing your high priced FA is not a good look in future negotiations with FA players.. no matter how he looks he needs to play and find a way to contribute to the team. |
It's too early but a FA could see it more as respecting a coach that sits a golly that isn't pulling his weight. Really though we worry too much about their feelings, he knows it's a bisiness. He too LA monopoly money while Cleveland was in his heart. If they literally fired him (won't happen) and he signed with the cavs he'd likely kiss Mitch on the lips and name a kid after Jerry. |
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Inspector Gadget
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| Posted: Fri Feb 10, 2017 2:34 pm Post subject: Re: Is this the end for Mozgov as a Laker? |
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| fansincemagic wrote: | | Inspector Gadget wrote: | | I'm not aware of Luke sitting him temporary.. and he looks healthy. I'm in support of giving Zu a chance, but not playing your high priced FA is not a good look in future negotiations with FA players.. no matter how he looks he needs to play and find a way to contribute to the team. |
It's too early but a FA could see it more as respecting a coach that sits a golly that isn't pulling his weight. Really though we worry too much about their feelings, he knows it's a bisiness. He too LA monopoly money while Cleveland was in his heart. If they literally fired him (won't happen) and he signed with the cavs he'd likely kiss Mitch on the lips and name a kid after Jerry. |
Link that Mozgov had or has his heart set in Cleveland? |
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Rawr
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| Posted: Fri Feb 10, 2017 6:12 pm Post subject: |
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I'm truly baffled by this and the Deng contracts. I honestly don't want to believe that either Mitch or Jim or Luke thought these guys would help us win a single game, let alone be worth the enormous salaries we gave them.
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SuperboyReformed
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| Posted: Fri Feb 10, 2017 9:04 pm Post subject: |
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you guys gotta chill. they are not bad players. haven't we learned by now that when the team plays bad, we trash everyone...except chickie and jerry.
you guys were way more down on nick and lou before the season. when we really start playing well, mozgov and deng will be fine. its possible some of you are only used to this season of their play...mozgov and deng have several provable good years, and not just good, very reliable and solid. So if they play bad or look bad, that's just the state of the team.
different teams make players different. Pau is very different on spain than with kobe. Nobody would ever use the term ga-soft if they only saw him on spain. |
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Inspector Gadget
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| Posted: Fri Feb 10, 2017 9:08 pm Post subject: |
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| SuperboyReformed wrote: | you guys gotta chill. they are not bad players. haven't we learned by now that when the team plays bad, we trash everyone...except chickie and jerry.
you guys were way more down on nick and lou before the season. when we really start playing well, mozgov and deng will be fine. its possible some of you are only used to this season of their play...mozgov and deng have several provable good years, and not just good, very reliable and solid. So if they play bad or look bad, that's just the state of the team.
different teams make players different. Pau is very different on spain than with kobe. Nobody would ever use the term ga-soft if they only saw him on spain. |
I have supported both of them if you see my posts this season countless times but the whining makes me hope both are traded, it just doesn't seem right to have players .. fans can't appreciate cause these guys are trying there best. |
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dcarter4kobe
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| Posted: Fri Feb 10, 2017 9:18 pm Post subject: |
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| Rawr wrote: | | I'm truly baffled by this and the Deng contracts. I honestly don't want to believe that either Mitch or Jim or Luke thought these guys would help us win a single game, let alone be worth the enormous salaries we gave them. |
A lot of LG did too. A few knew these 2 wouldn't move the needle much if at all
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activeverb
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| Posted: Fri Feb 10, 2017 10:03 pm Post subject: Re: Is this the end for Mozgov as a Laker? |
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| Inspector Gadget wrote: | | fansincemagic wrote: | | Inspector Gadget wrote: | | I'm not aware of Luke sitting him temporary.. and he looks healthy. I'm in support of giving Zu a chance, but not playing your high priced FA is not a good look in future negotiations with FA players.. no matter how he looks he needs to play and find a way to contribute to the team. |
It's too early but a FA could see it more as respecting a coach that sits a golly that isn't pulling his weight. Really though we worry too much about their feelings, he knows it's a bisiness. He too LA monopoly money while Cleveland was in his heart. If they literally fired him (won't happen) and he signed with the cavs he'd likely kiss Mitch on the lips and name a kid after Jerry. |
Link that Mozgov had or has his heart set in Cleveland? |
I don't know about Cleveland, but I am sure he and all the other vets would rather be on a contender. He came here first and foremost for the money. |
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activeverb
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| Posted: Fri Feb 10, 2017 10:10 pm Post subject: |
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| SuperboyReformed wrote: | you guys gotta chill. they are not bad players. haven't we learned by now that when the team plays bad, we trash everyone...except chickie and jerry.
you guys were way more down on nick and lou before the season. when we really start playing well, mozgov and deng will be fine. its possible some of you are only used to this season of their play...mozgov and deng have several provable good years, and not just good, very reliable and solid. So if they play bad or look bad, that's just the state of the team.
different teams make players different. Pau is very different on spain than with kobe. Nobody would ever use the term ga-soft if they only saw him on spain. |
Actually, Mosgov isn't doing that far off his norms. This is just what he is. He might do a little better but nothing dramatic. He's not going to turn into a way better player just because he got a ton of money.
Deng is more concerning. The issue with him is he really needs to play PF on a slower paced team to be effective now. |
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lukewaltonsdad
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| Posted: Fri Feb 10, 2017 10:22 pm Post subject: |
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The DNP's will get to him eventually; I'm just unsure of his trade value around the league right now.
This might have to be a matter we deal with in the summer. |
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tox
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| Posted: Fri Feb 10, 2017 10:24 pm Post subject: |
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| activeverb wrote: | | SuperboyReformed wrote: | you guys gotta chill. they are not bad players. haven't we learned by now that when the team plays bad, we trash everyone...except chickie and jerry.
you guys were way more down on nick and lou before the season. when we really start playing well, mozgov and deng will be fine. its possible some of you are only used to this season of their play...mozgov and deng have several provable good years, and not just good, very reliable and solid. So if they play bad or look bad, that's just the state of the team.
different teams make players different. Pau is very different on spain than with kobe. Nobody would ever use the term ga-soft if they only saw him on spain. |
Actually, Mosgov isn't doing that far off his norms. This is just what he is. He might do a little better but nothing dramatic. He's not going to turn into a way better player just because he got a ton of money.
Deng is more concerning. The issue with him is he really needs to play PF on a slower paced team to be effective now. |
I've posted before but Moz was extremely effective as a role player in 2014-2015. That included covering for Irving and Love at the 1&4 so it's not just a matter of playing with better defensive personnel (though having LeBron on the perimeter helps).
Forget the counting stats, I want the guy who posted Top-4 DRPM for a center, provided top-5 rim protection, and transformed the Cavs' defense en route to them finishing the season 39-3 or something with him.
edit: added a D
Last edited by tox on Fri Feb 10, 2017 11:06 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Krispy Kreme
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| Posted: Fri Feb 10, 2017 10:37 pm Post subject: |
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Like I said , he can be decent on a good or great team that has a good defensive scheme as it is . Not with a young , rebuilding team.
And people kept saying that after we got him... that he was solid in the finals without Kevin love. That was 2 years ago. He since got a serious knee injury and almost contributed zero in the previous finals.
Stupid signing.
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activeverb
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| Posted: Fri Feb 10, 2017 10:46 pm Post subject: |
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| tox wrote: | | activeverb wrote: | | SuperboyReformed wrote: | you guys gotta chill. they are not bad players. haven't we learned by now that when the team plays bad, we trash everyone...except chickie and jerry.
you guys were way more down on nick and lou before the season. when we really start playing well, mozgov and deng will be fine. its possible some of you are only used to this season of their play...mozgov and deng have several provable good years, and not just good, very reliable and solid. So if they play bad or look bad, that's just the state of the team.
different teams make players different. Pau is very different on spain than with kobe. Nobody would ever use the term ga-soft if they only saw him on spain. |
Actually, Mosgov isn't doing that far off his norms. This is just what he is. He might do a little better but nothing dramatic. He's not going to turn into a way better player just because he got a ton of money.
Deng is more concerning. The issue with him is he really needs to play PF on a slower paced team to be effective now. |
I've posted before but Moz was extremely effective as a role player in 2014-2015. That included covering for Irving and Love at the 1&4 so it's not just a matter of playing with better defensive personnel (though having LeBron on the perimeter helps).
Forget the counting stats, I want the guy who posted Top-4 RPM for a center, provided top-5 rim protection, and transformed the Cavs' defense en route to them finishing the season 39-3 or something with him. |
That was his career year to date and I wasn't expecting him to replicate it. But a lot of his success, offensively and defensively, was having the right complement of players around him. I think of him as a guy who can be raised by his teammates; but he's not going to raise a team. |
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dcarter4kobe
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| Posted: Fri Feb 10, 2017 10:49 pm Post subject: |
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Even that finals series Mozgov was dominating, he ended up being benched.
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"He's a Zen master, so he can speak to you, and he doesn't need a microphone; you can hear him in your head, 'Ron, don't shoot, don't shoot.' Whatever, pow, three. I love the Zen, though." |
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Baron Von Humongous
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| Posted: Fri Feb 10, 2017 10:57 pm Post subject: |
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| tox wrote: | | activeverb wrote: | | SuperboyReformed wrote: | you guys gotta chill. they are not bad players. haven't we learned by now that when the team plays bad, we trash everyone...except chickie and jerry.
you guys were way more down on nick and lou before the season. when we really start playing well, mozgov and deng will be fine. its possible some of you are only used to this season of their play...mozgov and deng have several provable good years, and not just good, very reliable and solid. So if they play bad or look bad, that's just the state of the team.
different teams make players different. Pau is very different on spain than with kobe. Nobody would ever use the term ga-soft if they only saw him on spain. |
Actually, Mosgov isn't doing that far off his norms. This is just what he is. He might do a little better but nothing dramatic. He's not going to turn into a way better player just because he got a ton of money.
Deng is more concerning. The issue with him is he really needs to play PF on a slower paced team to be effective now. |
I've posted before but Moz was extremely effective as a role player in 2014-2015. That included covering for Irving and Love at the 1&4 so it's not just a matter of playing with better defensive personnel (though having LeBron on the perimeter helps).
Forget the counting stats, I want the guy who posted Top-4 RPM for a center, provided top-5 rim protection, and transformed the Cavs' defense en route to them finishing the season 39-3 or something with him. |
His regression on defense even from last season is painfully surprising, and he wasn't what one would describe as good last year. |
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dcarter4kobe
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| Posted: Fri Feb 10, 2017 10:59 pm Post subject: |
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Dead horse here but that's the thing I never understood, why give a 4 year deal to a 30 year old player you dont know how will look after a down year due to health
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"He's a Zen master, so he can speak to you, and he doesn't need a microphone; you can hear him in your head, 'Ron, don't shoot, don't shoot.' Whatever, pow, three. I love the Zen, though." |
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tox
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| Posted: Fri Feb 10, 2017 11:05 pm Post subject: |
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| activeverb wrote: |
That was his career year to date and I wasn't expecting him to replicate it. But a lot of his success, offensively and defensively, was having the right complement of players around him. I think of him as a guy who can be raised by his teammates; but he's not going to raise a team. |
Absolutely. I wasn't expecting him to replicate his career year, but I was hoping for a decent approximation of it. And I agree that it's about putting him in a position to succeed. It's just weird since that Cavs team was really bad defensively (only plus defenders were the recently traded for Shump and LeBron) and Mozgov thrived as a rim protector. |
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epak
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| Posted: Fri Feb 10, 2017 11:07 pm Post subject: |
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| Moz is a good guy. Hoping he helped develop Zubac |
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