| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
laker4life
Star Player
Joined: 26 Nov 2001
Posts: 7317
|
 Posted: Tue Feb 21, 2017 9:10 am Post subject: |
|
|
| yinoma2001 wrote: | | I feel like it's likely that Jim/Mitch are out the door soon. Why pile on at this point? Let the season play out and make moves in the offseason. |
I agree we should let it go.
But with the existence of social media and reporters from ESPN, Bleacher Report, Blogs, etc, we will be getting a lot of information on the Lakers over the next few months. |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
laker4life
Star Player
Joined: 26 Nov 2001
Posts: 7317
|
| Posted: Tue Feb 21, 2017 9:11 am Post subject: |
|
|
| PICKnPOP wrote: | | J.C. Smith wrote: | | Laker's Fan wrote: | | Jeanie has a habit of speaking out at significant times, entering free agency, trade deadline, etc. some reason she can't stick to less strategically tricky parts of the calendar? |
It's very frustrating, and very obvious sabotage. |
She's been setting this up since her father died. Unfortunately for jim and Mitch she controls the media so she controls the narrative. losing doesn't help either
I'm prepared for Jeanie and magic to take over this summer tbh. Makes sense because if we get the top 3 pick we will have completely restocked on assets and will be in a good position to make a big trade and hopefully sign a big Free agent. They will take all of the credit of course |
It is similar to what is happening with the 76ers with Hinkle and what has happened with the Dodgers with Ned Colleti. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Treble Clef
Franchise Player
Joined: 20 Nov 2012
Posts: 23899
|
| Posted: Tue Feb 21, 2017 9:12 am Post subject: |
|
|
I never thought Ding had any value as a journalist. His work has always been very tilted and has always been all about how his personal favorites (Phil, Jeanie, Kobe, etc) are infallible. I know some people really appreciated that and when all of his favorites were here, those pieces were harmless fluff instead of the hitpieces they are now but he is who he always has been.
He is no more of a journalist than any other poster here. He just has a bigger platform and a bigger agenda. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
yinoma2001
Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010
Posts: 119487
|
| Posted: Tue Feb 21, 2017 9:21 am Post subject: |
|
|
| laker4life wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | I feel like it's likely that Jim/Mitch are out the door soon. Why pile on at this point? Let the season play out and make moves in the offseason. |
I agree we should let it go.
But with the existence of social media and reporters from ESPN, Bleacher Report, Blogs, etc, we will be getting a lot of information on the Lakers over the next few months. |
Once whatever change happens, I will support whomever is installed in the FO just as much as I have "defended" this regime.
_________________
From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Four Decade Bandwagon
Star Player
Joined: 18 Jul 2014
Posts: 8149
|
| Posted: Tue Feb 21, 2017 9:22 am Post subject: |
|
|
| irielight wrote: | | Truck Turner wrote: | | saetarubia wrote: | | https://twitter.com/LakerFilmRoom/status/833771288661352448 |
There's a LOT of revisionist history going on with Jim Buss and Mitch Kupchak and it's really unfair.
It's like people totally disregard the fact that the two fo them built a championship team that went to 3 straight finals and won 2 of them. People act as if Jim only took over when Dr Buss died even though he was head of basketball operations LONG before that. In fact when the Lakers were rebuilding back in the mid 2000's Jim and Mitch were blamed for not doing anything (just like now). They built a championship team but people now refuse to give them credit for it.
The CP3 deal was praised for being a master stroke and now all of a sudden it's Mitch and Jim's fault that the deal didn't work even though the League totally screwed them and Jeanie at the time didn't put up much of a fight to make things right.
The deals for Dwight and Nash were almost universally praised at the time and nobody could have predicted how terribly things would turn out. The only mistake they made in that scenario was the coaches they hired (Mike Brown then Mike D'Antoni).
Mitch and Jim have definitely made their fair share of mistakes, but the fact that the NBA landscape has been shifting underneath their feet has been ignored. The Lakers weren't the only team affected, but they're the only team that's expected to turn nothing into a dynasty overnight. |
Excellent post! Couldn't agree more... |
Thank you for reminding everyone of those all too often overlooked facts. At the time most were applauded. Hindsight is a wonderful thing when criticizing decisions.
There are a lot of reasons the Lakers have been so horrible in recent years. Even if you want to place the majority of the blame on Jim and Mitch and replace them I am not confident Magic or Jeanie are the ones I want choosing the replacements. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
tnell
Star Player
Joined: 23 Jun 2011
Posts: 3185
Location: Over the River And Through The Woods
|
| Posted: Tue Feb 21, 2017 9:24 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Wasn't Isaiah picked 60th overall? So im pretty sure we weren't the only team to pass on him. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
pmacla
Star Player
Joined: 31 Aug 2012
Posts: 7849
Location: Los Angeles, CA
|
| Posted: Tue Feb 21, 2017 9:28 am Post subject: |
|
|
if there is one thing in all the hit pieces the past few weeks that maybe apparent is that Mitch though great at maintaining and retooling a Championship team, is not great at rebuilding from rock bottom.
Also, the disconnect between Jeanie and Jim no matter what side you are on has hurt the team a lot. I dont know of any successful company that doesnt have communication or understanding what a major department of the company is doing can prosper.
Jim and Mitch maybe sacrificial lambs in the Lakers moving forward with a clearer and unified focus and vision. Jeanie has done this the wrong way and totally opposite of what they say the Lakers are the class of the leauge. I hope down the road karma for doing this the wrong way doesnt come and bite us later |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Omar Little
Moderator
Joined: 02 May 2005
Posts: 90306
Location: Formerly Known As 24
|
| Posted: Tue Feb 21, 2017 9:29 am Post subject: |
|
|
| irielight wrote: | | Truck Turner wrote: | | saetarubia wrote: | | https://twitter.com/LakerFilmRoom/status/833771288661352448 |
There's a LOT of revisionist history going on with Jim Buss and Mitch Kupchak and it's really unfair.
It's like people totally disregard the fact that the two fo them built a championship team that went to 3 straight finals and won 2 of them. People act as if Jim only took over when Dr Buss died even though he was head of basketball operations LONG before that. In fact when the Lakers were rebuilding back in the mid 2000's Jim and Mitch were blamed for not doing anything (just like now). They built a championship team but people now refuse to give them credit for it.
The CP3 deal was praised for being a master stroke and now all of a sudden it's Mitch and Jim's fault that the deal didn't work even though the League totally screwed them and Jeanie at the time didn't put up much of a fight to make things right.
The deals for Dwight and Nash were almost universally praised at the time and nobody could have predicted how terribly things would turn out. The only mistake they made in that scenario was the coaches they hired (Mike Brown then Mike D'Antoni).
Mitch and Jim have definitely made their fair share of mistakes, but the fact that the NBA landscape has been shifting underneath their feet has been ignored. The Lakers weren't the only team affected, but they're the only team that's expected to turn nothing into a dynasty overnight. |
Excellent post! Couldn't agree more... |
Yup, love how they've come up with some BS Bynum story to tarnish the CP3 get, and a ridiculous sacre cost us everybody tale, and very quietly but very tellingly ignored the Kobe signing.
_________________
“We must always take sides. Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim. Silence encourages the tormentor, never the tormented.” ― Elie Wiesel |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
yinoma2001
Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010
Posts: 119487
|
| Posted: Tue Feb 21, 2017 9:30 am Post subject: |
|
|
IF Mitch goes, I hope Jeannie and her new crew heap the praise the man deserves. He may have had a rough 3-4 years lately (though I think he drafted well), but he kept the Lakers together with the Buss siblings infighting and all.
_________________
From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
richmorgan12
Starting Rotation
Joined: 13 Feb 2017
Posts: 595
|
| Posted: Tue Feb 21, 2017 9:33 am Post subject: |
|
|
| pmacla wrote: | if there is one thing in all the hit pieces the past few weeks that maybe apparent is that Mitch though great at maintaining and retooling a Championship team, is not great at rebuilding from rock bottom.
|
I don't see it that way at all. Mitch and Jim have been great at drafting. Jeanie, on the other hand, has behaved like an idiot. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
KobeDunk
Retired Number
Joined: 23 Sep 2004
Posts: 26849
|
| Posted: Tue Feb 21, 2017 9:34 am Post subject: |
|
|
| yinoma2001 wrote: | | IF Mitch goes, I hope Jeannie and her new crew heap the praise the man deserves. He may have had a rough 3-4 years lately (though I think he drafted well), but he kept the Lakers together with the Buss siblings infighting and all. |
how exactly did he keep them together? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
KobeDunk
Retired Number
Joined: 23 Sep 2004
Posts: 26849
|
| Posted: Tue Feb 21, 2017 9:36 am Post subject: |
|
|
| richmorgan12 wrote: | | pmacla wrote: | if there is one thing in all the hit pieces the past few weeks that maybe apparent is that Mitch though great at maintaining and retooling a Championship team, is not great at rebuilding from rock bottom.
|
I don't see it that way at all. Mitch and Jim have been great at drafting. Jeanie, on the other hand, has behaved like an idiot. |
lets be honest... they drafted well getting Zubac, Nance and Clarkson. D'Angelo, Randle and Ingram fell into their laps, the monkey at the zoo would have made the same picks. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Krispy Kreme
Franchise Player
Joined: 30 Mar 2003
Posts: 12252
|
| Posted: Tue Feb 21, 2017 9:37 am Post subject: |
|
|
Like I've said before.. Jim may have had the title of head of ops in the 2000s or whenever, but it was just that. A title. Every article I had read in the mid 2000s and even with the Pau/Kobe lakers stated that Jerry and Mitch were trying to get FA X, or Coach Y. I rarely if ever saw Jim's name mentioned. He was probably sitting in a room with Mitch and Jerry while they negotiated or tried to recruit people and he'd go along with what they had to say. Big difference between sitting behind Mitch and Jerry versus YOU being the head of that group. He's good at sitting behind. Not good at leading.
Jim got his hand held by his dad, and now when he's the man, he can't handle the job. It's as simple as that.
If you think I'm wrong, and Jim had a huge role in the mid 2000s and with the Kobe/Pau Lakers, then there wouldn't be such a noticeable drop off not only in wins and losses, but in the direction of the franchise and the stupid comments he's made in the media.
The way you find out if a vice president or whatever has the intelligence and tact to be a president is when the VP needs to fill those shoes. In this case, he hasn't been able to. He's failed on multiple levels. Bad coaching hires, bad FA signings. Has it ALL been bad? No. I liked the Dwight move and the attempted CP3 move. But Dwight still didn't work out, so it ended up not being some great move for the franchise.
If Jim steps down or pushed out, and homers want to say, "well, he got screwed. he led us to so many titles being the main FO person and people have no respect or patience" then... whatever helps you sleep at night. he hasn't "led" this franchise in anything since his father passed away. he was a good assistant aka Jerry and Mitch's lackey.. but that's about it. That's his legacy.
_________________
Dominating every day.
Last edited by Krispy Kreme on Tue Feb 21, 2017 9:39 am; edited 1 time in total |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
pmacla
Star Player
Joined: 31 Aug 2012
Posts: 7849
Location: Los Angeles, CA
|
| Posted: Tue Feb 21, 2017 9:38 am Post subject: |
|
|
| richmorgan12 wrote: | | pmacla wrote: | if there is one thing in all the hit pieces the past few weeks that maybe apparent is that Mitch though great at maintaining and retooling a Championship team, is not great at rebuilding from rock bottom.
|
I don't see it that way at all. Mitch and Jim have been great at drafting. Jeanie, on the other hand, has behaved like an idiot. |
Drafting has been fine, coaching hires outside Luke a disaster and FA signings have been horrible overall we most likely have 4 of our worst seasons ever in a row. Dont know many who keep their job after that |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
BigGameHames
Star Player
Joined: 24 May 2015
Posts: 7982
|
| Posted: Tue Feb 21, 2017 9:42 am Post subject: |
|
|
| KobeDunk wrote: | | richmorgan12 wrote: | | pmacla wrote: | if there is one thing in all the hit pieces the past few weeks that maybe apparent is that Mitch though great at maintaining and retooling a Championship team, is not great at rebuilding from rock bottom.
|
I don't see it that way at all. Mitch and Jim have been great at drafting. Jeanie, on the other hand, has behaved like an idiot. |
lets be honest... they drafted well getting Zubac, Nance and Clarkson. D'Angelo, Randle and Ingram fell into their laps, the monkey at the zoo would have made the same picks. |
With Ingram you can say that but not with the other two. Russell was a surprising pick and Randle had his fair share of doubters. Even with Ingram, they deserve credit for pulling the trigger on all of them. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
KobeDunk
Retired Number
Joined: 23 Sep 2004
Posts: 26849
|
| Posted: Tue Feb 21, 2017 9:44 am Post subject: |
|
|
| BigGameHames wrote: | | KobeDunk wrote: | | richmorgan12 wrote: | | pmacla wrote: | if there is one thing in all the hit pieces the past few weeks that maybe apparent is that Mitch though great at maintaining and retooling a Championship team, is not great at rebuilding from rock bottom.
|
I don't see it that way at all. Mitch and Jim have been great at drafting. Jeanie, on the other hand, has behaved like an idiot. |
lets be honest... they drafted well getting Zubac, Nance and Clarkson. D'Angelo, Randle and Ingram fell into their laps, the monkey at the zoo would have made the same picks. |
With Ingram you can say that but not with the other two. Russell was a surprising pick and Randle had his fair share of doubters. Even with Ingram, they deserve credit for pulling the trigger on all of them. |
you can also argue that Russell wasn't the right pick looking back at the draft now. As for Randle, he was 7th, he was the only pick that made sense at that point. Marcus Banks had just gone to Boston so Randle was there for the taking. I don't know how they could have messed that one up. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
kikanga
Retired Number
Joined: 15 Sep 2012
Posts: 29279
Location: La La Land
|
| Posted: Tue Feb 21, 2017 9:48 am Post subject: |
|
|
Learned alot in this piece.
Looks like some of the other Buss kids have more to gain from Jim's "role change" than Jeanie. She'll be doing the same things in the organization no matter what happens to Jim.
But maybe Joey and Jesse want to take the lead sooner rather than later.
_________________
"Every hurt is a lesson, and every lesson makes you better”
Last edited by kikanga on Tue Feb 21, 2017 9:49 am; edited 1 time in total |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
0514
Star Player
Joined: 16 Nov 2012
Posts: 6309
Location: Fountain Valley
|
| Posted: Tue Feb 21, 2017 9:48 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Everything about this is just so silly and unnecessary. (bleep) man |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
adkindo
Retired Number
Joined: 16 Jun 2005
Posts: 40345
Location: Dirty South
|
| Posted: Tue Feb 21, 2017 9:49 am Post subject: |
|
|
| I didn't even read article once I saw author.....just my opinion...it is beyond foolish to take anything this tool writes at face value. He is a disgrace to journalism. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
BigGameHames
Star Player
Joined: 24 May 2015
Posts: 7982
|
| Posted: Tue Feb 21, 2017 9:52 am Post subject: |
|
|
| KobeDunk wrote: | | BigGameHames wrote: | | KobeDunk wrote: | | richmorgan12 wrote: | | pmacla wrote: | if there is one thing in all the hit pieces the past few weeks that maybe apparent is that Mitch though great at maintaining and retooling a Championship team, is not great at rebuilding from rock bottom.
|
I don't see it that way at all. Mitch and Jim have been great at drafting. Jeanie, on the other hand, has behaved like an idiot. |
lets be honest... they drafted well getting Zubac, Nance and Clarkson. D'Angelo, Randle and Ingram fell into their laps, the monkey at the zoo would have made the same picks. |
With Ingram you can say that but not with the other two. Russell was a surprising pick and Randle had his fair share of doubters. Even with Ingram, they deserve credit for pulling the trigger on all of them. |
you can also argue that Russell wasn't the right pick looking back at the draft now. As for Randle, he was 7th, he was the only pick that made sense at that point. Marcus Banks had just gone to Boston so Randle was there for the taking. I don't know how they could have messed that one up. |
By taking Mudiay and Vonleh instead of Russell and Randle. There are many people who would've done that at the time as well. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
richmorgan12
Starting Rotation
Joined: 13 Feb 2017
Posts: 595
|
| Posted: Tue Feb 21, 2017 10:07 am Post subject: |
|
|
| KobeDunk wrote: | | richmorgan12 wrote: | | pmacla wrote: | if there is one thing in all the hit pieces the past few weeks that maybe apparent is that Mitch though great at maintaining and retooling a Championship team, is not great at rebuilding from rock bottom.
|
I don't see it that way at all. Mitch and Jim have been great at drafting. Jeanie, on the other hand, has behaved like an idiot. |
lets be honest... they drafted well getting Zubac, Nance and Clarkson. D'Angelo, Randle and Ingram fell into their laps, the monkey at the zoo would have made the same picks. |
There are plenty of folks who would have picked Okafor, Magic being one of them. Randle was picked 7th, so he wasn't a no brainer either. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
44TheLogo
Star Player
Joined: 21 Feb 2009
Posts: 6364
|
| Posted: Tue Feb 21, 2017 10:11 am Post subject: |
|
|
we easily could have drafted okafor over russell.
of our three recent lottery picks, I think randle was the most no-brainer pick, but with Randle I think it's pretty obvious that we missed on a few guys in that draft (namely, Jokic, though most of the NBA missed on him). I would also prefer Hood and Saric over Randle at this point. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
AY2043
Franchise Player
Joined: 26 Feb 2012
Posts: 10621
|
| Posted: Tue Feb 21, 2017 10:11 am Post subject: |
|
|
| yinoma2001 wrote: | | Drifts wrote: | | it's time... no more losing Whiteside over Sacre... no more lazy draftees... no more skipping on bigs because of guys like Mr. Roy Hibbert... no more missing out on CP3 because of Bynum... no more missing out on Cousins because they want to "stand pat" |
1. So every other NBA team that passed on Hassan isn't mentioned, i.e. the Kings that drafted him then let him go? That's an institutional (NBA) rather than Lakers criticism.
2. "lazy draftees," no idea what that means. I presume this is your continuing crusade against DLO. That doesn't even deserve a response.
3. What bigs did we skip on b/c of Hibbert? Okafor? The one being traded for peanuts?
4. How do you know that Bynum (with major injury histories and such) would satisfy the NBA (de facto owners of Hornets)?
5. Presumably Magic, the team's advisor, was also part of the conversation and ultimate decision. Boogie was eventually traded for Hield b/c of the owner's ridiculous infatuation with Buddy Hield. |
People forget, Bynum had his best year in 2012, AFTER the veto. That played a big part in driving up his value enough to get Howard. Who knows if his value was high enough to get CP3 in Dec/2011. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Laker's Fan
Franchise Player
Joined: 27 Jun 2002
Posts: 12850
|
| Posted: Tue Feb 21, 2017 10:12 am Post subject: |
|
|
Mitch has worked for everything he has and done so in some very deep trenches. Jeanie's power was largely a birthright and what of it she's had to share she has despised. That isn't to say she hasn't worked hard, but good leaders don't do what she's doing much less how she's doing it.
_________________
Austin Reaves keeps his game tight, like Kobe Bryant on game night. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
tnell
Star Player
Joined: 23 Jun 2011
Posts: 3185
Location: Over the River And Through The Woods
|
| Posted: Tue Feb 21, 2017 10:13 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: | Lakers Name Earvin "Magic" Johnson President of Basketball Operations
LOS ANGELES -- Los Angeles Lakers Governor Jeanie Buss announced today that the team has named Earvin "Magic" Johnson as President of Basketball Operations. In addition, General Manager Mitch Kupchak has been relieved of his duties, effective immediately. Furthermore, Jim Buss will no longer hold his role as Lakers Executive Vice President of Basketball Operations.
"Today I took a series of actions I believe will return the Lakers to the heights Dr. Jerry Buss demanded and our fans rightly expect," Jeanie Buss said. "Effective immediately, Earvin Johnson will be in charge of all basketball operations and will report directly to me. Our search for a new General Manager to work with Earvin and Coach Luke Walton is well underway and we hope to announce a new General Manager in short order. Together, Earvin, Luke and our new General Manager will establish the foundation for the next generation of Los Angeles Lakers greatness."
"It's a dream come true to return to the Lakers as President of Basketball Operations working closely with Jeanie Buss and the Buss family," said Earvin "Magic" Johnson. "Since 1979, I've been a part of the Laker Nation and I'm passionate about this organization. I will do everything I can to build a winning culture on and off the court. We have a great coach in Luke Walton and good young players. We will work tirelessly to return our Los Angeles Lakers to NBA champions."
Jeanie Buss added, "I took these actions today to achieve one goal: Everyone associated with the Lakers will now be pulling in the same direction, the direction established by Earvin and myself. We are determined to get back to competing to win NBA championships again."
Regarding Mitch Kupchak, Jeanie Buss stated, "We are grateful for the many contributions Mitch has made to the Lakers over the years and we wish him all the best."
With regard to fellow owner and brother, Jim Buss, Ms. Buss said, "Jim loves the Lakers. Although he will no longer be responsible for basketball personnel decisions, he is an owner of this team and we share the same goal: returning the Lakers to the level of greatness our father demanded. Our fans deserve no less."
In addition to the changes made within the basketball department, the Lakers also announced they have parted ways with John Black who had been the Lakers Vice President of Public Relations. Chief Operating Officer Tim Harris will immediately begin a search for a replacement. Jeanie Buss added, "We thank John for his many years of service."
For further media inquiries contact Alison Bogli at 310/426-6002 or abogli _at_ la-lakers.com |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
