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NYLakerFan
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 Posted: Wed Feb 22, 2017 9:44 am Post subject: |
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Really? SO all of you who think Jimbo should have been left to run things after FOUR years of total incompetence while already attacking Jeannie after what ... 48 hours ... are holding her to the same standards as a man? Riiiiiiight.
| numero-ocho wrote: | | NYLakerFan wrote: | All this negative reaction ... and even outright hatred ... toward Jeannie Buss is simply ridiculous. I fear a lot of it is simply because she's a SHE and a lot of "fans" can't stand the idea of a woman running the Lakers.
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I can turn that accusation around and say the only reason people support her conniving ways is because she's a SHE and a lot of fans can't stand the idea that a woman would be held to the same standard of ethics as a man running the Lakers. |
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numero-ocho
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| Posted: Wed Feb 22, 2017 9:44 am Post subject: |
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| petergr wrote: | | Baron Von Humongous wrote: | | I feel like a Sixers fan being chided for not supporting the Colangelos after they raw dogged Hinkie. |
I wish Mitch could write a 17 page essay on the sabotage and everything he did right.  |
If he wrote a tell-all book about his tenure with the Lakers I'd buy it but I just don't see him doing that.
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GoldenThroat
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| Posted: Wed Feb 22, 2017 9:45 am Post subject: |
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| I am greatly relieved that the drama is gone and I'll be rooting for Magic to succeed just as I was with Mitch & Jim, but the entire premise here is pretty rich. smh |
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Vancouver Fan
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| Posted: Wed Feb 22, 2017 9:46 am Post subject: |
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| numero-ocho wrote: | | petergr wrote: | | Baron Von Humongous wrote: | | I feel like a Sixers fan being chided for not supporting the Colangelos after they raw dogged Hinkie. |
I wish Mitch could write a 17 page essay on the sabotage and everything he did right. |
If he wrote a tell-all book about his tenure with the Lakers I'd buy it but I just don't see him doing that. |
Naww. Mitch is all class. He's just going to kick back and relax for a minute.
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GoldenThroat
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| Posted: Wed Feb 22, 2017 9:47 am Post subject: |
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| NYLakerFan wrote: | Really? SO all of you who think Jimbo should have been left to run things after FOUR years of total incompetence while already attacking Jeannie after what ... 48 hours ... are holding her to the same standards as a man? Riiiiiiight.
| numero-ocho wrote: | | NYLakerFan wrote: | All this negative reaction ... and even outright hatred ... toward Jeannie Buss is simply ridiculous. I fear a lot of it is simply because she's a SHE and a lot of "fans" can't stand the idea of a woman running the Lakers.
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I can turn that accusation around and say the only reason people support her conniving ways is because she's a SHE and a lot of fans can't stand the idea that a woman would be held to the same standard of ethics as a man running the Lakers. |
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If Jeanie had been a part of this for only 48 hours, you'd be absolutely right. |
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pio2u
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| Posted: Wed Feb 22, 2017 9:50 am Post subject: |
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Laker for life: I would support the entire organization even if the naysayer on LG were running the show. We have no say only opinions. Things change or they get stagnate. Go Lakers!!
"Don't worry be happy." 😀😃 |
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NYLakerFan
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| Posted: Wed Feb 22, 2017 9:51 am Post subject: |
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Jimbo kept her out of the basketball side completely. Even Kupchak had not spoken to her since November. Neither brought her into the loop during the failed trade talks with the Kings. Other than very publicly bringing Magic in as her "advisor", how has she been involved in this fiasco of a FO?
| GoldenThroat wrote: | | NYLakerFan wrote: | Really? SO all of you who think Jimbo should have been left to run things after FOUR years of total incompetence while already attacking Jeannie after what ... 48 hours ... are holding her to the same standards as a man? Riiiiiiight.
| numero-ocho wrote: | | NYLakerFan wrote: | All this negative reaction ... and even outright hatred ... toward Jeannie Buss is simply ridiculous. I fear a lot of it is simply because she's a SHE and a lot of "fans" can't stand the idea of a woman running the Lakers.
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I can turn that accusation around and say the only reason people support her conniving ways is because she's a SHE and a lot of fans can't stand the idea that a woman would be held to the same standard of ethics as a man running the Lakers. |
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If Jeanie had been a part of this for only 48 hours, you'd be absolutely right. |
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lakergryl20
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| Posted: Wed Feb 22, 2017 9:51 am Post subject: |
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If I was Magic I would hire Kobe. I think he would be great at developing the young players, but also he would be the fall guy. He would be the person people would blame if things go wrong. He will get all of the blame for the failures, but none of the credit for the success. Everyone already thinks he's behind the Rob Pelinka hire. On First Take, they debated whether or not he would be intimidating to players on the team and free agents. He's already becoming the fall guy without saying anything so he might as welll get paid for it.
Last edited by lakergryl20 on Wed Feb 22, 2017 9:56 am; edited 1 time in total |
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TDRock
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| Posted: Wed Feb 22, 2017 9:51 am Post subject: |
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No. In honesty my opinions really changed behind this and I'll likely never fully back Jeannie or Exec Magic (vs Player Magic who is one of my fave players).
That said I hope whatever they're doing works because the Lakers will always be my team.
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Baron Von Humongous
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| Posted: Wed Feb 22, 2017 9:53 am Post subject: |
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| Megaton wrote: | I'm excited. This new FO seems to have a clear vision and think long term, logical moves like that Lou Will trade. Unlike Mitch/Jim with those ridiculous Mozgov and Deng signings and not doing anything to get more assets for our short term players.
Best of all, this FO has made a clear statement that they want to keep the youth core and grow em. Use them to attract free agents for years to come. Unlike the previous one, trying to "compete" every year with mediocre players that also don't fit the team as a whole.
The activity has also been very encouraging. Hopefully we hear a Nick Young trade soon which would solidify my excitement for this management and the direction for this team. |
1) The Lakers were clearly shopping Williams before yesterday and Mitch had a Lou trade available as of Sunday night, as per Shelbourne.
2) Mitch (and I assume Jim) had the same vision of building a young core and focusing on development. Jeanie and Magic inherit that vision from their predecessors. |
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Baron Von Humongous
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| Posted: Wed Feb 22, 2017 9:54 am Post subject: |
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| NYLakerFan wrote: | All this negative reaction ... and even outright hatred ... toward Jeannie Buss is simply ridiculous. I fear a lot of it is simply because she's a SHE and a lot of "fans" can't stand the idea of a woman running the Lakers.
A lot of you say this move was done in a classless way. How was this classless??? We've watched both Jimbo and Mitch absolutely trash our Lakers over the past 4-5 years. And I have no doubt this trade deadline would have passed either with no moves at all or another asinine attempt to bring in some washed up veteran. Why should Jeannie had allowed them to screw this up even more???
And what exactly would have been the "classy" way to handle this? Have her attorney talk to Jimbo's attorney and work out some face saving way for him to resign?
Maybe you all prefer Jimbo's "classy" way of doing things. Like when he cleaned house in 2011 during the lockout including letting Ronnie Lester go after 27 years. But he made up for that by naming his long-time bartender friend as a "scout". Or maybe you all prefer the way Mitch and Jimbo hired D'Antoni in the middle of the night after leading Phil Jackson to think he had the job. And don't forgot that they were the FO that fired Brown FIVE games into the season. Yeah ... real classy FO we had with Jimbo and Kupchak.
Jeannie did what any smart executive should do ... act quickly to minimize any further damage by an incompetent, dysfunctional front office. And she has moved quickly to put in place a new team of BASKETBALL people. Not some college drop out, wannabe race horse Jockey who did not value the advice of life-long basketball staffers. Maybe if Jimbo and Mitch had actually talked to Jeannie this might not have been necessary. Given the circumstances ... she did the right thing.
My only complaint is that she did not do this sooner. |
Shill. Sexist shill. |
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AY2043
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Joined: 26 Feb 2012
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| Posted: Wed Feb 22, 2017 9:58 am Post subject: |
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Jeannie played it like Game of Thrones when she really didn't have to. I wouldn't have an issue if she did roll out all the constant hit campaigns.. I mean hell, was the last parting shot the day before you fire Jim/Mitch really necessary? That's just hurtful IMO, especially to do it do your own brother and a guy who's represented the P&G with nothing but class and dignity for the last 35 years.
0 respect for her, there were so many better ways to handle this.
Magic... Ugh. Well, at least he was honest in his intentions I guess.
So yeah, sorry. I'll support them when they prove they can competently run a team |
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NYLakerFan
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| Posted: Wed Feb 22, 2017 10:01 am Post subject: |
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My bottom line is this ...
I've been a Lakers fan since the sixties. I grew up in SoCal and actually got to see the 33 game streak and our first championship in LA in person ... live! I suffered through the many, MANY championship loses during the West years; I suffered through the Elmore Smith years in the seventies and the Randy Pfund years in the nineties. And nothing was as painful as these past four years (well ... maybe the loses to the Celtics in the 60s was more painful).
When I heard the news on the radio that Jeannie had FINALLY cleaned house, I almost drove off the road I was shouting and pounding the steering wheel so hard.
This is one VERY long time Lakers fan who feels like we are finally back on the right track. GO LAKERS! |
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NYLakerFan
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| Posted: Wed Feb 22, 2017 10:06 am Post subject: |
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LOL ... maybe you should look up the meaning of the word "shill". Unless you actually think I'm a paid member of Jeannie's staff. In which case, I'd be flattered that you'd think so. It would be a dream job to work for the Buss family now that Jimbo is gone.
| Baron Von Humongous wrote: | | NYLakerFan wrote: | All this negative reaction ... and even outright hatred ... toward Jeannie Buss is simply ridiculous. I fear a lot of it is simply because she's a SHE and a lot of "fans" can't stand the idea of a woman running the Lakers.
A lot of you say this move was done in a classless way. How was this classless??? We've watched both Jimbo and Mitch absolutely trash our Lakers over the past 4-5 years. And I have no doubt this trade deadline would have passed either with no moves at all or another asinine attempt to bring in some washed up veteran. Why should Jeannie had allowed them to screw this up even more???
And what exactly would have been the "classy" way to handle this? Have her attorney talk to Jimbo's attorney and work out some face saving way for him to resign?
Maybe you all prefer Jimbo's "classy" way of doing things. Like when he cleaned house in 2011 during the lockout including letting Ronnie Lester go after 27 years. But he made up for that by naming his long-time bartender friend as a "scout". Or maybe you all prefer the way Mitch and Jimbo hired D'Antoni in the middle of the night after leading Phil Jackson to think he had the job. And don't forgot that they were the FO that fired Brown FIVE games into the season. Yeah ... real classy FO we had with Jimbo and Kupchak.
Jeannie did what any smart executive should do ... act quickly to minimize any further damage by an incompetent, dysfunctional front office. And she has moved quickly to put in place a new team of BASKETBALL people. Not some college drop out, wannabe race horse Jockey who did not value the advice of life-long basketball staffers. Maybe if Jimbo and Mitch had actually talked to Jeannie this might not have been necessary. Given the circumstances ... she did the right thing.
My only complaint is that she did not do this sooner. |
Shill. Sexist shill. |
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BigGameHames
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| Posted: Wed Feb 22, 2017 10:10 am Post subject: |
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Yes. The timing was horrible and makes no sense to me but it happened and its time to move on. As long as Magic does what he says and listens to the people he hires around him, I think this will work. I was very skeptical at first but I feel better today about the situation. If its going to work, I think it will be a group effort between Magic, Pelinka, and Ryan West because they all bring something different to the table.
West: He is looked at as one of the better assistant GM's in the league. He knows his basketball and learned from the greatest FO executive in NBA history(his father) and another GREAT GM in Kupcheck. He has also been around the team and the young players and will (hopefully) be a voice against dumping the young players for less than what they are worth. The downside to him is that he doesn't have the track record to demand respect and Magic may brush his opinion off.
Pelinka: IDK much about this guy but he's been around the game for years. Has played with and worked for tons of superstars over the years and clearly has a ton of connections around the league. He knows the game, but his role will be based around understanding the business side of basketball ops. Understanding the CBA, negotiating contracts(so MozDeng doesn't happen again), and anything else that involves money and the salary cap. The downside to him is that he is inexperienced, and possibly has a conflict of interests having the relationships he has with his clients.
Magic: He's the face of the franchise and has final say. He preaches that he wants to hire the most educated and informed people to help him make decisions. He immediately gives the Lakers more credibility around the league. He's a winner and often winners can see that quality in others. The downside is pretty simple. Will he listen to the people he hires around him or will he be stubborn and only trust his own opinion. Will he fall in love with a FA and offer him more money than Pelinka deems reasonable? Will he irrationally trade a young player for less value than West thinks they have? Will he blow it up and restart because he is Magic and thinks he knows more than everybody? Those things worry me, but with that said, he has been saying mostly the right things that have me optimistic. Please just don't toss Russell aside though because you're boy Byron couldn't get along with him. That's my biggest worry. |
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Baron Von Humongous
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| Posted: Wed Feb 22, 2017 10:15 am Post subject: |
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| NYLakerFan wrote: | LOL ... maybe you should look up the meaning of the word "shill". Unless you actually think I'm a paid member of Jeannie's staff. In which case, I'd be flattered that you'd think so. It would be a dream job to work for the Buss family now that Jimbo is gone.
| Baron Von Humongous wrote: | | NYLakerFan wrote: | All this negative reaction ... and even outright hatred ... toward Jeannie Buss is simply ridiculous. I fear a lot of it is simply because she's a SHE and a lot of "fans" can't stand the idea of a woman running the Lakers.
A lot of you say this move was done in a classless way. How was this classless??? We've watched both Jimbo and Mitch absolutely trash our Lakers over the past 4-5 years. And I have no doubt this trade deadline would have passed either with no moves at all or another asinine attempt to bring in some washed up veteran. Why should Jeannie had allowed them to screw this up even more???
And what exactly would have been the "classy" way to handle this? Have her attorney talk to Jimbo's attorney and work out some face saving way for him to resign?
Maybe you all prefer Jimbo's "classy" way of doing things. Like when he cleaned house in 2011 during the lockout including letting Ronnie Lester go after 27 years. But he made up for that by naming his long-time bartender friend as a "scout". Or maybe you all prefer the way Mitch and Jimbo hired D'Antoni in the middle of the night after leading Phil Jackson to think he had the job. And don't forgot that they were the FO that fired Brown FIVE games into the season. Yeah ... real classy FO we had with Jimbo and Kupchak.
Jeannie did what any smart executive should do ... act quickly to minimize any further damage by an incompetent, dysfunctional front office. And she has moved quickly to put in place a new team of BASKETBALL people. Not some college drop out, wannabe race horse Jockey who did not value the advice of life-long basketball staffers. Maybe if Jimbo and Mitch had actually talked to Jeannie this might not have been necessary. Given the circumstances ... she did the right thing.
My only complaint is that she did not do this sooner. |
Shill. Sexist shill. |
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My bad. Unpaid internships can open doors...keep at it! You're learning from one of the best PR minds in the business  |
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MIMLaker
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| Posted: Wed Feb 22, 2017 10:17 am Post subject: |
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| FWIW, Michael Wilbon was on ESPN Radio this morning and saying that as soon as it was announced that Magic was coming on earlier this month as an "advisor," several different NBA agents had told him they and their clients were more receptive to talking to the Lakers during FA period. |
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The Logo
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Location: Salem, OR
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| Posted: Wed Feb 22, 2017 10:18 am Post subject: |
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| I'm not going to support Jeanie, I can get behind Magic but less so Jeanie. She's been attacking Mitch and Jim for the last four years publicly/privately; say what you will about Mitch and Jim but they never stooped to Jeanie's level. Then she has the gall to go on television and say she "regrets her decision". That's a load of horse (bleep). |
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City_Dawg
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Location: Coming soon and striking at your borders.
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| Posted: Wed Feb 22, 2017 10:19 am Post subject: |
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I always support the Lakers and I'll hope the FO can bring us back to glory. That said, I'll always give both Magic and Jeanie a bunch of side eye and I'm sure they'll say and do plenty of stuff that is hilariously ironic.
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non-player zealot
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| Posted: Wed Feb 22, 2017 10:57 am Post subject: |
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| hydrohead wrote: | The feeling i have is relief. i never got the sense that Jim thought the Lakers were bigger than himself. the Lakers was his tool to show the world that isn't just a rich kid, but someone that can build success. in doing so, he was a slave to his own actions.
i don't get that feeling with Magic and Jeannie. they seem to understand that they are stewards of the Lakers, and that's it greatness was a collective action from Milkan and Baylor to Kobe and Shaq. |
I'm glad there's only Buss at the top echelon now. Some can feel bitter about the way it was handled, but right or wrong, management and FO are in one direction now. We will no longer hear about Jim vs Jeanie. People getting fired for poor performance is part of the biz and there have been much nastier handlings than this. Anyone who is waiting to gleefully pounce on every little misstep from here on out can kick rocks. And there are some of those mentalists among us. This should be thought as a positive series of moves which goes beyond any one of the parties involved. The bottom line is that the Lakers FO was a (bleep) joke that left FAs puzzled as to the Lakers' intentions. Not too long ago, such a thing would've been sacrilege for this org. Now there's a clear-cut hierarchy. If Mitch and Black had to be released just so that Jim could be as well, I can get over it. And I liked Mitch too. He was with the org since 81. His successes were probably stronger than his failures overall. He had a long run and I wish him well, but there is no forever in pro sports. Jerry West is gone, too. Pat Riley ran out of time -- and ask him how he got the job in the first place.
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iceberg01
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Posts: 2324
Location: Los Angeles, CA
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| Posted: Wed Feb 22, 2017 11:03 am Post subject: |
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I understand people being emotional and all, but I really have to wonder sometimes whether some of you are Laker fans. Or Kobe fans. Or Jim Buss fans. Or Kupchak fans.
I respect Kupchak. Believe it or not, I also respect Jim Buss for giving it his all. I've been one of the few people that has been in Jim & Mitch's corner 100% throughout all of this. And to be honest, I didn't think they did a bad job, as far as drafting goes. But free agency, a MAJOR staple of the Los Angeles Lakers, had become a problem.
Back in the day, the Lakers had the magic (no pun intended) combo: In addition to relaxed free agency rules, they had Jerry West's eye for talent and respect amongst players, and they had the charming personality of Jerry Buss. Many a Lakers player has told stories of how they personally met with Dr. Buss, and how Dr Buss personally recruited them or sold them on coming. Along with Hollywood, the Lakers could get anyone they wanted, whenever they wanted.
The new CBA was an anti-Laker rule. There's no secret to that. But even at their best, Mitch & Jim aren't exactly the #1 guys you'd want to drink a beer with (if they weren't Laker execs). And so much of free agency comes down to just that. The Dwight Howard & LaMarcus Aldridge free agent recruitment efforts were EMBARASSING, period. And where there's smoke, there's fire... I also think there's a bit of truth to the notion that Mitch was a bit cavalier (some could misinterpret it as arrogance) in his approach to free agents. He's a pretty mild-mannered guy, and these younger players want to feel wanted, I think.
On top of the Lakers faltering rep amongst agents & players around the league, the most recent free agent signings were the beginning of the end for the former front office. I can excuse the Mozgov deal--he's a passable C on a bad team/quality backup C on a contender, and the Lakers needed to hit the salary floor, so the overpayment is forgiveable. But the Deng contract is just straight up inexcusable: the Lakers could have gotten Matt Barnes, or someone of his caliber for much, much less, as a placeholder for Ingram.
Both Mitch & Jim have fired people before, sometimes in the middle of the season. Jim himself fired longtime Lakers staff & cleaned house when he took over. So they know the rules of the game. Nevertheless, I respect them & the job that they've done. But the fact is, it was time for a change.
You can be bitter about it, or you can be a Laker FAN and give Magic & Jeannie a shot. I've been a Laker fan for more than 30+ years, through plenty of eras. Through it all, I remain steadfast.
GO LAKERS. |
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J.C. Smith
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| Posted: Wed Feb 22, 2017 11:07 am Post subject: |
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| Even though I don't like how they came into power, if you're a Laker fan you have to hope for the team to do well. What's done is done. |
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Vin
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Location: France
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| Posted: Wed Feb 22, 2017 11:13 am Post subject: |
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| I don't have much faith in Magic and don't know much about Pelinka but I'am not rooting for them to fail. I just wait and see, not very impressed with their first move. |
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marga86
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| Posted: Wed Feb 22, 2017 11:15 am Post subject: |
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| richmorgan12 wrote: | | justsomelakerfan wrote: | | richmorgan12 wrote: | | marga86 wrote: |
Even worse, i heard Mike Wilbon this morning on 710... "you'd be shocked how impactful this is. I talked to several agents this morning who said... yup my guy is interested in at least talking to the lakers now." |
And you believed that PR? You really believe that players called their agents yesterday and said, 'Make sure you call Magic," despite the fact that IT ISN'T EVEN FREE AGENT SEASON right now! |
With how awkward, kind of arrogant at times, and private Jim Buss projected himself to be, I could actually buy that agents weren't thrilled with working with him. |
Agents worked with Kupchak, not Buss. Regardless, however, no player called their agent yesterday about Magic and free agency. |
I don't think you realize how important agents are in the the market. Yes the player makes the decision at the end.. but how do you think a player finds out if an org is working in the right direction?
Agents have all the inside info they relay to their clients and advise them on POTENTIAL destinations.
The point here is not that agents picked up the phone and called magic. It's that Wilbon said he gauged the impact of Magic stepping in by asking agents he knew whether their client would consider talking to the lakers.. to which he got positive responses from (maybe i misquoted what he said).. As in, yes, the lakers have made a significant change -- they changed something that swayed US (the player and the agent) from even bothering to meet with them.
You cant lock a player up if the agent himself wont give you a chance.
at least we know NOW that the lakers will get more shots at players, whether they sign them or not is a different story.
You cant talk to a girl if she wont give you her number. |
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richmorgan12
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| Posted: Wed Feb 22, 2017 11:17 am Post subject: |
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| marga86 wrote: | | richmorgan12 wrote: | | justsomelakerfan wrote: | | richmorgan12 wrote: | | marga86 wrote: |
Even worse, i heard Mike Wilbon this morning on 710... "you'd be shocked how impactful this is. I talked to several agents this morning who said... yup my guy is interested in at least talking to the lakers now." |
And you believed that PR? You really believe that players called their agents yesterday and said, 'Make sure you call Magic," despite the fact that IT ISN'T EVEN FREE AGENT SEASON right now! |
With how awkward, kind of arrogant at times, and private Jim Buss projected himself to be, I could actually buy that agents weren't thrilled with working with him. |
Agents worked with Kupchak, not Buss. Regardless, however, no player called their agent yesterday about Magic and free agency. |
I don't think you realize how important agents are in the the market. Yes the player makes the decision at the end.. but how do you think a player finds out if an org is working in the right direction?
Agents have all the inside info they relay to their clients and advise them on POTENTIAL destinations.
The point here is not that agents picked up the phone and called magic. It's that Wilbon said he gauged the impact of Magic stepping in by asking agents he knew whether their client would consider talking to the lakers.. to which he got positive responses from (maybe i misquoted what he said).. As in, yes, the lakers have made a significant change -- they changed something that swayed US (the player and the agent) from even bothering to meet with them.
You cant lock a player up if the agent himself wont give you a chance.
at least we know NOW that the lakers will get more shots at players, whether they sign them or not is a different story.
You cant talk to a girl if she wont give you her number. |
Gullible much? Wilbon is in Magic's pocket. |
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