Our Young Core-Year in Review
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yinoma2001
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 12, 2017 1:15 pm    Post subject: Re: Our Young Core-Year in Review

CaliRyderX wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
CaliRyderX wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
CaliRyderX wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
Ingram has shown me he has all star potential and is likely our highest valued player.

DLO has shown me similar all star potential, and is easily our 2nd highest valued player.

Jules has certainly (should be clear by now) wiped away any ridiculous fears that he's a bust. He may be on the near-all star trajectory.

JC is pretty much what I thought he'd be.

Nance showed his value on court as a smart defender. I worry about his durability going forward, but he's a big time keeper on this team.

Zubac has showed some flash in his offensive game. The concern remains about his defense (not necessarily rim protecting) in space and in PnR situations. Someone said that he may be going more towards an Enes Kanter (good offensive player, defensive struggle) trajectory, which is still quite a coup for a 32nd pick.

Nwaba is a good guy to keep. Love his life story and is a good reminder that the NBA is a daily grind and that each day should be cherished.

Ennis is an unrestricted FA and the Lakers are capped at 2.6m (due to CBA rules). So if a team offers him 3m, he's likely gone.

Black is likely gone unless we punt and keep his 6m deal.

It's been a really good year (especially post ASG) to evaluate these young players. We have at least 2 studs in the making (DLO/Ingram), a starting level player (Jules), 2 solid rotation players (JC, Nance) and a prospect (Zub). Things are looking well especially if we can add another top 3 pick this summer.

Go Lakers.


What do you mean Black is likely gone? He's under contract for next season, so it's more "unlikely" that he's gone.


Lakers can cut him by a date in July. It's a non-guaranteed 2nd year.


Are you certain? I thought his contract was fully guaranteed? And why cut him, even if that's an option? He's a great back-up PF/C to have, and making peanuts, relative to the rest of the league.


100% certain. It's a non-guaranteed deal. No cap hit.


Is there a difference between a non-guaranteed deal and a team option?


Yes. The latter would have given Black basically a no-trade clause for this season.
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 12, 2017 1:16 pm    Post subject:

Ingram: a stickman playing among pros. Plays the right way, has high IQ and feel for the game, elite height and length alongside very good athleticism, can cover a lot of ground with his long legs, good hoops, has to improve his shot, but it doesn't look broken. Has to focus on shooting, body strength/mass and footwork. The sky is the limit because hard work can take care of most of his shortcomings.

Zubac: 19 years old baby faced with the highest PER among our young players. Fantastic touch and feel for the game, legit size and frame for his position. Has to get better defending the pick and roll, but most legit 7' will struggle covering our porous perimeter defense. He told this offseason he is going to hit the weights hard and work on defensive concepts, seems like a coachable kid with as good of a potential as anyone.

Dlo: I'm very critical about his game, so how much I like him? I would move the 2nd pick from this draft (Ball) before I move him. I'm not sold he can run a team, he lacks about half the minimum repertorie for someone running a team, but the kid can play, period. He is a keeper and I believe he can flourish alongside good shooters and a reliable primary distributor. His floor is higher than any other young player from our core, his ceiling is limited by his lack of athleticism and motor. A few guys could just look back at the end of their careers and say "blow by speed ", they are the exception, guys that were so great doing other things, I mean all time great that he lack of athleticism wasn't a huge factor, those guys also had an incredible motor.

Julius: Randle is still our young player that puzzles me above anyone. When he is bad I really hate his game and I'm not telling hyper sensitive Dlo's stan in the middle of a freaking nervous breakdown, I'm talking about real hate, when you can't stand watching a player anymore and want to see him gone asap, but let's calm down, he had a terrible period after the birth of his first son, but since the all star game he has a steady production. It may look weird, his short arms makes him use unorthodox moves, but he is producing fine. I'm not ready to show him the money, but he is improving and I'm willing to observe him one more season without an extension to prove what kind of player he can become.

Nance: love him, the ultimate role player. Every championship team need someone like him. He is a keeper if he is willing to take role player kind of money.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 12, 2017 1:16 pm    Post subject: Re: Our Young Core-Year in Review

CaliRyderX wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
Ingram has shown me he has all star potential and is likely our highest valued player.

DLO has shown me similar all star potential, and is easily our 2nd highest valued player.

Jules has certainly (should be clear by now) wiped away any ridiculous fears that he's a bust. He may be on the near-all star trajectory.

JC is pretty much what I thought he'd be.

Nance showed his value on court as a smart defender. I worry about his durability going forward, but he's a big time keeper on this team.

Zubac has showed some flash in his offensive game. The concern remains about his defense (not necessarily rim protecting) in space and in PnR situations. Someone said that he may be going more towards an Enes Kanter (good offensive player, defensive struggle) trajectory, which is still quite a coup for a 32nd pick.

Nwaba is a good guy to keep. Love his life story and is a good reminder that the NBA is a daily grind and that each day should be cherished.

Ennis is an unrestricted FA and the Lakers are capped at 2.6m (due to CBA rules). So if a team offers him 3m, he's likely gone.

Black is likely gone unless we punt and keep his 6m deal.

It's been a really good year (especially post ASG) to evaluate these young players. We have at least 2 studs in the making (DLO/Ingram), a starting level player (Jules), 2 solid rotation players (JC, Nance) and a prospect (Zub). Things are looking well especially if we can add another top 3 pick this summer.

Go Lakers.


What do you mean Black is likely gone? He's under contract for next season, so it's more "unlikely" that he's gone.

Black is a guy that they might look to trade though. With Zu's emergence and Nance/JR playing small ball, Black becomes somewhat redundant with Moz still on the roster. We're actually kind of overstocked with C/PF's.
He's under contract for $6.1m next year and is probably tradeable. While he's young, he kind of doesn't really fit in with the long term direction of the team - so getting something back for him instead of just letting him walk after next year isn't an unreasonable goal.
All that is only if there's a reasonable deal to be had there
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 12, 2017 1:17 pm    Post subject:

Black is a non-guaranteed for next season.
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 12, 2017 1:17 pm    Post subject: Re: Our Young Core-Year in Review

yinoma2001 wrote:
CaliRyderX wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
CaliRyderX wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
CaliRyderX wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
Ingram has shown me he has all star potential and is likely our highest valued player.

DLO has shown me similar all star potential, and is easily our 2nd highest valued player.

Jules has certainly (should be clear by now) wiped away any ridiculous fears that he's a bust. He may be on the near-all star trajectory.

JC is pretty much what I thought he'd be.

Nance showed his value on court as a smart defender. I worry about his durability going forward, but he's a big time keeper on this team.

Zubac has showed some flash in his offensive game. The concern remains about his defense (not necessarily rim protecting) in space and in PnR situations. Someone said that he may be going more towards an Enes Kanter (good offensive player, defensive struggle) trajectory, which is still quite a coup for a 32nd pick.

Nwaba is a good guy to keep. Love his life story and is a good reminder that the NBA is a daily grind and that each day should be cherished.

Ennis is an unrestricted FA and the Lakers are capped at 2.6m (due to CBA rules). So if a team offers him 3m, he's likely gone.

Black is likely gone unless we punt and keep his 6m deal.

It's been a really good year (especially post ASG) to evaluate these young players. We have at least 2 studs in the making (DLO/Ingram), a starting level player (Jules), 2 solid rotation players (JC, Nance) and a prospect (Zub). Things are looking well especially if we can add another top 3 pick this summer.

Go Lakers.


What do you mean Black is likely gone? He's under contract for next season, so it's more "unlikely" that he's gone.


Lakers can cut him by a date in July. It's a non-guaranteed 2nd year.


Are you certain? I thought his contract was fully guaranteed? And why cut him, even if that's an option? He's a great back-up PF/C to have, and making peanuts, relative to the rest of the league.


100% certain. It's a non-guaranteed deal. No cap hit.


Is there a difference between a non-guaranteed deal and a team option?


Yes. The latter would have given Black basically a no-trade clause for this season.


Thank you for the explanation. And assuming everything you've said about Black's status is accurate, I am in agreement that he's probably gone. The team will most likely trade him for an asset or asset(s).
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 12, 2017 1:18 pm    Post subject:

Wow Nash. So much passive-aggressiveness.
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 12, 2017 1:20 pm    Post subject:

No one is going to trade an asset for Black cmon...

He will be cut and lucky to make a team as the 14th man...

Hes an undersized energy big. Cant shoot, and cant defend bigger players.

TROB is a better asset.
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 12, 2017 1:22 pm    Post subject:

BobbyB wrote:
No one is going to trade an asset for Black cmon...

He will be cut and lucky to make a team as the 14th man...

Hes an undersized energy big. Cant shoot, and cant defend bigger players.

TROB is a better asset.


Why wouldn't a team be willing to trade an asset for Black? He's a bargain at his current salary.
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 12, 2017 1:23 pm    Post subject:

CaliRyderX wrote:
BobbyB wrote:
No one is going to trade an asset for Black cmon...

He will be cut and lucky to make a team as the 14th man...

Hes an undersized energy big. Cant shoot, and cant defend bigger players.

TROB is a better asset.


Why wouldn't a team be willing to trade an asset for Black? He's a bargain at his current salary.


Could be used in a trade to save the other 6m if he is included.
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 12, 2017 1:23 pm    Post subject:

CaliRyderX wrote:
BobbyB wrote:
No one is going to trade an asset for Black cmon...

He will be cut and lucky to make a team as the 14th man...

Hes an undersized energy big. Cant shoot, and cant defend bigger players.

TROB is a better asset.


Why wouldn't a team be willing to trade an asset for Black? He's a bargain at his current salary.


What is an asset? no one is giving a pick for Black imo.
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 12, 2017 1:25 pm    Post subject:

tox wrote:
Aside from above, I have to say that overall I'm really impressed with the strides Randle made. Sometimes I get caught up in where he is, and my frustrations with stuff like his offball defense. But I forget just how undercoached he was going into this season. When you think about his weaknesses going into the season, he's worked on them all:

1) Tunnel vision bully ball? Fixed
2) Shooting? Improved
3) Defense? Improved?
4) Screening? Improved
5) Finishing with his right? Improved

Sure, he has ways to go more, and there are legitimate gripes about his effort level. But all in all, these are the improvements you want to see him make. I'm excited to see how he looks next season.

Ingram has impressed me with his slashing ability. In my January article, I talked about how he didn't have the explosiveness of a Giannis, but I'm starting to hedge a little on that statement. Is suggesting he might get to 90% of Giannis in terms of athleticism sacrilege? But ultimately it's going to come down to his jumper. I fully agree with the Dirk comp as the route BI will have to take ultimately to become a true superstar on offense.

Nance is Nance, besides his 3 ball I don't think he has improved and I don't think he will. That's fine, he's a legit championship-level role player.

Zubac was also a pleasant surprise. Really good offensive feel. Good sense of shotblocking. His defense is terrible, but he's 19. Too early to say if he'll go the Gasol route or the Kanter route, to quote Yinoma.


Don't forget his conditioning. KIROE's offseason video of JR showed him just constantly winded. He's improved there as well.

Ingram has shown a lot. One of the youngest players in the league, those long strides, the passing, he going to be good.

DLO's looked good too. I enjoyed watching him develop chemistry, on and off ball with almost each player. This should only improve.

I like our team, they're just so young. I hope we get to see them grow more together, Ingram, DLO, Randle specifically, but Zubac, Nance, and JC as well. There's a nice mix of skills atheleticsm/length/talent in our group. If they can work out how to play decent team defense together we'll be on our way.

I look forward to seeing more of Nwaba.
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 12, 2017 1:29 pm    Post subject:

BobbyB wrote:
CaliRyderX wrote:
BobbyB wrote:
No one is going to trade an asset for Black cmon...

He will be cut and lucky to make a team as the 14th man...

Hes an undersized energy big. Cant shoot, and cant defend bigger players.

TROB is a better asset.


Why wouldn't a team be willing to trade an asset for Black? He's a bargain at his current salary.


What is an asset? no one is giving a pick for Black imo.


By asset i meant something with value, a pick or player...and i think you're undervaluing Tarik's effort. He averages 12 and 11 per 36 minutes. Plus he's only 25 years old. I'm not saying he'll command a 1st round pick in return, but his overall output and current salary are in general, quite attractive for a young and hard-working power-forward/center.
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 12, 2017 1:33 pm    Post subject: Re: Our Young Core-Year in Review

All good takes, Yinoma!

I actually think BI/DLo's ceilings = superstars. I know its a stretch. DLo's vision and BI's bbiq makes them truly special. Really hope FO do not trade this duo (and Nance/Zu too).

Randle: I like him and think he can be rebounding monster. I dont know if he can be Draymond level on defense though. His passing? I think he can surpass Draymond here. Ultimately, I think his price tag might be too high and if thats the case I hope we trade high. I'm ok with it b/c I think Nance could be an excellent starting 4.

We need defense and shooting to balance out the offense-first guys like DLo, BI. This why I'm like Nwaba a lot. If he can hone in a 3pt shot at a decent clip (36%+) he just might be our starting SG. Jordan can fill that too if he can shoot like last night. Though I think him and Julius are most likely gone.
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 12, 2017 1:35 pm    Post subject:

tox wrote:
^ I agree with you there... I just can't think of precedent of a very poor rebounder becoming a good one. But I definitely wouldn't rule out that it's possible.

Usually when bigs are poor rebounders it's because:
1. they're just lazy. Shaq kind of got lazy when he was here, and had lots of 2 or 3 rebound games. Zu isn't lazy, so I don't think that's a problem
2. guys that have short arms and get out reached. Again, not a problem with Zu
3. guys that can't jump, and won't work for position to overcome that lack of vertical.

Zu doesn't have much vertical and he's kind of a slow jumper (both of which he needs to work on this summer), but he's tall/long/energetic ...and definitely not lazy. so, he should be able to get boards by working for position and actively pursuing them

Dennis Rodman was kind of a volume scorer when he started college, but not much of a rebounder. Apparently his college coach yelled at him every day to rebound - and that worked out okay..so, you can turn that around

Zu's not as bouncy at Rodman was, and probably won't be the rebounder Rodman was of course, but Zu's got a lot of room for improvement and a great work ethic

It actually kind of surprised me that someone taught Zu how to set roadblock screens on offense, but didn't teach him to box out on rebounds...
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 12, 2017 1:45 pm    Post subject:

I think people forget our SUMMER LEAGUE starting 5 consisted of

Russell
Ingram
Nance
Zubac

And we lost to Kay Felder and the Cavs. To say our young core has come a long way this season is the understatement of the year.

It's all about just putting these things into perspective. We're on the right path, lets just stay on it
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 12, 2017 1:54 pm    Post subject:

yinoma2001 wrote:
Wow Nash. So much passive-aggressiveness.


Not towards the player for sure, I was as straight forward as possible talking about what I like and what I dislike and how much value a believe he has ... a few sensitive fans may believe there are a some passive-aggressive words directed to them, but in this case we can bring Byron Scott to talk about the "man up" thing

I still don't know if we have a young core to build around, but it is a great feeling to believe we have a young core good enough to put around someone worth building around.
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 12, 2017 2:48 pm    Post subject: Re: Our Young Core-Year in Review

yinoma2001 wrote:
Ingram has shown me he has all star potential and is likely our highest valued player.

DLO has shown me similar all star potential, and is easily our 2nd highest valued player.

Jules has certainly (should be clear by now) wiped away any ridiculous fears that he's a bust. He may be on the near-all star trajectory.

JC is pretty much what I thought he'd be.

Nance showed his value on court as a smart defender. I worry about his durability going forward, but he's a big time keeper on this team.

Zubac has showed some flash in his offensive game. The concern remains about his defense (not necessarily rim protecting) in space and in PnR situations. Someone said that he may be going more towards an Enes Kanter (good offensive player, defensive struggle) trajectory, which is still quite a coup for a 32nd pick.

Nwaba is a good guy to keep. Love his life story and is a good reminder that the NBA is a daily grind and that each day should be cherished.

Ennis is an unrestricted FA and the Lakers are capped at 2.6m (due to CBA rules). So if a team offers him 3m, he's likely gone.

Black is likely gone unless we punt and keep his 6m deal.

It's been a really good year (especially post ASG) to evaluate these young players. We have at least 2 studs in the making (DLO/Ingram), a starting level player (Jules), 2 solid rotation players (JC, Nance) and a prospect (Zub). Things are looking well especially if we can add another top 3 pick this summer.

Go Lakers.


Mostly Agree.

However, some difference in my personal opinion are:

1. DLO/BI are much closer. I cant really value one over the other. BI will probably be an overall better player, but DLO has shown the ability to be clutch and to absolutely go off!

2. To me, ZU is next on this list. Kanter will be on the lower end for my expectations. He is already a better rim protector, and if he can get better defensively in space, hes a legit starter. Again, if he hits, we would have our Guard, Wing, and Center positions filled.

3. JR and JC are not busts by any stretch of the imagination and were great picks by our former regime at where they were picked. However, their style of play is the biggest question mark for them. I have seen some improvement in their ability to play defense and play within the offense. However, as long as those aspects stay as concerns, they will hurt the team overall or they will need to be bench players on great teams.

4. Nance. Agree 100%. While he is not the talent that JC or JR are; he makes the team better when he plays. He is the essential heart and soul of a winning team, and rotation player on a winning team.

5. Nwaba/TRob/Tennis: These are the guys that have me mad during the last stretch. They are third stringers at best. They hustled hard these last few games when other teams took their foot off the gas pedal, and they then got confident and played above their heads. Once the level of competition raises, they will regress to their scrub like performances. Of the three, Nwaba is the most valuable due to his defense, and could be a serious rotation player if he develops a jumper. TRob is valuable only as an energy guy deep off the bench, and Ennis is an under control PG off the bench.
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 12, 2017 2:51 pm    Post subject:

P.K. wrote:
tox wrote:
^ I agree with you there... I just can't think of precedent of a very poor rebounder becoming a good one. But I definitely wouldn't rule out that it's possible.

Usually when bigs are poor rebounders it's because:
1. they're just lazy. Shaq kind of got lazy when he was here, and had lots of 2 or 3 rebound games. Zu isn't lazy, so I don't think that's a problem
2. guys that have short arms and get out reached. Again, not a problem with Zu
3. guys that can't jump, and won't work for position to overcome that lack of vertical.

Zu doesn't have much vertical and he's kind of a slow jumper (both of which he needs to work on this summer), but he's tall/long/energetic ...and definitely not lazy. so, he should be able to get boards by working for position and actively pursuing them

Dennis Rodman was kind of a volume scorer when he started college, but not much of a rebounder. Apparently his college coach yelled at him every day to rebound - and that worked out okay..so, you can turn that around

Zu's not as bouncy at Rodman was, and probably won't be the rebounder Rodman was of course, but Zu's got a lot of room for improvement and a great work ethic

It actually kind of surprised me that someone taught Zu how to set roadblock screens on offense, but didn't teach him to box out on rebounds...


ZU's biggest problem on the boards is that he reaches and tips at boards (usually with one hand) instead of aggressively going and taking boards.
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 12, 2017 2:54 pm    Post subject:

BobbyB wrote:
No one is going to trade an asset for Black cmon...

He will be cut and lucky to make a team as the 14th man...

Hes an undersized energy big. Cant shoot, and cant defend bigger players.

TROB is a better asset.


TRob isn't even an NBA asset. He is funny as heck, his interviews after games are hilarious, but he has no basketball IQ or skills. If you have roster space for an energy big, he is a good one to have.
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 12, 2017 2:58 pm    Post subject:

foshowtime wrote:
P.K. wrote:
tox wrote:
^ I agree with you there... I just can't think of precedent of a very poor rebounder becoming a good one. But I definitely wouldn't rule out that it's possible.

Usually when bigs are poor rebounders it's because:
1. they're just lazy. Shaq kind of got lazy when he was here, and had lots of 2 or 3 rebound games. Zu isn't lazy, so I don't think that's a problem
2. guys that have short arms and get out reached. Again, not a problem with Zu
3. guys that can't jump, and won't work for position to overcome that lack of vertical.

Zu doesn't have much vertical and he's kind of a slow jumper (both of which he needs to work on this summer), but he's tall/long/energetic ...and definitely not lazy. so, he should be able to get boards by working for position and actively pursuing them

Dennis Rodman was kind of a volume scorer when he started college, but not much of a rebounder. Apparently his college coach yelled at him every day to rebound - and that worked out okay..so, you can turn that around

Zu's not as bouncy at Rodman was, and probably won't be the rebounder Rodman was of course, but Zu's got a lot of room for improvement and a great work ethic

It actually kind of surprised me that someone taught Zu how to set roadblock screens on offense, but didn't teach him to box out on rebounds...


ZU's biggest problem on the boards is that he reaches and tips at boards (usually with one hand) instead of aggressively going and taking boards.


His main problem as pointed by the coaching staff is his stance. Lowering his center of gravity bending his knees with his legs a bit far apart keeping the weight on his toes, things like that would help a lot.
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 12, 2017 3:00 pm    Post subject: Re: Our Young Core-Year in Review

foshowtime wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
Ingram has shown me he has all star potential and is likely our highest valued player.

DLO has shown me similar all star potential, and is easily our 2nd highest valued player.

Jules has certainly (should be clear by now) wiped away any ridiculous fears that he's a bust. He may be on the near-all star trajectory.

JC is pretty much what I thought he'd be.

Nance showed his value on court as a smart defender. I worry about his durability going forward, but he's a big time keeper on this team.

Zubac has showed some flash in his offensive game. The concern remains about his defense (not necessarily rim protecting) in space and in PnR situations. Someone said that he may be going more towards an Enes Kanter (good offensive player, defensive struggle) trajectory, which is still quite a coup for a 32nd pick.

Nwaba is a good guy to keep. Love his life story and is a good reminder that the NBA is a daily grind and that each day should be cherished.

Ennis is an unrestricted FA and the Lakers are capped at 2.6m (due to CBA rules). So if a team offers him 3m, he's likely gone.

Black is likely gone unless we punt and keep his 6m deal.

It's been a really good year (especially post ASG) to evaluate these young players. We have at least 2 studs in the making (DLO/Ingram), a starting level player (Jules), 2 solid rotation players (JC, Nance) and a prospect (Zub). Things are looking well especially if we can add another top 3 pick this summer.

Go Lakers.


Mostly Agree.

However, some difference in my personal opinion are:

1. DLO/BI are much closer. I cant really value one over the other. BI will probably be an overall better player, but DLO has shown the ability to be clutch and to absolutely go off!

2. To me, ZU is next on this list. Kanter will be on the lower end for my expectations. He is already a better rim protector, and if he can get better defensively in space, hes a legit starter. Again, if he hits, we would have our Guard, Wing, and Center positions filled.

3. JR and JC are not busts by any stretch of the imagination and were great picks by our former regime at where they were picked. However, their style of play is the biggest question mark for them. I have seen some improvement in their ability to play defense and play within the offense. However, as long as those aspects stay as concerns, they will hurt the team overall or they will need to be bench players on great teams.

4. Nance. Agree 100%. While he is not the talent that JC or JR are; he makes the team better when he plays. He is the essential heart and soul of a winning team, and rotation player on a winning team.

5. Nwaba/TRob/Tennis: These are the guys that have me mad during the last stretch. They are third stringers at best. They hustled hard these last few games when other teams took their foot off the gas pedal, and they then got confident and played above their heads. Once the level of competition raises, they will regress to their scrub like performances. Of the three, Nwaba is the most valuable due to his defense, and could be a serious rotation player if he develops a jumper. TRob is valuable only as an energy guy deep off the bench, and Ennis is an under control PG off the bench.


Sorry to nitpick, but when the Lakers players have been asked after some games this past season who the one player was that got them fired up and set the tone for them, it wasn't Nance. I love Larry and hope he retires here, but the players look elsewhere for inspiration and for someone to feed off of.
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 12, 2017 3:10 pm    Post subject:

nash wrote:
foshowtime wrote:
P.K. wrote:
tox wrote:
^ I agree with you there... I just can't think of precedent of a very poor rebounder becoming a good one. But I definitely wouldn't rule out that it's possible.

Usually when bigs are poor rebounders it's because:
1. they're just lazy. Shaq kind of got lazy when he was here, and had lots of 2 or 3 rebound games. Zu isn't lazy, so I don't think that's a problem
2. guys that have short arms and get out reached. Again, not a problem with Zu
3. guys that can't jump, and won't work for position to overcome that lack of vertical.

Zu doesn't have much vertical and he's kind of a slow jumper (both of which he needs to work on this summer), but he's tall/long/energetic ...and definitely not lazy. so, he should be able to get boards by working for position and actively pursuing them

Dennis Rodman was kind of a volume scorer when he started college, but not much of a rebounder. Apparently his college coach yelled at him every day to rebound - and that worked out okay..so, you can turn that around

Zu's not as bouncy at Rodman was, and probably won't be the rebounder Rodman was of course, but Zu's got a lot of room for improvement and a great work ethic

It actually kind of surprised me that someone taught Zu how to set roadblock screens on offense, but didn't teach him to box out on rebounds...


ZU's biggest problem on the boards is that he reaches and tips at boards (usually with one hand) instead of aggressively going and taking boards.


His main problem as pointed by the coaching staff is his stance. Lowering his center of gravity bending his knees with his legs a bit far apart keeping the weight on his toes, things like that would help a lot.

Yeah, I pointed that out in my first post - which is what Tox was replying too
Zu stands flat footed with his weight on his heels a lot and his knees locked.
Bending his knees puts the weight on the ball of his foot and unlocks the knee so he can move faster - he'd also be pre primed to jump rather than taking all that time to unlock his stance so he can crouch.
These problems also prevent him from moving very quickly laterally.
this is basic stuff that's easy to fix.
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 12, 2017 3:49 pm    Post subject:

TheBlackMamba wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
Cutheon wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
Many big men with Zub's size/girth have a problem with PnR and defending in space. Even if he leans up and gets stronger, it will be a fundamental problem. That's ok b/c we have interesting small ball options in Jules/Nance,.


I think Luke will use Zu like PJ used Bynum. Situationally. Maybe a "starter" in-name only. (unless he is the second-coming of MG, in which case, pencil him in for 32+ a night).


Yeah. I think Zub is a hard worker and smart player. That being said, MGasol is the exception not the norm for guys that big. I can see Zub being the 22-24mpg "starting" center with a small ball big man finishing games (i.e. Nance).


Zu morphing into Marc is the dream scenario, but I think the realistic middle ground he can shoot for is a better scoring version of Bogut (healthy Warriors' version), which would be amazing for the #32 pick. Bogut is huge and doesn't move well either, but he could protect the rim, and was generally a smart defender who know where to be and rotate (within his limited range) so as not to compromise the team defense. And his passing ability was big for their offense. Those are the things Zu needs to focus on.

(bleep) the Kanter comparisons, that dude never even tried to play defense. Zu at least has acknowledged (and the coaching staff has made this a point of emphasis for him, I believe) that he needs to improve his defensive awareness. Honestly, I see Kanter as his floor at this point.

I'll be happy with Jonas Valanciunas. Traditional starting C on a good team that plays 26MPG.
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 12, 2017 4:15 pm    Post subject:

Good thread.

1) DLO/Ingram. These guys are at the top of everyone's list. DLO is further along but Ingram is gaining ground fast. They both have Superstar ceilings.

What should they work on this summer? Shooting. Shooting unobstructed. Shooting form. Shooting when stepping in. Shooting fadeaways. Shooting with a hand in the face. Shooting mid-range. Shooting 3's. Shooting with someone counting down to zero. Shooting until Rex Tillerson drives a Tesla.

3) Randle. Tough call. I'd have said Zubac until this last couple of weeks. I thought Randle was a lost cause. Didn't think he was smart enough to learn the nuances of a motion offense, or care about setting proper picks and make an offense better. Or understand assignments on defense. He's surprised me several times this last month or two, and I get the distinct feeling he's learning this stuff. He's strong as an ox and quick, aggressive, and can impact a game. Ceiling - All-star.

What should he work on this summer? Anything he can do to further internalize his understanding of team defense, assignments, rotations, helping the helper. Also play using his off hand all summer, and lots of 3 point drills.

4) Zubac. This could change a lot - he has very high ceiling. He's a big in a small ball era, but he impacts games at 19, with little experience. I think his floor is starting center on an average or better team. Ceiling is perennial all-star.

What should he work on this summer? Stance, lateral mobility, P&R defense, the weight room, and that Sky Hook of his.

5) Nance and Clarkson. Clarkson has a higher ceiling, Nance is an all around solid bench guy on any team including a title team. Nance's all around game is real solid.

What should they work on this summer? Nance - outside shooting. See DLO/Ingram. Clarkson - learning Luke's playbook real well. How to move the feet on defense.
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 12, 2017 4:17 pm    Post subject:

Honestly I feel a lot better about Jules now than I did preseason. He's improved a lot. How much should we extend him for is another question.
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