OFFICIAL LONZO BALL THREAD
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The God Particle
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2018 8:43 am    Post subject:

Just for the record, I'm not suggesting Lonzo is a bust. Far from it, I actually think he's having a much better year than I anticipated, but mostly because his defense is light years ahead of any projection coming out of college. He's already a good on-ball defender and an even better team defender.

All I'm saying is that his weaknesses (he has many)aren't likely to ever develop into strengths. And he will likely (like Kidd) always need players around him that can go get their own shot. He can't - and will likely never be able to (strengths).
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2018 8:45 am    Post subject:

There's an entire generation of Laker fans who have never experienced the frustration of watching homegrown talent. These guys are just pups and they're going to fail a lot. I'm not going to judge Zo too much this season. I think he's ahead of the curve in some areas and behind it in others. Patience is a virtue.
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2018 8:48 am    Post subject:

The God Particle wrote:
Just for the record, I'm not suggesting Lonzo is a bust. Far from it, I actually think he's having a much better year than I anticipated, but mostly because his defense is light years ahead of any projection coming out of college. He's already a good on-ball defender and an even better team defender.

All I'm saying is that his weaknesses (he has many)aren't likely to ever develop into strengths. And he will likely (like Kidd) always need players around him that can go get their own shot. He can't - and will likely never be able to (strengths).


I personally never expected him to ever become a go-to scorer. Is that what some people were expecting? He's always been a low-usage facilitator.
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adkindo
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2018 8:48 am    Post subject:

32 wrote:
Every rookie gets the treatment. Expectations are high for #2 picks and even #7 pick. Randle got it, Dlo got it, BI got it and now it's Lonzo's turn. His rookie season has been uneventful. We have seen flashes of brilliance but mostly it has been average at best. There are so many flaws in his game he needs to work on. This year it didn't help matters that he was injured for 20+ games and you have to wonder if he is injury prone. He also missed summer league with an injury.


It did not help that he was coronated as the face of the franchise, and Magic creating a space in the rafters for his jersey. He should have been treated like every other rookie by this organization. Hopefully this FO learned that marketing and promotion is great for selling tickets, but it should not be done in overselling an actual player to the extent that it could be detrimental to said player.
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2018 8:51 am    Post subject:

Ziggy wrote:
There's an entire generation of Laker fans who have never experienced the frustration of watching homegrown talent. These guys are just pups and they're going to fail a lot. I'm not going to judge Zo too much this season. I think he's ahead of the curve in some areas and behind it in others. Patience is a virtue.


Typically a player shows who they will be 3-4 seasons into their career (except the 4 year college guys, they are usually who they will be). I have no problem waiting.
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2018 8:51 am    Post subject:

Guy needs to get better this summer. Better and stronger. Just STFU and work on your game. Don't care if he's quiet, does he have the ability to put in the time?

I will add none of the Laker lottery picks have looked very impressive year one (or in Randle's case year 2). They all got better and worked at it, even Russell who is gone. It took Randle 2.5 years to become what he is today, and he still can't shoot.

Ball needs to get better, there are a lot of aspects of his game that are impressive. I expect improvement there as well. But he has to become more of an offensive threat.
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2018 8:54 am    Post subject:

adkindo wrote:
32 wrote:
Every rookie gets the treatment. Expectations are high for #2 picks and even #7 pick. Randle got it, Dlo got it, BI got it and now it's Lonzo's turn. His rookie season has been uneventful. We have seen flashes of brilliance but mostly it has been average at best. There are so many flaws in his game he needs to work on. This year it didn't help matters that he was injured for 20+ games and you have to wonder if he is injury prone. He also missed summer league with an injury.


It did not help that he was coronated as the face of the franchise, and Magic creating a space in the rafters for his jersey. He should have been treated like every other rookie by this organization. Hopefully this FO learned that marketing and promotion is great for selling tickets, but it should not be done in overselling an actual player to the extent that it could be detrimental to said player.

Like Lonzo said, pressure breaks pipes but it also creates diamonds. I have no doubt Magic knew exactly what he was saying because he saw how well that Zo handles pressure. At the end of the day its all just noise, words have no effect on you unless you let them. Lonzo has shown that he's not afraid of the noise and is motivated and hard working enough to live up to expectations.
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2018 8:56 am    Post subject:

The God Particle wrote:
Just for the record, I'm not suggesting Lonzo is a bust. Far from it, I actually think he's having a much better year than I anticipated, but mostly because his defense is light years ahead of any projection coming out of college. He's already a good on-ball defender and an even better team defender.

All I'm saying is that his weaknesses (he has many)aren't likely to ever develop into strengths. And he will likely (like Kidd) always need players around him that can go get their own shot. He can't - and will likely never be able to (strengths).

If you told me on draft day he'd be a career 13-15/9/8 guy with elite level defense at his position, who puts up great RPM/BPM numbers, I would have been ecstatic. And that's still exactly what he projects to be.

In a perfect world, we'd have BI and PG (or even Bron) as go-to scorers, and we wouldn't need Zo in that role. As long as he can improve to a point where he's at least an average or even slightly below average scorer for his position, that's all we need.

The guy is 20 and already one of the best passers in the league, to go along with being one of the best rebounding and defensive guards in the league. Give him some time to improve and he'll be just fine.
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2018 8:58 am    Post subject:

The God Particle wrote:
Just for the record, I'm not suggesting Lonzo is a bust. Far from it, I actually think he's having a much better year than I anticipated, but mostly because his defense is light years ahead of any projection coming out of college. He's already a good on-ball defender and an even better team defender.

All I'm saying is that his weaknesses (he has many)aren't likely to ever develop into strengths. And he will likely (like Kidd) always need players around him that can go get their own shot. He can't - and will likely never be able to (strengths).


Good thing is he doesn't have to turn those weaknesses into strengths to be a star. He does everything else so well. If he can just become average as a scorer, he'll be fine.
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2018 9:05 am    Post subject:

trablos wrote:
adkindo wrote:
32 wrote:
Every rookie gets the treatment. Expectations are high for #2 picks and even #7 pick. Randle got it, Dlo got it, BI got it and now it's Lonzo's turn. His rookie season has been uneventful. We have seen flashes of brilliance but mostly it has been average at best. There are so many flaws in his game he needs to work on. This year it didn't help matters that he was injured for 20+ games and you have to wonder if he is injury prone. He also missed summer league with an injury.


It did not help that he was coronated as the face of the franchise, and Magic creating a space in the rafters for his jersey. He should have been treated like every other rookie by this organization. Hopefully this FO learned that marketing and promotion is great for selling tickets, but it should not be done in overselling an actual player to the extent that it could be detrimental to said player.

Like Lonzo said, pressure breaks pipes but it also creates diamonds. I have no doubt Magic knew exactly what he was saying because he saw how well that Zo handles pressure. At the end of the day its all just noise, words have no effect on you unless you let them. Lonzo has shown that he's not afraid of the noise and is motivated and hard working enough to live up to expectations.


I clearly have no earthly idea what your talking about
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trablos
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2018 9:07 am    Post subject:

adkindo wrote:
trablos wrote:
adkindo wrote:
32 wrote:
Every rookie gets the treatment. Expectations are high for #2 picks and even #7 pick. Randle got it, Dlo got it, BI got it and now it's Lonzo's turn. His rookie season has been uneventful. We have seen flashes of brilliance but mostly it has been average at best. There are so many flaws in his game he needs to work on. This year it didn't help matters that he was injured for 20+ games and you have to wonder if he is injury prone. He also missed summer league with an injury.


It did not help that he was coronated as the face of the franchise, and Magic creating a space in the rafters for his jersey. He should have been treated like every other rookie by this organization. Hopefully this FO learned that marketing and promotion is great for selling tickets, but it should not be done in overselling an actual player to the extent that it could be detrimental to said player.

Like Lonzo said, pressure breaks pipes but it also creates diamonds. I have no doubt Magic knew exactly what he was saying because he saw how well that Zo handles pressure. At the end of the day its all just noise, words have no effect on you unless you let them. Lonzo has shown that he's not afraid of the noise and is motivated and hard working enough to live up to expectations.


I clearly have no earthly idea what your talking about

Media talking heads and outside noise have zero effect on a basketball court, unless you allow it. Zo can handle the pressure.
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2018 9:13 am    Post subject:

https://www.si.com/extra-mustard/2016/01/11/10-athletes-who-got-yips-and-how-their-careers-worked-out
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2018 9:13 am    Post subject:

trablos wrote:
adkindo wrote:
trablos wrote:
adkindo wrote:
32 wrote:
Every rookie gets the treatment. Expectations are high for #2 picks and even #7 pick. Randle got it, Dlo got it, BI got it and now it's Lonzo's turn. His rookie season has been uneventful. We have seen flashes of brilliance but mostly it has been average at best. There are so many flaws in his game he needs to work on. This year it didn't help matters that he was injured for 20+ games and you have to wonder if he is injury prone. He also missed summer league with an injury.


It did not help that he was coronated as the face of the franchise, and Magic creating a space in the rafters for his jersey. He should have been treated like every other rookie by this organization. Hopefully this FO learned that marketing and promotion is great for selling tickets, but it should not be done in overselling an actual player to the extent that it could be detrimental to said player.

Like Lonzo said, pressure breaks pipes but it also creates diamonds. I have no doubt Magic knew exactly what he was saying because he saw how well that Zo handles pressure. At the end of the day its all just noise, words have no effect on you unless you let them. Lonzo has shown that he's not afraid of the noise and is motivated and hard working enough to live up to expectations.


I clearly have no earthly idea what your talking about

Media talking heads and outside noise have zero effect on a basketball court, unless you allow it. Zo can handle the pressure.


how do you know it has had no effect on him on the court?
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2018 9:36 am    Post subject:

If we can get lebron and PG, would u guys attach lonzo to Deng to get back nothing?
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2018 9:40 am    Post subject:

BigBallerBrand wrote:
If we can get lebron and PG, would u guys attach lonzo to Deng to get back nothing?


No
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adkindo
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2018 9:40 am    Post subject:

BigBallerBrand wrote:
If we can get lebron and PG, would u guys attach lonzo to Deng to get back nothing?


for what reason? depends on what you can do with the cap space.
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2018 9:42 am    Post subject:

BigBallerBrand wrote:
If we can get lebron and PG, would u guys attach lonzo to Deng to get back nothing?


One of the most ridiculous things I’ve heard on this board.
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audioaxes
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2018 9:55 am    Post subject:

the Lakers let him keep his funky shooting form and its obviously not working. Time for him to get locked in a gym with the best shooting coach money can buy and get his jumpshot fixed.
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2018 10:04 am    Post subject:

How much affect do shooting coaches truly have?

If they worked, wouldn't every poor shooter in basketball history eventually have resolved their shot? It's like Rogaine... you know it doesn't work because Steve Ballmer and Michael Jordan are still bald. My thoughts are that maybe you can tweak a shot a little bit for slight improvement but mostly it's almost an innate skill based on one's natural coordination and muscle memory.

This being said, I think if Lonzo could shoot well at one point in his life, there's no reason why he couldn't return to that. I think his issues are mostly mental.

But if you know of examples where poor shooters were drastically transformed by shooting coaches... please list them here, because I'd like to be educated.
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2018 10:12 am    Post subject:

Should folks be reminded about Fultz?

Lonzo has a lot of work to do but he’all get there.
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2018 10:15 am    Post subject:

yinoma2001 wrote:
Should folks be reminded about Fultz?

Lonzo has a lot of work to do but he’all get there.


Agreed.

How many people said that BI was historically bad last season and that his shot was broken. Hint, it was a lot of people.

Both BI and Lonzo shot it well in college, over 40% from 3. Both struggled in their rookie seasons. I am thinking that with more experience and practice that Zo will bounce back just like BI did.

Cheers!
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2018 10:16 am    Post subject:

Sentient Meat wrote:
How much affect do shooting coaches truly have?

If they worked, wouldn't every poor shooter in basketball history eventually have resolved their shot? It's like Rogaine... you know it doesn't work because Steve Ballmer and Michael Jordan are still bald. My thoughts are that maybe you can tweak a shot a little bit for slight improvement but mostly it's almost an innate skill based on one's natural coordination and muscle memory.

This being said, I think if Lonzo could shoot well at one point in his life, there's no reason why he couldn't return to that. I think his issues are mostly mental.

But if you know of examples where poor shooters were drastically transformed by shooting coaches... please list them here, because I'd like to be educated.

Kawhi Leonard is the example that comes to mind -- dude couldn't shoot at all coming out of SDSU, but transformed in to ~39% career 3 point shooter.

But that's definitely the exception, not the rule
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2018 10:17 am    Post subject:

BigBallerBrand wrote:
If we can get lebron and PG, would u guys attach lonzo to Deng to get back nothing?

You may have to give up that username.
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2018 10:21 am    Post subject:

BigBallerBrand wrote:
If we can get lebron and PG, would u guys attach lonzo to Deng to get back nothing?


I think this is a sarcastic post. But if it is not, then heck no!
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2018 10:21 am    Post subject:

Just trying to find ways to make up for the fact hes an average player most likely 6th 7th best player on our team next year. Hes easily replaced. Heck if i worked hard on my game all summer i would be a better overall player then him and im almost 30 5'10.
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